Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII Read OP For Mod Warnings

28-10-2021 10:51PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087812#Comment_118087812

Yep, absolutely nothing done to reduce transmission whatsoever

Snooker Loopy · 28-10-2021 10:53PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087723#Comment_118087723

If you;re not worried about cases then you aren't taking the issue seriously.

Everything flows from case numbers.

I agree with you that the media is a problem. It has enabled the normalisation of mass death, the normalisation of the vintner's epidemiology lobby and has treated this pandemic far too much as a dumb soap opera and not nearly enough as the actual existential crisis for our society that it is.

Hence you get a lot of posters here who are entirely certain in their beliefs that Covid is a cod or a conspiracy. And there's no truth that will persuade them otherwise.

Widdensushi · 28-10-2021 10:57PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087876#Comment_118087876

You can start by doing your bit, cocooning.

charlie14 · 28-10-2021 11:13PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087779#Comment_118087779

A few thing did. They gave up chasing herd immunity and are now relying on vaccines like everyone else. Lots of complaining here about booster shots, and strangely with all the mention of Sweden, none that they are offering booster shots this Autumn and are planning another round for 2022.

Blut2 · 28-10-2021 11:18PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087878#Comment_118087878

Both.

We had 17,665 hospital beds in 1980 in Ireland serving a population of 3.4 million.

We had 10,856 hospital beds in 2018 in Ireland serving a population of 4.9 million.

Thats just public healthcare - but even at the peak of the corona crisis in spring 2020 the government could only obtain 2300 beds from the private system when they tried to prepare for the worst. And obviously at far greater financial cost to the state than having those beds in the public system.

Its an even more horrendous decline given how much wealthier our country has gotten, and older our population has gotten, in that time.

There were multiple healthcare reports between 2005-2015 that said we needed to have at least 15,000 public hospital beds, and 500 ICU beds, for our population by the year 2020. That were all roundly ignored by our governments of the time.

Thats why all the media/government attention at the moment is being desperately focused on the unvaxxed 5%~ of the population. Who, admittedly, absolutely should get vaccinated. But even if we were at 99% vaccination we'd still only be about 3 weeks behind where we are currently on the hospital capacity crisis. The much, much bigger problem is FF and FG's gutting of the public healthcare system over the past 4 decades - that they desperately don't want people to focus on.

marilynrr · 29-10-2021 12:01AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118086855#Comment_118086855

God, it would be worrying if 10 years into this thing the government still hadn't managed to increase ICU bed capacity.

If you believe that doomsday scenario that you just painted then enjoy life as you know it now because things are going to be a hell of a lot worse in a few years time! There's a huge chunk of the unvaccinated who are not going to give in!!

Even if all the Irish citizens chose to be vaccinated there will still be many in the world who aren't so the potential for mutation is still there anyway and it just takes one person to bring it to Ireland.

29-10-2021 05:22AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087601#Comment_118087601

All of them but for simplicity say ICU.

29-10-2021 05:25AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087745#Comment_118087745

This is more more correct but instead of « e » have base number. Also t can be very small - like you say - but also negative number.

Penfailed · 29-10-2021 06:16AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088355#Comment_118088355

All of them? For simplicity, plot them all on a graph.

Dempo1 · 29-10-2021 07:12AM

Leo at it again

https://m.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/antigen-tests-and-contact-tracing-for-pupils-on-table-in-battle-to-keep-schools-open-40995389.html

But part from contradictions, wasn't it announced yesterday to much fanfare antigen tests would only be sent out to close contacts who are FULLY VACINATED, perhaps I've missed something but is it not the case, children remain unvaccinated.

Happydays2020 · 29-10-2021 07:18AM

NPHET/CMO have one tool in their armoury and that is lockdown.

they resisted masks.
they have continued to resist antigen testing (these should be free not just for close contacts). Remember the Lidl references.
they have played the media and bounced an elected govt into restrictions previously.
they treat the public like we are imbeciles, when in fact the public has been ahead of them.
other mistakes made such as nursing homes in the early stages.
poor processes and communication led to the resignation/dismissal of a Government Minister and an EU Commissioner.

NPHET were not responsible for vaccine rollout.

prunudo · 29-10-2021 07:21AM

@Snooker Loopy "Hence you get a lot of posters here who are entirely certain in their beliefs that Covid is a cod or a conspiracy. And there's no truth that will persuade them otherwise."

There may be posters who have different views to you but I haven't seen any one on here saying covid is a cod or a conspiracy. I think everyone accepts covid can be serious to some, its the fascination on cases and not accepting that when we have so many people vaccinated we have to move forward and to live with the virus that some posters have an issue with.

Dempo1 · 29-10-2021 07:25AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088393#Comment_118088393

All fair points but in addition, also fair to Add, they Advise only, that advice can be accepted or rejected in equal measure.

Happydays2020 · 29-10-2021 07:45AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088401#Comment_118088401

Just advisors? With those daily official briefings? The unofficial ones? Members regularly on the radio giving their views? The infamous Sunday meeting when the boss came back from his sabbatical? It has got better but governance has not been great.

they did get a lot right but far from perfect.

lawred2 · 29-10-2021 07:47AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087610#Comment_118087610

Saw that, he was a little put out by some of the "commentary".. honestly he'd curdle milk

darconio · 29-10-2021 08:10AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087816#Comment_118087816

Fair enough I am glad we are getting the direct experience from a doctor. Would you be able to explain why any other preventive treatment or treatment listed that can be used at an early stage to prevent hospitalization is not approved? I am thinking about hydroxychloroquine or ivermectin for example, I mean if a gp prescribe the proper dosage what would be wrong in suggesting those methods as a treatment? If steroid and cortisone are used successfully to treat covid-19 then we don't have an issue anymore? Based on your link from the BMJ there are several steps and treatments before a patient is considered severe: does that mean that all the treatments used before becoming severe are ineffective?

Incidences of individual doctors using medications off label is anecdotal evidence, basically the worst type of evidence.

Perhaps that is true but they saved several lives using unconventional treatments

Dempo1 · 29-10-2021 08:11AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088420#Comment_118088420

I again reiterate they Advise and do not implement policy, that's just a simple fact. Do I agree 100%, absolutely not, I'm simply pointing out, they have only an advisory role. Has there been mixed messaging, absolutely, but the same x10 could be said of government and in particular one particular member of the government.

It would appear there are two cohorts with little middle ground when it comes to criticism or assessment of how the Pandemic has been managed.

A. Absolute abhorrence for all and anything NPHET and more alarming, quite vile personalisation, Dr Death etc.

B. Absolute dismay at how government have managed the pandemic and we know 2 particularly politicians getting the brunt of critism.

I myself tended (I believe) to be neutral, initially very supportive of both Government and NPHET, now, I'm aghast at the astonishing ambiguity of Both. Watching for the past few months in bemusement. I'm as critical now of NPHET and Government, but do try to be objective.

Happydays2020 · 29-10-2021 08:22AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088457#Comment_118088457

I have ebbed and flowed last most people. Very supportive of the big lockdowns. Bit annoyed at being talked down to. All in - government and NPHET have probably got more right than wrong. But there are a few things there such as initial advice on masks and antigen testing which just did not make sense.

PalLimerick · 29-10-2021 08:28AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118086475#Comment_118086475

He meant exactly what I posted. Varadkar and his ilk are preparing the public for lockdown or at least a severe roll back on hospitality. Time will prove some of us right and some wrong.

Dempo1 · 29-10-2021 08:55AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088479#Comment_118088479

I hear you and agree completely 😉

Russman · 29-10-2021 09:07AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088457#Comment_118088457

Pretty much agree with this I think. The cohort A you mention unfortunately removed a lot of reason from any debate with, as you say, personalisation and name calling. As if any politician anywhere in the world actually wants to inconvenience the people they depend on to get elected.

Don't Chute! · 29-10-2021 09:10AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087610#Comment_118087610

This is the problem with these people, they simply cannot take any sort of criticism. We are right and the peasants are wrong how dare they question us! You can see it all over Irish society. Tony Holohan cannot be questioned. Government cannot be questioned. The lifers in RTÉ cannot be questioned. Pat Kenny cannot be questioned. It goes on and on. This is why we don’t get resignations in government in this country, they are never wrong everyone else is.

PhoneMain · 29-10-2021 09:19AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088453#Comment_118088453

But that's the thing, theres no evidence that Ivermectin or Hydroxychloroquine help with management of Covid. That's what I'm trying to say, they also have side effects. Theres clinical trials ongoing into ivermectin.

Theres also no evidence that the interventions that these doctors have done contributed to the improvement of these patients. It's highly likely that patients would have gotten better without these interventions. I could just as easily give tic tacs to patients and claim that it made them better, doesnt mean it did. That's anecdotal evidence.

brickster69 · 29-10-2021 09:22AM

A bit of good news

https://twitter.com/Novavax/status/1453338454226571268

Parachutes · 29-10-2021 09:32AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118087876#Comment_118087876

The fact that people actually want this is astonishing.

Beechwoodspark · 29-10-2021 09:42AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088424#Comment_118088424

Not MM biggest fan but he was 100% right.

the tone deaf whingeing from the nightclub “industry” in particular has been something to behold - he was dead right to put them back in their box

public health is the priority. Not nightclubs.

Burty330 · 29-10-2021 10:00AM

The Government need only reference the strain on the HSE and people will immediately crumble , submit and fall straight in line. Its like they are brainwashed to conform and regurgitate all of the governments talking points every time they hear anything related to the HSE.

Personally im sick to death of being held hostage by the HSE. Its none of our fault the hospitals are cramped and over-run. Thats the governments fuk-up. Why are we being held accountable for their failings?? This government is nothing but a failure on every level. Yet its all of us who suffer the consequences , not them. . They are a national disgrace and anybody defending them should be disgusted with themselves.

lawred2 · 29-10-2021 10:07AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088706#Comment_118088706

But sure we know you'd agree with him.

lawred2 · 29-10-2021 10:07AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088787#Comment_118088787

100%

It's Stockholm syndrome.

darconio · 29-10-2021 10:20AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118088639#Comment_118088639

You are the doctor and obviously know better, however there is evidence that those treatments are effective at managing the infection from covid-19. Otherwise why for example they would be approved in Nebraska or other instances? There is no evidence that the interventions that these doctors have done contributed to the improvement of these patients, because any attempt to begin clinical trial on a large scale has been shoot down from the start. The fact that you could give tic-tac and the patients would have gotten better without it, could be true for any medicine. Every medicine has side effects that's why it would be important to have a controlled dosage from a gp. The vaccine has side effects, mostly yet unknown because they didn't go through a significant long enough trial, yet we want to inject the worldwide population despite evidence demonstrating that their effect is waning or the damage caused in certain subjects. Anyway sorry for digressing from the main topic, I'll drop it now, I assume that whatever the hse/government has decided it's for the greater good

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII Read OP For Mod Warnings