High risk/cohort 7 - GP doesn't seem too interested

Unrealistic wrote: »

The decision back in April or earlier to start on the general public before starting on Cohort 7 was of his making.

The decision to continue to this day to prioritise MVC's serving the general public over GPs serving Cohort 7 when distributing vaccinations is of his making.

The failure to recognise that the shabby way GPs were treated by the HSE during the vaccination of earlier cohorts was going to reduce uptake by GPs when it came to vaccinating later cohorts, and to make alternative arrangements, is of his making.

The failure to have a robust system in place to refer Cohort 7 patients to MVCs, when this was necessary anyway for those who would be referred by specialists/consultants rather than GPs, is of his making.

The decision to halt all attempts to vaccinate Cohort 7 patients not being served by GPs until the HSE IT systems are fully up and running is of his making.

Not really, although your line seems to be to blame Donnelly for everything. GPs were believed to be doing Group 7 and you are ignoring the overarching aim of programme is to get as many people vaccinated as possible. I agree it was a mess but for a variety of reasons. Some GPs opted out after Group 4, some got fed up with the supply issue and opted out and the HSE continued to assume that the groups were being addressed in a separate process.

Is the issue here some sudden new level of risk to this group or the perceived unfairness that other people are getting jabbed first?

iamwhoiam wrote: »

He is the elected Minister for Health and ultimately responsible for all decisions made

In his department yes but not in the HSE, that's Paul Reid.

is_that_so wrote: »

In his department yes but not in the HSE, that's Paul Reid.

I'm afraid any decision made by Paul Reid (and that's rare with such an expert on Deflection) is ultimately approved by the Secretary General of the Department of Health, who in turn reports directly to the Minister.

is_that_so wrote: »

In his department yes but not in the HSE, that's Paul Reid.

Of course the elected Minister for Health has the ultimate say in decisions and he is well able to announce those decisions when it suits his agenda .But funnily enough he is gone quiet now on the shambles of the high risk groups being abandoned to their own devices .

https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/b44b2-minister-donnelly-announces-update-to-vaccine-allocation-strategy/



https://www.independent.ie/world-news/coronavirus/gps-get-power-to-use-spare-vaccines-on-younger-cohorts-40489901.html


https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40285097.html

is_that_so wrote: »

And I'll ask you for some form of a link to prove said link because this looks very made up. I am aware of the organisational structure but nothing like this claim.

https://www.hse.ie/eng/about/who/

If you look closely at the organisational chart you see quite clearly the HSE is an organisation within the HSE, much like the CMO"s office. All report to the Secretary General of the Department of Health, I'm not sure what part of this your not understanding. Anyway not going to get bogged down with samantics, particularly on such a beautiful morning

Incidently I offered no link, you did

https://merrionstreet.ie/en/news-room/releases/minister_simon_harris_announces_government_approval_to_publish_the_health_service_executive_governance_bill_2018.html


Ends

Notes to the Editor
The Bill provides for a 9 person non-executive Board including the Chairperson and the Deputy Chairperson. The Board will have authority to perform the HSE's functions and will be accountable to the Minister for the performances of its functions

Turtwig wrote: »

Cohort 7 is a medical risk group. They are not however a group you can easily identify. No matter how much people piss and moan about it. This is a problem that hasn't been unique to Ireland. To complicate this further some gps have been off the ball since this pandemic began. Others have gone above and beyond. The vaccines are a mix of gp capability and hse supply. It's never going to be perfect and I do not feel neither cohort 4 or 7 were let I down. Some patients in all cohorts may have been let down. But in general I think the cohort 7 squealing is a mountain out of a molehill. Some are no doubt legitimate. I sympathise a lot with them. Same for the over 60s still caught in the queue. I can't see this yet as part of a broader issue though within the rollout. Or that cohort 7 is. forgotten.
There is only sporadic anecdotes.

Both these sentences show a lack of empathy with chronically ill people who deserve better .And here is a list of those you accuse of pissing and moaning





People aged 16 to 64 at high risk
List of conditions
Cancer
Haematological - within 1 year.

Haematological - within 1 - 5 years.

Non-haematological - within 1 year.

All other cancers on non-hormonal treatment.

Chronic heart (and vascular) disease
Chronic heart disease, for example: heart failure, hypertensive cardiac disease.

Chronic kidney disease
Chronic kidney disease with eGFR <30ml/min.

Chronic liver disease
Chronic liver disease, for example: cirrhosis or fibrosis.

Chronic neurological disease or condition
Chronic neurological disease or condition significantly compromising respiratory function and/or the ability to clear secretions, for example: Parkinson's disease, cerebral palsy.

Chronic respiratory disease
Other chronic respiratory disease, for example: stable cystic fibrosis, severe asthma (continuous or repeated use of systemic corticosteroids), moderate COPD.

Diabetes
All other diabetes (Type 1 and 2).

Immunocompromised
Immunocompromise due to disease or treatment, for example: high dose systemic steroids (as defined in Immunisation Guidelines for Ireland Chapter 3), persons living with HIV.

Inherited metabolic diseases*
Disorders of intermediary metabolism not fulfilling criteria for very high risk.

Intellectual disability*
Intellectual disability*** excluding Down Syndrome.

Obesity
BMI >35 Kg/m2.

Severe mental illness*
Severe mental illness, for example: schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, severe depression.

*additional or updated medical conditions

** APECED - autoimmune polyendocrinopathy candidiasis ecto- dermal dystrophy

*** WHO definition of intellectual disability as “impairments in adaptive, social, and intellectual functioning (IQ<70), requiring daily support, with onset in the developmental phase (<18 years)

Turtwig wrote: »

I haven't accused anyone of with medical need of pissing and moaning. I'm well aware of the criteria list for who belongs in what cohort

You said people on cohort 7 pissing and moaning and squealing.
If you are in cohort 7 you have medical needs ?

We can agree to differ but I think the group 7 were let down badly by their GPs who had a duty of care to the most vulnerable of their patients .It’s something I feel quite passionate about as it was a matter of a few extra weeks of hard work and they chose not to do it . Frontline staff have battled on for over a year and never threw in the towel because they were stressed or overwhelmed

iamwhoiam wrote: »

You said people on cohort 7 pissing and moaning and squealing.
If you are in cohort 7 you have medical needs ?

We can agree to differ but I think the group 7 were let down badly by their GPs who had a duty of care to the most vulnerable of their patients .It’s something I feel quite passionate about as it was a matter of a few extra weeks of hard work and they chose not to do it . Frontline staff have battled on for over a year and never threw in the towel because they were stressed or overwhelmed

Many gps completely overestimated their capacity for handling the vaccination as well their usual clinic stuff. Some displayed incompetence. Others did their level best. It's a lottery for the patient. That's the worst part. As it was for what services their GP offered during covid. This wasn't a cohort 7 problem. It was a cohorts all the way down problem. Well intentioned as they were they created an unfortunate bottleneck. That coupled with some HSE supply mix ups and you have the effects of a traffic jam that will take some areas time to clear.

Just got an automated text telling me to attend Helix on Saturday. Clearly GPs can still refer patients to MVCs

Trish_MB wrote: »

HSE replied to me this weekend that GPs still can't refer anyone as portal is not available. Wondering then how you were referred, I'm sick of calling my GP and asking just to be told again and again to wait for my age group, while I'm still not going to be included in next age "shot" either....

The only thing I can say is that I registered interest on my GPs website before the HSE hack (they had a online form I had to fill out). What my GP did between the day I registered and the hack is beyond me.

ironictoaster wrote: »

The only thing I can say is that I registered interest on my GPs website before the HSE hack (they had a online form I had to fill out). What my GP did between the day I registered and the hack is beyond me.

Hi ironic toaster

There is a group of 120 small practices in dublin whose vaccines are being done via DCU. System and bookings totally seperate from the rest of practices in the country. For small practices only.

The list of 120 practices was originally drawn up last February and the practice was placed on the list if the had <200 patients age over 70.

Seperate from all the other regular larger GP practices

is_that_so wrote: »

I confess I'm baffled as to why the risk of COVID has suddenly shot up for these groups or is this just a fairness thing?

This question was answered politely the first time you asked it. That you're now asking it a third time suggests you're just trolling.

is_that_so wrote: »

FYI on the HSE with this programme they do not respond to anything about how it is run and only tell people when they have supplies to vaccinate.

That is not true, as I have pointed out to you already. They have gone into detail at the regular NPHET briefings in answer to questions from journalists; including about Cohort 7.

Marine Layer wrote: »

People with the condition I have in cohort 7 were told to shield last year and were vaccinated in NI and GB in January this year as a priority

I'm wondering what the difference is in the Republic? Same condition ignored now
Beggars belief

My advice for what it is worth, you will have to be pro-active. Try your GP first, if you do not get any joy then contact your consultant (if you have one). It should not have to be like this but unfortunately the group 7 prioritisation plan appears to have left a lot of people behind.

HSE hopes for Cohort 7 solution within ten days as high risk patients still waiting for vaccines

https://www.thejournal.ie/vaccine-cohort-7-5463185-Jun2021/

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Close the MCVs appointments for everyone else for a few days , let the GPs send printed lists to the MCVs .

Stop all other vaccinations for everyone else? Are you being serious?

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Hope to ! !!! Mother of god could they be any less proactive .
Close the MCVs appointments for everyone else for a few days , let the GPs send printed lists to the MCVs . Tell all in the cohort 7 to turn up in order of surname ( A-G one day etc ) and register and get them done and dusted. Bring in the army if necessary and get it sorted
With a bit of planning and cop on it could be done in days
By the time the HSE hope to have a plan everyone will be done by age anyone

The main aim is to get as many people done as possible as quickly as possible. Stopping the process will not do that. They say they have a pathway that was disrupted by the attack and who knows how far advanced that was. If it is really 10 days we will start to see signs of that quickly enough. In the meantime some of that group are being done by age.

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Without any any official stats I am presuming the cohort is much reduced now anyway . Only ones left are under 40 so guessing about half to one third left to do. So they have to be seen to do something and allow the media pick up on a “ plan “
Truth be told it was a shambles and should be examined so it wont happen if this ever happens again . If they did that at very least it would be a help and show they have grasped that it was a mess

Well, the problem all along was who do you count and who has the information as well as the uncertainty about who was taking care of the groups. It won't or shouldn't be an issue in the future now that they have been quantified.

Triangle wrote: »

It's not that simple. I know of a couple of over 65s in rural areas that have just got their vaccines because their GPS are inept.
People that think the data is just there and accessible don't understand databases, IT and data validation.
Going the paper route is even worse.
You could throw thousands of people at the issue and still have issues afterwards.

I get the frustration people have, especially with the vaccines being rolled out, but it really is complicated for the HSE and they are doing their best (especially after having their IT systems taken offline)

Wow. Over 65’s not done until is very upsetting for them .Some GPs quite simply were not up to this . I know one GP in a large urban estate with no computer or IT system working with paper files in a cupboard !! His patients were delayed by weeks and even months until called .