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Why do car owners drive in the middle lane?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 28,760 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    The problem is that the "motorway" designation isn't really suitable for certainly the central part of the M50 because of the number of exits in close proximity and the volume of traffic that in reality means that all lanes become driving lanes most of the day.

    As such, you can't really apply the "keep left" rule because in reality it would cause even more chaos and problems if people were constantly shifting lanes as you suggest.

    As I said, there are two types of drivers - those who slavishly follow the theory/rules and tell themselves they're in the right regardless of the negative impact they may actually be having, and those who read the road, the situation, and adapt their driving style (including speed and positioning) accordingly.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,591 ✭✭✭hoodie6029


    I love the middle lane, you don’t have to think about other traffic when you’re in it.

    I think everyone should use it instead of the other lanes.



    (I don’t believe this)

    The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,676 ✭✭✭creedp


    Post makes absolutely no sense but not worth the childish name calling/squabbling. Carry on sir and so will I



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,858 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    You claimed it's not your job to police others use of the road. I agree.

    I do however believe it's an individuals job to use the road properly which you seem unwilling to do so by instead joining the people who like to camp in the middle lane.

    You attempted to justify your sticking to the middle lane as a reduction in fuel usage, I'm calling that out as a bit of a stretch




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,676 ✭✭✭creedp


    Yet you suggest that I should sit in L1 and continuously meander left/right across a busy motorway so that I can hold the higher moral ground and ridgly comply with the rotr even though doing so puts myself and other road users at an increased risk of being in an accident.

    Youd be better off geting some markers, drawing up a keep left placard and standing on an M50 overpass.

    As for the unhealthy obsession with my fuel usage quip, the least of all my concerns, whatever...if it makes you happy I agree its a bloody stretch as its of absolutely no significance to how I drive on the M50



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  • Registered Users Posts: 27,123 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    no one is asking you to police anyone but yourself.

    The reason people drive in lane 2 is because other idiots drive in lane 2. Its that simple. Stop driving in lane 2 unless you are actively overtaking and the roads will be better and faster for everyone.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,123 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    You wouldnt have to continuously do it if there werent other MLMs sitting in lane 2.

    Its got nothing to do with moral high ground, its about making the motorway work they way it was designed, make it faster to drive on and remove phantom tailbacks.


    If you cant drive on a motorway safely then thats your problem and no one elses.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,123 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    You wouldnt have to continuously do it if there werent other MLMs sitting in lane 2.

    Its got nothing to do with moral high ground, its about making the motorway work they way it was designed, make it faster to drive on and remove phantom tailbacks.


    If you cant drive on a motorway safely then thats your problem and no one elses.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭DownByTheGarden


    At last, someone who is actually using their driving experience to drive. Some people if they were ever on the M50 probably never looked out the window of the car past the pages of their rule book to see what actually happening on the road.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,676 ✭✭✭creedp


    Exactly I cant change how other people drive so I adapt my own driving style to compensate. Again, in the real world I cant stop people from hogging L2 so Im not going to be the moron to use L1 and having to continously drive around L2 slouches. Be my guest if you want to be this person.



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  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,858 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Instead of sitting in lane 1 and not passing lane 2 drivers on the left, are you instead sitting in lane 2 and adding to the problem, or are you overtaking the drivers in lane 2 by moving out to lane 3. It's a relatively simple extra step then to make the final lane change back to lane 1. You can then pretty easily just look out the window and anticipate upcoming traffic to move out again as needed.

    If you manage that you'll achieve that most advanced driving skill of driving on a multi lane motorway.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,858 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    I wouldn't call a person who finds changing lanes on a motorway difficult experienced if they feel the need to sit in lane 2 to avoid lane changes and handling mergers. It's clearly a sign of lack of driving experience.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,787 ✭✭✭djan


    The amount of people using wild gymnastics to justify their inability to use a motorway just shows why this is such a big problem here. Having driven on many motorways in countries where camping in an overtaking lane is not tolerated whatsoever (police, cameras or people flashing/beeping) it always leads higher road capacity. Of course, this does not apply to heavy traffic jams.

    The safety argument for staying in L2 doesn't make sense either as then you are forcing people from L1 to change two lanes rather than one to make progress. People sitting in overtaking lanes also leads to a lot of people undertaking which is another big problem all together.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,925 ✭✭✭kirving


    On certain sections of the M50, religiously moving from L1 to L2 to L1 to facilitate mergers, while also maintaining a safe distance to traffic both in front and behind you, can be totally impractical, and certainly does add unnecessary risk at busy times.

    There is a distance of 500m between Ballymount and the N7 (Red Cow). At 100km/h (27m/s), that's just 18 seconds.

    Spread at correct 2s intervals, that's just 9 cars allowed in L2 between the exits at any time, not that anyone maintains that anyway. Even if just one or two cars try to move from L1 to L2 to facilitate joiners, there becomes very little time to match speed, look for a safe gap, and move out, while also maintaining a safe gap to the car in front of you in L1, who is at the same time trying to slow down to find a gap to merge onto the Exit Slip.

    Equally, religiously following the rules to the letter, is clearly a sign of lack of driving experience.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,858 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Yes I cover that section regularly and know what you mean. However I don't use that to justify sitting in lane 2 when driving between Dundrum and Knocklyon.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,676 ✭✭✭creedp


    Nail on the head there, if the gardai actually enforced lane discipline on the M50 then this unproductive discussion would be moot.

    However, until such time as this happens, Ill just have to suffer the ignominy of being slagged off on an anonymous internet forum for not being able to achieve the theoretically correct motorway advanced driving standard as I will continue to avoid the dance from L1 to L3 and back to L1 to overtake the perpetuall dawdlers in L2 during busy M50 traffic.

    As previously mentioned by another poster, in reality for the most part this involves staying in L3 unless there is a safe gap in L2 traffic to move across or until L2 traffic is actually moving slower than I am (unless I spot a car coming up behind me travelling above the speed limit as Im certainly not going to police speed limits by holding any driver up) which tbh is pretty rare given the high volume of dawdlers in L2 these days.



  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,684 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    It's nothing to do with the notion of higher moral ground - it's simply using the road properly and in accordance with the relevant legislation.

    Yes it's harder work but such is life.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,925 ✭✭✭kirving


    Well of course yep, but @_Kaiser_ did refer to some of the middle sections only.

    What we on a motoring forum often forget too is that it can be genuinely hard for a sub 70bhp car to get upto 100km/h (or more if needed) say when entering on a short slip roads. Even more important say when going Northbound form Knocklyon, the Tallaght exit lane can be blocked quite far back, and people driving in L1 make no account of this and pass stationary traffic in the next lane way too fast.

    The odd time I've borrowed my sisters car I'm reminded to always move out to L2 to give joiners more room. My car has well over 3 times that power and lots of torque low down so I can accelerate hard whenever I need to match speed.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,858 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    That's good anticipation and a sign of an experienced driver, not like most of the people on the M50 who will move straight into lane 2 and camp there until their exit at which point they'll do a mad dash for the slip road.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,676 ✭✭✭creedp


    Presumably you would never exceed the legislated speed limit to safely overtake a slower moving car, or for that matter never exceed the legislated speed limit period😂



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭DownByTheGarden


    Less likely to come up behind a stopped car who has decided to pass the ones queing in the filter lane and has now decided that stopping in L1 is the best way to join the filter lane. Particalrly dangerous when you come up to one of them in bad weather, or worse the person in from of you jams on the brakes when they encounter one in front of them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,165 ✭✭✭realdanbreen


    What's wrong with auld lads? Or peak caps for that matter! There's a lot of drivers out there who think driving a motor issue kind of art form. It's no big deal ,drive along nice and handy and as for those fukkers who reverse into a space turning the steering wheel with the palm of their hand, they should be shot if only for being gobshites. And when it comes to some fella driving up my arse on the motorway, i simply tip the rear foglight, you can almost see the sudden fear on their faces!



  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,684 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    I do my best to be safe and compliant.

    You deliberately and admittedly lane hog through laziness.

    Ain't you great.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,676 ✭✭✭creedp


    Accept Im being pedantic but I take it then that, despite doing your best, you do at times drive in a non compliant manner. Hopefully, for the rest of us, when that happens, you're actually aware of it and continue to drive in a safe, if not fully compliant manner



  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,684 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III




  • Registered Users Posts: 27,123 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    There is one person you can stop from hogging lane 2. Thats the only person I am asking you to stop.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,123 ✭✭✭✭GreeBo


    TL;DR

    I am going to drive in whatever lane leads me to not have to make basic overtaking maneuvers.

    If the M50 was 10 lanes wide you would still sit in lane 10 because you think you are a fast driver and dont want to have to overtake others.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,676 ✭✭✭creedp


    Again living in a theoretical world. Sorry sir/miss I live in the real world



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,676 ✭✭✭creedp


    Tbh that's not going to make a blind bit of difference. Maybe, as I suggested earlier, a placard on an overpass?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 28,760 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_



    Well, in my case ... If all of the other 9 lanes were filled with traffic moving slower, or jumping between lanes and cutting each other off as they merge/exit, or weaving/undertaking dangerously across multiple lanes to get a car length ahead (as is a regular feature on the 3-lane M50/N7), or just so busy that they were all effectively driving lanes, then I would absolutely sit out in L10.

    But then I don't dawdle, and have no issue keeping up with the flow of traffic or driving at the limits when no reason not to. It's pretty rare that I'm overtaken actually because most people seem incapable of this.



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