An Post returning packages from outside the EU-See 1st post

dxhound2005 · 27-10-2021 5:53pm

Here is an example of an English company which stopped sending to the EU. I found them useful for their 50 pence packets of seeds, now they won't even send to Northern Ireland. No doubt they found the whole thing "questionable".

https://moreveg.co.uk/

This is a EU company, with cheaper prices than GB, at least on some items I am familiar with. And free shipping from Italy to Ireland, on some deals. Not as cheap as Japan, but a lot less hassle.

https://www.mhzoutdoor.com/

Enrico Palazzo · 27-10-2021 10:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118081151#Comment_118081151

If Anpost has been holding my parcel from the UK containing only books (and declared as such), asking me to pay 23% VAT and their fee to release it and for weeks and hours spent on the phone their best offer is that I make the payment and later apply for a refund and I am supposed to apply for it at an email address that I am yet to receive a single response from, and based on others' accounts, my parcel may be prematurely returned to the sender even if I make the payment, and I read here that it's systemic, then there is something seriously wrong there and it's not just a matter of gross incompetence.

silver2020 · 28-10-2021 9:09am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118080550#Comment_118080550

I would like a laugh. Look at the weather out there. Pure miserable. So would love a laugh at what someone calls "illegality" because you get a lot of people like that. They spurt out utter nonsense and back it up with absolutely zilch.

The problem is some suckers will believe it and repeat it and then make fools of themselves in the process.

So I would love to read what "illegality" the poster claims as it will be bullsh1t and it will give me a hearty laugh.

dxhound2005 · 28-10-2021 9:19am

With four different actors involved, there is plenty of room for incompetence, gross or otherwise. I would take that over the conspiracy theories.

The exporter has to depend on the carrier, in GB Royal Mail / Parcel Force mostly. Anyone reading post 1375 would not be inspired to have much confidence in RM. But exporters can make mistakes too. Then we have our own Revenue, and An Post, or other deliverer.

silver2020 · 28-10-2021 9:36am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118080538#Comment_118080538

Yes there are a lot more parcels with issues going to Ireland that to other EU countries - guess why?

1 - There are a hell of a lot more parcels sent from UK to Ireland than UK to any other EU country.

2 - English people still think Ireland is some part of the UK and all the parcel needs is a stamp

3 - Many Irish people in England have a similar attitude as in "sure it will be grand".

4 - From previously living in the UK, staff in post offices are utterly dreadful and don't give a hoot

When all people living in the UK sending parcels to Ireland realise that you have to provide proper information, then the issue will go away. But until then, parcels will be returned.

Funny, I've had no issues with any packages, but in a couple of cases I gave the sender the taric codes and made sure they put the correct details on the package.

As for thinking it is just Ireland. If you google search in local language (please don't use English), you will see the EXACT same issues with the following countries.

Greece, France, Luxembourg, Bulgaria, Belgium, Portugal, Netherlands & Sweden are what I've found.

From that, the common denominator seems to be British people and Royal Mail. But sure lets blame the big bad local guys for british issues

28-10-2021 2:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083850#Comment_118083850

Nope its not going on in other European countries nearly as bad as here. In fact given our population, we shouldnt be having nearly as much issues as other Europaen countries, but the fact is, we are bypassing them withe the amount of returns. Also its not just the UK to Ireland parcel service. The UK is coming in second to that of China/Asia. In fact if you are ordering a parcel from outside of Europe its safer to have your products sent to another European country and then forwarded to Ireland. Every day i see 2 or 3 people who have had their packages returned to Asia. Personally i have had a package sent from China to France, it is currently on the way to me from France as i need to get it soon. I have had the same parcel sent to the US and sent to me and its currently on the way to me from the US. Thirdly i have the exact same parcel coming directly from China. Not sure were that is. I know people having their parcels sent to Germany from Asia, and then being forwarded from there in order to avoid any "Christmas Issues" . Other people i know have an address in Northern Ireland and then they are driving them down from there.

rf4c · 28-10-2021 3:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118083850#Comment_118083850

Before you ever made the suggestion I had already checked (in the local language) France, Belgium, Spain, Netherlands, Sweden, China and Japan.

You are partially correct in your assertion that there are some problems. What you fail to say is that the proportion of "problem shipments" is substantially less and more importantly, the Postal Authority engages with the recipient to resolve the problem. Needless to say they don't do it out of the goodness of their hearts, fees are involved, but at least the recipient has options.

You are incorrect that Ireland receives more UK parcels than any other European country. The UK Office for National Statistics would place these rankings as 1)Germany 2)Belgium 3) France 4)Netherlands 5) Spain 6) Ireland etc. etc. etc.

Finally "the common denominator seems to be British people" is borderline racism.

dxhound2005 · 28-10-2021 7:17pm

Something seems odd to me. Ireland got 6.8% of the UK exports in 2020, but lags way behind Belgium which got 3.4%, in the parcel post element of that trade??

https://www.worldstopexports.com/united-kingdoms-top-import-partners/

Or slightly different stats from another source. Both sources show Ireland at number 2 in the EU behind Germany, for total exports received by value.

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/exports-by-country

jwmpayne2004 · 28-10-2021 9:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085534#Comment_118085534

Greetings! Just wondering if you are using addresspal with your US shipment to Ireland? If you could recommend any forwarder that will great. Thanks!

rf4c · 28-10-2021 9:48pm

I'm not sure if this is any use to you, but here's my story, just 48 hours old.

I have a medical condition that needs a device which is only made in the US and only sold there and in the UK.

The manufacturer would be clueless about shipping to Ireland, so I contacted Addresspal and asked them if I got an accurate TARIC Code,

instructed the seller to put it on the invoice and purchased the item for delivery to Addresspal USA, would/could they use the invoice to generate the correct paperwork for successful import to Ireland.

They said the invoice would need all the usual, description, value, weight, TARIC Code and preferably placed on the outside of the box, and subject to the item not being a Prohibited or Restricted item, they would complete a CN23 to go with the shipment. More helpful than I'd hoped for but,this time at least, well done An Post! (or is it a trap!!!!!!!!!) (joke!)

Sparkling Gamorreans · 28-10-2021 10:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087642#Comment_118087642

I've ordered three things through Address Pal in the past month. Two from Hong Kong and Singapore via USA and one from the UK via the UK. Address Pal filled in impeccably complete CN23s with 10 digit TARIC code and I am almost sure the merchants didn't include said 10 digit code as I couldn't get them to comprehend Irish requirements in the first instance. They seem to be covering their own arses with caveats but in my recent limited experience it seems to be a solid way of ensuring something comes with the required Irish customs requirements. They'll apply VAT to the value of the item plus the Address Pal postage cost.

silver2020 · 29-10-2021 10:25am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085849#Comment_118085849

UK postal parcels - Ireland is way ahead of other countries on a per 100,000 basis and would be up there on a physical number basis especially in the personal parcel area. Though possibly overtaken by Poland at this point.

The common denominator being British people is not racist in any way at it is what it is. The issue is incorrect or not properly stated information at the source - eg British people.

Sparkling Gamorreans · 29-10-2021 10:46am

In spite of people wanting to shoehorn this into either a Brexit/British/RM issue or an EU wide issue there are North American and Asian retailers (as well as British) who have stopped selling or standard shipping to Ireland alone.

dxhound2005 · 29-10-2021 11:34am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087690#Comment_118087690

EU wide requirement, not just Ireland. They would also need a 10 digit code for any USA address, not just Address Pal. This is from the An Post site where I made a dummy export from Ireland to the USA of shoes made in Austria (AT). Maybe merchants in Asia have stopped sending to USA domestic addresses as well?

Running Shoes

A suitable HS6 code is 640411

A suitable 10-digit code for US import is 6404116160

A suitable 10-digit code for AT export is 6404110000

Sparkling Gamorreans · 29-10-2021 2:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118089199#Comment_118089199

"EU wide requirement, not just Ireland." - I didn't say it wasn't an EU requirement? The requirements to get post into Ireland could be characterised as Irish requirements notwithstanding the fact they're also EU requirements and could also be described as such?

"Maybe merchants in Asia have stopped sending to USA domestic addresses as well?" - Maybe this is a really obtuse comment but I don't follow what you're saying here? Are you trying to say that the requirement to export to the USA or the EU is entry of a 10 digit code therefore when I ordered from Asia to USA the merchant provided a 10 digit code regardless therefore my assumption they didn't provide it isn't correct?

rf4c · 29-10-2021 3:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088903#Comment_118088903

My objection remains. There are many issues, factors, organisatins, conflicting laws and rules that all go to make up this problem which you yourself said is widespread. It remains unacceptable to single out one group or nationality as you do.

innuendo141 · 30-10-2021 10:13am

Has anyone asked a seller to include the 10 digit code on a package prior to shipping and had a successful delivery? Hoping to buy a CD from Japan and ask the seller to include the code but I'm not even convinced that if this was included that it would ever get to me.

EDit · 30-10-2021 11:58am

I did on a record from UK seller bought on Discogs last week. The item was sorted in the Dublin Mail centre two days ago and nothing since. I’ll update if it arrives

Dynomutt · 30-10-2021 1:38pm

I did when ordering from the US on Oct 18th, and received a customs payment notice on Oct 27th.

When I checked tracking, I discovered that the parcel had arrived in Dublin on the 25th and was returned on the same day. An Post put it down to a “processing error”.

It arrived back in Ireland yesterday and I paid the customs charge. Tracking says it’s out for delivery so fingers crossed I’ll have it by Monday.

Esel · 30-10-2021 9:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118089199#Comment_118089199

Looks like you can turn a 6-digit code into a 10-digit one by adding '0000' at the end? Worth a try possibly if you can't find the actual 10-digit code.

NewbridgeIR · 30-10-2021 11:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118093175#Comment_118093175

The Japanese seller I recently used has re-sent my CDs via DHL. He refused to send again via normal airmail given An Post’s unexplained rejection of the package.

dxhound2005 · 31-10-2021 12:46am

Exporters in places like China and Japan should be well used to the 6 digit HS code, and would be expected to keep up to date with the current version. New update due in 2022. It forms the basis of the CN 8 digit code, used by the EU to gather statistics about trade within the Union. Another 2 digits is needed for the TARIC code. This is the 10 digit code that Customs in the EU want electronically declared and transmitted from outside the EU. As far as I can see, the last digit of the 10 digit code is always zero.

http://www.wcoomd.org/en/topics/nomenclature/instrument-and-tools/hs-nomenclature-2022-edition/amendments-effective-from-1-january-2022.aspx

https://porath.com/en/hs-cn-taric-ezt-whats-the-difference/

deezell · 31-10-2021 9:48am

They might keep up to date if the entire EU returned every 6 digit packet but only the zealots in AnPost are pulling that stunt. The result is some suppliers will only use expensive couriers.

Right now a supplier of drive belts in the UK I used will only quote DPD for Ireland, £10 on a £5 purchase, to which DPD will in all likelihood add VAT and an admin fee to satisfy customs. The last time I had a packet delivered by a courier from a non EU source, and had VAT added, the courier admin fee was €12.50. What fees are people paying for DPD /FedEx on small packets? If I add that and exchange rate, about €3, and VAT, 23% of €18, €4.14, I'm looking at nearly €35 all in. Time was it was £5 and about £3.50 Royal Mail. Same item is about €13 here, €10 delivery or an hours drive return to pick up from a counter, so the UK cheap source is no longer feasible. Sometimes though the only source of a part might be the UK, so a £5 item can turn into €35.

Darc19 · 31-10-2021 9:57am

Electronic declaration by DPD is €5.

dxhound2005 · 31-10-2021 10:10am

Another party involved is the UPU which has described postal services as having to deal with a "tsunami" of parcels. The same phrase is being used by DPD. They think that Advance Electronic Declaration will help with processing exports/imports by post, but it will probably take time to settle down. An example of how parcel post is increasing is the UK stats (all parcels, domestic and export).

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1170645/parcel-shipping-volume-united-kingdom/

deezell · 31-10-2021 10:15am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118096847#Comment_118096847

Has this to be paid on receipt along with VAT, or is it included in the total DPD charge on ordering?

Darc19 · 31-10-2021 10:20am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118096892#Comment_118096892

They send you an email with the details and link to pay.

A UK company/ individual can also do pddp with both royal mail and DPD. (Post delivered duty and tax paid)

Royal mail only added Ireland to the facility in the last couple of weeks. They should have had Ireland as one of the first countries

dxhound2005 · 31-10-2021 10:52am

Thinking about it, it would be nonsensical if they did.

Sparkling Gamorreans · 31-10-2021 4:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118096830#Comment_118096830

If there's something you need you can only find in the UK and that merchant will only go courier to Ireland then you're probably best using Address Pal. £6.50 delivery and the AP VAT collection admin fee of €3.50 on this side. Still a significant add on for a small purchase but you're probably saving a few pound on delivery and flat admin fee. That's if you can stomach using AP.

deezell · 31-10-2021 4:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118098373#Comment_118098373

I used addresspal before, it was great for UK sources who wouldn't deliver to NI and parcel motel, or whose free postage didn't extend to NI.

Now AnPost doubled the price, and a guaranteed additional €3.50, plus you'll definitely pay the UK VAT as well as Irl VAT, so it's painful to use it now.

31-10-2021 5:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118098409#Comment_118098409

We are almost at the stage in which it would be cheaper for individuals to be out of Europe and to set up trade agreements with the UK and US instead.

EDit · 02-11-2021 2:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118093175#Comment_118093175

Per my earlier post, I asked a seller on Discogs to specifically ensure that the 10-digit TARIC code for vinyl records (8523809000) was included with the electronic customs info on a package from England. He shipped it last Tuesday and it arrived today with no requests for VAT or customs fees. Of note, the form on it was a CN22.

cnocbui · 02-11-2021 2:37pm

Can someone please tell me if selecting DHL as the shipping method with those bleeps - Buyee/Tenzo - will result in a successful delivery? I have twice had a package returned to Japan because those S/heads take the attitude it's the customers responsibility to sort it and liase with those even bigger bleeps - AnPos/customs.

02-11-2021 2:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118106860#Comment_118106860

Did you pay the Irish Vat as source to the UK retailer through IOSS?

so if the Taric number is ten digits and if using IOSS number that also included and CN22 it should get through?

Has anyone used aliexpress or any other similar retailer recently and got anything through?

EDit · 02-11-2021 2:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118106950#Comment_118106950

Discogs is automatically adding VAT to purchases at source and the seller must include Discogs IOSS number with the shipping info. That, plus the 10-digit TARIC code and a CN22 got this package through no problem, which is encouraging. However, IMO an ‘n’ of 1 is not evidence enough that there wont be issues with a similarly prepared package next time… time will tell

whiterebel · 02-11-2021 3:43pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118106896#Comment_118106896

If its Express DHL are doing the clearance themselves. If its parcel post they seem to be handing it over to An Post either here or Germany and then its in trouble.

02-11-2021 3:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118107078#Comment_118107078

I just wonder what the chances of trying to communicate with sellers on a platform like Aliexpress to try to get them to put in this info would be...

When An Post are going on about "electronic declaration" I presume that they mean the information in the QR Code which they scan?

Sparkling Gamorreans · 02-11-2021 4:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118107498#Comment_118107498

I've had 10 or more deliveries from Aliexpress since the changes came and this became an issue in Ireland. Not a single one of them were returned regardless of what was on the label. I'd say 90% of them were flown to Liege and the rest came the slow way via Kazakhstan/Russia. I don't know if there's something inherent in their processes but all their parcels seem to be getting through fine. I even had a parcel come this morning that was ordered on 30 June prior to them charging VAT that disappeared 2 months ago on tracking in Russia. Showed up today no issues and AP never tried to collect the VAT due.

Before I knew that Ali stuff seemed to be getting through fine I tried to explain to a couple of sellers via the messaging but at best one person said "I am using IOSS number". Most of the others didn't even respond.

Anyone here had any issues with Aliexpress being turned back?

02-11-2021 5:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118107849#Comment_118107849

what postage methods were on those items out of interest?

ohnonotgmail · 02-11-2021 5:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118106950#Comment_118106950

I have had aliexpress parcels regularly with no issues. They also never have a taricc code on the outside of the parcel. all their customs declarations are done electronically.

Wheety · 02-11-2021 6:50pm

There's a UK site I want to buy from. Free UK delivery or £15 to Ireland and not even be sure it gets through.

If I get it through AddressPal, I presume there will be no customs info on it as it's a UK address. Do An Post then deliver these as it's their own service? Or will it be sent back for not having the info?

rf4c · 02-11-2021 6:57pm

I mailed Addresspal re exactly the same thing. I have an item of medical equipment that MUST get to me.

They were very helpful and said that the invoice must be in the parcel, or preferably a copy outside. It must contain

all the info as per their guide, including description, value, accurate TARIC code. Also the usual warning about restricted / prohibited were given.

After that they said they would complete the form CN23 and ship the parcel.

The best you'll get outside of expensive couriers I guess, but better than I'd hoped from An Post, in fairness!

Touch Fuzzy Get Dizzy · 02-11-2021 6:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118106896#Comment_118106896

I had mine sent from Buyee FedEx as a friend had trouble with DHL with no trouble, another post answered but just wanted to add that in

innuendo141 · 02-11-2021 6:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118106860#Comment_118106860

Thanks a million, as its Discogs I plan on taking the plunge and asking a seller to do that on. Cheers for the reply.

Sparkling Gamorreans · 02-11-2021 7:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118107925#Comment_118107925

Whatever the bog standard option is. Chinapost/Aliexpress standard shipping. Most seem to be flown directly from China to Ali's hub in Liege and they get re-labelled there. There was a bottle neck in Liege back in the summer but stuff seems to be flying through these days. Maybe 3-4 weeks end to end. The odd parcel seems to be sent this awkward route through Northwest China into Kazakhstan then to Russia and then into the EU where the tracking gets vague. That seems to take 2-4 months. I don't know if I just happen to be buying off the right merchants but some of them have been quite small and obscure or all Ali merchants have some kind of centralised processes? Or I've just been lucky.

RollingSun2000 · 02-11-2021 8:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118106896#Comment_118106896

I ordered from Japan using Blackship. They provide DHL Express. it arrived super quick and no problems. DHL contacted me for the VAT and fees. However, I got the impression they estimated the value themselves, regardless of me declaring the value to Blackship.

*Blackship is the same as Tenso, and is owned by White Rabbit.

-----

I have advised Blackship and a US seller about using the 10 Digit Taric code. Their response; Blackship disabled their cheapest option to Ireland, small package air mail. I had no choice but to use DHL Express. I don't know if the US seller understood the problem or my advice, but they just decided to use FedEx, which seems to be currently delayed in Dublin for the past 5 days (I assume it's stuck in FedEx's sorting centre, and not An Post's).

*Edit: FedEx package arrived this afternoon.

TomTomTim · 03-11-2021 4:10pm

Just had another package returned, which is the 2nd in the last few weeks. That's 4 out of 6 orders from outside of the EU that they've sent back now. These were all things that I've been waiting months for too, which makes it all the more frustrating.

rf4c · 03-11-2021 5:14pm

Just for comparison, I ordered an item of medical equipment on Monday afternoon coming from Central London.

Addresspal had offered to complete a CN23 for me, but as I needed it ASAP, I accepted the sellers suggestion to ship by DHL.

Ordered Monday 4 p.m.

Collected Tuesday Central London 10 a.m.

Wednesday Departed UK 7 a.m.

Wednesday Received Text and email requesting VAT payment 10 a.m.

Wednesday Paid VAT 2 p.m.

Wednesday Cleared fro delivery 4 p.m.

Great for private individuals who can afford the extra expense, but still not an answer for people who can't

afford it, or businesses whose margins are thrashed by these extra costs.

It's a bad situation where nobody wins. Even An Post lose revenue!

Mr321 · 03-11-2021 7:53pm

All my Ali Express stuff comes through OK and sometimes comes in a bulk parcel that's done in Brussels. A thing I've received from Ali has came via the Netherlands customs declaration so the Irish customs clear it no problem.

Ali Express stuff is coming within 10 days lately.

UK stuff that makes it to me OK is taking 3 weeks.

Sparkling Gamorreans · 03-11-2021 8:26pm

The item I ordered from Singapore and shipped through AP's Address Pal in USA has a combined value with postage of about €55. It seems to have sailed through AP in Dublin without any VAT being applied saving me the best part of €15.

An Post returning packages from outside the EU-See 1st post

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Running Shoes