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This whole cancel culture myth

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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,192 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    Here's an example of cancel culture:

    Hartley Sawyer, an American actor who was famous for playing a character on The Flash TV show got fired from said show in 2020. It was all because of tweets he posted earlier in 2012 and 2014.

    2012 tweet: "The only thing keeping me from doing mildly racist tweets is the knowledge that Al Sharpton would never stop complaining about me"

    2014 tweet: "Enjoyed a secret boob viewing at an audition today."

    Immature and shouldn't have said it, of course, but I have read way way worse of twitter. But cancel culture got him and the show axed him. Hasn't had a single imdb credit since. He joined flash in 2017 so someone went back through at least 8 years of tweets in 2020 to dig something up.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,416 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    the second one isn't great but the first one is completely stupid. imagine publicly admitting you are racist in 2012?



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,982 ✭✭✭Christy42


    That is capitilism. Not Cancel culture. Actors get payed based off of name recognition and his became bad. That is why famous actors get paid so much more than the average actor. Certainly many famous actors are good actors but not to the extent they get payed. However big names will attract more viewers and more money. Hartley was not a big name to begin, with no real big roles and wasn't going to bring in more money and being mostly famous for dumb tweets is going to lose them money.

    Side point: It didn't take much research to find out those were not the tweets that got him fired, I feel a bit more research should be required in future as what you wrote seriously misrepresents what happened. "Things only women should be in: twilight screenings, gynecologists offices, and Porsches."


    "As a lad, one of my favorite activities was kidnapping homeless women and cutting off their breasts"


    He seems to have a trend, people prefer not to support bad people and so likely would have led to viewers turning off. Should they keep an actor who gets them less views?



  • Registered Users Posts: 740 ✭✭✭RonanG86


    What does the second one even mean? Does it mean he spied on an actress changing her clothes during an audition? (He should be sacked for that) Or does it just mean he took out his phone and type "boobs" into Google cos he was bored?

    That's why you don't tweet the first random crap that comes into your head.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,192 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    Erm... I can only be blunt with this one.... are you alright in the head? Lol. First you say that didn't get him fired, then say I didn't do "research"

    Ermmm...


    So yeah... I don't think you have a clue what you are talking about. Normally, I wouldn't bat an eyelid but you come off as "a matter of fact" about it.



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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,704 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I remember when it was considered communism to dare question the wisdom of private entities on this site. Funny how things change just because bigots encounter consequences.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,774 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    The Lord of the Rings was, among other things, influenced by Tolkein's views on what he saw as the ever increasing industrialisation of England, which he viewed as destroying the rural village type of living that he had grown up with.

    It's a clear and documented case (and discussed by Tolkein himself) of an author's views and experiences being reflected in their work.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,416 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    you only mentioned two of the tweets. there were more including

    Other tweets refer pointedly to violence against women.

    Several tweets refer to assaulting women,

    The tweets also contained homophobic language and some discussed violence against women.

    so the tweets you quoted may have been enough on their own to get him fired BUT there were others as well. This is not cancel culture. this is somebody getting fired for being an asshole.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,192 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    First one is dumb alright. I think it was his personal twitter before he got going as an actor. Then made the mistake of not deleting it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,416 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    dumb enough to get him fired. that it was his personal twitter makes no difference. He wasn't cancelled. he got fired and rightly so.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,192 ✭✭✭✭B.A._Baracus


    What were the other tweets?

    I only ask cause I remember reading this story at the time (I watch the flash) and those were the only two tweets I remembered.


    Edit

    I see them here https://static3.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/Hartley-Sawyer-Stupid-Tweets.jpg

    to me, he comes off as some immature frat boy type who thought he was posting funny things. As I say, I've read way worse on twitter. People who posted absolute vile and not trying to be witty in any way



  • Registered Users Posts: 467 ✭✭nj27


    Famous individuals who lose their TV show or book deal etc is a just one aspect of this phenomenon, although it tends to get the most attention due to the fame already associated with the individual concerned. The more pernicious aspect is the cancellation of ideas in the media. Chompsky's book manufacturing consent put forward the case that mass media's reliance on advertising revenue lended extraordinary power to motivated individuals and groups who complained to networks about content they broadcast. Fear of losing advertising revenue as well as the capital required to setup and maintain a major media outlet results in a situation where media often buckles to complaints in sufficient volume, stultifying their ability to report on unfashionable stories. This power was once wielded by the Christian right, now it's in the soft and feminine hands of the left, although neither scenario is desirable, but it's basically unfixable at this point.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,416 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    the three articles you linked to mentioned them but dont show them. this reddit page lists them but the twitter page it uses as a source no longer exists




  • Registered Users Posts: 6,940 ✭✭✭El Gato De Negocios


    Thats where we are heading for imo and not just for people in the public eye.

    The most innocuous of things can potentially be used to cause difficulties.

    I'll give you an example. Now this is pretty funny imo but its evidence how comments can be perceived.

    A mate of mine watched a video on Facebook of a comedienne that has cerebral palsy, think it might have been from a BBC show. Anyway, the clip was subtitled and he posted a comment saying he thought it was a bit unnecessary having subtitles because she was perfectly understandable. He commented because he thought it was subtitled due to her having CP and that people wouldn't be able to understand her, and that, he felt, was doing this young lady a disservice. Nothing to see here, right? Wrong. The deaf community went ballistic with him. Multiple people started flaming him due to his "insensitivities", calling him disrespectful, deafist, all sorts of things. The harder he tried to explain what he meant, the more people joined in to bash him. It went on for over a week until he eventually bowed out of it. The most hilarious thing is that he is the least offensive person you'd care to meet. He himself is gay and has experience of homophobic abuse over the years so is very conscious of respecting people from all sections of society.

    We live in a world where "Im offended" is like the fuckin bat signal to draw all kinds of loonies out of the woodwork.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    How can it be sufficiently "proved"? Despite numerous examples, you refuse to concede there is any evidence that it exists.


    What constitutes "proof" that cancel culture exists?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,153 ✭✭✭Rented Mule


    Louis CK is back touring the United States. He did three nights at The Vic Theater in Chicago recently. He is selling out dates across the US at the moment.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I think in Rowling's case she has huge leverage over Warner Brothers. They can't do anything with Harry Potter without her consent. I think that's what's keeping her on life support in Hollywood. Otherwise they'd have TERF'd her to the curb.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,704 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Using empirical evidence and not right wing opinion.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,742 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    So cancel culture exists but rape culture, racism, misogyny and bigotry don’t? Or if they do they should just be ignored by people “just trying to get on with their lives”?

    “It is not blood that makes you Irish but a willingness to be part of the Irish nation” - Thomas Davis



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    There isn't a scientific formula to prove that cancel culture exists. Anymore than there is empirical evidence that racism exists. It's entirely subjective, but most reasonable people would be able to identify a pattern when they see one.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    There is a difference between isolated incidents that are statistically insignificant, and a series of events that indicate trends/patterns. Most people can agree on that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,858 ✭✭✭growleaves


    I wouldn't call it subjective.

    Anyone who has been following the news media for the last 20 years knows dozens of examples, maybe hundreds.

    There was the English scientist who lost an honorary award because he said men and women who work in laboratories fall in love with each other sometimes.

    There was an IQ researcher in Newcastle upon Tyne who correlated university admissions with class background.

    Etc., Etc.

    Why does it need to be presented as "empirical data" (in table form)? That is just a time-wasting request.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,858 ✭✭✭growleaves


    Should posters now spam the thread with news articles about PC controversies and firings because pro-PC posters claim to have never heard of such a thing? Bizarre



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,248 ✭✭✭Sonics2k


    Right so by that argument rape culture, racism, misogyny and bigotry are considerably bigger problems.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,993 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,704 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    So nothing then. Comparing it to racism is frankly ludicrous. One exists and one doesn't. It's that simple.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,503 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    which makes perfect sense as the WOKE ayatollahs are the new bishops , condemning from their social media pulpit and demanding an artists work be censored , the new " book burning "



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,227 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    Not comparable with Rowling and Harry Potter.

    Friends is a TV show, devised as a TV screenplay, with a script written for TV by multiple people over multiple years.

    The Harry Potter movies are based on novels, devised as novels, sold and very popular as novels, written by an individual.

    There is no comparison.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,858 ✭✭✭growleaves


    Yeah except ayatollah doesn't play dumb and claim he doesn't know what a fatwa is.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,248 ✭✭✭Sonics2k


    This guy is seriously saying that people getting cancelled on twitter is on the same level as racism. What kind of bubble is he living in?



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