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Polestar 4

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  • Registered Users Posts: 510 ✭✭✭serjical_strike


    An absolutely beautiful car!



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,558 ✭✭✭✭Creamy Goodness


    Looks gorgeous, but don't know how much I'd like the rear window being replaced by a camera entirely. Is this just piped into the rearview mirror or is there a giant screen on the back where the rear window is 😀. Both just seem really unnecessary.


    Edit: I've no problems with cameras at all, but this seems to be relying on the camera "Always working", I had an issue with mine in my Audi recently (took 8 weeks to get the part to fix) which meant it wouldn't work but at least I still had a rear window and wing mirrors to be aware of the surroundings. With the rear window blocked up this takes one of these away



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,392 ✭✭✭JohnC.


    No rear window at all, but a camera which admittedly will surely give a better view than other cars anyway. I wonder what it'll be like in the back seat with no light from behind. Though the glass roof will help.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,750 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Tbf I'm very well versed in driving vans with no camera. I personally think rear views are over rated in terms of driving skills. Can't see out my estate when it's packed full of kids stuff 🤣



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,558 ✭✭✭✭Creamy Goodness


    Added an edit to clarify my points. Sure you're well versed in driving with limited rear visibility, are the majority of other car driver though? And surely packed full of kids stuff is a temporary thing.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 33,750 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    My point is they should be. If people can't navigate a vehicle like this with multiple sensors all over it and a wider and further field of vision on a big screen then I suspect that we need to change our driving tests structure. 😅

    A window gives you far less visibility regardless of shape in comparison.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,392 ✭✭✭JohnC.


    Is there a frunk? I've seen one article say there is and another say there isn't.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,283 ✭✭✭✭Vicxas


    Thats beautiful, i've been saving my coppers for a 3 but this might change my mind.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,558 ✭✭✭✭Creamy Goodness


    I agree with what you're saying. I just think that there should be a reasonable fallback, a window still gives you visibility and if the camera system fails (like in my experience) limited visibility is better than no visibility. I do admit that the chances of cameras failing are rare but it does happen and if it takes as long as it did for mine to be fixed it just makes driving that tad bit more difficult, it could still be done but the more aids the better (including a limited visibility rear window).



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,120 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Not sure about Polestar but Volvo don't have hidden cameras so you need to clean them manually, VW have it nailed with the badge opening up to hide the camera and keep it clean. I'm with creamy, it makes things harder not having a window. Those back seats look very angled not sure how they'll go with car seats, Volvo have that part right with inbuilt boosters for kids.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭mailforkev


    Nice looking car, will probably be a bit tasty price-wise here though.

    As for the rear view camera... I'm probably one of the few people who currently drives a car with such a camera system.

    I keep it in standard mirror mode the whole time, the camera view is just a bit odd, I think it's the depth perception. I would probably not buy a car with a camera-only system. Would the cabin not be a bit dark too with a missing rear window.



  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    Audi is rubbish at aftersales. I'm sure Polestar would sort the problem a lot faster.



  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    If this car comes in under 60k for the single-motor rear-wheel drive, we are onto a winner. The Polestar 2 is competitively priced but I worry that Polestar will lose touch with their Volvo routes in time and chase the performance EV market that isn't really there in Ireland. Most customers here will want a base model with either a standard or dual motor. This is a direct competitor for the Model Y. Id even say it needs to be 55k but it won't be.



  • Registered Users Posts: 58 ✭✭Brock Stevens


    According to their press release pricing at the moment starts at €60,000 in Europe, so presumably 65 to 70 if not higher here. Actual pricing will be available at time orders open


    https://media.polestar.com/global/en/media/pressreleases/666140



  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    That's what I'm worried about. 65k is too expensive for a single-motor version. A Model Y is a little shy of 20k less. It might be a bigger car in the Metal but from what I'm seeing it isn't much bigger than a P2.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,865 ✭✭✭Soarer


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  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    It is a strange statement for sure by Polestar and I'm not sure how many toddlers would appreciate the "immersive experience" considering my two have spent all of their lives facing backwards up to now and like watching tractors behind the car.

    As I get older, I struggle more with spatial awareness when driving. The rear view mirror is very important, particularly on the motorway when overtaking in the outside lane. Id like to try out this new system when it launches to see how it actually works. As you said yourself, depth perception is so important for a lot of drivers. I'm sure it will work fine as they would be stupid to launch a car where this system wasn't effective. I wonder how does the camera stay clean and free from water in a heavy downpour.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,750 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Kids won't care. I do think people are making an oddly large deal of this. Motorcycles have two mirrors and that's it. I drive mine just fine. Vans and Trucks the same. Many convertibles and so on. The rear window in this being replaced by a huge panoramic view into the outside place I don't see anyone getting claustrophobic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,645 ✭✭✭creedp


    Just test drive the car and then see how you feel about it



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,854 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    yep, kids strapped in the seats, often with 2x large headrests on their child seats, have more things to be at than getting worried about a back window

    Like a poster said above, if youve an estate or hatch you'll often have the boot packed to the roof for big holidays and the kids havent a window to look out of. Thats pretty much standard with us for our holidays and they never had an issue. Sure, our latest car now has super dark windows and they are even happier than before.

    Windows in the back are often quite small so the idea of just ditching it altogether and replacing with a camera and screen on the "mirror" a far better solution for the driver, forgetting about the kids for a sec.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    I would primarily use my rear window on motorways. It's good to know when cars are coming up behind you. I think simply saying the rear mirror has no use is fine for some people but not for others. In my experience, Van drivers are notorious for sitting in the outside lane, probably because they are not immediately aware of cars behind them.

    It really comes down to how you drive. Are you someone like me who is always aware of rearward traffic, or do you pay most of your attention to the road in front of you.

    I'm not saying this system won't work. I'm sure it will. I'm just worried about how using a screen to navigate the road would be effective. I use my mirrors a lot, I wear glasses and my spacial awareness isn't what it used to be. The proximity of traffic in the rear mirror is very important to me when driving.



  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    My kids like to look out. We stay away from screens and other distractions in the car. I just think it's a bit rich for them to say it offers customers in the back a more immersive experience. Rubbish. They just needed more head room and decided to ditch the rear window as a result.

    Its a bold move. Once the car journalists get a hold of it I'm sure we will get a better idea of how well it works. Let's remember, this is a premium family SUV, not a van. It wouldn't put me off buying the car, i'm just curious as to how well it will work in the real world.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,750 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Having completed an IBT and motorcycle training I'd say I'm more cautious and aware of all my surrounding as you have to be even more so than any car driver. As anyone coming from behind can knock you flat under their vehicle. I'd have everyone complete motorcycle training I think it would improve skills across the board to understand how vulnerable the human body is.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,854 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    >I would primarily use my rear window on motorways. It's good to know when cars are coming up behind you

    and on the new Polestar this is still possible, from what I see you still have a central "rearfacing mirror" just as before mounted to the roof/ windscreen, but rather than showing the limited view of whats out the back window, it uses a camera to give you an even better view of whats behind you and the mirror is replaced by a dedicated screen.

    I am struggling to see what the issue is.

    by the way, trucks already use cameras and dedicated screens as replacements for physical mirrors and it actually improves safety and all round visibility

    https://www.man.eu/de/en/truck/assistance-systems/digital-mirror-replacement-system/man-optiview.html



  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    Yes, I'm aware of the camera. I'd like to see how it works in a family car. Trucks and vans are naturally compromised by not having a rear window and drivers of both work around this. I'm not sure if someone buying a family car wants to deal with this level of compromise. If the camera feels odd on the test drive, they will just rule out the car and move on to something else. For the camera to work it needs to be bang on accurate. We use our brains as much as our eyes when changing lanes and if the camera perspective is slightly off, that car coming up behind you might be nearer than you think. At least with a rear view mirror you are looking directly at that car. With a camera you are looking at a screen. Also, camera wing mirrors are rubbish. I've used them and they don't work and can be quite starling when changing lanes. They've also never really taken off either. I don't see the camera rear view mirror being as extreme but yeah, I'm just not convinced. It might be a deal breaker. Let's see when the car is available to test drive.



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,344 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    I drove caddy for years so used to not been able to see out the rear.


    nit I do hate driving behind vehicles where I can’t see through and get a glimpse of what’s ahead



  • Registered Users Posts: 522 ✭✭✭VikingG


    Actually that is one aspect I didn't think of - it is handy to be able to see through cars to see the road ahead. There is a similar downside to side cameras as opposed to side mirrors. From outside the car with the mirror you can see the driver as well and see if they have seen you - very handy when you are on a bike



  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    It seems strange that they didn't include a window considering the placement of the panel on the rear of the car. I'm wondering did they run into problems last minute with safety, headspace etc... I know thats a bit far fetched but they may be rushing to get this car out. I'm sure the car will be bullet proof none-the-less.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,854 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    I think its strange that nobody has done this with a normal car before.

    How often have you read car reviews and they lament the small window at the back being useless for visibility? The solution there is either make it a bigger window which then messes up the boot lid and may not be possible (which is why the window is the cr@p size it is), or do what polestar has done and ditch it altogether and replace a substandard window with a camera which potentially shows a lot more than any back window will ever show.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 765 ✭✭✭n.d.os


    I'm not so worried about the size of the window. It's just good to be able to see a car behind you or at least some of it, particularly at night. Also to gage its proximity is important hence why I'm not sure about a camera. If this works it's a great idea so let's wait and see.



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