Lions Tour

damianmcr · 13-04-2021 9:02pm

Cookiemunster wrote: »

AFAIK the 'possibles' also usually get measured for suits before around the same time they're told they're on the long list. Although I don't know how that would work this time.

Ah yes I do mind this now you say about suits.

Billy Ocean · 13-04-2021 9:34pm

According to O'Driscoll on off the ball a few weeks ago after the 6 nations they would pretty much have the squad nailed on bar 2 or 3 players, for how well VDF is currently playing i couldn't see him getting the spot of Curry, Tupiric or Watson.

dublin49 · 13-04-2021 11:22pm

I think Keenan may have done enough.He just gets better and better and was excellent again on Sat ,he is really elusive without seemingly doing a whole lot .

Cosmo Kramer · 13-04-2021 11:26pm

K Owens
J George
R Herring

M Vunipola
W Jones
R Sutherland

T Furlong
K Sinckler
A Porter

M Itoje
A W Jones
J Ryan
I Henderson

T Beirne
C J Stander
J Navidi
J Tipuric
H Watson
T Curry
T Faletau

C Murray
B Youngs
G Davies

J Sexton
D Biggar
O Farrell

R Henshaw
G Ringrose
G North
J Davies

L Rees-Zammit
J Adams
A Watson
J May

S Hogg
L Williams

Just throwing up my 36 man predicted squad for posterity. Very difficult to predict this year because some players might not want to travel in the circumstances. Also I think there may be more Scots with Townsend involved but it's hard to see who you would cut to fit them in.

Overall it looks a strong squad, although there is maybe a weakness in the front row outside of tight head, which might be a problem against South Africa.

Pussyhands · 13-04-2021 11:29pm

Sexton and North will just get injured right away.

Tommybojangles · 13-04-2021 11:46pm

Pussyhands wrote: »

Sexton and North will just get injured right away.

Jesus you're a ball of positivity on this thread.

Fwiw I hear the Lions get a lot of stick saying it's all about the money etc but I don't buy any of that. Maybe I'm a bit naive but I love every minute of it

Burkie1203 · 14-04-2021 6:56am

It's going well all the same

https://twitter.com/SunJonnyFordham/status/1382210699028480006?s=19

OldRio · 14-04-2021 7:48am

Tommybojangles wrote: »

Fwiw I hear the Lions get a lot of stick saying it's all about the money etc but I don't buy any of that.

😁

Thrashssacre · 14-04-2021 7:58am

McBride is apparently pushing for kelleher to be included on the tour. It'd be some achievement for the guy, hope robin manages to convince Warren to take him.

The Inbetween is mine · 14-04-2021 8:20am

Thrashssacre wrote: »

McBride is apparently pushing for kelleher to be included on the tour. It'd be some achievement for the guy, hope robin manages to convince Warren to take him.

Ken Owens would be nailed on.. you'd have to think Cowan Dickie and Genge would probably be ahead of Kelleher in Gatlands eyes ...
but who knows, he could be the bolter from the Irish side.....he has said that he knows about 25 of his squad..and that between all the coaches, they've picked nearly 55 different players.
I'm hoping Porter gets rewarded with a place in the 36 tbh.

Thrashssacre · 14-04-2021 8:24am

The Inbetween is mine wrote: »

Ken Owens would be nailed on.. you'd have to think Cowan Dickie and Genge would probably be ahead of Kelleher in Gatlands eyes ...
but who knows, he could be the bolter from the Irish side.....he has said that he knows about 25 of his squad..and that between all the coaches, they've picked nearly 55 different players.
I'm hoping Porter gets rewarded with a place in the 36 tbh.

Probably the more likely choice yes but can certainly see the merit in having the experience of Owens for 60-65 minuites then bringing in a fresh, explosive kelleher to finish.

AbusesToilets · 14-04-2021 2:20pm

The Inbetween is mine wrote: »

Ken Owens would be nailed on.. you'd have to think Cowan Dickie and Genge would probably be ahead of Kelleher in Gatlands eyes ...
but who knows, he could be the bolter from the Irish side.....he has said that he knows about 25 of his squad..and that between all the coaches, they've picked nearly 55 different players.
I'm hoping Porter gets rewarded with a place in the 36 tbh.

Owens is well over the hill, waste of a spot and I'd be shocked if Gatland brings him. It'll be kelleher, CD and probably George.

razorblunt · 14-04-2021 3:33pm

The Inbetween is mine wrote: »

Ken Owens would be nailed on.. you'd have to think Cowan Dickie and Genge would probably be ahead of Kelleher in Gatlands eyes ...
but who knows, he could be the bolter from the Irish side.....he has said that he knows about 25 of his squad..and that between all the coaches, they've picked nearly 55 different players.
I'm hoping Porter gets rewarded with a place in the 36 tbh.

Presume that should be George and not Genge?

I think Keenan might miss out and it would be incredibly harsh if so.

Buer · 14-04-2021 4:27pm

I would expect Irish players who are in great form like Keenan and VDF to miss out. It's not that they're not deserving but they don't offer enough flexibility and there are others who are ahead of them in the pecking order when it comes to their specialist position e.g. Tipuric, Watson (Hamish or Anthony), Hogg, Williams etc.

There's going to be a bolter/surprise from a couple of countries. I'd almost be surprised if guys like McBryde or Tandy/Townsend don't manage to push some of their players into the fold. With that in mind, I'd say the likes of Kelleher or VDM have suddenly become really strong options for the touring party. Kelleher in particular is a dark horse. Gatland was a hooker himself and I'm sure he's watching the hooker contest keenly. The first test match that Jamie George ever started was the opening Lions test in 2017 so he has history in pushing through the form player.

Even more left field calls in positions of weakness become interesting for selection. Ali Price might well sneak in, I think even though I'm not a huge fan. James Ritchie is in with a shot. And, nobody has mentioned him at all, but Jack Conan's form will have his name mentioned during the selection meetings although I don't think he'll end up on the plane. He has had 5 starts this year and won MOTM in 3 of them. He was a stand out performer in the other 2 where he comfortably outplayed his much hyped opposite numbers (Vunipola and Simmonds).

Also, I wouldn't be shocked if Manu Tuilagi is in the picture if he can play 3-4 games this season. Centre is a real problem position for them. They've a couple of stand out options and a gulf after that.

The Inbetween is mine · 14-04-2021 4:31pm

razorblunt wrote: »

Presume that should be George and not Genge?

I think Keenan might miss out and it would be incredibly harsh if so.

Hey, if POM can be a winger, I can throw a prop in at hooker

But yes, I meant George

theVersatile · 14-04-2021 6:35pm

I see McBryde mentioned that not all players being considered are necessarily current internationals. Opens the door for Zebo.

More seriously, which other non-internationals would be in contention?

Lucas44 · 14-04-2021 6:39pm

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

K Owens
J George
R Herring

M Vunipola
W Jones
R Sutherland

T Furlong
K Sinckler
A Porter

M Itoje
A W Jones
J Ryan
I Henderson

T Beirne
C J Stander
J Navidi
J Tipuric
H Watson
T Curry
T Faletau

C Murray
B Youngs
G Davies

J Sexton
D Biggar
O Farrell

R Henshaw
G Ringrose
G North
J Davies

L Rees-Zammit
J Adams
A Watson
J May

S Hogg
L Williams

Just throwing up my 36 man predicted squad for posterity. Very difficult to predict this year because some players might not want to travel in the circumstances. Also I think there may be more Scots with Townsend involved but it's hard to see who you would cut to fit them in.

Overall it looks a strong squad, although there is maybe a weakness in the front row outside of tight head, which might be a problem against South Africa.

Good squad would bring slade over ringrose, more versatile and better imo (in form too).. reckon they’ll bring 7 back 3 players can see Elliot Daly going, offers a lot of versatility + huge boot especially at altitude.. maybe underhill instead of navidi seems to be going well with bath since he’s back and offers something different than the other 6/7s

Brief_Lives · 14-04-2021 6:42pm

theVersatile wrote: »

I see McBryde mentioned that not all players being considered are necessarily current internationals. Opens the door for Zebo.

More seriously, which other non-internationals would be in contention?

the simmonds brothers in Exeter?

The Inbetween is mine · 14-04-2021 6:57pm

theVersatile wrote: »

I see McBryde mentioned that not all players being considered are necessarily current internationals. Opens the door for Zebo.

More seriously, which other non-internationals would be in contention?

Toner and his contemporaries in England, Scotland and Wales

aloooof · 14-04-2021 7:03pm

Lucas44 wrote: »

Good squad would bring slade over ringrose, more versatile and better imo (in form too).. reckon they’ll bring 7 back 3 players can see Elliot Daly going, offers a lot of versatility + huge boot especially at altitude.. maybe underhill instead of navidi seems to be going well with bath since he’s back and offers something different than the other 6/7s

I can see the value in bringing Daly considering his versatility, but imo, he’d be lucky to get in given the options available. He was England’s best player versus Ireland, but other than that he had an awful 6 Nations.

irishbucsfan · 15-04-2021 7:23am

theVersatile wrote: »

Opens the door for Zebo.

Haha!

Absolutely unreal. This is going to be a fun year.

Louis Friend · 15-04-2021 7:27am

theVersatile wrote: »

Opens the door for Zebo

Only if Rala is self-isolating and leaves the Lions in the lurch

Tigerandahalf · 15-04-2021 8:17am

Buer wrote: »

Also, I wouldn't be shocked if Manu Tuilagi is in the picture if he can play 3-4 games this season. Centre is a real problem position for them. They've a couple of stand out options and a gulf after that.

Chris Farrell has a very good chance of going given he can cover 12 and 13. Given the size of the Saffers he could well go.

I can't see Kelleher going. His lineout throwing has been suspect. Rob Herring should go instead of him. He has been quitely very effective for Ireland and a lot of Ireland's lineout success goes down to him. A big man too.

Cosmo Kramer · 15-04-2021 8:33am

I suspect, while they may be considered, in the end few if any players from outside the current international groups will be selected. Anyone hoping for Cooney or Chris Farrell or the likes to be picked will be disappointed I think. Especially with Townsend in the selection group batting for mediocre Scottish players at ever opportunity - Ali Price, Chris Harris, Zander Fagerson and the likes. The limited squad size will also work against less versatile players, especially in the back line. Keenan for example has done well but it's hard to see him travelling unless there are drop outs in his position.

unplayable · 15-04-2021 8:16pm

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

K Owens
J George
R Herring

M Vunipola
W Jones
R Sutherland

T Furlong
K Sinckler
A Porter

M Itoje
A W Jones
J Ryan
I Henderson

T Beirne
C J Stander
J Navidi
J Tipuric
H Watson
T Curry
T Faletau

C Murray
B Youngs
G Davies

J Sexton
D Biggar
O Farrell

R Henshaw
G Ringrose
G North
J Davies

L Rees-Zammit
J Adams
A Watson
J May

S Hogg
L Williams

Just throwing up my 36 man predicted squad for posterity. Very difficult to predict this year because some players might not want to travel in the circumstances. Also I think there may be more Scots with Townsend involved but it's hard to see who you would cut to fit them in.

Overall it looks a strong squad, although there is maybe a weakness in the front row outside of tight head, which might be a problem against South Africa.

agree with a lot of this.

i think the fact that townsend is backs coach gives van der merve a great chance of touring. hogg will go for sure. russell will miss out to the quality at outhalf. the back 3 has a few spots that could go either way. cant see daly or may going to be honest. townsend will want more than 1 scottish back and i think vdm will get the nod.

Buer · 15-04-2021 9:32pm

theVersatile wrote: »

I see McBryde mentioned that not all players being considered are necessarily current internationals. Opens the door for Zebo.

More seriously, which other non-internationals would be in contention?

Tuilagi and Marler would be the most likely ones that would come to mind. The coaching staff have already stated that they brought up Tuilagi in their first selection meeting.

Another one (and far more left field) would be George Kruis who is playing rugby, fully fit and was a test Lion on the last tour.

Buer · 15-04-2021 9:47pm

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Chris Farrell has a very good chance of going given he can cover 12 and 13. Given the size of the Saffers he could well go.

I can't see Kelleher going. His lineout throwing has been suspect. Rob Herring should go instead of him. He has been quitely very effective for Ireland and a lot of Ireland's lineout success goes down to him. A big man too.

I'd be utterly gobsmacked if Chris Farrell went. I'd be highly surprised if he was even in the 50-60 players that they've discussed.

I like him, he's a good player but he has gone backwards this season in terms of the pecking order. 12-18 months ago, there was very little between him and the starting options for Ireland. At this point, that gap has widened and Hume has significantly narrowed the gap behind him based on recent form.

Kelleher's line out throwing had some issues last year but there's been very little of it in 2021. His performance against Exeter was more indicative of where he's at currently with a 100% return. He can still improve there though overall. McBryde is the forwards coach also which is going to be a factor in discussion. He's reportedly already advocating for Kelleher's inclusion.

Herring might well go. He has been very consistent and reliable. Leads well from the front. Hooker is probably one of the most open positions. I think any 3 of 6 guys will go and I wouldn't have too many complaints about any of them.

RugbyLover123 · 15-04-2021 10:00pm

Not sure if Townsend taking the up the role of attack/backs is a great idea. What would the dynamic be between himself and the likes of Russell, Price, VDM etc who would be borderline calls but don’t get picked?

For this reason, I would say Russell is almost a cert to travel now. No way Townsend damages the relationship with his 10 by not picking him.

Buer · 15-04-2021 10:07pm

RugbyLover123 wrote: »

Not sure if Townsend taking the up the role of attack/backs is a great idea. What would the dynamic be between himself and the likes of Russell, Price, VDM etc who would be borderline calls but don’t get picked?

For this reason, I would say Russell is almost a cert to travel now. No way Townsend damages the relationship with his 10 by not picking him.

Pretty much. Tandy will be on board too as the defence coach. Scotland are going to have their biggest representation since 1993 when they had 8 players. Townsend was interviewed during the 6N and asked if he thought Russell could lead the Lions backline. He was effusive in his claims that he could do so excellently. He's not backing down from that now. He couldn't show his face in a Scottish camp again.

Right now, I'd say Russell, Price, VDM, Hogg, Watson, Sutherland, Fagerson, Gray and Ritchie all have a chance. I'd say 6 of those will travel.

AdamD · 15-04-2021 10:10pm

There isn't a hope in hell of Chris Farrell going on a Lions tour

Lions Tour

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