Music: The build up and the aftermath

Piste · 14-06-2009 12:08pm

God I hate the composition paper

If you modulate in bars 7-8 do you keep in the dominant in the third phrase and only modulate back to the tonic in the fourth or do you modulate back at the end of the 3rd phrase?

We weren't taught any formulas and tricks like that, I don't think our teacher really realised it was more difficult for us to hear the melody in our heads =/

Saffy · 14-06-2009 12:29pm

Music is the only subject that I am capable of an A in and if I don't get it I'll be so disappointed!:(

I really don't know how my practical went - I know I didn't completely mess it up but I could have done much much better!

I'm pretty okay at the composing paper but I'm ****ed for the listening paper:(

tootyflutty · 14-06-2009 2:38pm

tazbars wrote: »

thanks a million that is so helpful....but what are swirling triplets?!

the swirling triplets are in Berlioz, played on cello's and bass's, they have a sort of rising and falling sequence/melody in triplets that sounds swirling-ish :P
Working from memory here so that could be wrong lol

xOxSinéadxOx · 14-06-2009 3:35pm

my practical went **** so I've given up at this stage. only bit I find easy is the composition paper. the other paper is just wtf for me? haven't a clue about seachanges or mozart or anyway of it. hate it all

evolving_doors · 14-06-2009 4:27pm

tootyflutty wrote: »

You won't lose marks, but there are marks given for best progressions, and sometimes that includes viib or whatever the chord :P
Like using v7d sometimes instead of v. Not a necessity but it sometimes gives a nice counter melody in the bass.

The examiner will have worked solutions which are part of the standard progressions for the required chords as set out in the syllabus...therefore...you'll get the marks you deserve.No more no less.

If you use V7d, iii or neopolitan 6th's,wierd augmented or whatever, you wont loose marks(assuming you treat them correctly)..but you wont get any extra marks either..as this wouldn't be fair to those that are taught according to what is required from the syllabus..

mikeglee · 14-06-2009 4:50pm

I havn't a clue what a lot of you are talking about (no offense) which leads me to believe that I am so dead for composing

tootyflutty · 14-06-2009 5:37pm

Ok, just to clarify I'll show you the marks as taken from the marking scheme.

Question 5

Chords
- 1 mark that is part of a good progression in chord boxes = 23
- quality of musical progressions and cadences overall = 13

Bass
- 0.5 mark for every correct bass note under each correct chord symbol
- quality of bass line, including sense of musicality, awareness of style and technical knowledge = 13

Equals to 60 marks overall.

As I said before the 13 marks in both questions, will go for good progressions and musicality, which can include inversions and vii chords. They are included on the syllabus but are not a necessity.

Dr Gradus · 14-06-2009 5:44pm

My practical went well enough but had a rubbish music teacher who made it so that wirh 4 days too i will probaly still do atrociously in the melody writing and harmony questions. A shame really cause i quite like the subject.

Dante · 14-06-2009 5:57pm

Grrrrrr can't remember how to do anything!

tootyflutty · 15-06-2009 8:54am

Just listen to the set works a couple of times, then get some old papers for the composing and try them.
You might be able to get them on examinations.ie

-ME- · 15-06-2009 9:15am

I can't believe that the marks of all of the set works combined (55m) are worth less than just one French comprehension (60m)!

CaoimH_in · 15-06-2009 2:22pm

The Key Of C Minor

Cm Ddim EbAug Fm G Ab Bdim
i ii(2nd inversion only III(not in use) iv V VI vii(not in use)

Not sure what you are after, hope this helps.

Can someone give me the best Chord Progressions?

and one thing to add to the melody do's and don'ts.

at the end of Phrases, use a plagal or perfect cadence, as a rule, anything to I (or i), is good.

Ignore the rule, that its ok to copy the entire first bar. BAD, I just checked one some marking schemes, apologises. PLEASE MAKE THAT KNOWN TO ALL extremely sorry.

base the pun-ultimate bar on the chord of V and the final bar long note of chord I(i) ALWAYS END ON THE TONIC.

Be careful with passing notes. They can work very well, or very very poorly. if they work well.. happy days, if they work poorly, jesus hope the examiner has lube cause they'll you hard, well that is if they play the melody out on Piano, as it really really stands out.

Triplets are good, and a question just for me on triplets, is it always groups of three? or could it be a group of four and they'd be played in the time of 3?

Can someone give me 2/4 rhythms?

mikeglee · 15-06-2009 3:55pm

I Am Dead

xOxSinéadxOx · 15-06-2009 5:05pm

yeah same, never really planned on counting this but I did really bad in french so I probably will end up counting it! raar I hate it

CaoimH_in · 15-06-2009 9:31pm

tootyflutty wrote: »

If you get full marks in your practical (which 88% of people do) then you only need to get 80% in your written to get an A1

and the listening?!

rcaz · 15-06-2009 9:55pm

So how do you guys study set works? I know them all pretty well, but not REALLY well. But I'm trying to get REALLY good in two days. Tips = appreciated.

tootyflutty · 15-06-2009 10:05pm

By the written I was referring to the listening and composing.

For how I study my set works, I listen to one and write down everything in short hand that I hear, and repeat this 2/3 times, then listen to it with the score that has all my notes in it and check what I missed. Then I will go back and listen again to the bits I missed. I do this with all the set works/movements.

If you have exam papers, do them as much as you can and check them on the marking schemes.

After that not much more you can do. :P

rcaz · 15-06-2009 10:07pm

tootyflutty wrote: »

By the written I was referring to the listening and composing.

For how I study my set works, I listen to one and write down everything in short hand that I hear, and repeat this 2/3 times, then listen to it with the score that has all my notes in it and check what I missed. Then I will go back and listen again to the bits I missed. I do this with all the set works/movements.

If you have exam papers, do them as much as you can and check them on the marking schemes.

After that not much more you can do. :P

Wow, great idea! Thanks Tootyflutty!

tootyflutty · 15-06-2009 10:19pm

No problemo! Just a way that helps you notice the little things!

lilmissprincess · 16-06-2009 9:07am

Question....

I do the listening elective ( trying to work on it last-minute because I've kinda left it on the side, have barely anything done), and the question of "Musical features" has come up, but I'm wondering what falls under that because I somewhat remember there being a distinction between Musical features and something else....

Do instrumentation and rhythm fall under it?

Twinkle-star15 · 16-06-2009 9:50am

Piste wrote: »

God I hate the composition paper

If you modulate in bars 7-8 do you keep in the dominant in the third phrase and only modulate back to the tonic in the fourth or do you modulate back at the end of the 3rd phrase?

We weren't taught any formulas and tricks like that, I don't think our teacher really realised it was more difficult for us to hear the melody in our heads =/

A good formula is to base bar 7 around chord V, in the second half of the bar raise fah to fi, land on soh, repeat soh for a longer note (like a crotchet or dotted crotchet) in bar 8, land on fah briefly and end the phrase with a note from the major triad.

Crocodilius wrote:

What's the formula for a minor key? I think i know how to identify them (look for an accidental on the 7th note of the scale in the given melody, yes?)

Since you don't modulate, should you just use bar 7-8 as a further development of bars3-4?

P.S. i think it always says "include a modulation to the dominant at a suitable point" above the question if it's in a major key. Is this true or just me jumping the gun?

Yup, the formula for the minor key the exact same, just without the modulation.
You're right about modulating in the major key, it's always asked. And 'suitable point' is always the end of the second phrase.

mikeglee · 16-06-2009 3:34pm

Music!.... You're my last exam....and your going down!!!

rcaz · 16-06-2009 5:51pm

I always modulate Do Re Mi Fa So Fe Sooooo across 7 and 8, apparently that's a good way of approaching the modulation.

Piste · 16-06-2009 7:10pm

So you're only meant to modulate for two bars?! My modulations last a phrase =/

My melodies are usually Phrase 1: given, Phrase 2: finish off phrase one and end on tonic, Phrase 3: write completely new phrase in dominant and in the last bar work back to tonic Phrase 4: write a phrase somewhat based around phrase 1.

I jsut tack that together myself...we were never given that bar by bar breakdown everyone else seems to follow =/

rcaz · 16-06-2009 7:25pm

Yeah, we were told we only need to be in the dominant for 7 and 8. So we only actually use one accidental the whole time. I always start off Bar 9 back in the tonic like nothing happened in bar eight.

Du · 16-06-2009 7:45pm

CaoimH_in wrote: »

Can someone give me the best Chord Progressions?

Don't bother with chord progressions, just in general use (with major harmony):

I - Everything
ii - V
IV- I, ii, V, V7
V - I, IV, vi, V7
vi - ii, IV

Avoid using:
ii-I, IV-vi, V-ii, V7-V, vi-V
And you'll have it no problem.
Cadences:
V/V7- I - Perfect
IV- I - Plagal

V/V7 -vi -Interrupted
I-V - Imperfect
ii- V - Imperfect
IV- V - Imperfect

got plenty of helpful tips for those struggling with the melody!

Futurism · 16-06-2009 10:26pm

Christ,I'm ****ed. Don't know a thing.

tootyflutty · 17-06-2009 10:37am

Anybody got anymore recording techiniques for the Beatles songs?
All I have is double tracking but it's not very relevant except in Sgt. Pepper.

tazbars · 17-06-2009 11:04am

has anyone been given any tips on what might be coming up?

tazbars · 17-06-2009 11:07am

tootyflutty wrote: »

Anybody got anymore recording techiniques for the Beatles songs?
All I have is double tracking but it's not very relevant except in Sgt. Pepper.

is double tracking not in when im 64? sampling is used in Sgt. Pepper

Piste · 17-06-2009 11:08am

I don't think Seachanges has been a 25 mark question yet, or if it has, it hasn't been for a while, so I think that's due to come up.

tazbars · 17-06-2009 11:11am

yea i really think seachanges is a safe bet. Anyone else hate mozart movement 3? really hard to distinguish themes i think. do we have to know how each theme is developed?

Piste · 17-06-2009 11:17am

Yeah I much prefer the other two movements, I just can't seem to get my head around 3 =/

tootyflutty · 17-06-2009 11:18am

Oh sorry tazbars your right! Do you know of any more? I'm really stuck for them, and would like to have two or three with definitions if you have them?
I'm really guessing Seachanges will be q.1. after that it's anyones guess. I'd say a Beatles piece if it's not Seachanges.

Idjit · 17-06-2009 11:33am

I wish we didnt have to do Deane. The mozart piece makes me feel like cryin but in a nice way...and Un Bal makes me feel like swaying around the room like a madwoman coz it just sounds like you should be twirling and twirling around to it.reminds me of the teacups ride haha.
Does anyone know a good site for notes for the set works?

tazbars · 17-06-2009 11:40am

tootyflutty wrote: »

Oh sorry tazbars your right! Do you know of any more? I'm really stuck for them, and would like to have two or three with definitions if you have them?
I'm really guessing Seachanges will be q.1. after that it's anyones guess. I'd say a Beatles piece if it's not Seachanges.

Sampling in Sgt. Pepper is used in the opening, there is sound effects of audience chatter and instrumental tune-up create the atmosphere of an open air concert.
It used again in verse two, the crowd is clapping and cheering creating a sese of excitement.

Double tracking (When I'm 64) is where the vocal line was recorded in C but the tape was speeded up to raise the pitch to Dflat major

I cant think of any for she's leaving home??

Piste · 17-06-2009 11:45am

Isn't she's leaving home double tracking? Where McCartney's voice is sorta tinkered around with (wonder how I'd fare writing that in an exam...) to make it sound like a few people are singing.

tazbars · 17-06-2009 11:49am

Piste wrote: »

Isn't she's leaving home double tracking? Where McCartney's voice is sorta tinkered around with (wonder how I'd fare writing that in an exam...) to make it sound like a few people are singing.

no dont think its in she's leaving home

tazbars · 17-06-2009 11:54am

she's leaving home hasn't been tested since 2002....

Piste · 17-06-2009 11:55am

oh, what's that called then?

rcaz · 17-06-2009 11:57am

Double tracking is just recording the singing twice. It's done all the time in modern music. You can usually tell it by syllables not perfectly matching up. It is literally two people singing (but they're both the same person

)

When I'm Sixty-Four isn't double-tracked, just sped up.

Does anyone have any sweet links to Mozart Movement 3 notes? I've got nothing on it.

tazbars · 17-06-2009 11:59am

El Pr0n wrote: »

Double tracking is just recording the singing twice. It's done all the time in modern music. You can usually tell it by syllables not perfectly matching up. It is literally two people singing (but they're both the same person )

When I'm Sixty-Four isn't double-tracked, just sped up.

Does anyone have any sweet links to Mozart Movement 3 notes? I've got nothing on it.

yea got them mixed up sorry double tracking and echo effects are the recording tenchniques in she's leaving home

Idjit · 17-06-2009 12:02pm

ok this is gonna sound stupid but i cant remember the name of the other guy who sings with mccartney on shes leaving home so ill jus say this: mccartney and the other...'dude'...sing the song but their voices are double tracked so that it sounds like a quartet singing...

tazbars · 17-06-2009 12:18pm

Jade182 wrote: »

ok this is gonna sound stupid but i cant remember the name of the other guy who sings with mccartney on shes leaving home so ill jus say this: mccartney and the other...'dude'...sing the song but their voices are double tracked so that it sounds like a quartet singing...

lennon sings with him

Idjit · 17-06-2009 12:19pm

ah thank you

My brain is fried!

rcaz · 17-06-2009 12:23pm

On a slightly-related note, it's Igor Stravinsky's birthday today

Refer to the 2003 Aural Skills listening question!

tazbars · 17-06-2009 12:37pm

i know this is so basic but does anyone have any tips on how to distinguish between jigs and reels? i always get it wrong

lilmissprincess · 17-06-2009 12:37pm

Does instrumentation and rhythm fit under Musical Features?

www.leavingcertmusic.com has some notes on Beatles, not too sure how much I have the book they sell and I knwo some of the notes are in pdf form on the site, also for Mozart me thinks...

lilmissprincess · 17-06-2009 12:39pm

tazbars wrote: »

i know this is so basic but does anyone have any tips on how to distinguish between jigs and reels? i always get it wrong

Reel- double-decker double-decker.(4/4)

Jig- rashers and sausages. (6/8 time)

Sounds silly but its gotten me through six years of this...

Hornpipe is a slow reel.

Slip Jig- rashers and sausages and eggs (9/8)

tootyflutty · 17-06-2009 12:49pm

Mozart 3rd Movement.
Sonata Rondo Form.
Exposition -
1st subject a,b,c - A major - A
2nd subject a - E minor, b - E major - B
1st subject a - A major - A

Development
New Material -
Theme a - F# minor - C
Theme b - D major -C

Recapitulation
1st subject c - A major - A
2nd subject a - A major - B

Coda
1st subject a - A major - A
b
2nd subject b - D major - B
1st subject c - A major - A

Music: The build up and the aftermath

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