Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI Read OP For Mod Warnings

namloc1980 · 11-06-2021 10:02AM

hynesie08 wrote: »

It's apparently completely impossible that the likes of c&c/diageo/Heineken did a cost analysis of setting up and staffing a bar at an event like this and decided it wasn't worth it, much easier to believe Tony did it.

There was no alcohol permitted either for sale on site or you couldn't bring your own.

gozunda · 11-06-2021 10:06AM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I always love this attitude - if you don't like it, fook off :Which by the way, is exactly what many of our best have done over the generations. I suppose the idea of simply wanting and indeed demanding better for the country we were born and live in isn't an option, no? It's no wonder we are still so parochial and socially backwards in many ways (headline grabbers like SSM aside). Too many Irish people are quite content with the status quo as long as they're alright, and they really don't like change or anything that challenges their comfortable little bubbles. It explains everything from the inability to tackle the housing crisis (the decision makers and their supporters own their own homes and are landlords), public health care and waiting lists (not an issue if you can afford expensive private cover), the socio-economic divide (not something you worry about when you're wealthy to start with and connected), and many other fundamental problems in this country. There's a reason why me-fenism is a term in this country.
We are incredibly immature and selfish as a society, and it's wholly reflected in national policy and services and the politicians we elect.

No Kaiser its your attitude which was highlighted. Your words making out the country as a nation of thick paddies incapable of doing anything right just because it doesn't suit your personal pov.

_Kaiser_ wrote:

Forget the Indian variant. We're clearly dealing with a Paddy variant

_Kaiser_ wrote:

As I said, incompetent and backwards. Ireland in a nutshell most of the time

That's not "wanting and indeed demanding better for the country" that's just plain ignorance where you paint everything done during this pandemic as "incompetent and backwards" and "parochial and socially backwards" in an never ended litany of such drivel

And all that despite our significant success in keeping case and death numbers down whilst rolling out the biggest vaccination programme in the history of the state. But fuq that right?

And of note - this mealy personal mouthed dig that "Too many Irish people are quite content with the status quo as long as they're alright, and they really don't like change or anything that challenges their comfortable little bubbles." is more of the same.

The fact is you know feq all about any individual poster or any of those you lump together - but hey don't let that stop you throwing ****e and making out that all those you disagree with are selfish thick or wtte "Irish people"

But whats new Kaiser? If someone is truely that unhappy where - there are many options. Having a bit of cop on being being one of them.

I borrowed this - it looks a hell of a lot better here

:rolleyes:

the kelt · 11-06-2021 10:06AM

PhoneMain wrote: »

No you're trying to put things in my mouth there. This is a classic misguided view here, at this point in time things are ok therefore you're extrapolating that things are going to stay like this in the long term. And I'm not advocating for anything, I want to get back to normal as quick as possible, the point I'm trying to make is that there are many variables to take account of, one of which being new variants coming on board and with a proportion of the population not having their second dose. If there was a variant surge and an increase in hospitalisations due to Covid, there's already a level of people in hospitals that would suffer if Covid starts to increase again.

And by the way, I'm all for reopening. I've seen the levels of anxiety particularly in younger people that the last year has caused. I also know that we will get to a point soon where we wont be able to afford to pay for a health service if the economy is tanking. But a degree of caution is warranted. There's some in here who are advocating for the widespread opening of society which could be very bad. I was wondering the last day if we were overegging Covid, then I met a man who was in his late 30s and apart from being a stone or 2 overweight was healthy. He spent 9 days in hospital in February due to Covid. And he was one of the ones that didnt need ICU!

No im not trying to put words into your mouth or take a misguided view.

You simply stated "case numbers" not hospitilisations as a means of reviewing restrictions which is why i asked why the obsession with case numbers if hospitals are not being over run and people arent getting sick.

You then said you knew of one hospital at capacity and admitted it had nothing to do with Covid and mentioned variants.

There are many variables to take into account, hospitilsations being the most obvious but its very simple with vaccines case numbers are becoming more and more irrelevant.

Its very simple really, before vaccines case numbers were a significant metric, with vaccines, not so much, which is why i asked the question why are people still obsessed with them?

FlubberJones · 11-06-2021 10:07AM

brickster69 wrote: »

It's taking off

https://metro.co.uk/2021/06/11/indian-covid-variant-uk-cases-of-delta-strain-jump-to-over-42000-14753657/?ito=push-notification&ci=231553&si=22786189&ai=14753657

As long as they keep hammering away with the vaccinations they'll manage it

Graham · 11-06-2021 10:21AM

FlubberJones wrote: »

As long as they keep hammering away with the vaccinations they'll manage it

+1

Same here, all be it we're slightly behind on the vaccination timeline.

We could end up in a slightly better position than the UK if we manage to keep the Delta variant under control until the vaccination program is further along.

PhoneMain · 11-06-2021 10:25AM

the kelt wrote: »

No im not trying to put words into your mouth or take a misguided view.

You simply stated "case numbers" not hospitilisations as a means of reviewing restrictions which is why i asked why the obsession with case numbers if hospitals are not being over run and people arent getting sick.

You then said you knew of one hospital at capacity and admitted it had nothing to do with Covid and mentioned variants.

There are many variables to take into account, hospitilsations being the most obvious but its very simple with vaccines case numbers are becoming more and more irrelevant.

Its very simple really, before vaccines case numbers were a significant metric, with vaccines, not so much, which is why i asked the question why are people still obsessed with them?

You misread me when I mentioned the hospital at capacity. I meant that a significant surge will put more pressure on an already struggling hospital system. Of course I know that this pressure isnt due to Covid but it's not going to help if there's a surge of Covid. Some people here saying the decrease in cases is due to seasonality and not vaccines, you better hope it's due to vaccines so that we dont have a repeat of the Spring!

Stormyteacup · 11-06-2021 10:28AM

gozunda wrote: »

And all that despite our significant success in keeping case and death numbers down whilst rolling out the biggest vaccination programme in the history of the state. But fuq that right?

Definitely credit due to success of rollout, and most of us very happy it continues smoothly for the most part despite some small bumps in the road.

But is it not what we should expect at the least given the length of time to prepare for it and the learning experience of watching others begin rollout before us?

The emotional impact of what is being rolled out is naturally leaving people feeling hugely grateful - but as a logistical challenge how is it different to other countries setting up masses of free test centres for their citizens. A great achievement for sure but Ireland hasn’t reinvented the wheel, and keeping numbers down is down to keeping restrictions needlessly tighter and longer.

Silentcorner · 11-06-2021 10:43AM

Boggles wrote: »

I don't have to show you anything.

You are making the claims that you could have manged the pandemic, society, economy and health far better than we have.

So far you have offered to follow the Anti Vax playbook, which I think any functioning adult would dismiss as pure nonsense, blame everything on the bogeyman.

Now in your good time if you want to cost out how you would have managed it, by all means tap away, please base it on something that looks like reality.

You are a nasty piece of work, that's not the first time you have accused me of this, not once have I ever suggested being Anti Vax...far from it.

It's not my job to cost out anything, altho a cost benefit of analysis of severe lock downs would be nice from the Health Bureaucrats that impose them do you think, seeing as you expect me to produce one?

gozunda · 11-06-2021 10:45AM

Cal4567 wrote: »

Loads of good things here, just important to call out the silly ones. There can be a "let's wrap a green flag around ourselves" motion whenever criticism rears its head. It's a handy deflector.

Very little point for this event only to make the state look efficient. The news piece on RTE should have come with an advertisement warning in advance.

Well ok. Though one point on the green flag thing ...

Ireland had most certainly not been "incompetent and backwards" with regard to the successfully keeping case and death numbers at incredibly low numbers and all that whilst rolling out a massive vaccination programme. Has there been significant issues and failings? Yes there has - but wrapping that all up in some pseudo mass profile is frankly dishonest

That and using language such as "paddy" with all its ugly racial connontations to paint everything here as somehow being " incompetent and backwards" deserves a good boot up the arse Bishop Brenan style imho :

Silentcorner · 11-06-2021 10:47AM

PhoneMain wrote: »

Ha, yeah unlicenced, unproven therapeutics. No evidence behind them only their own limited experience. Unless you can show me a peer reviewed, randomised control trial or metaanalysis.

More nonsense.

What unlicensed therapeutic has been mentioned on this thread.

The therapeutic I mentioned has been used by the Mexican Government to great effect, I already linked to numerous sources.

the kelt · 11-06-2021 10:48AM

PhoneMain wrote: »

You misread me when I mentioned the hospital at capacity. I meant that a significant surge will put more pressure on an already struggling hospital system. Of course I know that this pressure isnt due to Covid but it's not going to help if there's a surge of Covid. Some people here saying the decrease in cases is due to seasonality and not vaccines, you better hope it's due to vaccines so that we dont have a repeat of the Spring!

But a significant surge in anything is going to put pressure. Its not going to help if theres a surge in the flu either

Again i go back to your original point (you keep ignoring where this all started with me replying to your post about case numbers being a reason to consider not easing restrictions)

Why obsess about a surge of COVID when less and less people are getting sick and we are flying through vaccinations, why use case numbers as per your original post i quoted as a means of reviewing restrictions when less and less people are getting sick, hence my original point "why are people still obsessing with case numbers"

And your last point above goes back to cases again!! Cases have remained pretty much static, i wouldnt say theres been a huge decrease yet hospitilizations and people getting sick have continued to drop. I would argue thats due to vaccines which is proving to be a successful operation in this country.

Why the obsession with case numbers?

Boggles · 11-06-2021 10:48AM

Silentcorner wrote: »

You are a nasty piece of work, that's not the first time you have accused me of this, not once have I ever suggested being Anti Vax...far from it.

I never said you were anti vax, but it is completely undeniable giving your musings on the topic that you are following the anti vax playbook, I imagine that's just a coincidence?

Although you did inform last week that you base the majority of your opinion on an anti vax / anti mask GP from Limerick who had to take some time off because of his dangerous nonsense.

Again just coincidence?

PhoneMain · 11-06-2021 11:02AM

Silentcorner wrote: »

More nonsense.

What unlicensed therapeutic has been mentioned on this thread.

The therapeutic I mentioned has been used by the Mexican Government to great effect, I already linked to numerous sources.

I'm not scrolling back through this thread but off my head I think you mentioned Ivermectin which is not licenced in Europe for treatment of Covid.

brickster69 · 11-06-2021 11:03AM

FlubberJones wrote: »

As long as they keep hammering away with the vaccinations they'll manage it

Good job 6 million tests per week are being carried out and they all get locked up. Imagine if they were all running around not knowing they have it and going everywhere on holidays.

PhoneMain · 11-06-2021 11:06AM

the kelt wrote: »

But a significant surge in anything is going to put pressure. Its not going to help if theres a surge in the flu either

Again i go back to your original point (you keep ignoring where this all started with me replying to your post about case numbers being a reason to consider not easing restrictions)

Why obsess about a surge of COVID when less and less people are getting sick and we are flying through vaccinations, why use case numbers as per your original post i quoted as a means of reviewing restrictions when less and less people are getting sick, hence my original point "why are people still obsessing with case numbers"

And your last point above goes back to cases again!! Cases have remained pretty much static, i wouldnt say theres been a huge decrease yet hospitilizations and people getting sick have continued to drop. I would argue thats due to vaccines which is proving to be a successful operation in this country.

Why the obsession with case numbers?

Yes surges cause pressures but non infectious diseases tend not to cause long term spikes. As for the flu, in my medical career I have never saw a spike in flu cases that we had last January. We also have a well established vaccine programme (which granted is coming on board for Covid which should hopefully prevent anymore winter surges) and relatively inexpensive antiviral treatments that have been proven against flu (tamiflu). We dont have anything like this for Covid.

I'm not ignoring anything. I'm very hopeful that hospitalisations stay at a low level but cases in general arent done on asymptomatic cases, they're usually people who have coughs/colds/breathing problems/temps. I'm very hopeful that hospitalisations continue to remain static and indeed fall but the Delta Variant is the elephant in the room. It's serious when Boris is contemplating delaying restrictions. Vaccines are rolling out well but they're still lagging behind the UK so cases do need to be considered in this case. They're not the be all and end all of course and I would like to continue with full reopening if hospitalisations continue to fall but they still need to be considered while we have ongoing uncertainty regarding variants.

Lumen · 11-06-2021 11:14AM

OwenM wrote: »

Lets put the whole series up, just for transparency:

Your graph which shows, over the last month, an increase of approx 30 admissions a day to a total of about 110 a day. At the peak they were admitting 3700 a day. And you think this is something to be worried about ?

I'm not worried, but I don't much care about people dying so I'm the wrong target for that question.

But the UK authorities are worried enough to be discussing delaying full re-opening.

In any case, I was simply countering the assertion that UK hospital admissions are not rising.

robbiezero · 11-06-2021 11:27AM

namloc1980 wrote: »

That test event last night is a bit dystopian. Pure theatre and nothing else.

Absolute theatre and purely enabling gombeens to be seen to be doing something and being in control.
Seen a few videos of it there. Embarrassing idiocy. That sham could have been held safely at any point during the pandemic.

What the point of holding it at this stage or what they might have learned for it, I have no idea.

celt262 · 11-06-2021 11:34AM

robbiezero wrote: »

Absolute theatre and purely enabling gombeens to be seen to be doing something and being in control.
Seen a few videos of it there. Embarrassing idiocy. That sham could have been held safely at any point during the pandemic.

What the point of holding it at this stage or what they might have learned for it, I have no idea.

It's a joke i would feel sorry for anyone that went to it as it couldn't have been enjoyable.

Of the clips i seen there would be more craic outside Mass on a saturday evening or Sunday morning.

Silentcorner · 11-06-2021 11:36AM

Boggles wrote: »

I never said you were anti vax, but it is completely undeniable giving your musings on the topic that you are following the anti vax playbook, I imagine that's just a coincidence?

Although you did inform last week that you base the majority of your opinion on an anti vax / anti mask GP from Limerick who had to take some time off because of his dangerous nonsense.

Again just coincidence?

So you are accusing me of being anti vax then.

Despite the fact I have repeatedly suggested otherwise.

Just because I agree with a medical practitioner on his stance on hard lock downs does not mean I agree with him on every thing.

Anti vax playbook....would you listen to yourself!!!!

robbiezero · 11-06-2021 11:50AM

celt262 wrote: »

It's a joke i would feel sorry for anyone that went to it as it couldn't have been enjoyable.

Of the clips i seen there would be more craic outside Mass on a saturday evening or Sunday morning.

There will be comedy sketches of this nonsense in years to come.

celt262 · 11-06-2021 12:03PM

robbiezero wrote: »

There will be comedy sketches of this nonsense in years to come.

It comical.

What are they going to do next. Come out in the next 2 weeks and say that nobody who attend has tested positive for Covid and slap themselves in the back for allowing the event to take place and enabling the safe reopening of the country.

The people at it may aswell have been sitting on their lawn at home with radio on for all the good that event was as a test.

gozunda · 11-06-2021 12:06PM

robbiezero wrote: »

Absolute theatre and purely enabling gombeens to be seen to be doing something and being in control. Seen a few videos of it there. Embarrassing idiocy. That sham could have been held safely at any point during the pandemic. What the point of holding it at this stage or what they might have learned for it, I have no idea.

Jaysus now that's going overboard headfirst :eek:

Are you always so easily upset about small scale concerts?

I'm fairly sure concerts can be scaled appropriately from that and its been done I guess mainly because restrictions are being rolled back at present. But fuq it I wouldn't be getting upset over it one way or another.

charlie14 · 11-06-2021 12:28PM

Micky 32 wrote: »

Not necessarily. It’s being abolished October 1st regardless who is vaccinated.

So what are you proposing that we do the same ?

Drop the face mask requirements on a similar basis, but have in place until 1st October a vaccine passport which would be required to go to a hairdresser, enter any business, gym, museum etc

11-06-2021 12:47PM

charlie14 wrote: »

So what are you proposing that we do the same ?

Drop the face mask requirements on a similar basis, but have in place until 1st October a vaccine passport which would be required to go to a hairdresser, enter any business, gym, museum etc

I think what most here want is to combine the least restrictive elements from lots of countries while ignoring those measures they have which are more restrictive

charlie14 · 11-06-2021 01:02PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I think what most here want is to combine the least restrictive elements from lots of countries while ignoring those measures they have which are more restrictive

Cherry picking while turning a blind eye is becoming an art around here alright.

namloc1980 · 11-06-2021 01:16PM

robbiezero wrote: »

Absolute theatre and purely enabling gombeens to be seen to be doing something and being in control.
Seen a few videos of it there. Embarrassing idiocy. That sham could have been held safely at any point during the pandemic.

What the point of holding it at this stage or what they might have learned for it, I have no idea.

We proved we can get 500 people to stand in roped off areas in a field for 2 hours. That's something I suppose. The world will be jealous of our people herding abilities.

TomSweeney · 11-06-2021 01:30PM

Hospitalisations down to 59, great stuff, I see the media are still fearmongering over "De Variants" tho, they really do want this to go on and on ...

Boggles · 11-06-2021 01:47PM

Silentcorner wrote: »

So you are accusing me of being anti vax then.

Again. NO.

I am pointing out that you are parroting the same nonsensical falsehoods commonly found in the antivax playbook.

- Restrictions don't work

- Seasonal.

- Masks.

- Miracle Cures

- Mass suicides

- Economic Armageddon.

- Nutty conspiracy theories undermining Public Health

- Championing Doctors who have been struck off or removed from positions because of lunatic dangerous rhetoric.

- Barrington Declaration

- Grifters

- Declaring the pandemic over last summer

- Continuously down playing how dangerous the virus actually is.

etc, etc, etc.

Now if none of them ring a bell I can gladly provide quotes or you can start being honest with yourself.

Either way, I don't really care.

Silentcorner · 11-06-2021 01:57PM

Boggles wrote: »

I never said you were anti vax, but it is completely undeniable giving your musings on the topic

Boggles wrote: »

Again. NO.

I am pointing out that you are parroting the same nonsensical falsehoods commonly found in the antivax playbook.

- Restrictions don't work

- Seasonal.

- Masks.

- Miracle Cures

- Mass suicides

- Economic Armageddon.

- Nutty conspiracy theories undermining Public Health

- Championing Doctors who have been struck off or removed from positions because of lunatic dangerous rhetoric.

- Barrington Declaration

- Grifters

etc, etc, etc.

Now if none of them ring a bell I can gladly provide quotes or you can start being honest with yourself.

Either way, I don't really care.

You were explicit in calling me Anti Vax...you have done it repeatedly....it's a nasty attempt to undermine any point I make, it is infantile!

At least have the maturity to accept your behaviour.

You have listed a load of separate issues there, it is perfectly plausible to have varying opinions on each of them....

Your difficulty is you cannot fathom how someone can be critical of severe lockdowns and yet be pro vaccine....it hurts your brain trying to figure that out....yet it is perfectly plausible to any reasonable individual even if you disagree.

Have you demonstrated an ability to critically analyse each issue you listed before....

Or

Are your opinions consistent with someone who has been conditioned by our Health Bureaucrats and our unquestioning media apparatus over the last 15 months?

Corby Trouser Press · 11-06-2021 02:13PM

Euro 2020 kicking off tonight.

Be interesting to see if there is much mention of the fact that Dublin was supposed to host the Poland v Slovakia match on Monday evening and as the tournament progresses, 3 more games.

Meanwhile, those reckless Danes are at it again, jeopardising their recovery from Covid...

https://www.thestadiumbusiness.com/2021/06/10/copenhagens-euro-2020-capacity-limit-increased-to-25000/

Copenhagen’s Parken Stadium has been cleared to welcome up to 25,000 fans for matches at the UEFA European Championships after the Danish government eased COVID-19 restrictions in the country.

The stadium’s capacity limit had previously been set at 15,900. The new 25,000 limit will come too soon for Copenhagen’s opening Euro 2020 match between Denmark and Finland on Saturday, but Denmark’s matches against Belgium on June 17 and Russia on June 21, as well as a Round of 16 fixture on June 28, will be able to go ahead at the increased capacity.

The Danish Parliament approved the capacity increases today (Thursday) as a number of other COVID-19 measures were eased, including the wearing of face masks and opening hours for bars and restaurants.

Up to 10,000 people will be permitted at public events from June 14, with an exception being made for Euro 2020 matches at Parken Stadium, which has a capacity of 38,000.

The Danish Football Association (DBU) has welcomed the easing of restrictions.

DBU chief executive Jakob Jensen said: “This summer’s European Championship finals are the biggest sporting event on Danish soil ever. That is why we have been working for more than a year to get as many fans as possible at the stadium, just as we have always aimed to distribute as many of the tickets as possible to our fans.”

The DBU noted that Parliament had asked the body to investigate the possibility of allowing 25,000 fans for Saturday’s match, but the quick turnaround needed to gain approval from UEFA and set up necessary COVID-19 protocols meant that this would not be achievable.

Jensen added: “We all want to get as many fans for the European Championship matches – as soon as possible. But the decision has been made so late that it is not possible to introduce the new framework for the match against Finland in just two days.

“For that match, the distribution of the 15,900 is already in place so we cannot get 9,000 more fans in and still live up to the current rules. We will now work hard to get more people in the stadium for the other European Championship matches at the Parken.”

The DBU said it will announce how extra tickets for matches will be distributed once the capacity increase has been approved by UEFA.

Denmark’s domestic Superliga has not yet commented on the new capacity guidelines. Earlier in the week, the league released a study which it claimed proved matches can go ahead without social distancing and sectioned seating areas if fans use COVID-19 access passes to enter the stadium.

The study pointed to low infection rates among supporters who attended matches held between April 21 and May 28, when small numbers of fans were permitted. Of the 266,259 fans that attended 170 matches during this time, 60 cases of COVID-19 were found, according to the Danish Agency for Patient Safety.

Euro 2020 matches will take place in 11 cities across Europe: Copenhagen, London, Munich, Seville, Saint Petersburg, Rome, Budapest, Bucharest, Baku, Amsterdam and Glasgow. Fans will be in attendance at every venue, with capacity restrictions to vary depending on local guidelines.

Rome’s Stadio Olimpico will host the opening match between Italy and Turkey tomorrow (Friday), with around 14,000 fans expected to be in attendance

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI Read OP For Mod Warnings