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Tesla Model 3 - V3.0

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81 ✭✭jobrien19


    Test drive was booked under my name. She was in the car however could not test drive as their system was down and they had no way of taking a copy of her licence. As I had uploaded a copy of my licence the day before they said I could test drive the vehicle myself. Will escalate it now as whether their employee was correct or not the deposit was placed based on his promise.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81 ✭✭jobrien19


    Thanks! will push them until the refund is processed. Just wanted to be safe that I wasn't in the wrong.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,473 ✭✭✭positron


    This is really annoying. They keep changing offers and prices every couple of days. In last two weeks the 20k free supercharger kms gone, finance drops from 6.9% to 0.9% and a few days later it's now 0.99%. Not sure what the it would be like tomorrow morning.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭User1998


    Its still the best value car money can buy in Ireland, so you can’t really complain



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,607 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    I don’t think this is 100% correct. The order was placed online following a physical test drive. That was the clincher in the refundable or not motto I always had.

    I may be wrong here though 🥵



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭kennethsmyth


    I can see why a lot of people would think that however the contract only occurred when order was placed online. The test drive is of no bearing on the distance selling regs. For it to have bearing you would have to sign up in dealership.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭kennethsmyth


    Ignore all the talk from Tesla and just keep requesting it under distance selling regulations, they know they are in the wrong and just push back on those that are not aware of their rights.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 640 ✭✭✭antfin


    It could be argued that by attending at Tesla's premises to test drive the car then you fall foul of the requirement of "the supplier making exclusive use of one or more means of distance communication up to and including the moment at which the contract is made" as some communication takes place in person. Whether or not you could count the test drive as being part of the actual sale process.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,735 ✭✭✭maidhc




  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,607 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    I won’t worry. But I may be right. OP had a test drive. Based on that he may not be eligible for a refund 😀

    But I hope it made you feel that bit better so your nonsense stalking posts don’t go unnoticed big man.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 966 ✭✭✭JOL1


    Tesla have added very specific wording to their Irish Order Agreements (see below) to address the scenario that have been discussed. Whether a specific contractual element specified in the Order Agreement (Contract) ranks ahead of any statutory rights is not something I am opining on but thought it useful to share to inform the debate given the specificity of the wording

    Screenshot 2024-07-10 at 22.44.50.png


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,607 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    That was my interpretation alright. And I’ve gotten 2 deposits back from Tesla using the distance selling rule.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,735 ✭✭✭maidhc


    “distance contract” means a contract concluded between a trader and a consumer under an organised distance sales or service-provision scheme without the simultaneous physical presence of the trader and the consumer, and with the exclusive use of one or more means of distance communication up to and including the time at which the contract is concluded

    I think the important time is when the contract is concluded. Echo the views to send this into the small claims if there is any guff from Tesla.

    (I’m not the EU any more than I’m UEFA, I’m just a person)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 640 ✭✭✭antfin


    I think you'll find that the difficult arises with the following part of your definition if you test the drive the car in person as you haven't exclusively used distance communications if you've attended the premised for a physical inspection as part of the sale "with the exclusive use of one or more means of distance communication"



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,607 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    without the simultaneous physical presence of the trader and the consumer,

    This will be key here. Whether the actual presence of the OP at a test drive before buying constitutes physical presence. They tried to get around it by booking the test drive in one name and then ordering in another.

    So is a test drive considered physical presence?

    this is from the uk, but may have some bearing here considering the structure of our legal system,

    If I test drive a car, and then buy it online or over the phone from the same business, and have it delivered to my home, does this still count as a distance sale? 

    This is no longer classed as a distance sale, as you’ve had the opportunity to view the car before deciding to buy it. Therefore, the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013 will not apply in this instance.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,735 ✭✭✭maidhc


    I don’t think it can change the fact the contract was concluded online and there was no element of negotiation or barter in person (this is Tesla). One might argue your point more convincingly in the case of dealing with franchised dealers negotiating like hell and sealing the deal electronically.

    you can’t contract out of the distance selling either of you are a consumer, so anything on the Tesla website is not likely to hold up.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,607 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,735 ✭✭✭maidhc


    I’m sure the local DJ will really care about your interpretation. You might get a job as an expert witness yet.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,473 ✭✭✭positron


    What works out better, PCP or HP?

    Both at 0.99% and with similar deposit, the cost of finance figure are more or less the same (however everything is based on the wrong on-road price etc). I guess PCP would cost less per month for the period of PCP with the final payment (12k-ish) compared to HP which locks in the full amount into a 5 year loan.

    Never bought a car on finance before, slightly clueless. What's the general consensus here.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,607 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Give it a rest will ya. Get over the fact i ridiculed the EU ending up with Chinese funding through the euro24 funding program and you are now dragging that childish argument across threads.

    So maybe report me again or shut up.

    You’ve been shown where the Op falls short of distance selling rules yet all you continue to do is attack me. Idiotic behaviour. You should be ashamed of yourself.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 966 ✭✭✭JOL1


    Thats a secondary point and perhaps irrelevant. Tesla's contactual provisions are clear and state that where the purchaser has ordered following a Test Drive then "this Agreement shall not have been entered into by using means of distance communication and consequently you will not have the statutory cancellation right described herein "

    The scenario that you mention as to timing of conclusion is a moot point in circumstances where the agreement was not entered into by means of distance communication.

    In conclusion the wording is crystal clear in its intent…whether this contractual term is capable of overriding a statutory right is another matter but there is zero doubt about what it is saying.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,735 ✭✭✭maidhc


    That’s the point though; it can’t override the regulation IF the buyer is a consumer. See regulation 39 & 40

    https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2013/si/484/made/en/print

    (Edit to include correct link)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,735 ✭✭✭maidhc


    I never mentioned anything about the euros here? You did. I said you were wrong on your interpretation of European law.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,607 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Time will tell.

    “distance contract” means a contract concluded between a trader and a consumer under an organised distance sales or service-provision scheme without the simultaneous physical presence of the trader and the consumer, and with the exclusive use of one or more means of distance communication up to and including the time at which the contract is concluded;

    So the OP visited the dealers and then placed a deposit online it will come down to interpretation on whether it’s a distance contract or not.

    Anyway. Off to Joe Duffy with ya and spill it out on air



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,636 ✭✭✭Redfox25


    Define better.

    Hp, you pay more per month but at the end, you own the car. Pcp, you pay less per month and after the term, you go again, hand back the car or buy it fom the finance company.

    Depends On what your long term plan is really.

    Pcp has been best summed up by many as a way to sell folks who can't afford it, a car.

    Probably best to do the sums yourself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,735 ✭✭✭maidhc


    Yes. I was trying to tease out why it is a distance contract in my view. Your posts just lower the quality of the conversation and unlike others here make no effort to actually grasp the issues.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,607 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    You haven’t exactly escalated the thread to the high heavens. More ranting and raving from you and sly dismissive comments. Go have a Kit Kat or something.

    I told the op Immediately to escalate it to the uk team, providing an email address to go to. In fact I’ve given that countless people by pm along with the wording to use to get a refund. I hope the OP gets it back. But hey, you continue your angry little man rants.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,531 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    An entity can't make a contract term to bypass a statutory right. They can say stuff and hope it sticks and can even try to persuade people the contract trumps their rights, but it doesn't. The word "simultaneous" in the regs is what will matter. The only way Tesla could get around this is if the order was placed in the presence of one or more of their staff.

    Stay Free



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 966 ✭✭✭JOL1


    You need to familiarise yourself with the differences as comparing PCP to HP is like comparing an Apple to an Orange..both are fruit but very different. The interest rate is similar to both but HP is a loan where you pay off the full amount borrowed by equal monthly repayments for the term and at the end of the term you own the car.

    In contrast PCP can appear attractive as there are lower monthly repayments but at the end of the term there is a large "balloon" payment due before you own the car. You may benefit from lower monthly repayments but you are postponing a major decision to the end of the term. You can usually pay the ballon and take ownership, hand the car back or enter a new PCP.

    Screenshot 2024-07-10 at 23.53.12.png


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,531 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    Anyone having Bluetooth issues connecting with car lately? Since update yesterday, our phones don't connect. The App does its thing, but won't connect to drive or lock when walking away. Reboot of car and phone didnt work. Opened a ticket.

    Stay Free



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