Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

The Irish Times has a letter from the Russian Ambassador to Ireland to-day. Extraordinary stuff: makes Wallace and Daly look reasonable.

See hare: https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/letters/cynicism-hypocrisy-and-lies-1.4842257

Two things stand out: he says that ("sadly" !!) there is a war in Ukraine. Words like that, even allowing for context, would get him locked up if uttered in Moscow. He also refers to Stepan Bandera (an ultra-right Ukrainian nationalist) being named a national hero of Ukraine. This was proposed by President Yushcenko in 2010, but declared illegal by his successor, a decision subsequently confirmed by the courts. Also a proposal to honour Bandera was rejected by the Ukrainian parliament in 2019.

The whole performance is totally off the wall.

It is an extraordinary document.

I said weeks back, that representatives of the Putin regime seem perfectly capable of lying through their teeth, officially, in print and on live TV. Its extraordinary.

Very little point on keeping up diplomatic relations with Russia - the only reason he is still here now, is

• so that our government can express its displeasure to Russia on a daily basis (read, berate Yuri Filatov in un-parliamentary language)
• So that when the time comes, all EU Member states can act jointly in expelling every Russian Ambassador simultaneously - it would feel wonderful to act unilaterally - but it lacks punch. 27 Expulsions (perhaps along with UK if they chose to follow suit) at once - does actually pack some diplomatic clout
• 
  

And really prove the lies Putin is telling Russians? Nope, Ukraine holds the high moral ground presently, and all Putin wants is looking for, praying for in fact, is a attack , preferably in Moscow, proving that Russia is under attack by Nazi's and he is the only one who can save them. Ironic really when you think it,, if that were to happen, because 20 odd years ago, he started his political career under the auspices of Boris Yeltsin when Yeltsin had 3 apartment buildings in Moscow blown up, blaming it on Chechens, and touting Putin as the man to stop the bombings and bring the culprits to justice. And this is what catapulted Putin into the position he holds to this day.

I wonder how long until our government starts getting serious and investing in our own capabilities. At the very least, we should have a debate about joining NATO.

Yep Saab make great jets. I loed their cars despite their quirkiness but they always seem to build things of quality. As for Finland, as far as I know they have one of the largest artillery units in Europe and with NATO moving towards having the smaller participants specialise in something rather than stretch themselves thin generalising that would be a substantial boost.

I'm surprised that this howler was not picked up before. Poland and Germany signed a non-aggression pact in 1934, which was well before Hitler's later adventures in the Rhineland, Austria, Sudetenland etc, and was a non-aggression pact, not a military alliance. Poland and the UK (and France?) signed a mutual assistance pact in 1939, which of course was the formal reason for the declaration of war on Germany later that year. Then of course there was the infamous Molotov-Ribbentrop pact just on the eve of WW2, which pro-Russian apologists conveniently forget.

Nowhere in these negotiations was there a German-Polish military alliance. Tooka, your assertion about this is just 100% false. I could call it a Big Lie, but I will be charitable and put it down to plain ignorance of history.

I feel that the success of the Ukrainian army in driving out the Russians in the north of the country could lead to overconfidence and they may be overstretched in the south when the Russians regroup and re supply their armies there. Will the Ukrainian army get enough fresh troops and equipment to the south in time for the coming new attack. I don't hold any hopes for a peace agreement for what it would be worth. It is predictible that Putin will double down.

You believe all of this is part of a plan, what plan exactly?

If they are carrying out such a ruse, they are doing an incredible job of it, leaving vehicles behind, leaving dead civilians lying everywhere, some with their hands bound, leaving uniforms behind, planting large quantities of mines.

You don't plant mines in an area you intend to return to..

Sky News covering this too - so further evidence of more weaponry and equipment being handed to the Ukraine

I just hope this isnt 'deterred' by some of the common Russian threats that are floating around

Classical Russian lying. You're correct.

Bandera was a product of Ukraine being squeezed in between Poland, Lithuania, Austria and Russia for few hundred years, and specifically in the WW2 period being squuezed by BOTH the Bolsheviks AND the Nazis.

Finally some movement, because so far it's been just talking. Once again, the US need to do something about it, because the Europeans are cynical árseholes and cowards - there's a clear breach of intl law and big bully of a country invading another one right at the EU border and the EU just sits back. The US hasn't been up to speed gauging by historical standards in terms of taking action on behalf of Europe (Bosnia, Kosovo), so maybe that's why this move to somehow correct the course and DO something.

Macron is probably the most embarassing one out of all EU leaders - just keeps calling Putin, his bill must be massive. I don't know if it's a cynical stance or genuine ignorance/naivity, but anyone from CEE knows that this is pointless and doing this more than once is embarrassing, the bully crackpot type such as Putin doesn't listen and doesn't understand "talking". The only thing he understands is force, strength and action. If Macron is rooting for an EU army (which I support) then he should definitely stay out of it, because he is destroying any credibility of this idea. France, with their strong military and budget means, should be shipping weapons to Ukraine en masse and making strong diplomatic statements and taking actions in international organizations, not keep calling the man in Kremlin.

Scholz, despite the historical change in stance regarding German military involvement (which is great, but too little too late really), is just weak and poor as well. Gas first and then maybe something later. While there's war going on 500km away. If I should guess then I would think the German strategy has been "let's just sit and wait it out and keep the gas flowing, it should be over in a month or two and then we're back to business".

Other EU "leaders" - nothing to mention about really, generally poor and weak. Only the CEE countries leaders know what they're dealing with and are pretty clear on what direction things need to be taken into.

And Rutte, that guy is so mean and ruins the optics and diplomatic/strategic aspect - strongly against giving Ukraine a candidate status. Diplomatic own goal for no reason, just pathetic. Ukraine can get EU candidate status, it's highly symbolic and will boost their morale plus geopolitically a strong signal to Russia, it costs nothing and of course Ukraine would take a decade at least to become a member. Turkey has had a candidate status for 27 years and it meant nothing, the country must want to join and make progress else candidate status on its own doesn't cut it.

In some sense, despite the massive support from the people of the EU, Ukraine goes through its little Munich Agreement moment here with the EU leaders, who are really leaving Ukraine on its own and going on with Appeasement Lite. Thankfully, the EU didn't surrender Eastern Ukraine to Putin just "so that we prevent war" this time!