Polestar 4

listermint

Polestar 4 just released , unveiled in China's motor show today.

https://www.polestar.com/ie/polestar-4?gclid=CjwKCAjw3POhBhBQEiwAqTCuBgp0hxKetbyGCX9ShHJREpvXmVkvC0du_MyMJosMyLQxzxq674zpiRoCJicQAvD_BwE

I still think Polestar and volvo are designing some of the best looking cars currently.

Pricing UK circa 55K. European pricing unconfirmed

serjical_strike

An absolutely beautiful car!

Creamy Goodness

Looks gorgeous, but don't know how much I'd like the rear window being replaced by a camera entirely. Is this just piped into the rearview mirror or is there a giant screen on the back where the rear window is 😀. Both just seem really unnecessary.

Edit: I've no problems with cameras at all, but this seems to be relying on the camera "Always working", I had an issue with mine in my Audi recently (took 8 weeks to get the part to fix) which meant it wouldn't work but at least I still had a rear window and wing mirrors to be aware of the surroundings. With the rear window blocked up this takes one of these away

JohnC.

No rear window at all, but a camera which admittedly will surely give a better view than other cars anyway. I wonder what it'll be like in the back seat with no light from behind. Though the glass roof will help.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490629#Comment_120490629

Tbf I'm very well versed in driving vans with no camera. I personally think rear views are over rated in terms of driving skills. Can't see out my estate when it's packed full of kids stuff 🤣

Creamy Goodness

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490648#Comment_120490648

Added an edit to clarify my points. Sure you're well versed in driving with limited rear visibility, are the majority of other car driver though? And surely packed full of kids stuff is a temporary thing.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490663#Comment_120490663

My point is they should be. If people can't navigate a vehicle like this with multiple sensors all over it and a wider and further field of vision on a big screen then I suspect that we need to change our driving tests structure. 😅

A window gives you far less visibility regardless of shape in comparison.

JohnC.

Is there a frunk? I've seen one article say there is and another say there isn't.

Vicxas

Thats beautiful, i've been saving my coppers for a 3 but this might change my mind.

Creamy Goodness

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490711#Comment_120490711

I agree with what you're saying. I just think that there should be a reasonable fallback, a window still gives you visibility and if the camera system fails (like in my experience) limited visibility is better than no visibility. I do admit that the chances of cameras failing are rare but it does happen and if it takes as long as it did for mine to be fixed it just makes driving that tad bit more difficult, it could still be done but the more aids the better (including a limited visibility rear window).

drunkmonkey

Not sure about Polestar but Volvo don't have hidden cameras so you need to clean them manually, VW have it nailed with the badge opening up to hide the camera and keep it clean. I'm with creamy, it makes things harder not having a window. Those back seats look very angled not sure how they'll go with car seats, Volvo have that part right with inbuilt boosters for kids.

mailforkev

Nice looking car, will probably be a bit tasty price-wise here though.

As for the rear view camera... I'm probably one of the few people who currently drives a car with such a camera system.

I keep it in standard mirror mode the whole time, the camera view is just a bit odd, I think it's the depth perception. I would probably not buy a car with a camera-only system. Would the cabin not be a bit dark too with a missing rear window.

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490629#Comment_120490629

Audi is rubbish at aftersales. I'm sure Polestar would sort the problem a lot faster.

n.d.os

If this car comes in under 60k for the single-motor rear-wheel drive, we are onto a winner. The Polestar 2 is competitively priced but I worry that Polestar will lose touch with their Volvo routes in time and chase the performance EV market that isn't really there in Ireland. Most customers here will want a base model with either a standard or dual motor. This is a direct competitor for the Model Y. Id even say it needs to be 55k but it won't be.

Brock Stevens

According to their press release pricing at the moment starts at €60,000 in Europe, so presumably 65 to 70 if not higher here. Actual pricing will be available at time orders open

https://media.polestar.com/global/en/media/pressreleases/666140

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120492008#Comment_120492008

That's what I'm worried about. 65k is too expensive for a single-motor version. A Model Y is a little shy of 20k less. It might be a bigger car in the Metal but from what I'm seeing it isn't much bigger than a P2.

Soarer

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n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120491145#Comment_120491145

It is a strange statement for sure by Polestar and I'm not sure how many toddlers would appreciate the "immersive experience" considering my two have spent all of their lives facing backwards up to now and like watching tractors behind the car.

As I get older, I struggle more with spatial awareness when driving. The rear view mirror is very important, particularly on the motorway when overtaking in the outside lane. Id like to try out this new system when it launches to see how it actually works. As you said yourself, depth perception is so important for a lot of drivers. I'm sure it will work fine as they would be stupid to launch a car where this system wasn't effective. I wonder how does the camera stay clean and free from water in a heavy downpour.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120494050#Comment_120494050

Kids won't care. I do think people are making an oddly large deal of this. Motorcycles have two mirrors and that's it. I drive mine just fine. Vans and Trucks the same. Many convertibles and so on. The rear window in this being replaced by a huge panoramic view into the outside place I don't see anyone getting claustrophobic.

creedp

Just test drive the car and then see how you feel about it

munchkin_utd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120494145#Comment_120494145

yep, kids strapped in the seats, often with 2x large headrests on their child seats, have more things to be at than getting worried about a back window

Like a poster said above, if youve an estate or hatch you'll often have the boot packed to the roof for big holidays and the kids havent a window to look out of. Thats pretty much standard with us for our holidays and they never had an issue. Sure, our latest car now has super dark windows and they are even happier than before.

Windows in the back are often quite small so the idea of just ditching it altogether and replacing with a camera and screen on the "mirror" a far better solution for the driver, forgetting about the kids for a sec.

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120494145#Comment_120494145

I would primarily use my rear window on motorways. It's good to know when cars are coming up behind you. I think simply saying the rear mirror has no use is fine for some people but not for others. In my experience, Van drivers are notorious for sitting in the outside lane, probably because they are not immediately aware of cars behind them.

It really comes down to how you drive. Are you someone like me who is always aware of rearward traffic, or do you pay most of your attention to the road in front of you.

I'm not saying this system won't work. I'm sure it will. I'm just worried about how using a screen to navigate the road would be effective. I use my mirrors a lot, I wear glasses and my spacial awareness isn't what it used to be. The proximity of traffic in the rear mirror is very important to me when driving.

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120494293#Comment_120494293

My kids like to look out. We stay away from screens and other distractions in the car. I just think it's a bit rich for them to say it offers customers in the back a more immersive experience. Rubbish. They just needed more head room and decided to ditch the rear window as a result.

Its a bold move. Once the car journalists get a hold of it I'm sure we will get a better idea of how well it works. Let's remember, this is a premium family SUV, not a van. It wouldn't put me off buying the car, i'm just curious as to how well it will work in the real world.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120495297#Comment_120495297

Having completed an IBT and motorcycle training I'd say I'm more cautious and aware of all my surrounding as you have to be even more so than any car driver. As anyone coming from behind can knock you flat under their vehicle. I'd have everyone complete motorcycle training I think it would improve skills across the board to understand how vulnerable the human body is.

munchkin_utd

>I would primarily use my rear window on motorways. It's good to know when cars are coming up behind you

and on the new Polestar this is still possible, from what I see you still have a central "rearfacing mirror" just as before mounted to the roof/ windscreen, but rather than showing the limited view of whats out the back window, it uses a camera to give you an even better view of whats behind you and the mirror is replaced by a dedicated screen.

I am struggling to see what the issue is.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a43631171/2025-polestar-4-debut-no-rear-window/

by the way, trucks already use cameras and dedicated screens as replacements for physical mirrors and it actually improves safety and all round visibility

https://www.man.eu/de/en/truck/assistance-systems/digital-mirror-replacement-system/man-optiview.html

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120495670#Comment_120495670

Yes, I'm aware of the camera. I'd like to see how it works in a family car. Trucks and vans are naturally compromised by not having a rear window and drivers of both work around this. I'm not sure if someone buying a family car wants to deal with this level of compromise. If the camera feels odd on the test drive, they will just rule out the car and move on to something else. For the camera to work it needs to be bang on accurate. We use our brains as much as our eyes when changing lanes and if the camera perspective is slightly off, that car coming up behind you might be nearer than you think. At least with a rear view mirror you are looking directly at that car. With a camera you are looking at a screen. Also, camera wing mirrors are rubbish. I've used them and they don't work and can be quite starling when changing lanes. They've also never really taken off either. I don't see the camera rear view mirror being as extreme but yeah, I'm just not convinced. It might be a deal breaker. Let's see when the car is available to test drive.

ted1

I drove caddy for years so used to not been able to see out the rear.

nit I do hate driving behind vehicles where I can’t see through and get a glimpse of what’s ahead

VikingG

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120497607#Comment_120497607

Actually that is one aspect I didn't think of - it is handy to be able to see through cars to see the road ahead. There is a similar downside to side cameras as opposed to side mirrors. From outside the car with the mirror you can see the driver as well and see if they have seen you - very handy when you are on a bike

n.d.os

It seems strange that they didn't include a window considering the placement of the panel on the rear of the car. I'm wondering did they run into problems last minute with safety, headspace etc... I know thats a bit far fetched but they may be rushing to get this car out. I'm sure the car will be bullet proof none-the-less.

munchkin_utd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120498806#Comment_120498806

I think its strange that nobody has done this with a normal car before.

How often have you read car reviews and they lament the small window at the back being useless for visibility? The solution there is either make it a bigger window which then messes up the boot lid and may not be possible (which is why the window is the cr@p size it is), or do what polestar has done and ditch it altogether and replace a substandard window with a camera which potentially shows a lot more than any back window will ever show.

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120499259#Comment_120499259

I'm not so worried about the size of the window. It's just good to be able to see a car behind you or at least some of it, particularly at night. Also to gage its proximity is important hence why I'm not sure about a camera. If this works it's a great idea so let's wait and see.

quokula

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120498806#Comment_120498806

This is what I don't understand. I could probably live with the change, but I just don't understand why they've chosen to do it. There's plenty of space for glass there and not having it hurts the looks of the car, aside from practicality. Side mirrors makes sense for aero but there's just no benefit to this change that I can see. The only one might be weight but there's already a full glass panoramic roof so a little bit more in a much more useful location surely wouldn't have hurt.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120499888#Comment_120499888

Glass will definitely be heavier that the equivalent sheet metal and water cleaner and motor for windscreen. Tiny increments in weight saving plus a unique design

Gumbo

Remember when that other brand got rid of buttons and used a large screen to control 90% of the functions…… Outrage, still to this day, by people that don’t own the actual car.

This will be the same some will adapt to it, some will like it and some won’t.

I like the look of all Polestars, just don’t think they offer value compared to others available so like them all, the devil will be in the released car. I really like the look of this P4 and will be watching it with interest.

listermint

https://youtu.be/mannFPtfylY

First flesh look here. Still looks the part.

Personally hate no tactile buttons for certain functions. No one will change my opinion on that.

Polestar are evidently going for the premium market other marque.. are pushing for volume and cost. As has always been the way in car market. Comparing badges has always been this way.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120501473#Comment_120501473

I read they were chasing the Porsche market with some of their cars. Polestar would certainly be up there as one of the top with regards quality but I thought the Porsche comment was a bit too much. Maybe I’m wrong?

FishOnABike

Not too keen on the no rear window. It's safer to be able to see through to one or two cars ahead in a line of traffic, whether moving or in stop start traffic.

I'd also usually give a clear turn of the head when keeping to the left a bit to let a motorcyclist know I had seen them and was making room for them overtake.

I can't see how something that reduces visibility for other road users can be good for road safety.

Soarer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120502076#Comment_120502076

Tens of thousands of van and truck drivers get on perfectly ok.

Creamy Goodness

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120501473#Comment_120501473

Yeah the lack of physical buttons/dials for things like air-con etc. boils my piss.

not to continue the rear window discussion again I guess I see similar comparisons to the two 🙂.

would love to test drive one though. Seeing a lot of polestars on the road recently.

carsfan2

I think this looks great.

The lack of rear window will be something you’d be grand with after a few minutes I’d bet.

I can’t see if being any cheaper than 65k for the base model in Ireland when it arrives here next year though.

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120501123#Comment_120501123

I think this is different to the button thing. Listen, I'm all for change. I'm usually the one arguing for it but screens in cars are a natural progression from phones and tablets that we use in everyday life. People aren't suddenly removed windows from their houses and replacing them with large projector screens displaying the world outside. When it comes to the world around you it is just as important in a car as it is everywhere else. Polestar is a sustainable brand so it's just a confusing message they are putting out with this rearward screen.

I watched an interview with the CEO of Polestar today where he talks about the camera. He couldn't really give an explanation for it except that it stops sun coming in from behind the back passenger. Is that a thing? Personally I think they had an issue with headroom. As I said before, it's not a dealbreaker for me. I'll try it first and hopefully be proven wrong.

On Polestars not offering good value. A P2 starts at 52k and offers a ton of kit as standard, more than any other car in that price range (except Tesla). You get plenty of range with their "standard" battery too. The cars are also beautiful inside and out.

listermint

Fairly detailed explanation here of why the rear change to window was done. Structural allowing for headroom and reduction in roof line back to front.

https://youtu.be/havLohAumXI

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120504636#Comment_120504636

I can’t argue with anything there. The value to me is a mix of spec V performance. 230bhp in the FWD P2 is a handful. It was a handful in my DC2 Type R and that had an LSD!

They’re no doubt lovely cars and I wouldn’t mind dabbling in the performance one of and when I can.

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120505432#Comment_120505432

The steering wheels pulls a little bit but the weight of the car more than makes up for that. I'll admit, I haven't tried a 0-60kph quick standing start but in general the car feels great and very manageable compared to a FWD hot hatch. My old JCW used to literally hop away from the lights. Dreadful torque steer. The 2024 rwd P2 facelift will improve the driveability of the car nonetheless.

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120503850#Comment_120503850

Yes, I'm worried it will be 65k too. I'm out at that price, at least for now. I'm sure I will consider it is the future. I'm hoping there is a completely new P2 in 2026. That might be a better option down the line.

carsfan2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120506412#Comment_120506412

well, a single motor Kia ev6 gt is 65k now and I think the new Hyundai 6 in higher spec single motor is around there too. If polestar are anywhere less I’d be amazed.

Do polestar do trade ins here or is it like Tesla where they offer rock bottom trade prices and move the cars in the trade?

TOLLOT

I see a review on Complete Car suggesting 70 k here , starting price . Im a little disappointed but not completely surprised. We’ll have to wait and see . It looks great imo .

TOLLOT

I see a review on Complete Car suggesting 70 k here , starting price . Im a little disappointed but not completely surprised. We’ll have to wait and see . It looks great imo .

n.d.os

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120506654#Comment_120506654

Polestar is linked to Spirit motors so that is where I sold my car. They are connected and also not connected so they can conveniently keep the trade in offer low. I got offered the same price for my car from pretty much every garage. The only time I got offered substantially more was when I was looking at an Enyaq and Skoda offered me a lot more for my car.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120506654#Comment_120506654

Funny enough, when I was selling my car I got the best price from Tesla by a large margin.

You just have to judge the market at the time of buying/collecting.

Get your car washed. Have the default photos all ready and put them into all the online car buying company’s and ring around. Have it on DoneDeal at this stage too and if there’s genuine a market for your car, you’ll get the calls.

Take the deal that works best on all occasions.

drunkmonkey

Just noticed the Hi Phi Z has no rear window as well, these are coming to the UK and Europe so I assume we'll get them, starts at $88k for the 5 seater and I think $92k for the 4 seater.

https://youtu.be/P_8To7rtKOU