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BusConnects Dublin - Bus Network Changes Discussion

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 525 ✭✭✭PlatformNine


    Ah I should have been a more specific, thats my bad. My problem isn't with Abbey St itself but the way it is used. I don't think Abbey St is a good terminus when it's used as a part of the Talbot St loop, like with the H-spine, 6, and 130. My problem really is just with Talbot St, which I think is poorly suited as a terminus or through route for buses (or private cars for that matter). It's a narrow street that is very congested and with enough foot traffic that I'd argue should be pedestrianised.

    While I am not a fan of urban services like the 33 and 41 using it for the O'Connell/Gardiner St loop, I think that loop routing could work well for limited stop services such as outer commuter and Xpresso services. The 101 I think could benefit from it over Busáras with it's stop on Gardiner St, or the 103 could use extra the extra space as it almost always has a bus using the layover point on Talbot St.

    They are not going to bring the 26 back.

    I've been thinking about this as I have been reading articles online or seeing reactions on social media. I understand why people are mad, they are losing some of the direct connections, even if it is an improvement in the long run. I do think the 80+130 change will be for the best (depending on what they do with the southside 80), but still I am not surprised that people are irritated. Like they really just want a bus that goes to X, wherever that may be, even if it's not exactly reasonable.

    But I think this has been the most intense reaction to any route change, at least from what I have seen. There were many changes that got some strong reactions, the northside 11 and 13 changes and hourly 19, the southside 13 and the proposed hourly 58, the 145 and the loss of the direct UCD-Heuston bus. They all had reactions that led to changes for the better. Even the slow rollout of the O hasn't even seen this much backlash, and there still hasn't been any changes there.

    But that they are still so mad after the updated changes and things like one of the protest organisers having the audacity to say the updated route is bad because it's a cross-city service is what really gets me. Like you say, they won't get the 26 back but how long is this going to go on even after the NTA does their best to accommodate them?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,735 ✭✭✭p_haugh


    We will soon see a re-shuffle of routes using Talbot Street & Abbey Street as a terminus, so maybe thjat will help things. Once the D & A spines are rolled out, the H spine will be the only "spine" routes stopping there and there will be 6 radials (6, 8, 20, 21, 78, 97) and the L91 utilising the loop (with the 10/130 being made cross-city).

    The 33 & 41s no longer using it as a terminus will definitely help in tidying up the congestion somewhat as well.

    Now this is depending on the frequency of the various radials, the number of buses there at any one time may well be similar to the current set-up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,408 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    You’re never going to please everyone - as long as they sort out the reliability then the majority of people will be ok.

    Some of the more extreme comments I think can be disregarded.

    As someone who used the H-Spine daily for some time, I have to fundamentally disagree with you. That terminus location is excellent for connectivity with the other Spines and the LUAS.

    The buses in my experience negotiated Talbot Street without any issues, and the set down stop there was the busiest on the routes which should tell you something.

    We have lost enough city centre termini/layover locations without losing more at this stage.

    It’s a key route for the bus service and will remain a necessary one well into the future.

    The 42 and 43 could finally be brought closer to O’Connell St if the 130 is moved out.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 15,801 Mod ✭✭✭✭dfx-


    Doing their best to accommodate them?

    Shouldn't accommodating passengers be the only priority? It's the same every time. The routes that are complained about are the routes currently used that are off a spine. It happens every time and nothing is learned.

    God forbid should passengers not go full in on the concept like the 19 and 11, 52 and 60 before that. They even made it an election issue on the 19, how dare they.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 525 ✭✭✭PlatformNine


    This is a good point, even before the 10/130 changes, it was going to be a drop from I believe 31bph using Talbot St, to 27bph, and now that will be dropping to 21bph. Then that isn't even considering the 33 and 41s which add their fair share of departures to Abbey St as well. So in total there is a lot of pressure relieved from the streets and termini.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 525 ✭✭✭PlatformNine


    People have the right to be angry, and it was very understandable why the people of Chapelizod were. However, there is a difference between fighting to fix a route that just won't work and the endless barrage of "save the X." At some point it’s not "fighting for a better service" and it is just opposition to change if not entitlement. I am happy Chapelizod fought for and won the changes to the 80, and I wouldn't blame them if they continue to protest until the changes are rolled out. However, when I see people complaining that the routes can't stay exactly the same, and possibly in Chapelizod's case complaining about having to share a route with another part of the city I can't help but feel like its entitlement.

    However aside from that, I really can't stress enough that the 26 had one of the worst CC routings and something with it had to give. It was one of many significantly contributing to bus congestion around OCB and CG. It turned at OCB going east/south, it turned at OCB going west/north, and it had the horrific routing that is going from Pearse St to Westmoreland St. It is never going to be brought back into service as is, as doing so would literally be a hinderance on the core of the network as the remaining buses with similar routings are replaced. There are maybe a few other options that could be considered versus what they are proposing now, but they are not necessarily any better/worse, and none of them will be the old 26.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,834 ✭✭✭john boye


    I largely agree and I go back to the lack of communication on why these routing changes through the city have to happen.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,349 ✭✭✭Daith


    It would help if Dublin City Council actually had their plans approved and set in stone though.

    As we saw with restricting traffic over O'Connell Bridge, that got watered down at the last minute.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,408 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Politics doesn’t work like that unfortunately - often you have to do things in stages to prove that chaos won’t actually result.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,701 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Is there a specific thread open for the infrastructure part of bus connects, ie the QBCs and ANPR, cashless fare etc?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,408 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    To clarify this - it would seem that new running boards & rosters have yet to be implemented - all that has happened is that the stop-by-stop times for the current rosters have been updated somewhat.

    So there will still be the issue of buses not getting to the other end of the route in time.

    In other news, in addition to the S6 and S8 timetable changes that I mentioned before, the 45a/45b, W2 and W6 also got revised timetables (running times) on Sunday which should see improved reliability and fewer cancellations.

    Stops 1370 and 1377 on the SCR have been reinstated on the 73.

    Stops 8413 & 8414 on Blackglen Road have been added to the 44b & 114.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,408 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    A new five year contract has been signed by the NTA with GoAhead Ireland for Dublin City bus services - they will increase the number of routes operated as the next phases of BusConnects are implemented.

    I suspect that the next phases may be some time away now for a variety of reasons (delays in commissioning more chargers and ongoing issues with recruitment and also funding).

    https://www.transportforireland.ie/news/nta-signs-new-contract-with-go-ahead-ireland-to-support-roll-out-of-new-bus-network-in-dublin/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 79 ✭✭hfjm20


    Cause it’s been such a success already



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,650 ✭✭✭VG31


    Yes, I noticed that. The turnaround times are still just as tight.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    This makes for grim reading. Filter by last week even. Embarrassing.

    https://buscancellationsdublin.eu/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,408 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Last week’s figure is highly distorted by planned diversions which were not cancellations.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    I was the victim of 2 ghost buses last week (neither of them listed on there) as the app said "due" and then nothing turned up.

    Insane how its going to take 2-3 years to sort that out.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,409 ✭✭✭caviardreams


    Same thing happened me - so that data definitely doesn't capture every cancellation



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,408 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    The new AVLC system is due to be rolled out next year, not in 2-3 years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭The Nal




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,496 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Am having mix of issues… H1 bus doesn't show on app, is scheduled and arrives. But then you risk being caught out by a 'ghost' bus. If it shows up on the road on the TFI app then you know for sure it'll arrive. Otherwise uncertain situation.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,409 ✭✭✭caviardreams


    How do you see the road on the TFI app? I can only see times.

    I normally use bustimes website for mapping



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,496 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    If you go into Timetables and search for the route, it puts up the times on left hand side and a route map on right with stops marked in blue. You can see little green bus icons moving along the route.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,408 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    It is far easier to see them on the “Transit” app.

    There’s no evidence that it will take 2-3 years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,258 ✭✭✭dublinman1990


    Are there any upcoming changes planned for the final phases for the Network Redesign in Dublin or will they still go out unchanged?

    If they go out unchanged it would be the following Spines D, A, and B & then possibly Route O/Final Routes phase?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,834 ✭✭✭john boye


    You could argue that the next phase is to fix the F-Spine



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    Well it was awarded in December 2023 and they're saying maybe the end of 2026.

    Their contract runs from 2024 to 2029…….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,650 ✭✭✭VG31


    Even seeing the live location on Bus Times isn't a certainty, although it's usually reliable. I've experienced ghost buses on Bus Times which appeared on the map but didn't actually exist. The first was a 16 I think maybe a year or so ago. The week before last I waited on an N2 that never arrived despite appearing on Bus Times. It was even showing as running late and continued tracking for the rest of the route. How is that even possible? Did they have the ticket machine in a car?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,822 ✭✭✭✭The Nal


    Going into town later. Bus is "scheduled" for 6.58pm. Meaning they just don't know.

    I'm not confident.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,408 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    In October at the Oireachtas Transport Committee meeting, Hugh Creegan stated that the initial system trial will be in Waterford starting before the end of this year.

    BÉ in Waterford have added two buses to the city fleet in the last week or two, which would indicate to me that they are pulling a couple of buses to have the new technology fitted.

    He then went on to say that it would then start to be rolled out on Dublin Bus from Q2 2026.

    Now if you know different to that, then fair enough, but that’s the latest information I’ve seen.



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