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Moon landing hoax

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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,088 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    Fair enough, minor slip up.

    Now what do the lines around the earth represent in the thumbnail image you've just linked?



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,062 Mod ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    Hi,

    Amateur sailor here who uses GPS to navigate while out at sea. I have 2 GPS systems in my boat, 1 is a marine GPS system which displays position in Lat & Long, and also SOG (speed over ground), the other is an iPad (cellular)

    When out at sea and miles from land in all directions, both system are still displaying my position to within 1 meter on the surface planet earth. (In a boat its important to know where you are, and be confident the data is accurate).

    This could not be possible without satellites in orbit transmitting time data to GPS receivers on the planets surface.

    So satellites exist, and thats no longer up for debate.



  • Registered Users Posts: 776 ✭✭✭raspberrypi67


    Because it wasn't a Hoax....

    don't even want to argue this but Moon rock samples don't just come back to earth on their own steam



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    A good while back one theory being proposed was that NASA was using a secret unmanned rover program to collect all of the samples.

    This was abandoned when the person proposing it could not explain how NASA kept this massive, parallel project secret, and why they didn't then continue to use rovers far more advanced than anything in use today.


    On the odd occasion that a solution for a problem in a conspiracy theory is suggested, it's usually very superficial: eg. "they just used unmanned space probes to collect the rocks". And these solutions always fall apart when you try to apply them to a real world situation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,158 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    Astounding! I hold my hand up. I must yield to a clear master of the topic. Absolutely, you have ground this debate to a complete halt. Debate, as we all know, holds no place in science and I thank you for bringing us back to firm ground.

    But before we do. If you are getting accuracy to within 1 meter, you clearly have an advanced piece of kit. Would have to be a differentially corrected GPS technology to get that level of accuracy - typically used by coast guards for navigating complex coastal areas and rivers and seems way out of the price range of an amateur sailor. Care to share the make and model? Wouldn't mind investing in this myself.

    Also, my ADS-B/MLAT system can track aircraft over 150nm over land, and likely much further if I lived at the coast. Commercial radio trackers achieving much much further, over wide expanses of ocean. Care to share with us how many miles in all directions you've been away from land?



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  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,062 Mod ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    Would have to be a differentially corrected GPS technology to get that level of accuracy - typically used by coast guards for navigating complex coastal areas and rivers and seems way out of the price range of an amateur sailor.


    Grand, so you agree that satellite based navigation is a thing, which therefore means orbital insertion flights (rockets to space) are also a thing that exists.

    Glad we cleared that one up.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,158 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    Not willing to provide the GPS model or distance you were from all coasts?



  • Registered Users Posts: 867 ✭✭✭Emblematic


    Is it your view that marine GPS is really ground based?



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,062 Mod ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    MLR FX312


    44nm from nearest land (on this particular trip), though have been further from land, much further.

    But at least now we agree that satellite based navigation is a thing…….. we’ll get you there eventually.




    Wait.... Are you also a flat earther? Because you know the curvature of the earth means you can have line of sight to an aircraft 100nm away, but not have line of sight to an object floating on the sea thats 20nm away right?



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    The vast majority of believers in the idea that the moon landings were fake accept that spaceflight exists. Some even argue that it was partly faked in space.

    Some however, specially recently believe that the landings were faked as part of a larger belief in a flat earth.

    Several of the videos and sources that Markus has provided have been flat earthers.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,245 ✭✭✭Cheerful S


    You claim all images or communications being sent from space originate from within the Earth's atmosphere. In the absence of satellites, how can you explain live sports feeds from other countries? How does it all work in a different way then?

    Astro's explanation shows that the block fabric pattern seen on the ISS is not unusual at all. The Astro YouTube video matches the screenshot image you uploaded here a few days ago. This indicates the images from the ISS are not fake. Still claiming it's a greenscreen

    Yes, I agree that it would not take hundreds of people to fake outer space footage. You have a problem with your theory, as massive amounts of data are generated by such activities every day. It would require an enormous team of people to keep track of all the fake communications, data, and footage that is generated across the world every day, and keep all the fake stuff secret. Do you not notice how absurd that sounds? This conspiracy must self-replicate every day to keep going.

    You focused on the credibility of one guy who claimed to be his father-son and saw the usual thing in the hangar somewhere. Not even his story, by the way; he claims it came from his father. It's nothing story unless you have corroborating evidence from many others.

    >>mod snip @Cheerful S as there is something salvageable from your post relative to this discussion, I've just snipped your post. Going forward if you want to discuss 9/11 there's a place for it and it's not this thread.

    HS

    Post edited by Hannibal_Smith on


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,977 ✭✭✭✭Giblet


    Oh he is a "flat earther", ala Nathan Oakley? He is just a contrarian who doesn't really believe this stuff then. Loves the argument, but ultimately no proof because... well.


    Nathan Oakley tried to pimp his wife on youtube as a tech youtuber before he got attention on Flat Earth, so many of the arguments he uses are for clickbait in between beating his child and drinking piss. I mean.. they can't even explain why the moon is upside down in Australia, or why it's darker nearer the Equator as well as going East at the same UTC time...



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,158 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    Are you joking? A ~€350 GPS and 44nm from the coast and you expect that because you achieved this the debate should stop?

    Incredible.

    Post edited by Markus Antonius on


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,977 ✭✭✭✭Giblet


    More evidence than you or anyone on the flatearth / moon landing hoax has ever produced, anywhere.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,088 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    Please show us something, anything, from a source where they state that GPS doesn't work over oceans.


    Not that planes and boats carry multiple back methods of navigation, "backups" are not the same as "doesn't work". Where is there any evidence of GPS not working in certain areas of the globe?



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,977 ✭✭✭✭Giblet


    Or any evidence of ground based sources of the data? Or is that idea pulled from your arse too?



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Or an explanation for why the people behind GPS claim that it works by satellites when there is no benefit for doing so and doing so only provides evidence to expose the conspiracy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,800 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Starlink satellites in orbit, seen with the naked eye

    Can literally buy a starlink dish and connect, quite a few Irish customers. Works pretty much everywhere, including out in the ocean.



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,062 Mod ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    I follow a German guy on YouTube who is currently sailing around the Atlantic Ocean (for the 2nd time).. Started in Europe, sailed across the Atlantic to the Caribbean, then up the East Coast as far as NYC, then back across the Atlantic to the Azores, and now on his way to Cape Town via Brazil. Not only is he using Satellite based GPS navigation, he’s also using off the shelf mobile satellite internet services so he can update his social media accounts daily..

    Watch any of his videos (he does the videos in German & English) where he crosses an ocean, and the satellite ’question’ is put to bed.. or is he in on it too? I’ve plenty more examples too including some Irish folk… or are they in on it too?

    There are thousands and thousands of amateur (though experienced) sailors sailing around all the oceans of the world, and the vast majority of them would simply not be able to do it without GPS. (Without GPS the ONLY other way to navigate an ocean is by sextant, which is an extremely difficult skill to master). So are they all in on it too?


    Here is a very basic Satellite communication system that most sailors doing substantial passages would have.. it offers basic text message based communications which can be used to communicate and also receive weather data.

    or are they in on it too?



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,484 ✭✭✭✭astrofool


    Not quite a flat-earther but seems to be going for a "god made all" explanation which means you can never be wrong as god decided on your opinion and god can't be wrong.

    Which is why the more interesting part is in the new stuff occurring and why it is being "faked", what reasoning is there to fake a fail and success so close to each other and how the devil, or an affiliate, is behind it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,248 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    So you've entirely abandoned the green screen claim? Numerous links have been provided that gps exists over the ocean, so you should probably just pretend you didn't make that claim as well. There's no debate about gps working in aviation or sailing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,977 ✭✭✭✭Giblet


    I think Markus can safely be ignored. They will not address when their claims are found to be bunk, so why bother?


    Next!



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,062 Mod ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    Heres a screen grab from a video on Youtube of an Irish guy on passage from Bermuda to The Azores.

    He is 334nm from nearest land (Bermuda) in this screenshot, yet knows his exact latitude & longitude... How? Is he in on it too?

    You've gone awful quiet @Markus Antonius ? Or is it a case now we'll just see another moon/spaceflight hoax thread pop up in a few days saying "yeah but"...... "all those people in the other thread are in on it too"


    Here he is 845nm from Bermuda and 845nm from the Azores... so 845nm from the nearest land.


    I get that some people don't believe man landed on the moon, and thats fine, good luck to them.... but to claim spaceflight is a hoax...... I mean thats right up there with flat earthers in the loony bin!!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 34,258 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Lidl must be in on it too as they are selling satellite meters, €8.99 IIRC, saw them in stock yesterday.

    I got one a few years back and used it to successfully align a dish quite accurately at the exact spot in the sky a geostationary satellite would be if positioned 28.2 degrees east of due south.

    If they existed, of course... 🤪

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Another success from India.

    I wonder why the decision was made to make it a success. I imagine if someone had actually figured out the conspiracy, they'd be able to make predictions of this before hand.

    Also, I can only assume that the Indian government and space industry is also in on the conspiracy that only involves a few ex-CIA freemasons.



  • Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭Henry James


    I see Nexus magazine has a story re moon hoax. They claim a death bed confession as far as I can remember. I don't buy that magazine, just saw in a bookshop while waiting for someone.

    They make some explanation regarding how NASA could have faked the communications from the apollo flights. I can't remember now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,800 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe




  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,088 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    The faking of the transmissions to and from Apollo craft would have required them to launch the Apollo craft, and then block anyone listening in from receiving the earth based transmission to the craft, and also nobody noticing double the expected delays in communication between earth and the craft as everything would have to go earth to moon to earth( fake Apollo craft) to moon and back to earth for one line of communication.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    The usual claim from the majority of believers were that the Apollo craft actually went around the moon, but didn't land. (Or didn't land people.) All of the transmissions were sent from the capsule that was in orbit around the moon and all the radio traffic and telemetry was scripted to pretend that they were doing the landing.

    The missions were tracked and listened to by sites around the world as well as amateurs and if course the Russians, so these scripts would have had to have been perfect so that no inconsistencies existed. Also they wouldn't have been able to communicate the real situations as they'd have been different from the scripted one. For example Michael Collins would have had to pretend that he wasn't cramped up in a tiny space with Neil and Buzz while they were supposedly on the lunar surface.


    The major issue here though is that we are being told that all space flight is impossible and fake, so this can't be the method the transmissions were faked.

    We can only assume that anyone with the capability of tracking the craft were also in on it. So we have to at least add the Australian government to the small team of ex-CIA masons.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 147 ✭✭SeanF


    Just so I'm clear on this:

    Moon Landing Hoax believers believe that NASA (a) hired 400,00 people, (b) built 14 full size rockets, and (c) flew all of them into the sky somewhere, but didn't land any of them on the moon? Okay.

    I mean, seriously, we know the 14 rockets were built, there were literally millions of people watching the Apollo rockets lift off from the Cape. 1 million people turned up to watch Apollo 11.



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