Advice Needed - May Be Going to Prison

dublinshane · 15-09-2005 07:05PM #1

Hi there,

I am wondering if anybody here knows anything about what it is really like in prison, either from their job or having been in jail themselves. If things work out badly for me I could be going to jail and it scares me ****less. I don’t want to go in to any of the details of why I ended up in this situation other than to say I made a big mistake and know that I have to take the punishment. I never thought I would be in this situation and up until now had little sympathy for prisoners but now that I might end up as one things have changed. I’ve only seen prison stuff on the TV and in films and this is what I am thinking about as I don’t know anybody who has done time.

There are loads of questions going through my mind like:

What is it like at first when you go in?
Do you usually go to prison on your own or do they take you in in groups?
Are all the scenes of getting shouted at and strip searched and hassled right?
How do the prison officers act towards you?
Are they looking for you to slip up and break rules or are they reasonable?
What can you bring in with you?
Which prison could I end up in (I’m 25 and from Dublin)?
How do the other prisoners generally treat you – never been in prison before?
Can you go to prison yourself are you always taken directly from court?
Do you normally get a cell on your own or how many people do you have to share with?
Is it likely that you have to slop out – that seems pretty bad and I would hate that?
Are you allowed a TV and radio?
How bad is it with regard to people trying to touch you up or whatever or is that exaggerated on TV – certainly hope it is?
What happens if you get into trouble in prison and what can they do to you?
Are you allowed have money to buy things like cigarettes or do you get an allowance?
Is there a limit on the money you can have each week. I would spend €45 a week just on smokes at the moment without anything else – are you allowed have that much?
Do you have to wear prison clothes or can you bring in your own?
How often do you get a chance to shower and wash properly and do you do this on your own?
How much violence and bullying actually goes on and do the prison officers try to get involved?
Is the food alright?
How often can you get visitors and do you see them one to one or are there glass dividers or whatever?

I know I’ve asked loads of questions and maybe not that many people can answer them but loads of things are going through my mind.

I know it is probably not something people might want to talk about if they have been in prison and I know many people probably think that prisoners have it too easy and are the scum of the earth but when you think it may happen to you – things change. I can only say that I am scared ****less of ending up inside.

I would really appreciate any responses to any of the queries. Thanks.

Endurance Man · 15-09-2005 07:20PM

I was taken on a tour of the dublin prison while in school and found it to be decent.
Most of the prisoners where wearing there own clothes as the gaurd said they had behaved well
I think there where 2 men to a cell (could be wrong)
The more violent criminals where kept well away from the pety criminals.
Wardens seemed friendly with the in-mates.

If i remember any more ill let you no

.
Really sorry to hear about this

.

Edit : Remembered more

While i was there we saw they where installing tv plugs in each cell, the gaurds said tv's where being installed for the well behaved in mates.
We went into the visitors section and there were no glass dividers.

Amazotheamazing · 15-09-2005 08:10PM

Depends what you are in for, the lads who were charged with violent disorder in relation to Brian Murphy's murder were sent to a medium security facility, and were given work in the kitchens. I know a guy in Limerick prison who thinks it's really helped him out, given him order and responsibilty, his main complaint is he can't go home at night, it's hard though.
Again depends on your crime, I know one prisoner in Limerick was allowed run a marathon withing the prison walls, and is getting day release to run from Ballybunion to Limerick (both runs were/are for charity).

amazingemmet · 15-09-2005 08:13PM

What is it like at first when you go in?
-Depends on the case, if your found guilty they'll set a date for sentencing

Do you usually go to prison on your own or do they take you in in groups?
-Depends if anyone else has been sentenced with you

Are all the scenes of getting shouted at and strip searched and hassled right?
-Strip searched yes, shout at and humiliated no
How do the prison officers act towards you?
-Don't give them agro and they won't hassle you
Are they looking for you to slip up and break rules or are they reasonable?
-Depends on what rules you break
What can you bring in with you?
-Clothes and money afaik
Which prison could I end up in (I’m 25 and from Dublin)?
-You can end up in anyone, depends on the crime, if its a small one maybe the joy more serious wheatfield. you can apply to be transfered to anyone i think
How do the other prisoners generally treat you – never been in prison before?
-some can be grand, some can be p***ks much like real life
Can you go to prison yourself are you always taken directly from court?
Taken after sentencing
Do you normally get a cell on your own or how many people do you have to share with?
If your sharing you'll most likely end up with one other
Is it likely that you have to slop out – that seems pretty bad and I would hate that?
- you only have to slop out in some prisons the joy being one, i think they're phasing it out though and there's some scheme that you get 2k for every year you serve if you had to slop out iirc
Are you allowed a TV and radio?
If you behave
How bad is it with regard to people trying to touch you up or whatever or is that exaggerated on TV – certainly hope it is?
Don't know
What happens if you get into trouble in prison and what can they do to you?
-Take away your privelges,
Are you allowed have money to buy things like cigarettes or do you get an allowance?
-your allowed have money, tryn not to have too much remember your in with criminals, some reformed/reforming some not.
Is there a limit on the money you can have each week. I would spend €45 a week just on smokes at the moment without anything else – are you allowed have that much?
-Not too sure, but don't think so
Do you have to wear prison clothes or can you bring in your own?
-depends on how secure your prison is low security you can wear you own higher up you wear uniforms
How often do you get a chance to shower and wash properly and do you do this on your own?
-Don't know
How much violence and bullying actually goes on and do the prison officers try to get involved?
-A bit does go on
Is the food alright?
-Food is terrible thats what all my friends who've been inside have missed the most
How often can you get visitors and do you see them one to one or are there glass dividers or whatever?
- Get to sit aroud a table i think you get 40 mins visiting time a week

hope that helps a bit haven't been inside myself but have a couple of friends who have. if you do go in, there is a load of course you can do in pretty much anything i advise you to take one up and use the time instead of sitting round doing nothing. also try not to get involved in drugs inside. can lead to some bad situations

Sparky · 15-09-2005 08:13PM

what did ya do?

nesf · 15-09-2005 08:17PM

Moved from AH.

LegacyUser · 15-09-2005 08:26PM

Well from what i ve heard from a relative who did work in prisons, the inmates are allowed PS2's nd games(bought by them selves of course), the place is full of drugs, keeps the prisoners relaxed, the guards seem alright, but some should be in prison themselves. The food for the guards is excellent(not sure about prisoners, maybe the same food). The prisoners wear their own cloths.

LundiMardi · 15-09-2005 08:43PM

oh come on, you may be going to prison and you're actually asking if you're gonna be allowed enough money to smoke:rolleyes:

The_Conductor · 15-09-2005 09:46PM

If you have previous good character, and have not come to the notice of the Gardai previously, unless its a particularly serious offence- you are far more likely to get the probation act, or for worse offences a suspended sentence than be imprisoned. In some cases where the offence relates to a "white-collar" crime, your solicitor may be able to argue that a suitable donation to the court poor-box may be a suitable punishment for you.

Ultimately- the days of Dickensian prisons are gone, and the worse prisons have largely been either renovated or closed down altogether. Most modern prisons have individual toilets in cells, bed, seating, shelving and some limited space for personal belongings. Depending on the type of jail- some jails even have bungalows where the prisoners more-or-less have free rain to come and go as they choose (without leaving the complex- and they must of course report for role calls etc). You may remember the uproar over the IRA men in Roscommon being able to order in pizza last year?

The Irish prison population is at an all-time high though, and the lack of spaces means that for more minor offences, the judiciary are encouraged to come up with punishment of a more varied nature- possibly including community service instead of incarceration.

If its your first offence, without getting your hopes up, it is possible (depending on the nature of the offence) that your solicitor may be able to argue for a lesser punishment than would be metted out to a repeat offendor.

Ultimately- if you do not have a solicitor, get one immediately. Discuss the situation with him/her. Unless there is someone here willing to admit to having been an inmate- and in a position to advise you on the possible *accomodation*- what you need is professional help. Regardless of the nature of the crime- get professional representation. Pondering over the possible comforts of a jail cell will get you no-where......

bohsboy · 15-09-2005 10:01PM

If its a first offence, depending of course on the severity you will end up at best with a fine or suspended sentence. Pretty difficult to get jail these days!

Jail is indeed daunting at first but no one is out to do you intentionally. My advice is to give up cigarettes as it is currency in the jail system these days. A lot of bullying will occur over tobacco. Everything revolves around "dust".

However, worst case scenario you get sentenced. Remember straight away you earn remission for good behaviour which is one quarter knocked off your sentence, so twelve months becomes nine, etc...

You are transferred to a Committal jail depending on age, i.e. 16-21 St Pats or 21+ Mountjoy. On committal you give personal details, medical details are also recorded. Change into prison attire, no cavity searches or stripping! If you treat the wardens with respect you will get 110% back and also easier jail time. Bit of an attitude and I'm afraid the system is designed to grind it down.

Keep the head down and prisoners will respect your wish to do jail quietly. The only trouble is mostly due to drug related issues so avoid at all costs, even a drag of a joint, you will end up owing someone a "favour". There is no pressure of drugs being pushed due to the scarcity in the system.

Take a course, go to school or a workshop, anything to avoid walking around the yard all day.

See the Governor on your first day, tell him if you are uncomfortable and ask to be considered for a transfer to a more suitable prison.

Above all, relax, it's not as long as it seems and know in yourself that you wont be going back!

Regards.

Gummy Panda · 15-09-2005 10:05PM

If i remember right from my school tour of the joy, you can only have one shower a week unless you use the gym everyday. The cells had small tvs and radios. I think they get a phone card a week and have to ask the governor for it. They had some name for it where they all queue up for it.

Unless its a sex offense you should be fine from what i heard on the tour.

Nevyn · 16-09-2005 12:35AM

Please keep the thread on topic.
Bickering and unhelpful posts will get you banned.

Do read the charter.
Thaed

dublinshane · 16-09-2005 10:16AM

Thanks to everybody for the replies so far – it has been good to get some info. From what people have been saying it seems a better than what I imagined. I do have a solicitor and he is working away but in the mean time I just want to do what I can to prepare myself if I get a sentence.

The drugs thing seems pretty bad – never done drugs at all and definitely won’t go near them in that situation.

It’s pretty hard to get information on prison life in Ireland – I had read some stuff about England and America and the American way seems pretty bad. I will come back on later on to answer a few questions that have been asked but thanks so far.

bohsboy · 16-09-2005 10:39AM

Just to clarify above, PS2's are not allowed and food is top notch. TV's and radios are in cells. You can opt for single cell cell or double accomodation if you know someone who might be in to show you the ropes. Wardens are grand if you play the game. You will not be treated badly.

rick_fantastic · 16-09-2005 11:50AM

sorry

Beruthiel · 16-09-2005 11:52AM

read this forums charter rick
B

dublinshane · 16-09-2005 12:27PM

Thanks for the support -appreciate it.

Endurance Man – Presume when you say Dublin Prison you are talking about Mountjoy?

Amazing Emmet – Surprised what you say about Wheatfield and Moutjoy as I would have thought that if the crime was less serious you would go to Wheatfield as I think it has better conditions. The whole thing about slopping out and all that in Mountjoy sounds bad. Glad to hear about the visits though although 1 a week isn’t that much – that must be really tough. Your info really helped – if I do end up inside I really would use the time to do something new and at least get something out of it

Sparky S – Prefer not to say with court case and all that.

LundiMardi – Yeah OK it seems stupid but I did ask questions that were on my mind – didn’t say they were sensible. I was just wondering how much money you have to spend and I was saying I spend a fair bit just on cigarettes at the moment.

SMcCarrick – I take your point. I have got a solicitor who I think is doing a good job. I am getting professional advice but he does say there is a fair chance of prison.

Bohsboy – Hope it works out without jail but I’m not so sure. Can’t imagine coping without cigarettes – smoking enough now but it’s good advice. Really good to hear about drugs been scarce because that’s something I never want to go near expecially in prison. It seems the prison officers are OK from what you say – no intention of getting into trouble or anything like that. From what you say it looks like I would go to Mounjoy – I’m 25. Disappointed with that as the conditions seem worse there than in other places. Does everybody go there? You talk about prison attire – is that a uniform or what? I imagine time goes really slowly though – can’t imagine relaxing. Thanks again for all the info.

Gummy Panda – one shower a week seems pretty bad. No not a sex offence.

Thanks for your posts – really useful and what I am looking for. The fear of the unknown is a big thing and I think the more you know the better. As I said from the comments things seem a bit better than I thought.

bohsboy · 16-09-2005 01:02PM

You change into prison clothes on committal, they are basically prison made jeans and shirt and jumper. After a couple of days ask the governor for permission to change into your own clothes which is no problem. You just need 3 sets of clothes to be left in by family. Clothes can be sent out each week to be washed and cleaned.

Vangelis · 16-09-2005 05:44PM

Hello dublinshane,

First of all I want to say that just because you are going to jail does not mean you are a bad person. Hearing that someone is a prisoner autuomatically switches on some kind of prejudgemental feeling among people and they think that the person must be evil and and psychopathic or very unintelligent.

I have never been to prison myself, but I have visited prisoners of all kinds because I enjoy seeing their smiles when I come. I intend to become a more active visitor and to me, it does not matter whether the prisoner is sentenced for murder or drug-trading. I'm sure you are a great guy who has many good qualities. There is no need to feel ashamed!

You have allready been given much advise and more than that I cannot give you, but I wanted you to know this. I wish you good luck with any trials and prosperity in your life!

PS: I don't know to which prison you may be going, but you will have the opportunity to study and you'll probably be able to take up a hobby, play an instrument even to keep your mind active and keep the day from growing grey!

dublinshane · 16-09-2005 09:42PM

Vangelis - thanks for the post. I know I'm not a bad person but I'm disappointed with myself for ending up in this situation and ashamed for my family and my girlfriend. I don't have any excuses for ending up here - a great family, decent job, not into drugs or anything like that. I just know I've let people who I care about down and if I do go to jail how badly they will take it and that. But the info here has been useful and has given me a more positive attitude so that's helpful.

Fionn · 16-09-2005 11:09PM

lotsa good advice there! it may not happen
and hey...
everyone makes mistakes.......like there for the grace of God...etc.
no judgements here
and if it does..
you'll be fine,
be aware of your surroundings, aware of others,
show respect..usually earns it in return
and
yes as someone posted
fill the time up, it'll make the passing of it more bearable
good luck!!

Vangelis · 17-09-2005 03:16PM

You're very, very welcome, dublinshane.

I came to think of something.. Do you believe in God? Maybe you could ask him to give your girlfriend and family patience, as well as yourself! That always helps for me!

LegacyUser · 19-09-2005 07:00PM

Jeez, I hope things work out for you!!
Whatever it is you did, it sounds like you are genuinely sorry for it, and probably have already learnt your lesson.

Keep the chin up, and hopefully it is more of a scaremonger .. at worse, probation.

Mist · 19-09-2005 07:28PM

Hello Shane.

I know a few people who have been in prison.
Their main advice is:

Keep yourself busy, they say there are alot of things to do in prison.

As mentioned before avoid the drugs situation altogether.

Avoid mixing with the "wrong" people. This means gangs and that sort of thing.

And as long as you behave the guards will treat you with respect.

I hope you're not in there for too long, and that you have an easy time in there.

Good Luck Shane.

dublinshane · 22-09-2005 01:38PM

Thanks for all the comments – never thought I would get so many decent replies. Just in case you are interested this is an update of the situation:

Had a decent meeting with my solicitor yesterday given the circumstances. The news was grim enough. The best possibility if the case is heard by the District Court where the maximum I could get is a year. If it goes to the Circuit Court it could be as much as 5 years although he said that this was a very worse case scenario and he couldn’t see any chance of that.

Against me is that I do have a record from last year – was in court and got a fine and a serious lecture too. The case here was relatively minor but the judge was far from impressed and told me it was a wake up call etc. etc. Because of this he says it is probable I will get a jail sentence and the best hope would be if it was suspended or partially suspended. It’ll be viewed that I got a chance and screwed up – which I did – and that won’t look good.

He also said that I would go to Mountjoy first – as some of the posters had said. From other peoples posts the situation in there doesn’t seem to have been as bad as I imagined but the thoughts of the old conditions, slopping out and the drugs are not pleasant.

I consider myself a generally good person – far from perfect but just being very stupid on occasion. I never thought that I would be likely to end up named and shamed and labelled a criminal or a prisoner or whatever. I know it sounds hard but I have always thought of prisoners as wasters, no hopers so it is hard. I don’t know if it would be easier to cope with all this if I was in a situation of knowing other people who had been in jail but as I have said I have a great family and have got through life to now without too many problems. The thoughts of ending up in a cell with a violent druggie with loads of problems is the nightmare situation for me but it’s dawning on me that people might view me as not much different.

Being in court last time was bad enough – I felt bad for myself and my family but had no doubt that things would end up OK. As I said I ended up with a criminal record but it seemed to me over and done with. If I go to jail I imagine it will always be known that I have been in prison and will always be considered a criminal. I know that people have a hard time when they get out with getting a jobs or trying to go away and all sorts of things so it seems very hard to get over it even when you get released.

As I said this is all very difficult on my family and my girlfriend. They’ve been as good as I could have expected but I know if I end up in prison things could change especially with my girlfriend. I wouldn’t expect her to carry on with things while I am in prison. Can’t imagine her to be happy being known as the one whose boyfriend is in prison. I know her family will probably put pressure on her to end things – they would see me as holding her back – and I am sure they wouldn’t want an ex-prisoner for a son in law. Anyway, she has been great so far – more than I deserve.

I don’t think until you are in this situation you can understand the shame thing. As I have said I have been in trouble twice and even just getting arrested and handcuffed and spending a night in the cell is pretty shattering and I always planned never to end up in the same situation again but it didn’t quiet end up that way. I keep on thinking of those pictures you see in the paper or the news when somebody is going from the court to jail. The person is handcuffed and then double handcuffed to a prison officer – they always looked pathetic to me. I know it only lasts a few minutes but being led away like that with my family looking on or whatever must make you feel the lowest of the low.

One last question, if anybody knows the answer to – how long do you spend locked up in prison? As I said I will probably be going to Mountjoy if that makes any difference.

Sorry for rambling on so much but sometimes it is easier to say what you feel with some anonymity. Friends and family are great but at the moment the screen is very useful too.

Oriel · 22-09-2005 02:05PM

A very humbling situation you're in dublinshane.
The only help I could give would be - see it as a time to do something constructive. If it was me I'd try to write a book or something like that. People could do so much with their lives if they only found the time to sit down and do it. Take that chance yourself.

S.

tbh · 22-09-2005 02:16PM

Hi Shane,

I was going to pm you this, but I wanted to say this publicly.

I'm afraid I've no practical advice for you, but the one thing that strikes me, reading your posts, is how you sound like you have a smilar personality to me, given that there's only so much I know about you. The only thing I can say to you is, maybe one day I'll find myself in your position. If I do, I hope I can deal with it with the same strength and humility that you seem to have. I think a lot of people would agree with me, even if they don't condone whatever it is you've done.

chin up,
Caimin

Vangelis · 22-09-2005 02:41PM

dublinshane,

It's good that you came back and gave us a little up-date.
I just wanted to say that there is no shame in having violated a law. If there was no law, you'd have nothing to be ashamed of, whatever you did. And neither do you now. I feel with you. You may regret what you have done, but don't look at yourself as a lesser, lower human being.

Think about how we wish not to be judged by others. This is one of Europe's modern values that we cherish. Well then.. what about the Judges in court? They are no better!

I know a couple of prisoners who have got a sentence of around 20 years all of them. They are good guys, intelligent, and they felt no shame, only a huge disappointment of course at having their freedom deprived from them. The term 'criminal' could be placed on all of us. We all make a mistake, hurt someone, lie or cheat at some point. You are not alone

From what I have learned from them, you need to be patient as things will take time in prison. Make sure you stay active with something - anything that can make time fly and keep your mind busy. Maintain contact with family, friends and your girlfriend via letters, cards, phonecalls. And hope that they will come to visit you! Take a day at a time and think over what you do before you do it.

Don't be afraid of ending up in a cell with an addict. You don't know for sure. Irish prisons are not like the ones in Russia, so you can calm down.

Best wishes!!

Beruthiel · 22-09-2005 02:49PM

Fat_Tony wrote:

UR GONNA GET BUM ****ED = new ass on the block

watch ur back

banned
B

lomb · 23-09-2005 07:21AM

ul probably be out in a month or so, on probation, this is ireland after all......ud have to kill someone here for them to lock u up and even then its only for a few years.
use the time to think about what u did and what u are going to do, and use it wisely. good luck on the court date and use the opportunity at sentencing to express ur remorse and get some family members to make a character reference also. also if it was theft, make restitution to the victim b4 the court date.
if u play ur cardsright u might not even spend a day in jail.

luckat · 23-09-2005 09:43AM

Vangelis wrote:

dublinshane,

It's good that you came back and gave us a little up-date.
I just wanted to say that there is no shame in having violated a law. If there was no law, you'd have nothing to be ashamed of, whatever you did.

Vangelis, I'd agree with you in some cases, but Irish ways and Irish laws are, in general, made at the desire of most people, and with their consent.

Dublinshane, I've done a little teaching in prisons, so this is what prisoners told me, and my own observation.

For a start, in prison you lose all control. You can't do something as simple as deciding to take the dog for a walk.

For the next year, every time you walk up to a door you'll be accompanied by a prison officer wearing keys on a chain at his waist. As he approaches the door (or rather, barred gate), he'll shout "GATE" and another officer will approach from the other side and unlock the gate, and he'll escort you through.

You will lose all privacy. You won't even be able to write a letter without someone else reading it. You won't be able to have a visit without the permission of those who control your life. You can't take a course in a Leaving Cert subject without permission, which is given on condition of good behaviour.

Now, the people in jail: you're going to meet plenty of nice and kind people, and some who are not so nice - both in the case of prisoners and prison officers.

But by definition, virtually everyone in jail is there because he hasn't found good ways of dealing with other people.

You're going to have to think your way through two separate lives: your life in the prison for the next year, and what you do when you come out.

First, when you go in, do what you do when you go into boarding school: be polite and courteous to everyone, but don't be too pally with anyone for the first few weeks - wait until you've seen people's style of dealing with others before you decide who your friends are going to be.

Don't get involved in all the anti-this and anti-that stuff - for instance, "screws are bastards" - that goes on inside; it's a way of trying to have some power, but it's not a way that'll serve you well.

Try to make yourself a schedule for how you're going to deal with the next year - the first month, learn the routines of prison; the second, start a course if possible, and so on. This will break up the time for you and make it more bearable.

Give up the smokes. Doing so will give you a great feeling of control, which is invaluable when you don't have a lot of other control.

Work out what you're going to do when you get out. You're not going to find it easy to get work when you've been inside, so I'd suggest that you try to sign up for a course in university if possible for next year, so that your prison time becomes less visible.

Even if you don't go to jail, I hope the possibility gives you a chance to change your life so it's never a possibility again. May I wish you the very best of luck.

Advice Needed - May Be Going to Prison

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