Why I'll say no to a united ireland

But that's the opposite of my point, how do you not see this? I am not talking about political entities, but geography. If they were born in Catalunia, they are Catalan. It would be like Spanish telling them no, you are not of the place you are born, you are only Spanish.

It fits perfectly in my view.

It was Unionists who decided that to be called Irish was some kind of slur.
It didn't use to be that way.

It's your identity issue, not mine. My identity is fine, I am securely an Irish man, born here and bred here.

What a Ukrainian chooses to identify as doesn't bother me either and I am free to offer an opinion on why they suddenly decide to change.

Interesting to hear someone from a traditional hardline unionist background use the word inevitable in respect of a UI and that he mentions there are others in his community and within the loyal orders that agree with his view.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3gxyxv8kllo

To people born British on this island, calling them Irish is a slur.

Simple as. The right to be born British is enshrined in the GFA.

The territorial claim was given up in the GFA when we acknowledged that this island is shared by both British and Irish people. In the next evolution, we will also be conceding that it is shared by Northern Irish people.

Calling someone who is not Irish an Irish person is disrespectful and insulting.

Refusing to acknowledge that some people born here are born British is arrogantly insulting.

I have not called anyone Irish who isn't from Ireland, and I have not denied anyone's Britishness or their Nationality. Nationalities don't own being Irish.

Why is calling someone Irish insulting?

You are talking again about nationality and passports.

There is no difference between what people in NI do, and people in Scotland, and Wales and England, and they are all British and Scottish, Welsh and English.

A tricolour doesn't, or shouldn't own Irishness, that would be exclusionary republicanism surely if it tried to. And to correct you, the tricolour is not owned by republican terror groups, no more than the Union jack is owned by the UVF, would you not agree with this?

The only thing that defines Irishness, imo, is being of Ireland, our shared island. It is diverse, has two jurisdictions, and two or however many more nationalities.

As I mentioned, Ian Paisley himself knew the patent absurdity of denying he was Irish, even when many down here would have denied him that right due to their own prejudice. I happen to agree with him.

I don't see how being called Irish could be a slur, or how anyone denying Unionists their Irishness along with their Britishness, can be explained outside of prejudice.

I have seen dozens of quotes from him down the years, and anecdotes, proclaiming his Irishness. No idea where they are online, but I will look.

Yup I'll take your word for it re Indian people, as you said before, alot of people have no idea where Ireland is and and why would they, it's only when you talk to someone form a place you get educated.

“I’m an Ulsterman… I would never deny I was an Irishman… The person that says that [denies they are Irish], they are Irish and there have been more generations from Irish roots in them than they’re prepared to meet. The English that came over here were ‘Irish-ised’ very quickly.”

I despised much of what he preached but had a fondness for him aswell I couldn't put my finger on, even with all the trouble he caused and people he radicalised. But in the end he compromised, and the island is better because of it.

Reading and hearing him speak about Irishness over the years changed my mind on the whole thing. It isn't about passports,.or republicanism or unionism or nationality or tricolours, it's about where you are from and your roots, and to my mind I cannot square how you can deny you have two sides if you live and are of Ireland, and are British.

So are you saying that Jerry Adams is Northern Irish whether he likes it or not?

I do not have to identify as anything. I am born British. It is the people who want to identify as Irish that need to take action.

Let me check something in case we have different starting points.
Do you accept that there is an international border running across this island, separating to distinct countries?
I think I posted a list of 50 significant things that are different either side of the border, I won’t bore you with that again.

so the question again is do you accept that there is an international border running across this island separating two distinct nations?. I would also be quite keen to hear answers from some other posters to that question. Maybe the problem is that some of you guys are starting from a, romantic fancyfull place that is not in reality

No you were not 'born British' nobody is born 'British'. You could be born 'in' Britain which is the large neighbouring island to Ireland, which is were you were born 'in', same as me.

Being of Ireland does not equate to Irishness. Simple as that.

Your refusal to accept this, to insist on labelling everyone born on this island as Irish, is identity-denying. It is wrong in law because of the GFA, it is wrong in morality, forcing the Irish identity onto people.

As for the tricolour, it has been besmirched by the PIRA, and despite its noble ideas on foundation, it can never serve as a symbol of reconciliation.

Unionists are fully entitled to say that even though they were born on this island, and are of this island, that they are not, and have never been, Irish.

You are mixing up identity - which is something you choose and can change - with the location of your birth.
Nobody is saying downcow's identity is Irish, which is what the GFA disallows - he like everyone else on the island of Ireland has the right to identify as he pleases.

Please show us where in the GFA it says anything different on the matter of identities.