Covid 19 Part XXXV-956,720 ROI (5,952 deaths) 452,946 NI (3,002 deaths) (08/01) Read OP

I'm fully aware of all this but there was a period of time when I was back in school yet couldn't go to the hairdresser, restaurant or pub. I was waiting to be told either get the vaccine or don't return to work but that never came to pass, thank God. The point still is, we were in front of 100s a day and it was ok according to the Government guidelines yet couldn't get a one on one appointment with a hairdresser. That made no sense. My daughter and niece never stopped working, retail and nurse but again couldn't go to the gym. This was baffling to me at the time and still is.

It doesn't mean they are " useless at preventing infection " !

This is blatant attempt at misinformation And you the one in a previous post decrying rational discussion and moving of goalposts !

That is like saying condoms are " useless at protecting against STIs and pregnancy because they are ONLY 98% effective " !

NO it means they were exposed to the virus.

They could have been vaccinated in 2021, and infected 12 months later with Omicron. To conclude from that the vaccine is useless at preventing infection, without qualification, is a false and baseless statement.

So I repeat, where does it state that were infected and infectious?

You're actually contradicting the comments of the study's principal investigator, which you have zero standing to do so.

An interpretation you have zero qualifications to make, and you don't even declare it as your own interpretation.

So you are deliberately misrepresenting the contents of the article and spreading medical misinformation by stating your own interpretation of it as a finding of the article itself.

Also there were nurses who didn't get vaccinated for various reasons , who were redeployed if they were going to be at risk themselves or deemed a risk to vulnerable patients . Some did administrative work . Others were working in less acute non Covid areas . All had to regularly test afaik.

I had to step back from front facing duties as I am classed highrisk until I had my full primary course . Then I was back full on.

Every workplace were obliged to protect their staff and their clients and it wasn't black and white all the time .

This for you too @maude6868

The R for SARS-COV2 later variants was estimated at 12-20 in unvaccinated/uninfected population.

The real world R post vaccination (and with everyone else infected and with some antibodies) with everything open hovers at about 1.

What "magic" causes that drop in R?

Why does infectivity drop most soonest after vaccination?

Why do boosters reduce infection rates in those that receive them?

If you're going to argue "mountains of data" you have to be prepared to understand what that data means rather than ranting and raving about it.

Use the data to answer the above in a coherent fashion, if you can.

Again I disagree .Look when the study was. Had that age group been fully vaccinated and boosted at that time ? It doesn't mention boosters at all . In fact it only mentions in regards to checking to see if antibody levels are waning with the specific antibody tests to see if you need a top up booster which they discuss as preventing illness , not infection .

The vaccines have had a massive impact on Covid which was KILLING PEOPLE in massive numbers , unlike flu or any other virus around before . There us 'mountains of evidence" to show this , unlike what you are claiming in your post there . If you gave these mountains of evidence to counter this , where is it?

Yes , there is still a lot of infection around despite the vaccines , and the fact that Omicron is better at evading the vaccines but not causing severe illness is something that has been flagged and discussed by everyone .

To say that we blindly follow whatever we are told is untrue . You only have to look at threads like this and the Vaccine thread to see that many questions and discussions on the subject have been ongoing . Following research studies and trials . Looking at data from everywhere .

Don't remember you contributing much but maybe you were following, who knows?

There are new variants of Omicron around now eg XBB in Singapore which are causing extreme concern as they are mutating again to evade the present vaccines further if they become dominant worldwide , so it is hoped that the bivalent booster will buy us time before we find that the vaccine in its present form is really not effective . Until then at least immunity from Omicron infection and vaccines might get us over a winter wave , if that happens .

But saying it's useless now and always was is just fingers in the ears stuff...

So now you're done.

Well, apart from misunderstanding R (R of 1.1 can lead to spikes, that spike is significantly less than R in an unvaccinated population...), I asked you to come with data, and as predicted, you sh*t yourself over it.

Here's the R data from the UK, take a look at the averages before and after vaccination.

The R value and growth rate - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

Take a look at the numbers after full reopening with vaccination vs. in lockdown pre-vaccination.

Come with the data.

But but ..people don't believe that hospital admissions are an indicator either .

Sure they are all just admitted with incidental infections , aren't they , " With Covid" not " of Covid " ? 🤨/sarcasm

Phase 3 trials had been completed. Or put it another way all necessary trials for them to be approved for the general public had taken place. All medicines are reviewed after they are approved. Its important to remember they are multiple phases to testing which includes post market review.

Take this quote from the article

"Pfizer indicated in its trial protocol that individual participant data would be made available two years after study completion."

Pfizer have pushed this back and remember the release of this is to independent researchers and not regulatory bodies. It also unclear what exact trials the article is talking about on top of that.

Your link doesn't say that the vaccines hadn't been tested or received the relevant regulatory approval. Again there are different stages in every trial. Not all of them have to be completed or can be completed before a product is authorised for the general public.

I think your post is classic Dunning Krueger and confirmation bias. I don't think you actually understand the article or the regulatory process in general. If you look at the top of the article "intended for Medical professionals only". Its intended for a very specific audience who havd a better knowledge of the area. It's also a warning for lay people that they may not be able to understand the topic. This is not unusual for any area of academia.

The idea that the Covid vaccines didn't undergo the relevant tests is a conspiracy theory simple as. Stand back for a second. These vaccines have been approved independently the heath authorities world wide. That's at least thousands of people that are knowledgeable in the area, have independently looked at the relevant data, understand the approval process(which will vary slightly country to country) and have decided these are safe. Are you honestly saying all these thousands of people are part of one gigantic conspiracy/were fooled? Because that's what your argument boils down to.

Varadkar alluded to the fact that the Irish were subject to brutal lock down tactics in the Spring/Summer of 2021 to drive the vaccination rate.

That is control, the government forced restrictions on the population when there was absolutely no danger to the health system.

Remember in August 2021 Minister for Health said "hell was about to be unleashed"(about the spread of the virus) and we were all in danger.

Admittedly, we didn't go as far as Canada but lets be honest here, whose leader called the unvaccinated "racist/misogynists etc", Canada is in control of an authoritarian leader...we don't want to be copying China, North Korea, Canada, California etc...highly controlled societies, do we?

How many health workers were sacked in the US/UK/Europe? In the middle of a pandemic...

We imposed restrictions on unvaccinated children!!! That is sick!!

From the Mirror

Health officials have issued a stark warning over the latest sub-variant of Omicron to be detected as it spreads across the globe.

‘Omicron Spawn,’ which is also known as BF.7 and BA.5.2.1.7 was included in the latest update from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

The CDC warned on Friday that the newest strain can evade all existing immune responses to Covid-19 as well as vaccines, as many countries prepare for a difficult winter.

What restrictions were imposed on unvaccinated children in Ireland?