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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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Comments

  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,351 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    Not quite. The whole nuclear winter thing was massively overestimated for a start. Radiation? The bombs dropped on Japan were very inefficient, barely working prototypes(of two types in case one was a damp squib) and because of that they didn't convert close to the majority of the fissable material so were very "dirty". Even so both cities are fine today and were rebuilding within years. Currrent weapons are a lot more efficient(for economics if nothing else) so are far less "dirty".

    Put it another way; the largest device ever detonated, the Soviet Tsar Bomba at fifty megatons, was insanely powerful and lit up the sky hundreds of miles away, yet a few hours after it went bang they sent in researchers with geiger counters and found at the epicentre of the blast radiation levels were barely above normal.

    A disaster involving nuclear power stations like Chernobyl, or Fukushima is way way worse. If we had detonated two ten megaton nukes at those sites, people would still be living there today. Well other than the ones vapourised in the blasts.

    We've also detonated over a 1000 nukes in all the testing since then, 500+ in atmosphere, a few underwater and the weather didn't change. One mid sized volcano going pop has far more power than our arsenal.

    What would happen in a full on exchange is a load of north American, European and Russian urban areas(and military bases in the backwoods) would be, I think the techy term is fúcked. Western, or at least northern hemisphere Western civilisation would be horrendously affected and millions would die, millions more in the aftermath as any sort of society and infrastructure would rapidly break down for months if not a year or so after. Africa, South America, China(if they didn't get dragged in) Australia etc would be affected that's for sure, economies would crumble, but significantly less in human costs. More remote areas in such places would likely not even notice.

    The putinistas and other gobshítes would get their "multipolar" world, though they wouldn' be around to see it and it would be largely a "third world" for generations.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,745 ✭✭✭seenitall


    I just can’t believe that man is still alive, and not only that but travelling around to fancy shindigs..?

    I just checked, he’ll be a neat 100 this year. :o



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,432 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    There is a common theme with Nazi ideology here. The best known marching song of the Hitler Youth contained these lines : "The flag leads us into eternity / Yes, the flag is greater than death".



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 258 ✭✭Annd9


    I'm sure i will be accused of being a "Putinbot" by pointing this out , was Zelensky not knee deep in off shore accounts before the war kicked off ? I seem to remember him being embroiled in the Panama papers scandal . Id imagine its nothing compared to the previous crew who butchered the finances of Ukraine for personal gain over many years , still not a great look for him though . In saying that, im sure it is the last thing Ukrainians will care about if he sends the Russians packing .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,514 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    Might be worth going back a couple of thousand pages to catch up.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,609 ✭✭✭.Donegal.


    British Retired air vice Marshall has a more balanced factual piece on the Germans than the childish echo chamber on here and that’s coming from someone who believes they should send the tanks to Ukraine. But sure what would the retired air vice Marshall know compared to the self confessed international relations mega gobs experts who post conspiracy shite from twitter all day 😂 wiki source😂




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,777 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Ukraine had a massive pile of ex-soviet equipment. They certainly werent manufacturing a huge amount of their own in the last 9 years thats for sure

    And sure if you dont need a big army when you have NATO protection, why dont the baltic states transfer all their equipment then?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Actually unless they are talking to Cuba your not going to find much of a stockpile of Soviet tanks in south America,

    Most of tanks in south America are Europen and hybrids



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,436 ✭✭✭SortingYouOut


    It says there is a condensor within, i'd imagine the steam returns to water after use through condensation and used again in cycle? Water never disappears, it just changes states.

    Beverly Hills, California



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,777 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Where did I say tanks?


    For example, Argentina, Colombia, Ecuador, Mexico and Peru all have variations of the Russian Mi-17 transport helicopter requested by Ukraine shortly after Russia launched its invasion last February.


    Ecuador and Peru have a total of about 40 Grad multiple launch rocket systems, though some may not be serviceable.

    Peru and Uruguay have a variety of Russian-made armored vehicles, including BMP-3 infantry fighting vehicles and MT-LB amphibious armored vehicles.


    Meanwhile, Peru has the Russian-made S-125 surface-to-air missile system, 35 self-propelled anti-aircraft guns and 80 towed anti-aircraft guns.

    Peru also reportedly has nine serviceable MiG-29 fighter jets and another four Su-25 ground attack aircraft in storage, though some analysts estimate the number of serviceable attack aircraft is higher.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,852 ✭✭✭zv2


    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    They have transferred a Fair amount but they do need to have something for their own defense and training,

    Sure why don't we make our own defense forces unemployed and and send everything we have guns ,ammo , mortar's, anti tank weapons,

    Don't think it would go down so well ,let alone with countries who have been occupied since WW2 to recently



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Most of which was scrap and most of it was left with little or no maintenance,the joys of having a military controlled and abused via Moscow



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 258 ✭✭Annd9


    Seeing as i was replying to a post on the previous page im not sure why i need to go back to the start of the thread . Thanks for the useful input anyway .



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,514 ✭✭✭Fighting Tao


    Well you did raise a subject that had been covered here. You’ve a similar sense of humour to Putins gang.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,852 ✭✭✭zv2


    dp

    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,303 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    There were some issues with his personal finances. He declared assets and holdings, but failed to declare some other offshore holdings (which he transferred just before he became president). I believe it's related to some dividends from his previous TV work flowing to his wife or something. Perhaps he had a legitimate reason to keep it out of the domestic scene, perhaps not. Either way, it's relatively minor stuff.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,351 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    Well that's a win win and win for the Americans. They keep crippling Russia, they clear the decks of Russia's previous arms industry exports and they replace them with kit made in the good ol US of A and help to insure new continuing trade of they swap them ove wholesale the US/NATO weapons systems.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    When did you Google that exactly,

    Don't recall anyone talking about it on boards over the last few year's,que a random low post count account suddenly brings it up



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,764 ✭✭✭storker


    Because it can take time for all the NATO capability to be deployed and why gift your invader more territory than is necessary?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    3 days depending on location and forces needed,less for smaller forces to be deployed



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,843 ✭✭✭weisses



    EU common defence ??? What about NATO ? Last time I checked Poland was a member



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,285 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,777 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    You could argue thats why they wont supply Abrams to Ukraine either, but are more than happy to supply the rest of Europe and are very keen on Germany exporting their own, and allowing other EU members to export their leopards.

    Germany simply cannot replace the leopards in their own stocks or other countries' stocks in a reasonable timeframe. So if Poland, Finland, Spain etc were to donate their leopards to Ukraine - that will be the end of them fielding Leopards, and being reliant on Germany for parts and maintenance etc etc.

    Anyone who gives their Leopards to Ukraine becomes an Abrams customer instead - a nice little way for the US to further destroy the German arms industry



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38,048 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Don't accept the premise.

    Apparently sending this doesn't meet the criteria of "If Russia decides to respond..."

    Untitled Image

    Or France sending this...

    Untitled Image


    But sending this triggers some sort of frothing at the mouth response in Russia that will send Russian tanks into Poland... and involve Ireland in the war.

    Untitled Image

    (images from Military Today)

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38,048 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Given how small and slow the Leopard production is, I don't know how it will be 'destroyed'. Sounds like it destroyed itself by complete inability to scale in a crisis.

    Won't Ukraine be in need of all those things for its Leopards?

    And wasn't Germany supposed to be increasing its own military budget? Why wouldn't it be restoring and buying Leopards???

    Or was that a lie too?

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Except the Abrams is more expensive and the only place for one to be repaired,or rebuild is currently Texas or Alabama (open to correction )

    That's long way for a tank to travel to be repaired or replaced,

    But there currently thousands of leopards already in Europe both operational and in various states of decommissioning, meaning spares and parts are already on shelves unlike Abrams parts and spares



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,777 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Germany, for better or worse, have not been able to siphon off nearly as much public money to their defense industries to make tanks. Even their stockpiles are low. Compare that to the Abrams stocks in the US - night and day the difference. Now the US likely couldnt produce enough new abrams' either, but they dont need to. they have the stocks to sell (or upcycle and sell). Germany do not have such stocks. So if EU countries send their leopards to Ukraine, they simply cannot possibly get those stocks replenished in the next decade.

    So they will get abrams instead, and become new loyal customers.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,661 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Kind of a conspiracy theory isn't it...?

    The ongoing costs and harm of this war dragging on to Germany (while Ukraine is not supported enough to win by its backers) are such that I think any loss of defence sales if European Leopard 2 tanks go to Ukraine will be a rounding error.

    If the tanks perform extremely well there (not impossible)...could be some renewed sales of them (or modernised/upgraded version), even if the customers have to wait a while for Germany to increase defence production to meet the demand.

    The whole of Europe (and Asia) is very, very nervous and everyone is arming up (again). There is alot of future business to be had for all Western weapons companies with good products they are willing to sell (not just the US). Russia (which is I think a much bigger "merchant of death" than Germany or any Western country bar the USA) is probably not going to have industrial capacity to produce many extra weapons for anyone else for a while.

    If IRC I think you were also a believer that Ukraine was definitely going to do some kind of nuclear contamination "incident" around Zaporizhzhia nuke plant (+ blame it on Putin) to drive the Russians out of the region, and that the Nordstream pipelines were blow by the British or the Yanks?😲



This discussion has been closed.
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