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Ukraine Homes

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    #32
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118770631#Comment_118770631

    I do not agree people want change as they did it would happen... Sure we're grand as we are...



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    #33
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,168 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118762076#Comment_118762076

    Refugees have poured into Poland and other states bordering Ukraine. There are not enough resources for all of them to stay just inside the border or even in those states at all. Ireland will have to take its share of the refugees. The refugees themselves will not have much choice. Some may have preferences which will be accommodated but many will be sent to Ireland. Some of the refugees have already enrolled in school in Ireland and if they integrate sufficiently, may be not so inclined to go home to a wasteland, which is what Urkraine will be when the fighting stops, whether or not the Russians are still there.



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    #34
    Sleepy
    Registered Users Posts: 24,173 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    Given that Ukranians are, in general, a highly educated lot, maybe we could organise an exchange programme and send some of our career dolers out to the front lines?



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    #35
    wangchung
    Registered Users Posts: 65 ✭✭wangchung


    Irish people have surpassed themselves relation to helping out the Ukraine people against a murderer and tyrant . The Irish Government's decision to allow any Ukrainian to come here from the war zone without any visa ,whilst maybe admiral, they have done so without any plan how they would handle all these people. The various government agencies who have been told to handle the influx are completely overwhelmed; the social welfare; housing ,health etc. The airport is in chaos as they appear not to be able to deal with all the numbers coming in. The other issue is who all these people coming in and from where? I understand there are a number of Ukrainians coming in from other European countries where they have been residing for a number of years and taking advantage of our new open border policy and others using Ireland to get to UK .



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    #36
    Claw Hammer
    Registered Users Posts: 6,168 ✭✭✭Claw Hammer


    They are welcome to go to the UK. Why should we stop them going to the UK? We left the UK in 1922!



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    #37
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118784527#Comment_118784527

    This is basically what the article I read was talking about... There is agreed travel arrangement between Irl/UK and people able to get to UK using this back door... I expect Boris and MM disfussed this at weekend...



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    #38
    RichardAnd
    Registered Users Posts: 3,630 ✭✭✭RichardAnd


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118783346#Comment_118783346

    Most likely it has not been thought out at all. Furthermore, there will be plenty of money to be made from this. Consider this article:

    https://news.sky.com/story/ukraine-war-tens-of-thousands-of-ukrainian-refugees-could-come-to-uk-with-10-000-funding-per-individual-says-michael-gove-12564972

    Granted, this is the UK, but it would be safe to wager that something similar will be created here. This will create a financial incentive to take refugees, and it will line many a pocket. Call me cynical, but I would opine that mammon had more to do with the state's eagerness to take in refugees than any humanitarian ambitions. Also, I'm sure that the old Irish ambition to appear as the best boys and girls in the class probably weighed heavily on the minds of the politicians and bureaucrats who are behind this. Likely, the welfare of the refugees and the immense pressure they will place on already strained services were low on the list of priorities.

    Anyways, I don't see that 100k+ people will find accommodation in private homes, so it begs the question of where they will be housed. Methinks a disaster is on the cards. Hopefully, cooler heads will prevail in the next round of peace talks and this can be averted.



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    #39
    AnnieinDundrum
    Registered Users Posts: 108 ✭✭AnnieinDundrum


    Not specifically here but the “discussions” on refugees from Ukraine makes me wonder how we’d have reacted to boatloads of Jewish refugees in the 1940s.

    history shows us what brutality can happen. Surely we welcome them to save lives and sort out the practicalities later?



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    #40
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    Very few of them will want to go home.

    I stayed in Kiev for a month with work about 5 years ago.

    During that time I went to a few other places in Ukraine for a bit of travel and Kiev is most definitely the only part of it that you might even think was a modern city that someone might be happy to live in, and that is a stretch.

    So I believe that all the refugees wont be from Kiev. Any who arent will definitely see Ireland as a step up and want to stay here.

    Kiev will be a bombed out shell of a place, so reasons not to go back there if you think you can do better in Ireland.

    Of course you will get some who will want to go back no matter what state it is in, but anyone thinking of improving theirs or their familys lives, will for sure come down on the side of - better life to be had in Ireland. Citizenship to follow, with everything that brings too (Europe).



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    #41
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118792295#Comment_118792295

    Ireland famously didn't want Jewish refugees. There were public protests against taking them in.

    The government basically didn't want them in case they give rise to an anti-Semitic problem. Like saying now, we don't want Ukrainian refugees in case it causes racism to rise.



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    #42
    AnnieinDundrum
    Registered Users Posts: 108 ✭✭AnnieinDundrum


    I know what we did in the 1940s but after the horror was revealed to us I thought we’d be better now. We can see live feeds of what’s happening, we don’t have to wait a decade to see it.

    i read a posting on FB from an American I know slightly, he told his family tale of escaping from Ukraine and other parts of Eastern Europe in 1920s ish. But his other posts are about how the USA must tighten borders, reduce immigration etc.



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    #43
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118792498#Comment_118792498

    Have you any pointers for reading up on that? Genuinely interested.



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    #44
    RichardAnd
    Registered Users Posts: 3,630 ✭✭✭RichardAnd


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118792295#Comment_118792295

    It would depends on the individual and on their personal circumstances, just as it does today.

    Humans are a tribal / family orientated species. If an individual is in a position where their needs are met, they will be open to considering the needs of others as it will not be seen as a “threat” to their own procurement of resources. This is just how we are, and there are very good, evolutionary reasons behind it

    Taking the current situation as an example, if someone is struggling to pay rent / pay bills or find a home, the thought of an additional 100k people here is very worrying, regardless of the reasons.  More people means more pressure on resources. It’s very hard to be altruistic when one is themselves in a difficult position, and many people are indeed in difficult circumstances. I myself know a Romanian lady who is facing the loss of her rented accommodation, and she is extremely concerned that she will be unable to find something else if refugees arrive in huge numbers. I think that her worries are not hard to understand…

    For my own part, I have sympathy for anyone who is displaced by conflict, but it is also important to bear in mind that there are consequences to every action.  Simply because someone raises concerns does not mean that they are a bad person. What is the right thing to do? I have no idea, but as I have said above, I have severe concerns about the motivations of the state and great worries for what could happen. 

    My two cents…



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    #45
    retalivity
    Registered Users Posts: 14,105 ✭✭✭✭retalivity


    There is a ton of student accommodation built/being built in Dublin that has very low occupancy due to the ridiculous cost of a room. I expected the government to commandeer a few of these to house the Direct Provision crowd, but could see that being fast-tracked to house incoming Ukrainian refugees instead.



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    #46
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    I know of one slumlord that's entered into deals with DCC for some of his properties, to house refugees.



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    #47
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118792551#Comment_118792551

    On the mobile at the mo, so can't really, but there is lots online about it



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    #48
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118793002#Comment_118793002

    All good thanks. Found some stuff on Irish Times and Holocaust Ed Trust Ireland.



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    #49
    Annascaul
    Registered Users Posts: 118 ✭✭Annascaul


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118763573#Comment_118763573

    I am not against housing refugees, but that's the main issue. We're supposed to accept refugees, but can't even properly house our own people.



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    #50
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    I think they are approaching people now to get housing.

    we have an old mobile home. Its about 30 years old. Mainly used a s a shed now, but it still looks like you could live in it, but you cant. It would be freezing and leaks. Even the toilet is decommissioned.

    Had someone call in from a charity asking if they could use it to house refugees.



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    #51
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813324#Comment_118813324

    Housing refugees isn't going to make that much difference.

    The people in control of housing don't want to fix the crisis, and people who own property don't want their homes/investments to devalue.



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    #52
    JimmyVik
    Registered Users Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭JimmyVik


    There is so much that is unknown here.

    Its a hot topic at work with most people having pledged.

    But questions have come up after they pledged that there are no answers to.

    How long will it be for?

    Do you have to pay for food and heat?

    If you decide its not working out what happens?

    Will there be a defined period that you can sign on for and will the state then house the person or leave them inyour house for you to deal with - like the way rentals have gone.

    One scenario described was.

    Imagine if you take in a refugee and all is well for a few months. Then you dont get on with them, or even it has just gone on too long and you would like your house back. Will there end up a story in the paper where you are the evil landlord evicting the poor refugee?

    All of these bad things have happened to people renting out their homes. No reason to expect they wont happen if you share your home.

    There will come a point where there has to be places for refugees to go when people want their homes back. This is Ireland. There will not be anywhere for them to go to. What happens?



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    #53
    RichardAnd
    Registered Users Posts: 3,630 ✭✭✭RichardAnd


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118817489#Comment_118817489

    Lots of very good questions there, and there are plenty more withal. From my own experience, I don't know anyone who has actually pledged to take a refugee. Some have said that they want to do it, but I would say that the cold reality of what they're signing up for will sway them against it.

    To be honest, even asking people to do this is irresponsible on the part of the state. I seriously doubt that they will get anywhere near enough people to sign up to this to take a refugee, and even if they did, it's not a long-term solution. What will the state do instead? I don't know, but I would be happy to wager that we'll be paying for it for a long time.



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    #54
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users Posts: 16,113 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    In my opinion they have to accept a pledge of less than a year ,. Most people would be ok with 4-6 months but its pushing it top ask for a year to 18months .Six months would give to Government breathing space to sort something out long term .

    Also as JimmyVik said so many questions to be answered ,

    Who feeds them and pays all the bills

    Who shows them around and guides them to all facilities

    What if they dont speak a common language who will help out with that

    Who will drive them to hubs etc .

    Who will clothe the people who arrive with absolutely nothing at all



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    #55
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    There's people that will make big money to house and feed them, that's for sure. But that's an issue with the system, and how it's set up to allow companies to make big profits from it.

    Some refugees that have moved in close to me have a volunteer that's doing interpreting for them. They were given some clothes and provisions when they arrived at the airport. My neighbours and myself have helped out with other things that they've needed.



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    #56
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    Today is the first time i noticed our politicians acknowledging the gravity of acomodation problem for the new arrivals... Likely too much happening witjh St Patrick's day.. it be interesting to see how this is sorted with already house shortage...



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    #57
    uli84
    Registered Users Posts: 1,683 ✭✭✭uli84


    Don’t know the details but one of my ex-colleagues housed a few in her house but apparently they are already getting ‘their own place’, whatever that means. She was asking the other day for help with the items they’ll need moving forward, so not sure how exactly that works.



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    #58
    Slava_Ukraine
    Registered Users Posts: 320 ✭✭Slava_Ukraine


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118762076#Comment_118762076

    Social welfare is more here for sure, however those that I know have came here to their families, including mine, have no other intention but to go home once they can safely do so.



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    #59
    Slava_Ukraine
    Registered Users Posts: 320 ✭✭Slava_Ukraine


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118782806#Comment_118782806

    That's thinking outside the box!



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    #60
    chicorytip
    Registered Users Posts: 4,101 ✭✭✭chicorytip


    The local authorities are to "fast track" a building programme to help accommodate the influx of Ukrainian refugees. Good news but what about Irish families on waiting lists for the past ten years?



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    #61
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    That suggest this is being funded which makes sense... Local authorities haven't been really looking after housing for years because of lack of money they say...



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