Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all! We have been experiencing an issue on site where threads have been missing the latest postings. The platform host Vanilla are working on this issue. A workaround that has been used by some is to navigate back from 1 to 10+ pages to re-sync the thread and this will then show the latest posts. Thanks, Mike.
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Should we suppress the Irish language.. ?

  • 15-02-2006 7:24am
    #1
    JaysusMacfeck
    Closed Accounts Posts: 324 ✭✭JaysusMacfeck


    NOT FOR THE GAEILGE FORUM. I want unbiased answers.

    Interested on your views on this.

    When I was walking through town today I got a thinkin'. All the public transport systems and street signs with the Irish language, do you think we'd be better off doing away with Irish and enforcing English as the ONLY language in the country?

    The majority of us just speak English. Irish is an inferior language (which has been drilled into us by British occupation in Ireland for many a year) perhaps it's time the government bit the bullet and ditched Irish altogether from the constitution. They've made a balls of the education system in regards to the language anyway.

    Seeing as the majority of us don't speak Irish (and most of us hate it because of the way it's taught) let's just be done with it altogether; remove the requirement for Irish in schools, place names on signs, etc, etc.

    Let's face it, us tax payers are paying a good few cent to keep these Irish language departments alive in the country, and what do we get out of it?

    Remove Irish from the education system, remove the Irish language completely from Ireland and let's get on with speaking English. After all, Ireland is just a damaged region of Britain with a few Irish speaking communities in the west. Yeah, Irish was the main language in Ireland not too long ago, but the famine (British genocide) fixed that. And a good job it did too.

    So, for those of you that haven't a word of Irish, should we suppress it and be done with it for good? What purpose does it serve our 'country'? Choose your poll choice now!



    But hold on, flip the coin for a minute le do thoil.

    Yes, the government have made a balls of things with our language particularly with the education system and the curriculum; those that have sat the Leaving Cert will know how bad the Irish curriculum is.. Boring, Ancient, Prehistoric, well out of date? Did I mention ‘horrendously boring’?

    So as I'm now on the flip side of the cent coin, let me think, why should the government pump money into the Irish language and why should they continue to protect the Gaeltachts?

    Those of you that have studied Irish and have developed respect for it will understand that it is the most poetic and beautiful language to be in existence today. A difficult language, yes, but it’s also one of the oldest languages in Europe.. she's delicate and needs way more attention.

    Set aside the abysmal education system fán second. A lot of you (but certainly not all) hated Irish in school, you didn't understand why you had to learn it, you paid no attention to Irish history, you just wanted to get on with life and communicate with your friends in your mother tongue.

    After school, you began to travel around the world discovering different cultures and languages.. but hold on, you're continuously mistaken as an American or British citizen? American aint so bad, but to be mistaken as a British citizen is a bit of a kick in the nuts for a lot of us. It's also a kick in the heart when the majority of foreigners think that Ireland is apart of the UK.. It's a damn shame that, isn't it?

    And why do foreigners think that? Because Ireland is an English speaking country, as is Scotland, and therefore due to out close proximity (amongst many other facotrs) we are assumed to be British. It’s a pisser that isn’t it? I’ve since educated and chastised many a Spanish/Italian/French ach mar shampla.. the Dutch and Germans are usually very well clued up on Irish history, and fair play to their education system for that.

    Unfortuanatley the British themselves, god bless them, are taught a very filtered and cleansed version of history in school. Did you know that the Irish “famine” and ALL the other atrocities against the Irish by the British are completely non-existent in the British curriculum? Keep that in mind the next time an innocent English person visits Ireland, they have absolutely NO clue about the bloodshed in Ireland by the Brits for that past 800 years. They were taught that Ireland was a "troublesome nation" in the British empire for decades, etc, etc. The Scottish however include Irish history in their curriculum, you’d have a very different conversation with them.

    Moving on to somthing else, so you’re in Brazil mar shanpla, and how you wished you could speak Irish to your buddy about what that arsehole behind the bar just said, or perhaps you would have liked to have described in detail what your plans were for that sexy wench beside the fish tank; she was eyeing you up! You can’t though can you? You can’t express yourself properly in Irish, your official language. Don’t blame yourself, it’s never too late to learn though. There's no shortage of classes now.

    Unfortualtey though the response from a lot of you will be “don’t care”, or “Irish… ****e”.. and it really is a damn shame folks.

    So, Bertie? What the shag are you doing to our language? Build it or kill it mate.

    Thanks for reading. You’re either anti Irish or Pro English, mayhaps in between for some reason.. but the response from all of my friends is Pro Irish… “but I just can’t speak it!!” I’d assume the same response from a lot of the Irish posse.

    Slán Slán agus ciao.

    The Irish language 520 votes

    Ban Irish from the State and enforce English as the main language.
    0% 0 votes
    Reform the Irish curriculum, boost funding, and encourage Irish.
    17% 90 votes
    Don't do anything. Leave the state of the Irish language as it is.
    82% 430 votes
    Tagged:


«134567…10

Comments

  • #2
    tba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,111 ✭✭✭tba


    I wish I could speak Irish

    Although I wish I could speak Spanish, French, German, Italian, Chinese, Japanese and a multitude of other different languages aswell...


  • #3
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    It needs to play more of a part in our lives. Otherwise, we may aswell call ourselves english. Many countries do just fine with two languages, Ireland could too.


  • #4
    Grem
    Registered Users Posts: 145 ✭✭Grem


    Thats a fantastic argument u have there. Enjoyed reading it. Id love to be able to speak more Irish, can have a conversation in it but have to substitute some words as english which kind of gives the game away if your talking about someone in a foreign country.
    Most people in school arent bothered with spending time learning it bacause we practically never use it in day to day life. Which is a shame.
    In Australia at the moment and the amount of people who mistake me for a British person is crazy! Its understandable seeing as we both speak similarly but then when you explain they are Irish they still say stupid stuff like "Is it cold over there in the UK". Grrr!

    The Irish language should definately NOT be abolished.


  • #5
    mise_me_fein_V2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭mise_me_fein_V2


    It should be reformed. I think everyone can remember reading Irish in primary school and not knowing what they were talking about.

    I didn't know what ta me meant for 5 or 6 years.

    If it was taught like the way the Dutch teach English, I think we'd be fine.


  • #6
    Archeron
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,330 ✭✭✭Archeron


    A Chara.
    Like most other people, I didnt like Irish in school, but I think what I disliked most was the way it was taught. Now, many moons after leaving school, I'm sorry i didnt pay more attention, as I do truly think that Irish is a beautiful language that should be protected and used as much as possible. Nothing makes me smile more that hearing my fellow Paddies using Irish in everyday life, and while it doesnt happen often, it does happen occasionally.

    I'd be all for the funding and encouragement 100%, but not for ramming it down peoples throats. I would think that with the increasing multiculturalism in this fine country, that more people will naturally feel inclined to learn the language of their country anyway. Its part of our identity, and even more so now with so many people from all over the world being welcomed here.
    As an aside, does anyone know where you can find details of places offering Irish language courses for adults? Or can anyone suggest an alternative way of learning , maybe linguaphone or something?
    Go raibh maith agat.


  • Advertisement
  • #7
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    When I was younger, I didn't appreciate Irish. Although I studied honours Irish, I can barely speak a word of it now. Just some very basic stuff. It's a damn shame, because it's only when you get a little older, you learn to really appreciate your culture more. Why is that? I'm not sure..


  • #8
    Red Alert
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 7,486 ✭✭✭Red Alert


    I got an A1 in honours, but disliked the way it was taught. Emphasis should only be on oral and written (as in say French, where the written is about modern topics). Ditch the literature and leave it either in a separate optional course or let it wait until university.


  • #9
    Oral Slang
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,519 ✭✭✭Oral Slang


    I did my whole education through Irish & would recommend it to anyone thats contemplating sending their children to all irish schools..
    I'm so glad I am fluent in irish (not that I get any chance to speak it), but I really feel proud that I can speak it if I want to. Any friends I have that can't speak irish usually say they would love to. There should be really more irish evening classes in place, if what I've heard is anything to go by!
    Irish has really picked up in recent years in Dublin.. More & more irish playschools are opening, so in turn the irish primary & secondary schools are full to brimming point!
    Really hope that when / if I have children I have to opportunity to send them to irish schools. I found leaving 2 languages from such an earlier age, made it easier to learn foreign languages..
    As everyone else says, they just need to start teaching irish the way other languages are taught, with fresh ideas & new books!


  • #10
    tba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,111 ✭✭✭tba


    What way are other languages taught in our fellow EU states exactly?

    Just curious as I have no experience of it.


  • #11
    Stephen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,484 ✭✭✭✭Stephen


    Suppress it? Absolutely not. Remove its compulsory status? Yes. Let those who want to learn it do so, and let those who don't, have the freedom to ignore it. Keep dual-language signage and so on... in gaeltacht areas too.


  • Advertisement
  • #12
    spahndirge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 69 ✭✭spahndirge


    Irish Language Training


  • #13
    finlma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 712 ✭✭✭finlma


    Irish is a beautiful language and should be promoted more. It is being improved at primary school level - bringing in an emphasis on conversational Irish. Thats a huge start.

    Its pretty obvious that something is wrong when every Irish person learns the language for 14 years of school but can yet barely hold a conversation.


  • #14
    Kojak
    Registered Users Posts: 12,801 ✭✭✭✭Kojak


    I dont see why Irish should be surpressed - every other language in the E.U. no matter how obscure etc. isn't pressurised into existance.

    I agree that it shouldn't be made compulsory. Also the curriculm should be changed - I liked irish spreaking and writing but detested the poetry and short stories.

    If there was a 'modern irish' subject for the Leaving involving more spoken and writen irish then I believe it would be more popular.


  • #15
    Belle Screeching Drivel
    Posts: 0 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Belle Screeching Drivel


    No, I don't think it should stop being compulsory. I do think it should be taught properly. Learning all those finicky grammar rules only at LC level is a joke.
    A lot of other countries that teaches a language from an early age - the speakers are fluent by 13 or so. When I was in Denmark, the kids around that age had fine English.

    Maybe there's a view of Irish as being old fashioned and boring, and brings to mind ros na run. That kinda thing. Maybe they could work on that too.

    I did honours and I liked it well enough though its been a few years so I forget a lot...


  • #16
    Dave!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,857 ✭✭✭✭Dave!


    No it shouldn't be suppressed; there should be a massive change in the way it's taught, focusing alot more on oral work and every-day usage, and alot less on poetry and stories. We're not there yet, so let's stop pretending we're as good at Irish as at English, and don't use the English course as a template for the Irish one. Completely change it, knock it down and build it up again from the bottom. And simultaneously, encourage places like post offices, Gardaí, etc., to speak as Gaeilge, thereby giving people an opportunity to start using the cúpla focail in their everyday activities.

    Seems like a decent enough plan... Yeah, it'd cost a bit of tax money, but it's worth it in my opinion.


  • #17
    murphaph
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,031 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    It should be removed from all roads signage in English speaking parts of Ireland and the requirement on public transport operators to use it (thanks DeV) should be removed also. For the Miniscule number of people who can only speak Irish, 99.99% of people suffer because of cluttered, awkward signage.

    Spend money on it in other ways. Ramming it down our throats by calling the DUTC 'Bus Atha Cliath' has not suddenly created half a million Irish speakers in Dublin.

    As for wanting to be differentiated from an english person, well I think that's kind of sad. We have a lot in common with the United Kingdom.


  • #18
    Mmmm_Lemony
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 891 ✭✭✭Mmmm_Lemony


    I like many others here wish I could speak irish but can't because it was difficult in school to learn. We had a great teacher in primary and I was nearly fluent but when we got to secondary the first three years we had an absolute maniac. If you did your homework he liked you and he was a great teacher if you got on his good side. If you didn't (and I certainly didn't) you struggled. I was eventually moved to pass for the inter and the teacher we had, had no confidence and the class ran riot.

    I will definitely be sending my kids to an Irish Speaking School even considering the very high cost. If the government put as much funding into education and in particular the irish language instead of leaky funking tunnels, we would all be speaking irish (the whole nation) and we would be smart enough not to fall for the bull**** tunnel expenses and the crappy road network, and the..... well pretty much everything about this country is fecked because of the idiots that are running the comedy show!!!!
    spahndirge wrote:
    Irish Language Training

    OT - the guy in the film looks like wolverine!


  • #19
    Sleepy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,268 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    I'd definitely be for removing the language from the Leaving Cert sylabus as a mandatory subject. The opportunity costs of forcing the language on our young people are far too high and what's gained by having the language forced down their throats is of far to low a value to be considered worthwhile continuing with.

    Given that the Leaving Cert is pretty much the only determinant in college place allocation in this country, the imposition of Irish as one of a student's seven subjects discriminates against those students that don't have an apptitude for languages.

    In the entirety of this thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=291582 not one person could make a persuasive argument for the continuation of Irish as a mandatory Leaving Cert subject (unless the point was made towards the end of the thread when certain parties of the debate started using Irish which I'd already pointed out that I couldn't understand. The thread started here in AH before being shunted to the Gaeilge board).

    Should Irish be abolished? Even I'd be against this. I like the idea of keeping place names in Irish and having it a reformed Irish curriculum as part of primary and early secondary education.

    However, I'm flatly against wasting money by insisting the language be recognised as an official working language of the EU, forcing government departments to squander my taxes on translation services that charge thousands of euros to produce Irish-language versions of official documents that few people ever bother to read in English, never mind requesting the version of the document as Gaeilge (I've come across this in a professional capacity.) I don't believe TG4 should be subsidised by the state as frankly, I can't see why 90% of the country should subsidise the other ten percent's viewing habits when we're selling the television rights to international sporting events to satelite television.

    I'm neither pro-Irish nor anti-Irish. Sure, it'd be nice if we could all speak fluent Irish but it'd also be nice if we could all read Latin, play Chopin on the piano, recite Greco-Roman poetry, play bacarat and hurl with the grace of DJ Carey. In any society where there are limited resources we must choose how best to utilise those resources in the manner which will maximise utility for the majority of the members of that society. The Irish language simply doesn't have enough tangible benefits to justify throwing money at it's life-support systems.

    So, I've picked option A on your poll. Not because I'd like to ban Irish but because I simply can't support the current misallocation of taxpayers money it receives, nevermind boosting it.


  • #20
    mickymg2003
    Closed Accounts Posts: 990 ✭✭✭mickymg2003


    Its should be encouraged and taught in schools. But it shouldnt be forced on us. If they made it an option after The junior cert.(maybe it is already but it was forced on us in my school)


  • #21
    Sleepy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,268 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    As an aside to my last post, if anyone can present a sensible, logical argument for the continued state-funding of Irish, I'd be interested to hear it.

    I will not accept 'it's worth it in my opinion', 'it's part of our culture' or 'because it differentiates us from the Brits' as a valid argument. Those are subjective viewpoints that would support an individual's decision to pay for their education in the Irish language, not for society to force the language (and pay for it to be forced upon) the population at large.

    BTW, JaysusMacFeck, if you genuinely wanted unbiased results in this poll, you'd have given unbiased answering options.


  • Advertisement
  • #22
    RefulgentGnomon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 354 ✭✭RefulgentGnomon


    There is obviously something wrong with the way it's taught when Leaving Certificate students can speak very good German/French after 5 years of learning but can barely string 2 words together 'as Gaeilge' after learning it for circa 13 years.
    Be warned about Gaelscoileanna though as I know somebody who has very good Irish from a Gaelscoil but cannot understand a lot of English words (i.e. any word the length of say 'retribution'). This could be a real hindrence if they were interested in a university course such as English Literature or Journalism.


  • #23
    tba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,111 ✭✭✭tba


    Sleepy wrote:
    As an aside to my last post, if anyone can present a sensible, logical argument for the continued state-funding of Irish, I'd be interested to hear it.

    A short answer would be, if the Irish goverment did not fund its diffusion into everyday usage who would.

    But first I would like to disagree with you on this point
    Sleepy wrote:
    I will not accept 'it's part of our culture'

    A standpoint of this nature would mean that, the literature, art, history, mythology and ideology of Ireland and Irishness is void and defunct, that it is worthless to learn or understand these concepts and ideals.

    The Irish language is part of this archetype.

    Now I will agree that influences in our culture are passing. Catholicism would be a good example, it popularuty is waning and a forced prayer session would be as repulsive as prohibition of it practice. What seperates The Irish Language from a religion is that we own the Irish language, it is akin to a precious jewel we keep in our pocket but never show because we have an assortment of borrowed gems already around our neck.

    What makes our language so much more repulsive than English that it should be thrown away by the masses only to be entertained by them as a passing fancy, the domain of those who see its true beauty.

    You say remove the Irish as a compulsory language, I say remove English, remove Maths, remove History and Geography, Physical Education and Art, why trifle with your cull.

    Destroy our heritage bit by bit and when your children, and grandchildren become something other than Irish, some mish mash of cultures, trodden together by sky one dramas, harry potter books and american sitcoms, remember all you had to do was show them that gem in your pocket.

    Its a family heirloom, treasure it, and show them Its more than just a shiny old rock.


  • #24
    thelordofcheese
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,368 ✭✭✭thelordofcheese


    I started off thinking about this, and siding with the "follow the Dutch example", and dropping Irish as a compulsory subject for the LC, but, I don't think even that'll do much good.

    Really, the success of the Dutch method has a good deal to do with the fact that English is a useful language to learn. People can go abroad and use the language they spend X amount of years learning, business can and often is conducted in English around the world.

    What real use do we have for Irish? Aside from feeling special about ourselves, it doesn't really have much of a practical use.

    So, I have to vote for A, not that I want it suppressed or anything, but because option B is just a waste of money.


  • #25
    dbnavan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭dbnavan


    Why the hell would you ban Irish, silly option IMO, promote it or leave it alone, I say promote its use.


  • #26
    Oriel
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,154 ✭✭✭Oriel


    Don't kick something when it's already down.


  • #27
    ionapaul
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,303 ✭✭✭ionapaul


    As for wanting to be differentiated from an english person, well I think that's kind of sad. We have a lot in common with the United Kingdom.

    After living for the first 20 years of my life in Galway city and the next 5+ years in California, when I first moved to Dublin a few years ago I was blown away at how similar Dublin is to any English city. Particularly the way the people speak, slang and so on, suddenly I was someone's 'mate', lads were 'blokes', girls were 'birds'. Is it worth €x million a year in an effort to maintain / support cultural diversit, or should we (particularly those of us in Dublin) just learn to accept we are as much British / American as those in London or Boston?

    It's invaluable when abroad to be able to talk with friends in public using your 'secret' language! Particularly when discussing the hot waitress...


  • #28
    Stephen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,484 ✭✭✭✭Stephen


    tba: The only compulsory subjects at leaving cert level are English, Irish and Maths, so your talk about the "cull" is rather inaccurate.
    Like it or not, English is the language that the vast majority of the country speaks day to day, and is pretty much necessary to get by. Maths is simlarly useful in varying capacities for all manner of careers.
    Irish, however, is spoken as a first language only by a tiny minority. It gets disproportionate amounts of time and money spent on it. Sure its part of our culture and heritage and all, and if you want to learn it, good for you. Just don't try to cram it down everybody's throat.


  • #29
    Terry
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,061 ✭✭✭✭Terry


    i just wish some of the people here could speak english. "aswell" and "alot" are not words.

    as for the Irish language, it's one of my biggest regrets in life that i can't speak my native language. a different teaching method may indeed be needed.

    i see a lot of complaints here about 'funding for a language that only a few people speak'. if it was taught properly, then maybe more people would be able to speak it. ever thought of that?


  • #30
    tba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,111 ✭✭✭tba


    Stephen wrote:
    tba: The only compulsory subjects at leaving cert level are English, Irish and Maths, so your talk about the "cull" is rather inaccurate.

    What about primary school and the education you recieve from your parents, your academic career does not begin in six year, nor shall it end there.


  • Advertisement
  • #31
    PlayGirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,400 ✭✭✭PlayGirl


    i think everywhere should just speak english.. how much easier would that be??


  • #32
    jonny68
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,531 ✭✭✭jonny68


    I'm absolutely appalled that any self respecting Irish person could ever suggest such a thing,disgraceful,id love to speak better Irish myself,it's just a shame more isn't done to promote and encourage people to learn our national language.:(


  • #33
    Zebra3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,946 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    I think the OP chose the wrong word 'suppress' in the heading of the thread.


  • #34
    Sleepy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,268 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    tba wrote:
    A short answer would be, if the Irish goverment did not fund its diffusion into everyday usage who would.
    Why should it be diffused into everyday usage?
    But first I would like to disagree with you on this point

    A standpoint of this nature would mean that, the literature, art, history, mythology and ideology of Ireland and Irishness is void and defunct, that it is worthless to learn or understand these concepts and ideals.

    The Irish language is part of this archetype.
    How long are you suggesting students should spend in school? If you want to spend the same 5 hours a week teaching students literature, art, history, mythology and 'ideology of Ireland' (whatever the hell that is) that we currently waste teaching Leaving Cert Students poor Irish, you'd be adding the best part of an extra year to the Leaving Cert sylabus. Irish is something that is *nice* to learn. It is not essential, nor even particularly useful in modern day usage. And no, the ability to surreptitiously perve on foreign waitresses is not a useful enough skill to warrant forcing a subject onto Leaving Cert students, ionapaul.
    Now I will agree that influences in our culture are passing. Catholicism would be a good example, it popularuty is waning and a forced prayer session would be as repulsive as prohibition of it practice. What seperates The Irish Language from a religion is that we own the Irish language, it is akin to a precious jewel we keep in our pocket but never show because we have an assortment of borrowed gems already around our neck.
    To you it's "akin to a precious jewel", to me it was a waste of fourteen years of my education. This is precisely the kind of argument I already pointed out doesn't stand up to reasoned thought. Your love for something does not make it valuable to society.
    What makes our language so much more repulsive than English that it should be thrown away by the masses only to be entertained by them as a passing fancy, the domain of those who see its true beauty.
    Did I ever say the language was repulsive? No. Though I will admit I don't see the 'beauty' of the language at all. Compared to Italian or French, it's nowhere near as pleasing to the ear IMHO.
    You say remove the Irish as a compulsory language, I say remove English, remove Maths, remove History and Geography, Physical Education and Art, why trifle with your cull.
    Forgetting the fact that History, Geography, PE and Art are already optional subjects for leaving Cert Students (as Stephen has already pointed out to you, but hey, don't let facts get in the way of impassioned debate) would you honestly like to see students sent to college without adequate numeracy or literacy skills? English and Maths are the only subjects that you will use in life no matter what career you adopt, hence they are compulsory for Leaving Cert students, and rightly so.
    Destroy our heritage bit by bit and when your children, and grandchildren become something other than Irish, some mish mash of cultures, trodden together by sky one dramas, harry potter books and american sitcoms, remember all you had to do was show them that gem in your pocket.

    Its a family heirloom, treasure it, and show them Its more than just a shiny old rock.
    You completely missed the point about what an individual values differing from what is for the benefit of society as a whole didn't you?


  • #35
    Sleepy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,268 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    jonny68 wrote:
    I'm absolutely appalled that any self respecting Irish person could ever suggest such a thing,disgraceful,id love to speak better Irish myself,it's just a shame more isn't done to promote and encourage people to learn our national language.:(
    Care to back that sentiment up with any reasoned argument?


  • #36
    mandz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 526 ✭✭✭mandz


    To echo what most people are saying i would love to be fluent in irish. Being honest i didn't like Irish until 5th year. The teacher we had for irish obviously loved the language and was so enthusiastic about it that i think it was contagious i found myself actually enjoying the class. It also helped that the short novel she picked for us to study was a modern book with issues that related to our age group. i thoroughly think that the way that it is taught needs to be changed asap. Teachers need to be more encouraging with the use of the language rather than being forceful and aggressive. As someone has already mentioned the fact that after learning the language for 14years people are not fluent seriously highlights that changes need to be made.

    I definately do not think the language should be ignored especially in todays world and in particular this country. With the new multi-national population that we have today it appears that every other nationality will retain their language giving them individuality so why can't the irish do the same? Our language, culture and heritage should be celebrated and not just abandoned to be more like the main ringleaders of western society. The irish people and countryside were liked for a reason worldwide and if we're not careful i think we are serious danger of losing this amicability.

    The fat pay check people in the Dail and Seanad need to open their eyes and do something about this problem (they couldn't even be bothered to have the language registered as a european language -hello!!) before its far too late.


  • Advertisement
  • #37
    Binomate
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,783 ✭✭✭Binomate


    spahndirge wrote:
    Irish Language Training
    I nearly pissed myself looking at that!


  • #38
    tba
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,111 ✭✭✭tba


    I dont think we can agree sleepy, you seem to think everything must have a reason, every action a purpose, I prefer to see possibilties, and an holistic path but that is just me.

    Suffice to say neither of us has convinced the other.


  • #39
    R0ot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,473 ✭✭✭R0ot


    The irish language is the best thing in ireland, i wish i had been taught it better but i had a crappy teacher in primary and developed a very poor grasp of the irish language. Everyone should be taught it. UP THE IRISH! :D


  • #40
    Dave!
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,857 ✭✭✭✭Dave!


    tba wrote:
    I dont think we can agree sleepy, you seem to think everything must have a reason, every action a purpose

    I agree, I've seen you (Sleepy) posting before about this, and you come across as wanting us all to be cogs in a machine, all fitting together, everyone university educated, everyone equally serving to benefit the economy in their respective positions -- devoid of emotion! or creativity! or romanticism!

    I've seen you posting about how we should take Irish class out and put in drivers' ed, sex ed, etc etc, and how that would benefit society greatly, which is true, but then that comes back to, at what cost? And that goes back to the importance of a national identity, and what role the Irish language can play in that, which you apparantly don't see as important, and all diddly-aye-diddly-aye stuff.

    Polarised opinions I guess. I think that the language is important.


  • #41
    Terry
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,061 ✭✭✭✭Terry


    i don't think you can put a price on national identity.


  • Advertisement
  • #42
    rainbow kirby
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,928 ✭✭✭✭rainbow kirby


    I would agree that the Irish language is important, but I don't think it should be compulsory past Junior Cert. I didn't like the subject in school, but then again, I was more of a scientific type and didn't like English or French much either. In fact, I never really enjoyed a language class until I took a Japanese class in college. It does need to be taught a lot better though, literature at LC level is pointless.


  • #43
    440Hz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,424 ✭✭✭440Hz


    Gaeilge Abu!


  • #44
    Random
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,080 ✭✭✭✭Random


    Teach us French/German/Spanish/Chinese in school instead and leave Irish as an optional extra.


  • #45
    susanna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 229 ✭✭susanna


    Ban Irish from the State and enforce English as the main language?

    That's just plain ridiculous. Irish is our native language and the fact that it has gone through such a decline is a real shame. Like many people, I didn't enjoy studying Irish in school because its a really difficult language to learn, but I really wish I could speak it fluently. It's a part of our culture and it should be protected, not thrown away. And how could anyone even consider it being banned? What country in the world would ban their own language, unless it had been occupied by another country (not the way of the world these days).

    The fact that we speak English and have a similar lifestyle to the British does not make us British. Our language is part of our identity and we should encourage it to grow. I just hope the way its taught in school is addressed pretty quickly, it needs a contemporary spin to stand half a chance of keeping students interested


  • #46
    segadreamcast
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,872 ✭✭✭segadreamcast


    Poll poster framed the question in such an awkward way so that (s)he could only generate the desired response.

    Honestly, this question is so poorly done - I'd be disgusted if it were ever used/quoted anywhere.


  • #47
    xha1r
    Closed Accounts Posts: 311 ✭✭xha1r


    Suppress? Ban?

    I mean come on, are you on dope? Im a 5th year student and like every other student in the country, have to learn it. However, I love Irish. I went to an all Irish primary school and have always wanted to learn Irish.

    The only problem is as people have said, the way it is taught. So many people dislike it due to this. People who know me would call me a jack-the-lad type dosser, so it isnt often Id praise something like this (ie a dying language, more homework etc).

    Gaeilge is a fantastic language, and if we "ban" it, we may aswell get them to destroy the Anglo-Irish Treaty and allow the UK to call the 26 counties of the Republic of Ireland, British.

    What does it give us other than keep with our culture? (paraphrased from another post). Not alot to be fair, but what does History give us? We dont really need to know about it, I mean its in the past, not many people really need it to do well in life, do they?

    It makes us more intellectual, we have a broader knowledge and respect for our language and culture. I was disgusted when I saw this topic, although the argument was quite fair, it is stupid and ignorant to ever consider "banning" or not teaching the our language in this country.

    Call yourself Irish?


  • #48
    dceire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭dceire


    I can speak very little Irish & hated it when I was in school but now I regret not trying to learn it in school. I plan on taking Irish evening classes when I finish college.

    The way its taught is in need of major reform & it needs to be encouraged in the media, I think shows like Gift Grub using Irish would have a great affect on the languages popularity.


  • #49
    Mr.D.Leprachaun
    Closed Accounts Posts: 620 ✭✭✭Mr.D.Leprachaun


    I don't think it should be abandonned, nor do I think it should be forced as an exam subject on students but rather taught seperately from other subjects so as to remove the pressure and also get rid of the daftness that happens in my school, and others too I'd assume, of learning off essays and the like.If it were taught for the sake of teaching it rather than or an exam I think it would get a more positive reception.


  • #50
    xha1r
    Closed Accounts Posts: 311 ✭✭xha1r


    Mr.D.Leprachaun wrote:
    nor do I think it should be forced as an exam subject on students but rather taught seperately from other subjects.

    im sorry, but i dont quite understand that? it is taught seperately from other subjects no?


  • #51
    J.R.HARTLEY
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,792 ✭✭✭J.R.HARTLEY


    give hector a government grant and have him teach irish in the workplace,
    it's a fantastic language but i can't come up with any logical or budgetary reasons not to ban it.
    however having completed my entire education through irish i thoroughly support the language and culture and don't have a chip on my shoulder about how it was taught to me.


  • Advertisement
Advertisement