Eurovision Song Contest 2021

forumdedum · 19-05-2021 09:13AM

Mike Murdock wrote: »

She is not Kara DioGuardi level that is for sure. Lesley pretty much gave up singing in 2009 to concentrate on songwriting.

She should never have sung the song live as she does no have the vocal power or stage presence to pull it off.

The second point is not true. Plenty of established European bands/performers represent their countries at this thing. We seem to be fixated on plucking people from obscurity to represent us.

I must be out of touch as I haven't heard of any of them. It has been a very long time since I heard a decent song.

What Irish acts that are not obscure could represent Ireland?

Capt'n Midnight · 19-05-2021 09:17AM

gmisk wrote: »

So Ireland have made the final....once in 8 years... absolutely awful record. Need a new team behind decision and preferably a national final not some afterthought shoved into the late late.

Ryan likes music on 'his' shoe.

But the audience for the LLS is not of the same demographic as the Eurovision audience. Needs it's own show. Maybe do give the winner a fly on the wall show as they prepare for the big day.

Or do a Big Brother where one group gets voted out each week ?

Or something anything, bring back proper old school juries rather than the public ?

From 1987 to 1997 we won 5 times ...
Johnny Logan "Hold Me Now" (1987),
Linda Martin "Why Me" (1992),
Niamh Kavanagh "In Your Eyes" (1993),
Paul Harrington and Charlie McGettigan "Rock 'n' Roll Kids" (1994)
Eimear Quinn with "The Voice" (1996).

... and could have won another three times.
Liam Reilly "Somewhere in Europe" (1990) = came second
Marc Roberts "Mysterious Woman" (1997) = came second = last time we were in the top 5
Nocturne - Secret Garden - Norway (1995) = an assist that caused a rule change due to how little of the entry was a song

Capt'n Midnight · 19-05-2021 09:20AM

forumdedum wrote: »

What Irish acts that are not obscure could represent Ireland?

https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/music/hozier-if-i-wanted-to-make-a-f-king-pop-song-i-would-1.3794161

19-05-2021 09:20AM

Why don't we lean into Enya-type music. That ethereal, Celtic, stuff.

People everywhere love that stuff.

forumdedum · 19-05-2021 09:21AM

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Ryan likes music on 'his' shoe.

But the audience for the LLS is not of the same demographic as the Eurovision audience. Needs it's own show. Maybe do give the winner a fly on the wall show as they prepare for the big day.

Or do a Big Brother where one group gets voted out each week ?

Or something anything, bring back proper old school juries rather than the public ?

From 1987 to 1997 we won 5 times ...
Johnny Logan "Hold Me Now" (1987),
Linda Martin "Why Me" (1992),
Niamh Kavanagh "In Your Eyes" (1993),
Paul Harrington and Charlie McGettigan "Rock 'n' Roll Kids" (1994)
Eimear Quinn with "The Voice" (1996).

... and could have won another three times.
Liam Reilly "Somewhere in Europe" (1990) = came second
Marc Roberts "Mysterious Woman" (1997) = came second = last time we were in the top 5
Nocturne - Secret Garden - Norway (1995) = an assist that caused a rule change due to how little of the entry was a song

Rock 'n' Roll Kids is a fabulous song. Love Shay Healy's What's Another Year too. Johnny Logan great voice as did Niamh Kavanagh. The other winners meh.

Mike Murdock · 19-05-2021 09:23AM

forumdedum wrote: »

Rock 'n' Roll Kids is a fabulous song. Love Shay Healy's What's Another Year too. Johnny Logan great voice as did Niamh Kavanagh. The other winners meh.

Rock N'Roll Kids is arguably top 10 of all time to have won the thing.

forumdedum · 19-05-2021 09:23AM

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/music/hozier-if-i-wanted-to-make-a-f-king-pop-song-i-would-1.3794161

Hozier is a stunning talent. I believe he would flush his career down the toilet getting involved in Eurovision. There is a seriously uncool element to it.

forumdedum · 19-05-2021 09:24AM

Mike Murdock wrote: »

Rock N'Roll Kids is arguably top 10 of all time to have won the thing.

Arguably too good a song for Eurovision imo. Just a super song.

gmisk · 19-05-2021 09:27AM

forumdedum wrote: »

So much "own music" is junk. Sadly, great songwriters have become pretty rare.

If you read her CV Lesley hasn't really cut it in the songwriting game.

Just watched her on a playback. Poor vocals, voice sounds very tired. Probably over rehearsed etc.

Anyone who has a chance of a career in music certainly shouldn't flush it down the toilet entering Eurovision. Besides, what do the winners do? Apart from Celine Dion and ABBA they are pretty much forgotten.

Niamh Kavanagh went back to working in the bank. Sensible lady (super voice too.)

Lesley Roy, was a poor choice, she couldn't sing the song and the stage production didn't work for enough people.

What do the winners do? Just because they don't hit the heights of Celine Dion and Abba it doesn't mean they aren't successful just because we don't hear of them in Ireland. Eurovision can be an amazing platform. We (RTE etc) just don't take it seriously enough.

Niamh Kavanagh also does not work in a bank...she works in Tesco....and that was more due to illness in her family.

19-05-2021 09:33AM

I feel sad for Lesley and her team because they did put so much work into the concept and staging.

Parts of it looked really nice, though I think they should have abandoned the flipping-book-pages bit as it just looked a bit out of place.

Vocally it wasn't perfect, but I didn't think her vocal was any worse overall than Azerbaijan (who has basically one note yelled at different volumes) or Israel (who somehow managed to hit the whistle note at the end after missing several "easier" notes in the run-up).

I thought the studio cut of Maps was the best entry Ireland had sent for a long time. As a stand-alone song I think it deserved qualification more than the OTT cheesefest from Norway, the cliche-ridden banality from Sweden and the blatant Lady Gaga rip-off from Cyprus. But I guess that's always gonna be subjective. I also thought Australia, Romania and Croatia were better songs than a lot of those that qualified.

Overall I think this year goes into the pile of unlucky NQ's for Ireland, along with 2015 (and possibly 2009), as opposed to the years we didn't qualify because we fully deserved not to (Donna & Joe, Nicky Byrne, Brendan Murray, Sarah McTernan)...I'm not sure which of those categories Dustin falls into!

Russia, Belgium and Ukraine were the stand-outs for me, they all brought something striking and different that made you take notice.

For those saying that Lesley can't sing, she did an acoustic performance in the run-up that sounded good (around the 8:50 mark in the video). I think maybe her voice isn't "big" enough for stadium performances but definitely suitable for singer-songwriter type stuff:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKnAfg3DF_U

Beechwoodspark · 19-05-2021 09:42AM

Just on the staging I thought it was way too “busy” and too much going on.

Also it put SEVERE pressure on the singer.

It was more like an an elaborate fitness routine mixed with an obstacle course

Anyone would’ve struggled doing it and then ON TOP of that she had to sing the damn song!!

Maybe someone like Beyoncé at her very peak could’ve pulled it off but still it’s a maybe...

Was unfair to be honest to ask L R to do this

Also, she looked wrecked tired and I can’t really blame her

gmisk · 19-05-2021 09:43AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I feel sad for Lesley and her team because they did put so much work into the concept and staging. Parts of it looked really nice, though I think they should have abandoned the flipping-book-pages bit as it just looked a bit out of place.

Vocally it wasn't perfect, but I didn't think her vocal was any worse overall than Azerbaijan (who has basically one note yelled at different volumes) or Israel (who somehow managed to hit the whistle note at the end after missing several "easier" notes in the run-up).

I thought the studio cut of Maps was the best entry Ireland had sent for a long time. As a stand-alone song I think it deserved qualification more than the OTT cheesefest from Norway, the cliche-ridden banality from Sweden and the blatant Lady Gaga rip-off from Cyprus. But I guess that's always gonna be subjective. I also thought Australia, Romania and Croatia were better songs than a lot of those that qualified.

Overall I think this year goes into the pile of unlucky NQ's for Ireland, along with 2015 (and possibly 2009), as opposed to the years we didn't qualify because we fully deserved not to (Donna & Joe, Nicky Byrne, Brendan Murray, Sarah McTernan)...I'm not sure which of those categories Dustin falls into!

Russia, Belgium and Ukraine were the stand-outs for me, they all brought something striking and different that made you take notice.

For those saying that Lesley can't sing, she did an acoustic performance in the run-up that sounded good (around the 8:50 mark in the video). I think maybe her voice isn't "big" enough for stadium performances but definitely suitable for singer-songwriter type stuff:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKnAfg3DF_U

That performance was slightly better than last night, but it wouldn't be hard. She still has horrible mannerisms singing out the side of her mouth, employing a weird accent and mangling words like Ronan Keating, very limited voice.
The studio version of the song is fine, but she cannot sing it live, it didn't deserve to qualify.

Meanwhile you have songs like the below not even making the final in the national contest in Denmark

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_vTiBoMGK4

The standard is improving in most countries, meanwhile we send dreck without a competition.

reniwren · 19-05-2021 09:51AM

I'm sure LR can sing her own songs, but if the vocals need to be edited so much on the recording that it might as well be a different person live there is no point. Ireland doesn't have a history of big show female acts like Gaga, Grande, and now lipa. So L R performance should not be based on a big moving around stage act, and you could tell when she was running out of breath because of movement.

Oymyakon · 19-05-2021 09:51AM

Deleted User wrote: »

I thought the studio cut of Maps was the best entry Ireland had sent for a long time. As a stand-alone song I think it deserved qualification more than the OTT cheesefest from Norway, the cliche-ridden banality from Sweden and the blatant Lady Gaga rip-off from Cyprus. But I guess that's always gonna be subjective. I also thought Australia, Romania and Croatia were better songs than a lot of those that qualified.

I completely agree with everything you said in your post except for a hard disagree about Romania, I thought it was the worst performance of the night by a mile!

ebbsy · 19-05-2021 09:54AM

It was not one of those songs that when you are listening to it in the car, you reach to turn up the volume.

The whole thing was a confusing mess, and wouldn't make you want to vote for it.

Ireland has great singers, what the hell is going on ???????

breezy1985 · 19-05-2021 09:56AM

odyssey06 wrote: »

Either they should have found someone else to sing it (maybe no one can do that properly live given its production) or written a song that could be performed properly live.

The studio version of Maps is ok but live it was a failure.

It wasn't a defense. I thought it was rubbish too but I was replying to a post that said we should try acts who do their own music and was pointing out that that's exactly what we did and it sucked

19-05-2021 09:58AM

Oymyakon wrote: »

I completely agree with everything you said in your post except for a hard disagree about Romania, I thought it was the worst performance of the night by a mile!

I was mainly referring to the studio versions of the songs there, but yeah I'm not surprised Romania didn't qualify as the live version was wobbly. I think like Ireland they also tried to do too much moving around and singing at the same time.

Deeper Blue · 19-05-2021 10:01AM

Oymyakon wrote: »

I heard she's written for Katy Perry? I stand to be corrected

Apparently she's written for Adam Lambert, Miss Montreal, Medina, Jana Kramer, Marlee Scott, Deorro, Anish Sood and Brendan Murray.

The best known person on that list (Lambert) is famous for touring with Queen as their lead singer. Not known for his own songs at all.

As for the others, Katy Perry they are not.

The lad that represented Ireland in 2017 (and failed to qualify) is on that list ffs, so they're stretching it a bit. But still, at least she had some sort of songwriting pedigree I suppose.

Man Vs ManUre · 19-05-2021 10:01AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Why don't we lean into Enya-type music. That ethereal, Celtic, stuff.

People everywhere love that stuff.

We did that many years ago with Eimer Quinn, The Voice. And we won!! Tho times very different now. Now the audience want weird and wacky upbeat modern pop. Not soppy love songs or rock ballads.

BobMc · 19-05-2021 10:03AM

I liked our song having played it at home via usuall sources, I liked last years song too, but it just wasnt sounding great last night, I'm no musician but it felt like she was off key and it ran a bit fast, think her concentration on the performance took from her vocals, thought it picked up once she took off from the stills and took to the stage, could it have been slowed down just a tiny tad ?

Some duds on the night, but I do believe the best song of the competition usually pulls off the win on finals night

forumdedum · 19-05-2021 10:03AM

gmisk wrote: »

Lesley Roy, was a poor choice, she couldn't sing the song and the stage production didn't work for enough people.

What do the winners do? Just because they don't hit the heights of Celine Dion and Abba it doesn't mean they aren't successful just because we don't hear of them in Ireland. Eurovision can be an amazing platform. We (RTE etc) just don't take it seriously enough.

Niamh Kavanagh also does not work in a bank...she works in Tesco....and that was more due to illness in her family.

On a positive note at least the 'singers' are made to sing vocals live. Every dog on the street knows you don't sing and dance at same time. Some acts sing a little then the sound engineer replaces the live vocal with pre recorded vocal for dance routines.

Maybe they are successful. I'd sure like to hear more of them and see if there are any decent songs out there.

I'm sorry to hear about Niamh's family illness. Even in the 90s when records could be sold for decent profit she knew the state of the Irish Music Industry

forumdedum · 19-05-2021 10:05AM

Deeper Blue wrote: »

Apparently she's written for Adam Lambert, Miss Montreal, Medina, Jana Kramer, Marlee Scott, Deorro, Anish Sood and Brendan Murray.

The best known person on that list (Lambert) is famous for touring with Queen as their lead singer. Not known for his own songs at all.

As for the others, Katy Perry they are not.

The lad that represented Ireland in 2017 (and failed to qualify) is on that list ffs, so they're stretching it a bit. But still, at least she had some sort of songwriting pedigree I suppose.

Not pedigree in my eyes I'm afraid.

breezy1985 · 19-05-2021 10:06AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Why don't we lean into Enya-type music. That ethereal, Celtic, stuff.

People everywhere love that stuff.

Ukraine are after popping up with a cracking outside bet using tin whistles

forumdedum · 19-05-2021 10:07AM

breezy1985 wrote: »

Ukraine are after popping up with a cracking outside bet using tin whistles

I wouldn't like to meet the singer in a dark alley

breezy1985 · 19-05-2021 10:09AM

forumdedum wrote: »

I wouldn't like to meet the singer in a dark alley

I would. She scares me but I definitely would

Fine Cheers · 19-05-2021 10:20AM

All I know is that I watched Maps once on youtube last night to see what the all the fuss was about.
I woke up humming the the tune and now can't get it out of my head.
Not sure what that is a sign of !!

Deeper Blue · 19-05-2021 10:20AM

forumdedum wrote: »

Not pedigree in my eyes I'm afraid.

I think I was being kind by saying pedigree.

odyssey06 · 19-05-2021 10:23AM

Fine Cheers wrote: »

All I know is that I watched Maps once on youtube last night to see what the all the fuss was about.
I woke up humming the the tune and now can't get it out of my head.
Not sure what that is a sign of !!

Did you watch the studio \ video version or the actual live performance from the semi-final?

gmisk · 19-05-2021 10:23AM

Man Vs ManUre wrote: »

We did that many years ago with Eimer Quinn, The Voice. And we won!! Tho times very different now. Now the audience want weird and wacky upbeat modern pop. Not soppy love songs or rock ballads.

Weird and wacky upbeat modern pop?
Did you miss the song Portugal won with?
Or the most recent winner? Or Ukraine?
So 3 out of the last 4 winners were a world away from weird and wacky upbeat modern pop

The style doesn't inherently matter in Eurovision, the cream generally rises to the top.

forumdedum · 19-05-2021 10:24AM

Deeper Blue wrote: »

I think I was being kind by saying pedigree.

Very :-)

Eurovision Song Contest 2021

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