Phoenix Park littering

begbysback wrote: »

First sign of the psychological impact of long term lockdown appearing on this thread.

a) putting rubbinsh in bins is not littering

I never said it was.

begbysback wrote: »

b) yes, double the amount of bin collectors if there are going to be more people in the park who would like to dispose of their rubbish

That's never going to happen, and anyway if it did do you think it will cut down on rubbish being dumped? I don't.

begbysback wrote: »

c) it seems the people who littered disposed of their rubbish beside the bin, so it looks at least they made an effort to get to a bin, only for it to be full - why make it difficult for people to dispose of rubbish?

Made an effort??

Look at all these great citizens making an effort, you really think 2 extra bins in this shot would have left the location spotless :pac:

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Maybe they should leave skips all around the countryside too to stop the fly tippers there!... maybe put 2 beside each other because there wouldn't be enough.

bins attract rubbish.

Just bring it home with you. and sort it/recycle it.

https://www.thejournal.ie/dcc-removes-public-bins-illegal-dumping-491596-Jun2012/

VonLuck wrote: »

That's not really providing a solution though. It's like saying that you've found a way to prevent theft - just don't steal!

Wat?

I have found a way to prevent theft... Just Don't leave your front door open

Your analogy is bad and you should feel bad.

VonLuck wrote: »

You're the one with the bad analogy I'm afraid! You originally said that the individual should bring home their rubbish in order to stop them being a litterer. A like for like situation is that an individual should not enter someone else's home in order to stop them being a thief.

What you've followed up with is essentially that the onus is on the victim to prevent theft! I guess that's like saying don't give people packaging that will enable them to litter? To be honest I'm not really sure what your analogy is there

Likewise.

You could also argue if you had more houses then burglary rates would go down!

More bins, littering goes down.

What's the big deal about bringing home your rubbish? Why can't you do it.

VonLuck wrote: »

Yes, more bins. That was my suggestion, but you were saying that everyone should just bring their rubbish home!

The big deal about bringing home your rubbish is that there are plenty of lazy and careless people out there. Simply telling them to bring their rubbish home won't change anything. That takes years of education from a young age and even a cultural change. Bins are the temporary solution to the problem and education is the long term goal.

Ya I totally agree, plenty of lazy and careless people out there who will dump no matter how many bins the are.

I remember back in the 80s we watched a cartoon in primary school , the tag line was "litterbug, litterbug shame on you." Needless to say we went INSANE shouting the jingle at locals and random strangers outside the school, got obsessed and took licence plate numbers of people chucking stuff out the window passing in cars. Principal passed on the plates to the gardaí and all :pac:

begbysback wrote: »

Or here’s an idea, maybe actually put in more bins, bigger bins even, and maybe clear the bins out more regularly.

There’s a vast shortage of bins in the park, we need more bins, not the bin police

This isn’t always true. The council put loads of extra bins in the grand canal dock area this past weekend. They all filled up and the rubbish around the area was the worst I’ve ever seen in that area the next morning. With that said we still do need an adequate amount of bins evenly spread around.

Likewise I mentioned here a while back about a privately operated bin which overflowed at weekends creating so much litter. It was removed and the litter issue has disappeared. Bins can create a litter issue in the immediate vicinity of the bin.

There’s definitely a cultural problem on this. Also folks. Crush your cans, coffee cups and pizza boxes. Make space for others to dispose of their rubbish.

Finally, seagulls. Those damn things are also massive litter bugs. They can easily pick at rubbish bags and throw rubbish all over the place. I think people underestimate the amount of litter created by them. We need some anti seagull bin bags or something.

Hi OP,

Its not just the Phoenix Park, Fairview park was in a mess last week also, Clontarf seafront same, St Annes Park same.

The problem here is the general public, who just dump their rubbish anywhere and everywhere.

Its a behavioural problem , people here dont seem to respect their environment, this is a family and parent education/ up bringing , good manners.

We need more enforcement , not enough littler wardens , not enough park rangers.

People throw cigarette butts out of their cars, fly tipping is also rampant since covid started.

Observed a guy last week driving a top of the range Audi 192 reg in my local Applegreen service station , taking 2 black bags out of his boot and transfer the contents to the Applegreen bins as I was topping up on air and water.

Said it to him, was told to mind my own fcuking business.

Reported it to staff in the service station as there was CCTV covering the area.

He said , oh thats happening all the time since Covid 19 in March 2020.

So as I cant generalise but why are the general public littering so much.

You dont see this in Singapore, the place is spotless.

Treppen wrote: »

I never said it was.

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Looks like a scene from a 3rd World country, its very sad that people have no civic pride anymore.

mrcheez wrote: »

Yes but the Japanese take personal responsibility seriously. They would feel ashamed to make others uncomfortable due to their actions.

It's a cultural thing that would be absent here.

In other words, here, if no bins then people would fling their rubbish in the Liffey or just anywhere.

Personal responsibility here by some is absolutely frowned upon, gone awol, it’s about as fashionable as lice ... next you’ll have someone having been arrested for theft of xxx euros of groceries from tesco.. “ there were no signs to say I couldn’t steal, so it’s the shops fault, AND I’m going to sue both the shop and An Garda Siochana because of the stress...my mental health, I should be given the GPO and a lifetime of free groceries as compensation”

People littering in parks need sorting. Get the Gardai and courts to make examples of them.

A nice monetary fine and a week in a jumpsuit with a sweeping brush for company.

Treppen wrote: »

The point is... People are doing that anyway, bins or no bins.

Not really, I think the majority of people are putting them in bins when the bins are empty, but then when the bins are full they fling them "in the proximity" of the bins... in a sort of half-hearted attempt at well meaning (cuz sure it's easy for the bin men to collect them off the ground if they're near the bins)

Treppen wrote: »

Ya I agree, although if you but an extra bin beside that one would it solve the problem?

Ok so.. update... Extra New bins are really solving the littering issue. Maybe we need double the amount of extra new bins.

We're just a nation of uneducated, ignorant scumbags really when all is said and done. Anything which involves personal responsibility, "doing the right thing" is just met with excuses, blame and finger pointing.
This very thread has been done to death on "The thrashing of parks and beaches" thread. The only thing Irish people understand is "what is this costing me". Since it costs money to bring it home and throw it in your own bin, people won't do it. It never ceases to amaze me how people who think nothing of buying a coffee or a pint for 3 or 5 euro think it is so dreadful to pay the extra few cent to dispose of it in their own bin. Or even worse, pay a euro for a reusable bag in Tesco and leave the bag beside a bin.
I think our "outdoor summer" just won't work and by the end of it, we'll realise that Irish people just can't do the right thing. The education isn't working either - walking through a leafy South Dublin suburb recently, there was a school kid from a fee-paying school dumping his can on a wall. There was a bin 5ft away.

Treppen wrote: »

Take a look at the rubbish not in the bin in that photo.

I'd guarantee you there would be less than that amount if there was no bin there at all. More bins just attract more rubbish.

I both agree and disagree with you. A full bin attracts more rubbish as people just end up leaving stuff in front of it and it ends up blowing everywhere or the birds get at it.

Simple solution is more bins and more regular emptying of them. It's not rocket science.

VonLuck wrote: »

I both agree and disagree with you. A full bin attracts more rubbish as people just end up leaving stuff in front of it and it ends up blowing everywhere or the birds get at it.

Simple solution is more bins and more regular emptying of them. It's not rocket science.

You're missing the point. The photo above is from the "more bins" plan, they were installed a few days ago.
Rocket science is quite basic btw.
Managing human behaviour is much more difficult.

VonLuck wrote: »

That's not something that you can do overnight. That takes years of education from a very young age. You need a solution in the short term, which is more bins.



You failed to highlight the next part of my sentence which said to empty them more regularly. A full bin attracts rubbish, an empty one doesn't.

Also, no need to be a pedant about my rocket science comment. You're fully aware that it's a common idiom.

A couple of better "short term" solutions:
1. A 50c charge added to every bottle/can/plastic bottle. Get back once brought to a deposit return facility. See how quick 85% by-volume of the rubbish disappears once there's skin in the game. (Eamon Ryan bleated about this for years in opposition and it is glacially slow in its implementation)
2. Add bin charges to the property tax. Get your bins lifted included. 2 advantages, 1. nobody can avoid and the council knows who is paying (they don't at the moment due to GDPR) 2. the incentive to litter is gone 3. you can provide bins at every street corner in the city, there is no difference in cost between bringing rubbish home and throwing in a street bin. At the moment, there is.

Pay by weight bin charges just doesn't work with Irish people. Most people will do their bit by recycling etc - once it doesn't cost them any more.