Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Christianity in the modern world.

Options
12467

Comments

  • Options
    #92
    MeditationMom
    Registered Users Posts: 380 ✭✭MeditationMom


    Jackass - sorry to call you this :o - you sound like a really good person who is using your faith to be compassionate and tolerant. In your case it does not hurt anyone that you believe your religion is the only true religion. I am not suspicious of anything you believe in that serves you to be peaceful and kind. You sound a little worried about other people who don't have what helps you so much in life, but you don't sound self-righteous to me.

    On the world stage though, we all, Christian, Jew, Muslim... get into a lot of trouble with this idea that our religion is the only one. That is why so many people are turning away from religion because this idea alone has caused so much bloodshed. That is why people are questioning their faiths and try to bring their scientific minds to it.

    As far as all religions melting away - think of it this way.

    When you finally "go home", or "go to heaven", or "are taken by Jesus to be with God for all of eternity" - you will be speechless, your mind will be completely empty of all thoughts, ideas, opinions, faiths, knowledge, etc - in other words - it all melts completely away in the presence of God. If a woman can take a man's breath away, make him speechless, forget everything he has ever known, blow away his mind - just think of what this would be like in God's presence. It is beyond comprehension.

    All faiths and religions are like boats, and atheists are great swimmers!

    Once you get to God/Allah/Heaven (Nirvana for Buddhists, the truth for Atheists) you can burn the boat ( or let it "melt away"). People arguing about each other's religions is silly. We should just keep paddling (meditating, praying, living compassionate lives). We certainly can consult each other on the great features of our navigational choices and help each other to get to the other side - like we are doing here on Boards :) - but even that amuses God - he knows we can only end up where he is - because he is always with us ( I am putting this into Christian language even though we are in the Buddhist forum) He - and people like Jesus - are trying to tell us, but we are too busy trying to get somewhere.

    If Jesus is said to have said, that his boat is the only boat - well, that to me is suspect. I suspect that Jesus did not say that, and suspect that these words were put into his mouth. If Jesus said "I will take you to the other shore, come follow me, be at peace, be free of your fear of drowning, I guarantee it, trust me, believe in me, my boat is the way for you because I am here only for you, even if you kill me, as long as you stay in my boat you will get there if you have faith in what I am telling you, my boat is the way" - some sneaky little devil or misguided, well-meaning fool added one word - my boat is the "only" boat, and started ramming other boats to prove his point - like the so-called "Muslim" terrorists are doing now, and like the Christians have done in the past.

    The problem is that everybody started charging for the boat rides and it all became a competition for the number of passengers with proud captains everywhere. The Jews didn't like Jesus taking on passengers for free in their days. Later the Christians didn't like the Muslims starting giving boat rides. The big religions today don't like the little Indian and Japanese gurus "stealing" passengers etc, and so it all goes on forever.

    Some have motor boats, some sailboats, some leaky boats, old boats, new boats, big ones, little ones, some with Captains, some without, some are paddling like mad, or rowing in peace, some are swimming, some are just floating, trusting in the river - and, some are drowning. Even the dead get washed up on the shore.


  • Options
    #93
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    Hello again MM, with respect to your beliefs, I find your language just a bit too "fluffy", too wishy-washy. Sorry. Truth is something far more concrete.

    Jesus is either the Son of God, or He's not.
    Reincarnation is either true or it's not.
    God is either a Trinity of three Persons, or He is not.
    Jesus either rose from the dead, or He did not.
    Mohammed is either the last prophet of God or he isn't.
    Jesus is either the Messiah or He is not, etc, etc....

    IMO, Christiantity is the only "boat" with no hole in the bottom. Jesus died for us and nobody goes to death by crucifixion lightly. He could have very easily avoided His death but He didn't. He must have had a very good reason!

    God bless,
    Noel.


  • Options
    #94
    MeditationMom
    Registered Users Posts: 380 ✭✭MeditationMom


    You are a very logical person, kelly1. It is true, I have long left logic for fluffy and am deeply contented in the wishy-washy.


  • Options
    #95
    Archeron
    Registered Users Posts: 6,205 ✭✭✭Archeron


    MeditationMom wrote: »
    You are a very logical person, kelly1. It is true, I have long left logic for fluffy and am deeply contented in the wishy-washy.

    Fan of fluffiness or not, your post above with the boating metaphors is beautifully written :)


  • Options
    #96
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    MeditationMom wrote: »
    You are a very logical person, kelly1. It is true, I have long left logic for fluffy and am deeply contented in the wishy-washy.
    Surely the truth regarding the way to everlasting life must be of paramount concern for us humans? This life is only a short sojourn on the road to eternity. You say that all roads eventually lead to God but what if you're wrong? What if Jesus is the only way to God and reincarnation is a cunning trick of the devil to lure poor souls into a false sense of security???

    Do you think we can afford to be complacent about this? Is is wise to lie back "rowing your boat merrily down the stream" unaware of the treacherous waterfall we could be heading for? How can we safely discount the possibility that this is the only life on this planet and that after death comes judgment followed by Heaven or Hell?

    After my conversion/reversion 5 years ago, one thing that really struck was how I had been deceived in so many ways by false philosophies and religions. The devil is a cunning ba***rd! He uses every trick in the book and his book is a big one.

    As Jesus said He is the "Way the Truth and the Life" and "The Truth shall set you free". i.e. if you don't know the truth, you are a slave to falsehood. Jesus also said that "Satan is a liar and murderer from the beginning and the father of lies".

    God bless,
    Noel.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #97
    Archeron
    Registered Users Posts: 6,205 ✭✭✭Archeron


    kelly1 wrote: »
    What if Jesus is the only way to God and reincarnation is a cunning trick of the devil to lure poor souls into a false sense of security???

    Do you think we can afford to be complacent about this? Is is wise to lie back "rowing your boat merrily down the stream" unaware of the treacherous waterfall we could be heading for?


    But what if Jesus isnt? What if the Islamic faith are right? Or Hindu? Or any of the religions? Thats the point of this thread, how do we KNOW what is right and what is wrong, and with that in mind, where to put our allegience? How do we know what parts of what we hear is lies? I agree that its an important question, but IMO, none of the major religions offer any concrete advice over any of the others and that is not enough to allow me to close my eyes to other potential answers.

    As for being complacent, I would feel that it is better to be complacent and to live a peaceful life offering kindness and consideration to your fellow man, than to follow a specific religion wholeheartedly and possibly kill or harm the innocent in a quest to spread that truth. I know that most (some?) Christians are peaceful people, but recent events around the world have shown us where absolute faith in religion can lead, and that is to misery and heartache.

    If Jesus is the real prophet, would he not show forgiveness for those who have lived good lives, regardless of who they worshipped or believed in? At the end of time, when Judgement day comes, if I have lived my life as a good man, and have never harmed another, I feel that to be sentenced to eternal damnation because I didnt believe in the right diety to be rather egotistical on behalf of the diety in question.
    (no offense intended in what I am saying here, of course).
    That is part of where my interest in Buddhism stems. It practices tolerance and kindness and compassion, and I feel that THAT is the true way to reaching the true God, whomever he/she/it/where may be.


  • Options
    #98
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    Archeron wrote: »
    1. But what if Jesus isnt? What if the Islamic faith are right? Or Hindu? Or any of the religions? Thats the point of this thread, how do we KNOW what is right and what is wrong, and with that in mind, where to put our allegience? How do we know what parts of what we hear is lies? I agree that its an important question, but IMO, none of the major religions offer any concrete advice over any of the others and that is not enough to allow me to close my eyes to other potential answers.

    2. As for being complacent, I would feel that it is better to be complacent and to live a peaceful life offering kindness and consideration to your fellow man, than to follow a specific religion wholeheartedly and possibly kill or harm the innocent in a quest to spread that truth. I know that most (some?) Christians are peaceful people, but recent events around the world have shown us where absolute faith in religion can lead, and that is to misery and heartache.

    3. If Jesus is the real prophet, would he not show forgiveness for those who have lived good lives, regardless of who they worshipped or believed in? At the end of time, when Judgement day comes, if I have lived my life as a good man, and have never harmed another, I feel that to be sentenced to eternal damnation because I didnt believe in the right diety to be rather egotistical on behalf of the diety in question.
    (no offense intended in what I am saying here, of course).
    That is part of where my interest in Buddhism stems. It practices tolerance and kindness and compassion, and I feel that THAT is the true way to reaching the true God, whomever he/she/it/where may be.

    Firstly before I start I would like to just thank you for giving me a bit more material to comment on. This is the kind of thing that I was thinking into before I started into the Christian faith and into the ins and outs of it. I have numbered the topics you have dealt with in relation to the paragraphs that you have put them in just for ease of response and reading purposes.

    1. As for the age old question of what if this religion is right or if that religion is right. I personally believe that we do not have to deal with this questions as Christianity, however I suppose that I regard my religion as being the closest to divinely revealed truths that are out there.

    However as a Christian I also cannot ignore how some other major world faiths have adopted certain principles of truth, particularly in the Golden Rule or the rule of being onto others as you would unto yourself. I however regard Christianity as being more true as I have progressed in my encounters with it, and as I have felt the Holy Spirit in my life (or as I claim depending on what you yourself believe). This is the spiritual side of it of the empirical side of the experience of being Christian, feeling God and feeling the changes that He can carry out in your daily life. I know for a fact that I am not the same person as the person who picked up the Bible the first time. So yes it depends on the person on how much the religion has progressed or influenced their lives.

    Although there is another category that one must consider, the logic and the history and the connections between the spiritual and the reality. Looking throughout the fields of Christology, or the place of the historical Christ and the Spiritual Christ they tend to interlink very closely. Then you have to look forward in the development of Christian identity from the start of the Jewish nation right up until Christ broke down the barriers between Jews or Gentiles, slave or free. After consulting the Bible narrative and the other histories and even some of the works of the Apostle Thomas (although I don't consider these to constitute the guidelines of my faith they are useful in Christian understanding) it became apparent to me that I was following the correct path.

    Although some other religions may have some brilliant teachings, I believe that Christianity has the most comprehensive morality system for human life in this world today. The fact that this religion has a purpose, the fact it impacts peoples lives just as much as it has mine is the ultimate proof that it indeed is the true religion in my eyes anyhow. It is up to each individual to make this choice.

    2. As I'm pretty certain it is impossible to have a level of human kindness without religion, I think that one needs the power of the Holy Spirit and the power of Christ along side them to make a powerful impact and to act kindly towards ones neighbour, and to put self aside and to think of God's wishes for the world and to think of those around you. This reminds me of Christ's teaching based on the Jewish Shema, when he was being asked about the most important command in the Law.
    Matthew 22:36-40 wrote:
    "Teacher which commandment in the law is the greatest? He said to him, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart with all your soul and with all your mind." This is the greatest commandment and the second is like it: "You shall love your neighbour as yourself." On these two commandments depend the law and the prophets".

    Christianity is exactly about peace. I don't know where the notion of killing came from. Unfortunately some despicable people did kill in the name of Christ, and I'm sure this puts a great shame on him and us as His Christian people. Christianity spread initially through the peace, love and the teaching of the prophets as well as giving people throughout Europe and the Middle East a comprehensive system by which they could govern their lives.
    Matthew 26:52 wrote:
    Then Jesus said to him, "Put your sword back in it's place; for all who take the sword will perish by the sword".

    I also believe that violence is futile, as you are killing your fellow brother and sister by Christ and are ultimately limiting the possibility of Christian impact on the earth. People are harming us if they are taking the knife or the gun in the name of Christ, just as it is done in any other religion.

    3. Jesus is far more than a prophet. He is a human manifestation of the Almighty God. You have to understand this from a Christian view this question.
    Romans 14:28 wrote:
    But those who have doubts are condemned if they eat, because if they do not act from faith; for whatever does not proceed from conviction is sin.

    The idea behind the concept of hell is actually discussed in several ways and there are different camps on hell. Some even being as subtle as referring to it as life without God, which would be torment for the faithful. Of course you have several other groups regarding it as a place of punishment. Theologians have been discussing this for centuries. All that we know is that there is a means of punishment yes.

    You have to understand that God has been reaching out to you in particular since the second you were born, and He has always welcomed you to live in peace of mind with him. He will wait your whole lifetime. However unfortunately there is only limited availability, and you ultimately need to make a decision, are you going to accept Him or are you going to reject Him. Christians consider that truly good works come from accepting God's authority in the universe. Why should He recognise you if you refuse to recognise Him? That's the interesting question that nobody seems to want to pose.

    I wish you the best of luck on your spiritual quest and I hope that you will look towards the Bible for inspiration.


  • Options
    #99
    maitri
    Closed Accounts Posts: 426 ✭✭maitri


    Jakkass wrote: »
    2. As I'm pretty certain it is impossible to have a level of human kindness without religion, I think that one needs the power of the Holy Spirit and the power of Christ along side them to make a powerful impact and to act kindly towards ones neighbour, and to put self aside and to think of God's wishes for the world and to think of those around you.


    This made me curious: Are you saying here that you believe that the kindness of your non-Christian neighbours isn't as strong as the kindness of Christians, that it does not have a powerful impact and thus doesn't really "work"?

    Do you mean that non-Christians cannot do any real good?

    If you are, is this really compatible with your experience?


  • Options
    #100
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    maitri wrote: »
    This made me curious: Are you saying here that you believe that the kindness of your non-Christian neighbours isn't as strong as the kindness of Christians, that it does not have a powerful impact and thus doesn't really "work"?

    Do you mean that non-Christians cannot do any real good?

    If you are, is this really compatible with your experience?

    Interesting point. What is good comes from God as far as I am concerned, and He is the measure of what is good. Yes people can do good without religion or Christianity to an extent. However I would always hold that one needs to attain a relationship with God to allow Him to work good through you. There is only so much good one can do on his or her own steam. Also, when one does a good deed to another, I always try to remember that this is God working through mankind, any appending of these good deeds to a particular person can in some cases lead to arrogance, and it is our duty as Christians not to cause a fellow believer to fall into sin.

    But to answer the main point of your question, I believe good deeds that come through Christians are more likely to repeat themselves than good deeds that come as a result of no faith at all.

    The point is not that non-Christians cannot do good, it's that if you are Christian you have more power to do good if you ask it from the Spirit.


  • Options
    #101
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    Archeron wrote: »
    But what if Jesus isnt? What if the Islamic faith are right? Or Hindu? Or any of the religions? Thats the point of this thread, how do we KNOW what is right and what is wrong, and with that in mind, where to put our allegience? How do we know what parts of what we hear is lies? I agree that its an important question, but IMO, none of the major religions offer any concrete advice over any of the others and that is not enough to allow me to close my eyes to other potential answers.
    IMO, I'd say that Christianity is likely to be the most pleasing to God. Christianity emphasizes the enormity and ugliness of sin and the importance of holiness through doing God's will. At the same time Christianity is not so rigid that it forbids alcohol and the eating of meat. I don't think any other religion has an "economy of salvation" meaning that sin incurs "debt" which must paid according to divine justice. Hence Jesus died for our sins.
    Archeron wrote: »
    As for being complacent, I would feel that it is better to be complacent and to live a peaceful life offering kindness and consideration to your fellow man, than to follow a specific religion wholeheartedly and possibly kill or harm the innocent in a quest to spread that truth. I know that most (some?) Christians are peaceful people, but recent events around the world have shown us where absolute faith in religion can lead, and that is to misery and heartache.
    Fair points. I don't think religion should involve violence.
    Archeron wrote: »
    If Jesus is the real prophet, would he not show forgiveness for those who have lived good lives, regardless of who they worshipped or believed in? At the end of time, when Judgement day comes, if I have lived my life as a good man, and have never harmed another, I feel that to be sentenced to eternal damnation because I didnt believe in the right diety to be rather egotistical on behalf of the diety in question.
    Good question. Nobody except God knows who will actually be saved. The main point about Christianity is that Jesus alone opened the gates of Heaven which was closed due to original sin. This effectively means that nobody can be saved through their own efforts of atonement. Everyone was ever born on this planet can only be saved by the blood of Christ so we depend entirely on Jesus for salvation. The Catholic Church teaches that salvation is possible for non-Christians but it considerably lessens their chances, so to speak.
    Archeron wrote: »
    (no offense intended in what I am saying here, of course).
    That is part of where my interest in Buddhism stems. It practices tolerance and kindness and compassion, and I feel that THAT is the true way to reaching the true God, whomever he/she/it/where may be.
    Compassion etc is all good but above still applies.

    God bless,
    Noel.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #102
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    maitri wrote: »
    This made me curious: Are you saying here that you believe that the kindness of your non-Christian neighbours isn't as strong as the kindness of Christians, that it does not have a powerful impact and thus doesn't really "work"?

    Do you mean that non-Christians cannot do any real good?
    Hello Maitri, my answer to this is that some good done for the love of God is far more valuable in the sight of God than the same thing done purely out of human goodness. Christ said that what we did for/to the least of His brethern was done for/to Him.

    Another point is that something done for Christ or "in union" with Christ is far more meritorious because God considers the good coming from Christ but applies the merit to us so the act becomes infinitely good as opposed to finite.

    God bless,
    Noel.


  • Options
    #103
    Popinjay
    Registered Users Posts: 507 ✭✭✭Popinjay


    kelly1 wrote: »
    IMO, I'd say that Christianity is likely to be the most pleasing to God.

    I understand that this thread is about christianity in the modern world but I had to raise this point. Christianity is only likely to be the most pleasing to God if the Christian god is really the one true god.

    If the Christian god doesn't exist then it's hardly likely that whatever divine power is up there is going to find the worship of an incorrect idea of what it is very pleasing. If the real god is a she for example, she might take exception to being constantly referred to as a male.

    I know you were only stating your opinion but that opinion makes a rather large assumption.


  • Options
    #104
    MeditationMom
    Registered Users Posts: 380 ✭✭MeditationMom


    by kelly1 - Surely the truth regarding the way to everlasting life must be of paramount concern for us humans? This life is only a short sojourn on the road to eternity.

    100% true!!!!!!!
    by kelly1 - You say that all roads eventually lead to God but what if you're wrong? What if Jesus is the only way to God and reincarnation is a cunning trick of the devil to lure poor souls into a false sense of security???


    It is a common mistake to have reincarnation and eternal life confused. To Buddhists eternal life comes after all Karma is fulfilled. ""Many lives" does not mean "eternal life". Eternal life is beyond life. Not after life, not before life, not many lives - it means beyond life. And that is hard to explain. You can only discover it through mediation, through Jesus' Way. 40 days in the desert is a good start. Or, Buddha's Way. Find a Bodhi tree.

    When Jesus says he is the Way, he means meditation is the Way, prayer is the Way, not falling for the many distractions of the material world - is the Way. Jakkass' explanation of asking for help from the holy spirit in this, is also a useful aspect of Christianity. Buddhist simply go deeply into an attitude of trust and surrender. It's just a more abstract way than thinking of the holy ghost/spirit - but it is the same mechanism.

    Nothing in the material world is eternal or infinite. Not even Christianity. Just pretend Jesus never said anything - and take what is left - that! - is the Way. You have to figure out what that is! All words, all teachings, all religions are of the finite world. Nothing but boats. Useful, but just ways to get home.

    If you believe your boat - Christianity - is the only boat, just make sure you stay in it!!! You'll see when you get there whether all the other people made it or not. Wouldn't you be happy if all the Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, Jews were already there to welcome you? Wouldn't you turn around and welcome all the Christians, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus and Jews that came behind you?


  • Options
    #105
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    MeditationMom wrote: »
    Nothing in the material world is eternal or infinite. Not even Christianity. Just pretend Jesus never said anything - and take what is left - that! - is the Way. You have to figure out what that is! All words, all teachings, all religions are of the finite world. Nothing but boats. Useful, but just ways to get home.

    The way must be nothing, or if I was to take your post literally it would mean Judaism if Jesus said nothing.

    The very purpose of Christ was exactly to lead us on the way (Gk: hodos). That is why he had a group of followers and that is essentially why he took a huge roadtrip if you want modern terms, to tell everyone of the ways by which they should lead. Living a Christian life as far as we are concerned (I think Noel will agree?) is following the teachings of Christ. Gk: Christianos = partisan of Christ.

    You have to understand that there is the New Jerusalem (described in Revelations), and a place where God will live with mankind.


  • Options
    #106
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    MeditationMom wrote: »
    It is a common mistake to have reincarnation and eternal life confused. To Buddhists eternal life comes after all Karma is fulfilled. ""Many lives" does not mean "eternal life". Eternal life is beyond life.
    I understand what reincarnation is. There are two false things about it. 1. nobody reincarnates and 2. reincarnation by definition means that we can reach our ultimate goal by our own efforts (fulfilling karma). Christ taught that His death on the cross opened the way to eternal life for us and that it had nothing to do with our actions.
    MeditationMom wrote: »
    When Jesus says he is the Way, he means meditation is the Way, prayer is the Way, not falling for the many distractions of the material world - is the Way.
    No sorry, Jesus said He *IS* the Way. He said nothing about salvation through meditation. I don't suppose you have a passage from scripture to support your claim, do you?
    MeditationMom wrote: »
    Nothing in the material world is eternal or infinite. Not even Christianity. Just pretend Jesus never said anything - and take what is left - that! - is the Way. You have to figure out what that is! All words, all teachings, all religions are of the finite world. Nothing but boats. Useful, but just ways to get home.
    Jesus said:
    Luke 21:33 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

    Why pretend Jesus never said anything?! He spoke the truth! What's leftover is lies. Sorry, you're using that fluffy language again.
    MeditationMom wrote: »
    If you believe your boat - Christianity - is the only boat, just make sure you stay in it!!!
    Why stay in it if the other "boats" will also take me home?
    MeditationMom wrote: »
    You'll see when you get there whether all the other people made it or not. Wouldn't you be happy if all the Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, Jews were already there to welcome you? Wouldn't you turn around and welcome all the Christians, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus and Jews that came behind you?
    What I believe is that Heaven will *mostly* be populated by Christians. The blood of Christ is the *only* thing that allows access to Heaven. Nobody goes to the Father except through Christ. I do believe however that God will take into account peoples ignorance of the Gospel and judge people according to how they lived. But without Christ, we're all damned. Simple as that.


  • Options
    #107
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    Jakkass wrote: »
    Living a Christian life as far as we are concerned (I think Noel will agree?) is following the teachings of Christ. Gk: Christianos = partisan of Christ.
    I sure do. The chief concern of every Christian should be to do the will of God as revealed by Christ and His apostles. It is the Father's will that we obey the teachings of His Son. Jesus went beyond the 10 commandments in the beatitutes and in His teachings about loving our neighbour as ourselves for the love of God.


  • Options
    #108
    CerebralCortex
    Registered Users Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭CerebralCortex


    kelly1 wrote: »
    .....But without Christ, we're all damned. Simple as that.....

    And you call us atheists arrogant!!?? :confused:


  • Options
    #109
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    CerebralCortex wrote: »
    And you call us atheists arrogant!!?? :confused:
    In case you've misunderstood me, what I'm saying is that everyone who ever was or will be saved will only be saved by Christ's sacrifice on the cross. He died for all mankind past and present. I'm not saying that only Christians will be saved.


  • Options
    #110
    yomchi
    Registered Users Posts: 4,621 ✭✭✭yomchi


    MeditationMom wrote: »
    100% true!!!!!!!




    It is a common mistake to have reincarnation and eternal life confused. To Buddhists eternal life comes after all Karma is fulfilled. ""Many lives" does not mean "eternal life". Eternal life is beyond life. Not after life, not before life, not many lives - it means beyond life. And that is hard to explain. You can only discover it through mediation, through Jesus' Way. 40 days in the desert is a good start. Or, Buddha's Way. Find a Bodhi tree.

    When Jesus says he is the Way, he means meditation is the Way, prayer is the Way, not falling for the many distractions of the material world - is the Way. Jakkass' explanation of asking for help from the holy spirit in this, is also a useful aspect of Christianity. Buddhist simply go deeply into an attitude of trust and surrender. It's just a more abstract way than thinking of the holy ghost/spirit - but it is the same mechanism.

    Nothing in the material world is eternal or infinite. Not even Christianity. Just pretend Jesus never said anything - and take what is left - that! - is the Way. You have to figure out what that is! All words, all teachings, all religions are of the finite world. Nothing but boats. Useful, but just ways to get home.

    If you believe your boat - Christianity - is the only boat, just make sure you stay in it!!! You'll see when you get there whether all the other people made it or not. Wouldn't you be happy if all the Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, Jews were already there to welcome you? Wouldn't you turn around and welcome all the Christians, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus and Jews that came behind you?

    Thats a fantastic explanation of your point.


  • Options
    #111
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    Jon wrote: »
    Thats a fantastic explanation of your point.
    Yes fantastic as in fantasy :)


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #112
    yomchi
    Registered Users Posts: 4,621 ✭✭✭yomchi


    True! What a paradox, as reality is really fantasy anyway.


  • Options
    #113
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    Jon wrote: »
    True! What a paradox, as reality is really fantasy anyway.
    Couldn't agree less.


  • Options
    #114
    iFight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,498 ✭✭✭iFight


    kelly1 wrote: »
    I do believe however that God will take into account peoples ignorance of the Gospel and judge people according to how they lived.

    Kelly1 wrote:
    But without Christ, we're all damned. Simple as that.

    So God will take into account that people born into different religious backgrounds will be ignorant to Christianity's teachings and then punish them anyway for not eating Christ every Sunday?

    Sort of a twisted logic.


  • Options
    #115
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    iFight wrote: »
    So God will take into account that people born into different religious backgrounds will be ignorant to Christianity's teachings and then punish them anyway for not eating Christ every Sunday?

    Sort of a twisted logic.
    Where did I say that? :confused:


  • Options
    #116
    iFight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,498 ✭✭✭iFight


    kelly1 wrote: »
    Where did I say that? :confused:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55126314&postcount=106


  • Options
    #117
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    iFight wrote: »
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55126314&postcount=106

    God will ...... punish them anyway for not eating Christ every Sunday?
    I didn't say the above, did I?


  • Options
    #118
    yomchi
    Registered Users Posts: 4,621 ✭✭✭yomchi


    kelly1 wrote: »
    Couldn't agree less.

    excellent. And so the earth continues to spin :)


  • Options
    #119
    iFight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,498 ✭✭✭iFight


    kelly1 wrote: »
    I didn't say the above, did I?

    Well my replies aren't always going to use your exact words. I quoted you above my reply. The bit that is in the quote tags is the quote.

    You said that God will take into account people being brought up through other faiths. Then you said that without Christ we are damned.
    Make up your mind.


  • Options
    #120
    kelly1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,026 ✭✭✭kelly1


    iFight wrote: »
    Well my replies aren't always going to use your exact words. I quoted you above my reply. The bit that is in the quote tags is the quote.

    You said that God will take into account people being brought up through other faiths. Then you said that without Christ we are damned.
    Make up your mind.
    Oh I see. Just to clarify, what I mean is that if Christ hadn't died on the cross, nobody could possibly be saved, regardless of their religion. i.e Nobody is saved ever except by Christ's atoning sacrifice. So Christ wasn't just another teacher. He is the source of all Truth and He came to save us primarily by His sacrifice and also with the truth.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #121
    monosharp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,981 ✭✭✭monosharp


    kelly1 wrote: »
    Oh I see. Just to clarify, what I mean is that if Christ hadn't died on the cross, nobody could possibly be saved, regardless of their religion. i.e Nobody is saved ever except by Christ's atoning sacrifice. So Christ wasn't just another teacher. He is the source of all Truth and He came to save us primarily by His sacrifice and also with the truth.

    This is what turned me away from Christianity and every time I hear it I'm glad I did.


Advertisement