My Well Built Shed Project

Lumen · 04-06-2021 1:32pm

Seve OB wrote: »

It will be clipped to the fence so. However I might run it down the fence and under the slab as opposed to my original lazy idea of just drilling through my lovely new build

Nothing wrong with that, although it can end up looking better to keep the cable above ground, because you can run it up inside the cladding and then enter the wall where you have the fuse box.

I used airtight grommets for this:

https://www.ecologicalbuildingsystems.com/product/kaflex-cable-grommet

dodzy · 04-06-2021 6:41pm

Seve, please don’t take this wrong but your efforts on the groundwork are overly time consuming, overly costly and overly overkill! Keep your energy and your money for later stages of the project

listermint · 04-06-2021 6:46pm

dodzy wrote: »

Seve, please don’t take this wrong but your efforts on the groundwork are overly time consuming, overly costly and overly overkill! Keep your energy and your money for later stages of the project

Isn't that the nature of ground works

Fils · 04-06-2021 6:49pm

dodzy wrote: »

Seve, please don’t take this wrong but your efforts on the groundwork are overly time consuming, overly costly and overly overkill! Keep your energy and your money for later stages of the project

All fur coat, I think seve is getting his project correct from the ground up quiet literally,

dodzy · 04-06-2021 7:04pm

listermint wrote: »

Isn't that the nature of ground works

Lister, you know your stuff in this regard. I’m just prepping Seve for the task ahead

It’s hard to gauge at his stage of planning but this preferred route for the base will be timely and costly. Moreso than elevated on 4” solids, which would give arguably a better insulating and element ingress opportunity. I understand that the default is “concrete base will be more stable” but let’s not lose sight of the fact that this is a shed/wood structure, with feck all weight bearing downwards in reality. The planned concrete / rebar approach would allow for 2 storey blockwork almost

The Continental Op · 04-06-2021 7:07pm

Securing the frame to the base is a fairly important detail.

Seve OB · 04-06-2021 10:13pm

dodzy wrote: »

Lister, you know your stuff in this regard. I’m just prepping Seve for the task ahead It’s hard to gauge at his stage of planning but this preferred route for the base will be timely and costly. Moreso than elevated on 4” solids, which would give arguably a better insulating and element ingress opportunity. I understand that the default is “concrete base will be more stable” but let’s not lose sight of the fact that this is a shed/wood structure, with feck all weight bearing downwards in reality. The planned concrete / rebar approach would allow for 2 storey blockwork almost

I’m listening.

But I’ve already said I want the ground on this to be as low down as possible for reasons outlined. And even forgetting that, I want a concrete ground floor because it’s the best base you can have. I just don’t like wooden flooring nor raised flooring.

I know that’s what you did and yours looks great, maybe on a different project in a different location I’d look at raising the floor, but for what I want, is there a better way to do it?

Leave out the rebar and insulation maybe?

Am I going to thick on the 804 hardcore @ 4 inches? The ground does get very very very very soft in the wet weather

Am I going with to much concrete @ 4 inches?

I genuinely don’t know any of this, I’m just reading stuff on the internet and speaking to lads and taking the best of the best that I come across...... or at least I think I am.

dodzy · 05-06-2021 5:55am

Fully understand Seve. Nothing at all wrong with your plan. As for the 4” depth, insulation & rebar/mesh, if I was going to forego any of that, it’d be the steel but it will add a relatively insignificant cost to the base and definitely would not hurt the build. Best of luck and keen to see pics as you progress

Lumen · 05-06-2021 5:57am

Do you have access for a mini digger?

Seve OB · 05-06-2021 9:26am

Lumen wrote: »

Do you have access for a mini digger?

If I want one yes but I’ll be grand by hand.

Anyway, digging is on hold

young one birthday on Tuesday and having a couple over to the garden so will wait till after that to start.

Seve OB · 28-06-2021 3:26pm

So I’ve been quiet here….. not got an awful lot done so far but the digging is well underway along with plenty of conversations with friends, colleagues and builders

I was set on the above plan, raft and insulated but a few builders explained that insulating the way I was planning would not be the best. A rising wall and bringing the insulation up the inside of it is much better…..:. So that’s where I’ve headed! More work, more cost, but it will be done right. Digging the top was grand but digging the trenches is hard going, digger being delivered later in the week

also with the garden sloping up towards the back it means a good bit more digging at the back fence.

Tow · 28-06-2021 3:55pm

Steve, from the size of those photos I think you must be using dialup internet.

SteelyDanJalapeno · 28-06-2021 5:29pm

Agreed, some of the worst pictures I've ever seen

Please don't take offense &#55357;&#56834;

mloc123 · 28-06-2021 9:40pm

Tow wrote: »

Steve, from the size of those photos I think you must be using dialup internet.

Seve OB · 28-06-2021 11:12pm

Tow wrote: »

Seve, from the size of those photos I think you must be using dialup internet.

May as well be at times here!!
I’ve fixed size there now for ya

Seve OB · 05-08-2021 1:26pm

Been tipping away. It’s slow with work, got some holidays in and playing a bit of golf. But I’m in no rush, good things come to those who wait! I’m a bit further on from this picture with the rising wall complete and hardcore nearly done. Can’t go anywhere yet, been waiting on delivery of the insulation for a couple of weeks now. Seems stocks are low. When it comes, it comes!

have plans for next week so hopefully the insulation will arrive in the meantime and I’ll get a day or 2 of decent weather in a couple of weeks to get the slab finished.

I would like to know what you guys think of my next plan which is to lay a course of blocks around the perimeter on which I will build the timber frame. Idea to rise the wood off the ground to stop any rot and will have a layer of DPC on top of block. I was looking at some soap bars, 4 inches*4 inches. Would they do the job?

Lumen · 05-08-2021 2:00pm

I wouldn't skimp on the DPC level. IIRC the minimum is 150mm above ground level. Soap bars are pretty weak, I'd go with regular blocks.

That said I know naff all about blocklaying so...

Which details are you following? IIRC there are national guidelines but also this looks decent

https://www.woodspec.ie/docs/Woodspec%20Final%20-%20Section%20B.pdf

Seve OB · 27-05-2022 10:41am

Well project went on hold around about last September. I was sure I had posted updates but maybe not! I wasn’t arsed doing anything in dark cold winter months. A lot going on early in the year but all finished up last week to give me some free time to get cracking again

anyway here is a couple of photos I snapped the other day showing the state of play

Seve OB · 14-07-2022 12:24pm

Ok so I’m finally getting some time to start cracking on my actual shed build!

I’ve built a course of blocks around the perimeter, I’ll update pic later. I’ll lay a base board on top of these blocks with a layer of DPC in between block. This should help keep moisture away from wooden frame.

im going to build a frame, Sheet it with 11mm OSB 3, a layer of breather membrane, and then clad it with treated shiplap. I will eventually insulate and clad the inside walls…… at some point down the road. 😇

so a couple of early questions to throw at yiz please as I am starting to write a list of material requirements.

Is there different grades of breather membrane and which should I go for

i was going to try and seal the cut ends of the treated timber somehow. Any recommendations? Some kind or creaso?

i read that studs should be built either 16 or 24 inches apart but how far apart are the cross studs? Can’t remember their name and Google is not my friend 🤣

is 35mm timber ok for building the studs?

and any tips on securing my door into the frame?

Lumen · 14-07-2022 1:56pm

Yes, there are different grades of membrane.

I used Pro Clima Solitex Fronta Quattro because I was using open jointed (deliberately gappy) cladding so it needed to be black and UV resistant. You probably won't need those characteristics.

The purpose of the outer membrane is windproofing, not airtightness. Windproofing goes on the outside of the insulation, air tightness on the inside.

OSB can be made reasonably airtight by taping the joints, but tape is expensive, but if you're not going to tape the OSB you'll need to tape an inner membrane, so in some respects taping the OSB is cheaper (although it technically doesn't prevent interstitial condensation in or behind the insulation, so depending on your insulation choice you may still need a taped inner membrane).

By cross studs I think you mean blocking/noggins.

35mm is a bit skinny in term of giving enough width to fix OSB into, but maybe there's some technique I'm not aware of. I used 44mm.

I use Protim on cut ends but I'm not sure it's still available.

I wouldn't give you tips on doors. It took me three attempts to make mine 😂

Seve OB · 14-07-2022 3:31pm

Lol on the doors. I bought a door, it’s a beast. Just unsure on how to get it in place properly. Have just done very quick Google and not found any real help yet

noggins, that was the word I was looking for. I think they get done and offset each other? Would 2 noggins be enough on an 8 foot high wall?

thanks for info on the membrane. I might just go with the cheaper stuff then? It’s meant to keep the moisture off the OSB is it not?

not sure on the air tightness thing, hadn’t thought about that, but it won’t work on the outside for me with the way I plan to build it. Kinda hard to describe but will be obvious when you see me build it lol I’ll probably get some tape anyway and do the OSB joints. But I’m not sure it will make any difference. I might do something with it on the inside when I get that far

Seve OB · 14-07-2022 3:36pm

ill go with 44mm for studs also thanks

Seve OB · 14-07-2022 3:41pm

I need help with the roof please.

I have the walls all built and can picture it in my head. But not sure on how to finish roof.

am thinking.

120mm *44mm for the joists or whatever they are called 😄

then stick sheets of OSB3 11mm on top of them…. Or should it be thicker?

will throw some of the breather membrane over that, and think I’ll go with the felt shingles to finish (I did that on my dads shed a few years back which I think I posted a thread about before.

not sure on the edging though and the finishing. Soffits etc. this is where I need some advice if anyone can please

Lumen · 15-07-2022 8:18am

The roof members are called rafters.

The dimensions depend on the spans and loading, search for rafter span tables.

Generally speaking rafters need to be much deeper than studs. 120mm is probably insufficient.

It is generally a bad idea to have roof or wall finish directly attached to sheathing due to trapped moisture, better to affix to battens to provide a ventilation gap.

CreadanLady · 15-07-2022 8:52am

You'll want a minimum of 18mm OSB or WBP plywood. 11mm would be highly dangerous as if you stand on it you could fall through. It needs to be able to support the weight of a person who might go up there for maintenance purposes.

You should use a proper torch on roofing membrane. Shingles is only a load of crap and your roof pitch is too shallow for that anyway. It'll leak and hold moisture.

Anyhow, why are you bothering with a built up timber roof. It sounds very labour intensive. Would you not be better off roofing it with a few insulated Kingspan type roofing panels, perhaps one being a double skin insulated skylight. The can span a distance so you might only need two or possibly even one purlin across the middle, depending on the allowable spans of the panels.

It would be a way faster, easier, maintenance free, and a better job over all that will probably outlast the rest of the shed. Seems like a no brainer to me and building it up in timber and so on is just making unnecessary work and complication.

Seve OB · 15-07-2022 10:09am

11mm is fine for the walls though?

any link to those roofing panels? They sound expensive……. This is after all a glorified shed/man cave. It’s not a house nor home office 🤣

CreadanLady · 15-07-2022 11:21am

Not going to be all that expensive for what you need, which would be probably 2 or 3 panels at most.

And what you might spend extra in money will save you literally days and days of in time that you would otherwise spend fluting around with joists, plywood, insulation and shingles or torch on covering. You end up with a much cleaner looking job that will ultimately be more leak proof and last longer and be almost totally maintenance free.

Depending on the allowable span of the panel, you might even get away with just one purlin/beam across the middle of the shed.

If you got on to a supplier or Kingspan themselves, you might even be able to get a few seconds for very small money. Seconds, as in products that might have cosmetic imperfections or damaged in storage so that they are unsaleable for commercial use, but still would be perfectly serviceable.

I'd hazard a guess that a few panels would actually be cheaper when you consider all the timber, coverings, fixings, insulation and general fluting around you'd have to do to put on a built up timber roof.

It is a no brainer in my opinion. Also the option for a skylight which you can integrate into the cladding roof relatively easily and cheaply.

I know it is too late now, but I would even go so far as to say that it would have been better to build the whole shed from insulated cladding panels, and frame it with metal purlin Z or [ sections. Or you could frame it with timber too though. You would have a very warm and solid structure. Cladding panels are remarkably strong.

Plus you would have a totally maintenance free building and you wouldn't have to be bollixing around with treatment for years to come trying to stop the thing from rotting in the weather. A battle which will ultimately be won by the rot.

Seve OB · 15-07-2022 10:45pm

So found a brief video on you tube with those panels. They look the job.

will have to find more information though about fitting them before I decide.

skylight is not happening, daft idea in a shed 😂

it’s not to late, nothing has been ordered.

im building into the corner so won’t be able to build a frame and go around the sides to clad it, not enough room.

so I plan to build panels/sections of complete walls, and then stand them up into position.

for now, I’ll keep working on my requirements. I think I will order on Monday enough to complete the walls. I’ll worry about the roof in due course, but yes, I do like the look of those kingsman panels so if you have any more information or links on them, please send them on

Dr_Colossus · 16-07-2022 11:12am

No info or experience to offer regarding the insulated panels but saw this video last year which may be of interest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ol8zYBMzG3Q

Seve OB · 17-07-2022 5:47pm

Quick one

should I and how / with what seal the concrete blocks before I lay the timber base on top of them. I will be using a layer of DPC

fecking boards still spinning the photos sideways ☹️

My Well Built Shed Project

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