Do you really need a car?

Peppa Pig · 02-06-2017 5:13pm

InTheTrees wrote: »

How is the LPT calculated? Value Plus square footage?

Valuation band only. An average 4 bed detached house in Dublin has LPT up to €765. A similar sized house in the middle of nowhere would be about €405.
The same sized house is about 40% - 50% higher in an urban zone.

Fathom · 02-06-2017 5:21pm

Live LA metro. Spread out. Poor public transportation. Car needed to get around.

Arcade_Tryer · 02-06-2017 5:25pm

John_Rambo wrote: »

It is.

It's not. The housing situation is benefiting substantially more people than it is costing in Dublin, hence the delight. People and politicians like to talk a good game, and crib and moan about each other and everything, but at the end of the day the housing situation in Dublin is the situation society has chosen and is content with having. That is even more clear from the lack of any real urgency in increasing the supply, and the refusal by DCC to change planning restrictions to make it easier for developers to increase supply. It's hypocritical to then use the homeless crisis to score cheap points against rural dwellers, when the two have nothing in common in reality.

John_Rambo · 02-06-2017 5:35pm

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

It's not

It is. Ridiculous thing to say. Nobody want's homelessness. Not good for the city, not good for the country.

Arcade_Tryer · 02-06-2017 5:59pm

John_Rambo wrote: »

It is. Ridiculous thing to say. Nobody want's homelessness. Not good for the city, not good for the country.

Huge difference between not wanting homelessness, and being more than willing to tolerate it, and enable it. Homelessness is simply a by-product of a housing situation which suits most people. Homelessness is common in most modern, western countries too, so it's not that big a negative in terms of Dublin and Ireland. Dublin is still booming economically regardless of homelessness.

InTheTrees · 02-06-2017 6:17pm

And what are the reasons for the building height restrictions in Dublin?

John_Rambo · 02-06-2017 8:38pm

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

Huge difference between not wanting homelessness, and being more than willing to tolerate it, and enable it. Homelessness is simply a by-product of a housing situation which suits most people. Homelessness is common in most modern, western countries too, so it's not that big a negative in terms of Dublin and Ireland. Dublin is still booming economically regardless of homelessness.

Homelessness suits nobody.

Conspiracy theories - that way >>>

wordofwarning · 02-06-2017 11:13pm

I love Sean nos wrote: »

Not this **** again. People in cities should pay less LPT because providing services in cities is cheaper.

However, LPT can't be cut as it has to subsidise rural areas.

I cited a fact based article on the cost of supplying services to rural areas. Nox001 ignored it several times as it was 'biased' ie did not a line with their views of it being cheap to supply services to rural Ireland despite a fact based article showing the contrary.

Some rural dwellers like Nox001 refuse to accept it is cheaper to supply services in Dublin than in the rural Donegal. Even when there is hard facts showing it cheaper to supply services in urban areas, those articles are 'biased' :rolleyes:

Arcade_Tryer · 02-06-2017 11:35pm

John_Rambo wrote: »

Homelessness suits nobody.

Conspiracy theories - that way >>>

Homelessness doesn't suit homeless people. Wake up.

John_Rambo · 03-06-2017 12:34am

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

Homelessness doesn't suit homeless people. Wake up.

Homelessness doesn't suit anyone. Whoever is telling you it does is spoofing you. It's not good for any city, town or village. People don't want homeless people. They don't want to be homeless, they don't want people to be homeless.

However, you can make a difference and fight these people that are happy for homelessness.

I've been involved and have worked in inner city volunteer groups that tackles drug use and other ills that cause homelessness. I'm still involved with and have good contacts in the North East inner city of Dublin that are calling out for people that want to battle the path that leads to homelessness, particularly in the mid-teen bracket.

If you feel you can make a difference there's a Garda vetting system, you can apply and volunteer and become a part of the solution.

Please PM me for more details. We're always looking for someone that can make a difference.

This thread is about cars and the need for cars. You're derailing it.

Do you really need you car?

con___manx1 · 03-06-2017 1:15am

Drive 44k to work so yes I need a car

Arcade_Tryer · 03-06-2017 3:11am

John_Rambo wrote: »

Homelessness doesn't suit anyone. Whoever is telling you it does is spoofing you. It's not good for any city, town or village. People don't want homeless people. They don't want to be homeless, they don't want people to be homeless.

However, you can make a difference and fight these people that are happy for homelessness.

I've been involved and have worked in inner city volunteer groups that tackles drug use and other ills that cause homelessness. I'm still involved with and have good contacts in the North East inner city of Dublin that are calling out for people that want to battle the path that leads to homelessness, particularly in the mid-teen bracket.

If you feel you can make a difference there's a Garda vetting system, you can apply and volunteer and become a part of the solution.

Please PM me for more details. We're always looking for someone that can make a difference.

This thread is about cars and the need for cars. You're derailing it.

Do you really need you car?

Homelessness does suit a city if it occurs in tandem with economic progress and high economic rents, hence why a certain level of homelessness is tolerated in pretty much every city in the world.

And thanks but no thanks. I have little interest in volunteering to help the homeless.

I love Sean nos · 03-06-2017 9:07am

con___manx1 wrote: »

Drive 44k to work so yes I need a car

You live approximately 92km from your place of employment. That's stupid.

Chuchote · 03-06-2017 10:40am

Getting back to the original title of this thread, may I offer a sobering statistic?

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/more-than-half-of-travellers-use-cars-for-journeys-under-2km-1.2303451

More than half of travellers use cars for journeys under 2km
Bicycle trips made up just 1.6% of all journeys last year

2km! That's from the GPO to the gate of the Phoenix Park! You'd cycle it in around 8 minutes! (At least I would, but I cycle about the speed of Mr Magoo, very very slowly!)

A lot of the earlier posters on this thread said they had to have cars to drop kids to school. Are Irish children now born without legs?

People also wrote about slow, unreliable public transport, especially in Dublin. This is certainly true, though less than it used to be. And they wrote about public transport that doesn't go outside set times. Also very true - try getting to Dublin Airport for an early flight, or indeed to work there, by bus.

Some of this will be solved by the Core Bus Corridors that are supposed to come in, I think it's by 2020 - these are full bus corridors (they won't be interrupted by non-bus-lane roads, but will be bus corridor all the way along). Some of these will run from the suburbs inwards to the city centre, others will be orbital, running in concentric circles around the city.

There is also a plan - though we need a better transport minister to push this along - for a series of cycleways. Greenways along the rivers Liffey and Dodder and along the Royal Canal and Grand Canal, and the Sutton-to-Sandycove cycleway along the coast, as well as quietways along back streets.

http://irishcycle.com/2013/09/16/greenways-proposed-greater-dublin-strategic-greenways/

We should be able to cycle safely through Dublin; children should be able to cycle to school, and it should be the norm for them to do so.

We shouldn't have parking lots along the sides of our streets where people can store their cars. That's an insane use of road surface.

If we're going to have high-rise cities (and I don't mean just Dublin) we should do it like Haussmann in Paris - raze narrow streets and build broad boulevards; Haussmann's rule was that everyone living in the spacious apartments in his beautiful buildings must have a park within 500 metres, if I remember the figure right

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haussmann%27s_renovation_of_Paris

Ireland's planners often interpret 'increased density' (what they're supposed to be doing) as giving permission for ballooning extensions on suburban houses, which ironically actually reduce density by making bigger houses for fewer people.

We need a more rational and kind way of transporting ourselves, whether in the city or in the country; we need to keep each other safe. I recently asked a self-sufficient farmer living a couple of kilometres from his local village why he drove everywhere - the next day he took to the bike, and was somersaulted off it by a local lad racing along the hedge-lined roads…

Chuchote · 03-06-2017 8:10pm

And incidentally, how the Dutch stopped the rush to car culture and supermarkets outside towns and returned to small, concentrated cities and human-powered transport and public transport, and why:

freshpopcorn · 03-06-2017 8:15pm

Chuchote wrote: »

And incidentally, how the Dutch stopped the rush to car culture and supermarkets outside towns and returned to small, concentrated cities and human-powered transport and public transport, and why:

It wouldn't be for me to be honest!
I prefer my lifestyle!

Chuchote · 03-06-2017 8:57pm

freshpopcorn wrote: »

It wouldn't be for me to be honest!
I prefer my lifestyle!

Heh, doesn't have to be a lifestyle - if you just did the <2km journeys by bike you'd still lesson the carbon you use and get yourself fitter and sleeker.

03-06-2017 9:03pm

Chuchote wrote: »

Heh, doesn't have to be a lifestyle - if you just did the <2km journeys by bike you'd still lesson the carbon you use and get yourself fitter and sleeker.

Yeah but even the majority of less than 2km journeys I do the car is either required or much handier. Going to the shop needs the car, rushing to the bookies before a race, going anywhere in the rain etc etc. Also the car is out front pointed for road it would take as long to get the bike from the shed as to get as far as the destination in the car.

freshpopcorn · 03-06-2017 9:03pm

Chuchote wrote: »

Heh, doesn't have to be a lifestyle - if you just did the <2km journeys by bike you'd still lesson the carbon you use and get yourself fitter and sleeker.

I'd still choose the car for work/school/shopping/etc a lot more pleasurable in my experience. I can excise in my spare time and choose activities I enjoy. Cycling is not something I'd consider a bit enjoyable and it's nothing to do with cars/trucks being on the road!

Chuchote · 04-06-2017 8:47am

Brayan Tall Pup wrote: »

Yeah but even the majority of less than 2km journeys I do the car is either required or much handier. Going to the shop needs the car, rushing to the bookies before a race, going anywhere in the rain etc etc. Also the car is out front pointed for road it would take as long to get the bike from the shed as to get as far as the destination in the car.

I shop on the bike, if I rushed to the bookies it would be faster on the bike than in a traffic jam; it doesn't rain that much, actually.

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I'd still choose the car for work/school/shopping/etc a lot more pleasurable in my experience. I can excise in my spare time and choose activities I enjoy. Cycling is not something I'd consider a bit enjoyable and it's nothing to do with cars/trucks being on the road!

Ah, now, this is horses for courses. I cycle for pleasure, just love it, sailing along happily in the fresh air, stopping for a chat with neighbours, hopping into a cafe for a cuppa and a cake, and wheeling past all the grim-faced people in their cars sitting in a line.

I loved driving when I did drive, but only the longish drives with the radio playing. But even then I'd take the bike for a hop up to the shops or a cycle out to the sea.

Meanwhile, lifestyle example - a man and his dog go to work along the Dodder:

04-06-2017 11:34am

Chuchote wrote: »

I shop on the bike, if I rushed to the bookies it would be faster on the bike than in a traffic jam; it doesn't rain that much, actually.

No traffic where I live really so far will always be faster, particularity due to steep hills. Shopping without a car is an extremely painful task and not sure why someone would do it by choice, maybe you are one of those who buys a few bits for the day but when I shop it's going to two or three different supermarkets in the area for different things and having a number of bags of shopping. Cycling to me is a chore even without the shopping.

Yes it rains quiet a lot, especially in the south and west of the country.

Chuchote · 04-06-2017 11:58am

Brayan Tall Pup wrote: »

No traffic where I live really so far will always be faster, particularity due to steep hills. Shopping without a car is an extremely painful task and not sure why someone would do it by choice, maybe you are one of those who buys a few bits for the day but when I shop it's going to two or three different supermarkets in the area for different things and having a number of bags of shopping. Cycling to me is a chore even without the shopping.

Yes it rains quiet a lot, especially in the south and west of the country.

Yeah, I shop more often - most people who use bikes do, it's one reason they're better for businesses: less spend per visit but more over a period. The days of the 'big shop' are gone for me. And occasionally I'll get a lift from friends to get some of the bulky stuff like toilet paper and slabs of Saskia water or bags of compost or garden sand (though I'll return the favour by adding my friends in on my cycle shops).

You'd be surprised how your perception of raininess changes when you get out of the car. I used to think it rained an awful lot until I started cycling regularly. Now I know that most of the showers are short - the traditional wisdom is that if there's a shower you get under a tree, and by the time the drops start landing on you from the leaves, the shower will be stopping. (Not true for the very occasional thunderstorms, of course!)

Galway is an outlier, though - that soft Galway rain in your face is a pleasure, but a fairly constant pleasure. Though a friend who lives in the far west of Connemara gloats of enjoying daily rides along the Sky Road.

04-06-2017 1:53pm

Chuchote wrote: »

Yeah, I shop more often - most people who use bikes do, it's one reason they're better for businesses: less spend per visit but more over a period. The days of the 'big shop' are gone for me. And occasionally I'll get a lift from friends to get some of the bulky stuff like toilet paper and slabs of Saskia water or bags of compost or garden sand (though I'll return the favour by adding my friends in on my cycle shops).
i

Food shopping has to be one of the most boring and painful tasks and I want to do it as little as possible so a big shop a week and if possible not have to go again is the ideal scenario.

Doing one big shop is also a cheaper way of doing it.

freshpopcorn · 04-06-2017 2:29pm

Chuchote wrote: »

I shop on the bike, if I rushed to the bookies it would be faster on the bike than in a traffic jam; it doesn't rain that much, actually.

Ah, now, this is horses for courses. I cycle for pleasure, just love it, sailing along happily in the fresh air, stopping for a chat with neighbours, hopping into a cafe for a cuppa and a cake, and wheeling past all the grim-faced people in their cars sitting in a line.

I loved driving when I did drive, but only the longish drives with the radio playing. But even then I'd take the bike for a hop up to the shops or a cycle out to the sea.

Meanwhile, lifestyle example - a man and his dog go to work along the Dodder:

I'm not saying don't cycle but if you live where I live cycling doesn't save you time.
We're the complete opposite, I live just outside a small town in cork and I never encounter traffic. We overtake the cyclists(They might overtake us at traffic lights but we generally end up passing them out again going through the town). There's three/four of us in your house and we'd do one main shop and a few top up shops(That varies). Our shopping would be a nightmare on a bike.

Widdershins · 05-06-2017 4:30am

If worried about your carbon footprint you should stop taking long distance plane journeys.

Chuchote · 05-06-2017 8:08am

Widdershins wrote: »

If worried about your carbon footprint you should stop taking long distance plane journeys.

And stop eating meat and heating your home, of course

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jan/19/how-to-reduce-carbon-footprint

Widdershins · 05-06-2017 1:18pm

Chuchote wrote: »

And stop eating meat and heating your home, of course

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/jan/19/how-to-reduce-carbon-footprint

I wouldn't lecture someone on something a personal as their daily diet. And home heating should be considered an essential. The reason I made my comment is that car journeys are far from a luxury for a lot of people. Unfortunately we can't realistically be 'perfect' on this one. Foreign travel is not necessary for many people, though. I would just suggest that people consider whether they could have a holiday at home or at least somewhere closer than usual, and those who go on multiple long distance trips could think about cutting back on them. Of course if you don't really care about it you'll be one of the ones who always has an excuse to never make a single sacrifice.

Chuchote · 05-06-2017 1:57pm

Ah, I wasn't lecturing, just pointing out that lots of things contribute to carbon footprint. Believe me, as soon as airship travel is an affordable alternative I'll be in like Flynn!

According to this calculator http://www.carbonify.com/carbon-calculator.htm

driving 1,000 miles a month in an SUV is 9.42 tons of CO2 a year
flying 1,000 miles a month is 5.82 tons of CO2 a year

(I do neither, but was trying to get an estimate of flying 12,000 miles vs driving 12,000 miles, 12,000 miles a year probably being average-ish for people who drive)

05-06-2017 2:09pm

Chuchote wrote: »

Ah, I wasn't lecturing, just pointing out that lots of things contribute to carbon footprint. Believe me, as soon as airship travel is an affordable alternative I'll be in like Flynn!

According to this calculator http://www.carbonify.com/carbon-calculator.htm

driving 1,000 miles a month in an SUV is 9.42 tons of CO2 a year
flying 1,000 miles a month is 5.82 tons of CO2 a year

(I do neither, but was trying to get an estimate of flying 12,000 miles vs driving 12,000 miles, 12,000 miles a year probably being average-ish for people who drive)

I drive about 10,000 miles a year and have already flown more than 11,0000 miles this year with multiple trips yet to come (combination of work and travel). So flying a lot is not unusual.

How many people really care about their carbon foot print anyway, I know I don't give it a second thought.

Chuchote · 05-06-2017 3:17pm

Brayan Tall Pup wrote: »

I drive about 10,000 miles a year and have already flown more than 11,0000 miles this year with multiple trips yet to come (combination of work and travel). So flying a lot is not unusual.

How many people really care about their carbon foot print anyway, I know I don't give it a second thought.

It's true; people aren't going to give it a second thought until the effects on the planet start to affect them personally.

For instance, if what we grew up calling the Gulf Stream (the Ocean Conveyor Belt) is stopped or reversed due to the melting of Arctic ice, as looks likely, the Irish climate could change to be more like that of New York. Fisheries are likely to decline drastically with the loss of the warm ocean current…

Widdershins · 05-06-2017 5:39pm

Brayan Tall Pup wrote: »

I drive about 10,000 miles a year and have already flown more than 11,0000 miles this year with multiple trips yet to come (combination of work and travel). So flying a lot is not unusual.

How many people really care about their carbon foot print anyway, I know I don't give it a second thought.

I care about the impact my behaviour has on the environment.

Chuchote · 05-06-2017 6:00pm

Trump doesn't! Nice take on him and the Paris Agreement by John Oliver

InTheTrees · 05-06-2017 6:22pm

Chuchote wrote: »

For instance, if what we grew up calling the Gulf Stream (the Ocean Conveyor Belt) is stopped or reversed due to the melting of Arctic ice, as looks likely, the Irish climate could change to be more like that of New York…

I don't see why it would change to be like new York, Ireland is far further north than new York. It's more likely to change by having a climate more suited to how far north Ireland is which is more like newfoundland.

Jamsiek · 07-06-2017 8:56pm

Brayan Tall Pup wrote: »

How many people really care about their carbon foot print anyway, I know I don't give it a second thought.

So you don't care about your kids or future generations?
That's nice

Chuchote · 08-06-2017 7:51am

Jamsiek wrote: »

So you don't care about your kids or future generations?
That's nice

And people who refuse to wash the plastics and tins they put into the green bin - contaminating whole truckloads of recycleables - do they think they're so much better than the people who work in the recycle centre? So mean!

billyhead · 18-09-2021 6:50pm

Apologies for resurrecting an old thread but with the increase in remote working and the fact that petrol costs are going through the roof and are to be increased in the upcoming budget has anyone contemplated getting rid of the car? Also the carbon emissions factor might come into peoples reasoning to get rid of it or at least cut down from 2 cars to 1 in the household.

DJD · 19-09-2021 11:42am

We went from two cars to one around the start of the pandemic. One friend did the same (that I know of).

Living in suburban Dublin makes it very doable. If I need a car there are 3 GoCars within a short walk. Also cycling most places nearby is reasonably easy. The saving on tax, insurance etc is very noticeable.

I remember speaking to family who live in rural Kilkenny at the time, definitely not an option for them though.

Ash.J.Williams · 19-09-2021 11:44am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2057736711/do-you-really-need-a-car

I need my car

KaneToad · 19-09-2021 11:46am

Never an option for me. If you are outside a major urban area, you have very limited options.

Even if living in a large Irish town, you'd be hard pressed navigating it with public transport...e.g. Navan, Drogheda...

RandomViewer · 19-09-2021 11:50am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/103404194#Comment_103404194

Public transport is usually disgustingly dirty ,

Fr Tod Umptious · 19-09-2021 11:52am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117908873#Comment_117908873

Live in a small town/big village in Kerry.

It's not urban but it's not rural either.

Were a two car family before COVID.

One the family seven seater the other a small Fiesta that I used mainly to go to work 10 minutes away.

When tax was up on the Fiesta in May 2020 I did not renew it (declared it off the road)

Renewed my insurance in August 2020 because I thought we might be going back to the office.

By that stage the battery was dead in the Fiesta

By August 2021 I did not bother renewing my insurance.

We have done fine with one car, if I am going back to the office a few days a week I'll cycle or get a lift.

At the end of the day it's not that hard to give up the second car.

Hangdogroad · 19-09-2021 12:09pm

A lot of people in this country still have this attitude that if you don't have a car, or rather don't be seen to be driving one, people will think you're poor. A very plebby mindset ironically.

Manky O Toole · 19-09-2021 12:12pm

If you have a family you need a car.

venusdoom · 19-09-2021 12:18pm

Laughed at some of the comments about banning cars on this thread. People seriously have no idea of what it's like to live in rural Ireland. I drive 5/6kms 4times a day just leaving kids to preschools/school. 20ish km to the nearest supermarket. Could not survive without yet. And yes, my partner also has a car to travel to his work which is like 120km a day journey. Very little public transport. No option to car share with neighbours.

PsychoPete · 19-09-2021 12:29pm

Living in the back arse of nowhere so obviously need a car, of course I don't need the 6 cars I have

Strumms · 19-09-2021 1:17pm

nope...

wouldn't get rid of the car...

Covid...vaccinated or not I’d want to be sitting on a crowded train, Luas , bus or Metro, only as the exception rather then the regular rule.
Weather...it’s a poxy miserable, wet and cold climate here about 70% of the year, I don’t relish Qing and waiting for public transport from mid October to the start of May.
Public transport is not fit for purpose in many places... and often people say going to work 20 minutes drive away if to do the same by public transport just using my last job as an example...roughly

walk to bus stop - 6 minutes.

wait for bus - 10 minutes to be sure of getting it. run early / late.

Journey - 15 minutes

Walk to second stop - 4 minutes

Wait for bus - 5 minutes

Journey - 10 minutes

Walk - 6 minutes

bit faster getting home.

so basically with everything on time, I’d be spending ‘the guts’ of 90 - 110 minutes a day traveling 9.2 kilometers return ... about 28 minutes of that walking or waiting... in the elements...in a different climate and non covid times maybe...come home time on Friday you’d be cream crackered, freezing.

can do that in a car in about 32 minutes of driving a day max... dry, warm, comfortable, safe...

The country and especially urban areas are so chronically behind the 8 ball in terms of public transport...

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 19-09-2021 1:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117910574#Comment_117910574

Irish public transport,maybe.

Galwayguy35 · 19-09-2021 1:58pm

I do because I live in a village with no public transport and work in the city.

In fact BE has decided to stop the bus route through the nearest large town to me which will make more people use the car and make life even harder for those unable to drive.

If I lived in an urban area I'd be happy to ditch the car and cycle or take public transport for long distance journeys.

The Greens do nothing but talk shite when they have no clue about how things are outside the main urban areas.

Manky O Toole · 19-09-2021 5:37pm

I'd had enough 'interesting' experiences on public transport to last a lifetime. I'll stick to my car.

BobHopeless · 19-09-2021 5:53pm

I'd rather sit in my car for an hour commute than a 20 minute cycle or 30 minutes public transport tbh. Most days i jump on the motorbike and i'm in work in 15 minutes tops though.

Do you really need a car?

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