Are we there yet? Your second Travel Megathread (threadbans in OP}

Ray Donovan · 15-04-2021 08:00PM

Corholio wrote: »

It's not a vaccine passport, as has been said numerous times. The cert allows for 3 variables.

So why is Leo speaking in the manner I outlined above. Worrying.

Tenzor07 · 15-04-2021 08:01PM

saabsaab wrote: »

Of course only the fully vaccinated would get the vaccine passport and be allowed travel.

'What gives? Personally I feel he is trying to mislead the public into believing that only the fully vaccinated will be eligible for the cert.'

Hey, how are you going to stop De Variants when there's an open border with a soon to be fully reopened Northern Ireland?

Corholio · 15-04-2021 08:03PM

Ray Donovan wrote: »

So why is Leo speaking in the manner. I outlined above. Worrying.

I heard him say that alright, I doubt very, very much they'd get away with Ireland having their own vaccine passport. I think it's perhaps him bigging up the vaccine roll out i.e. most could be vaccinated by the time it's brought in. Honestly I take very little what Leo says as truth.

zebastein · 15-04-2021 08:04PM

Ray Donovan wrote: »

I think we really need to talk about Leo everyone. He has been on a few different media outlets today and he has referenced the EU Travel Cert on all occasions as a means to reopen travel. However, he immediately follows this by saying the cert will be a way to get the fully vaccinated travelling around the EU this Summer.

One example is the last 15 seconds of this.... https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1382604306889777152?s=21

Ok, if it happened once I might say it was a mistake or whatever, but it happened numerous times today?

What gives? Personally I feel he is trying to mislead the public into believing that only the fully vaccinated will be eligible for the cert.

Or are we looking at something more sinister and our geniuses are trying to use it with the caveat that only fully vaccinated people can get it?

Or am I just going mad?

I think that a lot of details are not ironed out regarding the EU cert, and that he mentions only the part that is sure, I.E. that vaccinated people will be able to fly.

The cert will most probably allow people with tests to fly, but i am not completely sure if the decision is final on how many tests will be needed and when.

That is a topic where Ireland will be mostly a follower to whatever is decided, so I am not sure that Leo is using this topic for his own agenda or is preparing the public to any specific decision.

Tenzor07 · 15-04-2021 08:13PM

Ray Donovan wrote: »

Leo.

zebastein wrote: »

Leo.

Isn't it great the way people refer to the Tanaiste Leo Varadkar by his first name as if he was their mate and not some dodgy politician that loves to give all these worthless media interviews which tease the public into the impression that our buddy "Leo" is going to give us back some of our freedoms...:D

Corholio · 15-04-2021 08:15PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Isn't it great the way people refer to the Tanaiste Leo Varadkar by his first name as if he was their mate and not some dodgy politician that loves to give all these worthless media interviews which tease the public into the impression that our buddy "Leo" is going to give us back some of our freedoms...:D

Isn't just cos Leo is shorter to type? I typed Leo and only criticised him.

Tenzor07 · 15-04-2021 08:17PM

Corholio wrote: »

Isn't just cos Leo is shorter to type? I typed Leo and only criticised him.

Not picking on anyone, just saying, funny how people refer to politicians by their first names as if they were our friend.....even worse when they are crooked like Varadkar...

caveat emptor · 15-04-2021 08:20PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Isn't it great the way people refer to the Tanaiste Leo Varadkar by his first name as if he was their mate and not some dodgy politician that loves to give all these worthless media interviews which tease the public into the impression that our buddy "Leo" is going to give us back some of our freedoms...:D

deja remember Bertie? First name basis with the whole country as we went straight into the iceberg.

scouserstation · 15-04-2021 08:21PM

zebastein wrote: »

I think that a lot of details are not ironed out regarding the EU cert, and that he mentions only the part that is sure, I.E. that vaccinated people will be able to fly.

The cert will most probably allow people with tests to fly, but i am not completely sure if the decision is final on how many tests will be needed and when.

That is a topic where Ireland will be mostly a follower to whatever is decided, so I am not sure that Leo is using this topic for his own agenda or is preparing the public to any specific decision.

It has now been as good as confirmed that people who have already had the vaccine will be given certain privileges over others, an article in the media today stating that vaccinated travellers will not require hotel quarantining from next week onwards

To say this is grossly unfair is an understatement, some might say it is a clear case of discrimination against those who have refused or not yet received the vaccine,

Then you have the issue of how you make this workable, for example if you have a family of four travelling where you have 2 parents vaccinated but not the children, what then?

Del Griffith · 15-04-2021 08:26PM

RedPaddyX wrote: »

Is saabsaab the new “Donald Trump” poster - aka Stephen Donnelly?!!

That's a horrible thing to say

Father Hernandez · 15-04-2021 08:26PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Not picking on anyone, just saying, funny how people refer to politicians by their first names as if they were our friend.....even worse when they are crooked like Varadkar...

Like Mehole.

zebastein · 15-04-2021 08:28PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Not picking on anyone, just saying, funny how people refer to politicians by their first names as if they were our friend.....even worse when they are crooked like Varadkar...

I am not going to spend too much time on this as it is off topic, but I think it has mostly to do with the fact that people use the part of the name that is convenient (short) and that identifies easily the person. On a football topic, you will see people referring to Cristiano Ronaldo as Cristiano. Nicolas Sarkozy was called Sarko by everyone in France (including critics) because Nicolas is too common. Mao Zedong was called Mao, and I am not sure people found him really friendly.

Tenzor07 · 15-04-2021 08:36PM

zebastein wrote: »

I am not going to spend too much time on this as it is off topic, but I think it has mostly to do with the fact that people use the part of the name that is convenient (short) and that identifies easily the person. On a football topic, you will see people referring to Cristiano Ronaldo as Cristiano. Nicolas Sarkozy was called Sarko by everyone in France (including critics) because Nicolas is too common. Mao Zedong was called Mao, and I am not sure people found him really friendly.

Or Kim Jong-Un as Kim, Vladimir Putin as Vlad... Leo Varadkar as Leo... :pac:

mmclo · 15-04-2021 09:10PM

caveat emptor wrote: »

deja remember Bertie? First name basis with the whole country as we went straight into the iceberg.

Enda, Charlie, Garrett, it's part of our political culture

Mr. Karate · 15-04-2021 09:17PM

scouserstation wrote: »

It has now been as good as confirmed that people who have already had the vaccine will be given certain privileges over others, an article in the media today stating that vaccinated travellers will not require hotel quarantining from next week onwards

To say this is grossly unfair is an understatement, some might say it is a clear case of discrimination against those who have refused or not yet received the vaccine,

Then you have the issue of how you make this workable, for example if you have a family of four travelling where you have 2 parents vaccinated but not the children, what then?

They're certainly setting themselves up for Civil Rights Violations lawsuits with all this talk.

saabsaab · 15-04-2021 09:19PM

Mr. Karate wrote: »

They're certainly setting themselves up for Civil Rights Violations lawsuits with all this talk.

Doubt it. Will be EU and perhaps international travel policy.

Ray Donovan · 15-04-2021 09:35PM

saabsaab wrote: »

Doubt it. Will be EU and perhaps international travel policy.

The EU Travel Cert literally has 3 criteria, and people have to meet 1 as to AVOID discrimination. Man, you are talking some nonsense, you know that ya?

faceman · 15-04-2021 09:59PM

caveat emptor wrote: »

Germany has largely dealt with it historically speaking. There are of course elements and the far right is on the rise everywhere.

Italy it's absolutely alive and kicking. Try live there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Italy

Let me get this straight. There are posters in this thread saying that “Italy [and France] are in no position to be lecturing us” and they have racism issues.

Ok.

Didn’t Ireland take the MHQ model from New Zealand and Australia? You know, 2 countries that have deep racism issues and deplorable treatment of the indigenous people?

We’re going to run out of straw before the week is out....

Creol1 · 15-04-2021 10:10PM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Not picking on anyone, just saying, funny how people refer to politicians by their first names as if they were our friend.....even worse when they are crooked like Varadkar...

It's something I always notice and it does seem to vary depending on who the politician is. Micheál Martin tends to be referred to by his full name, Leo Varadkar by his first, same (to a lesser extent) with Enda Kenny; Brian Cowen very much by his surname or full name; Bertie Ahern by first name obviously (well, actually, his middle name; his first name is Patrick).

zebastein wrote: »

I am not going to spend too much time on this as it is off topic, but I think it has mostly to do with the fact that people use the part of the name that is convenient (short) and that identifies easily the person. On a football topic, you will see people referring to Cristiano Ronaldo as Cristiano. Nicolas Sarkozy was called Sarko by everyone in France (including critics) because Nicolas is too common. Mao Zedong was called Mao, and I am not sure people found him really friendly.

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Or Kim Jong-Un as Kim, Vladimir Putin as Vlad... Leo Varadkar as Leo... :pac:

Mao and Kim are both surnames. The surname comes first in China and North Korea.

16-04-2021 12:03AM

mmclo wrote: »

So we've at least established that it is a regulation

Hmmm, EU law doesn't go in to holidays etc, Art 21 covers freedom of movement, our Constitution (by way of various referendums to amend it) and Van Gend en Loos 1954 set out the superiority of the treaties. This regulation is made under the relevant section of the treaties

I'm not really making claims, I have some involvement in the EU legislative procedure so just trying to explain it and interpret it in the light of these proposals, people can accept it or not

I find it hard to follow the rest of your points to be honest, I have said elsewhere that Ireland could still have strict restrictions under this regulation, others have a different view, that's how it works, I have quoted the sections of the regulation that support my view

Yes it is a proposal, that's the Commission fulfilling its role under the treaties. It is now going through the legislative process under the "ordinary procedure" where MEP's and the Council are co-legislators, not sure what your point is? This is how EU law works. MEP's are co-legislators with the Council (ministers) that's the current legal situation for about 85% of EU legislation

My point was very very simple. Ireland is not required to allow tourists in because MEPs say so. Freedom of movement doesn't cover it. We now agree on that.

I see now that it wasn't you that commented about the MEPs and this regulation already being passed. My bad on that

That was it, that's all.

16-04-2021 12:08AM

Mr. Karate wrote: »

They're certainly setting themselves up for Civil Rights Violations lawsuits with all this talk.

Nonsense. It's a plain medical decision not based on any of the 9 discrimination points.

16-04-2021 12:09AM

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Wonder what happened to the Garda investigation into Varadkar leaking state secrets to his friends, all swept under the carpet now... why would anyone listen to him?

Your legal knowledge continuous to impress.

The file will need to go to the dpp and they will then decide.

16-04-2021 12:12AM

jellies wrote: »

Meanwhile back in the real world Aer Lingus is running two flights a day tfrom Belfast to London. Go and try to book one. The prices will tell you something about how full they are. Hint: They are rammed. How many people that need to get home are transferring from other destinations. No idea, but I know what I would do.
There is also no testing on these flights as they are UK-UK, no antigen testing, no PVR testing. Nothing.
But somehow MHQ is going to keep variants out. Gimme a break.

Your entire argument basically falls within "sure if they are trying to bypass it via the border, give up".

There's nothing stopping the state from setting up checkpoints close to the border ya know

dalyboy · 16-04-2021 12:32AM

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Your entire argument basically falls within "sure if they are trying to bypass it via the border, give up".

There's nothing stopping the state from setting up checkpoints close to the border ya know

Do we have Garda manpower to service the 400 roads that access the northern border ?
What would the Gardai say to a driver once the country travel is permitted ?
What about people who work either side of the border ?
What about people who have family in the north ?

Hint . Check points would be a monumental waste of time and easily bypassed.
(Though saying that , with this governments recent history I wouldn’t put it past them to try this)

agoodpunt · 16-04-2021 02:22AM

NZ zero covid nonsence its to late its already in the country when I plan a return to Dublin it will be via Belfast

16-04-2021 03:22AM

faceman wrote: »

Let me get this straight. There are posters in this thread saying that “Italy [and France] are in no position to be lecturing us” and they have racism issues.

Exactly the same strategy is used by citizens in China who defend everything their government does whenever China is criticized by the west. This is the ilk who would inform on you, or join the Stasi, or accuse people of witchcraft, or turn in their Jewish neighbors, in certain settings.

caveat emptor · 16-04-2021 04:14AM

faceman wrote: »

Let me get this straight. There are posters in this thread saying that “Italy [and France] are in no position to be lecturing us” and they have racism issues.

Ok.

Didn’t Ireland take the MHQ model from New Zealand and Australia? You know, 2 countries that have deep racism issues and deplorable treatment of the indigenous people?

We’re going to run out of straw before the week is out....

Let me get this straight.

Because New Zealand and Australia have issues with racism we shouldn't do anything they do?

Let's kick out all of the American companies so. I hear they have some historical issues with race. Not to mention wiping out the indigenous peoples.

Del Griffith · 16-04-2021 04:37AM

Ryanair stating what's pretty obvious, Ireland getting left behind for investment in traffic links due to this shambles and lack of any plan.

https://www.newstalk.com/news/ireland-is-last-on-our-list-for-investment-ryanair-ceo-warns-1180488

caveat emptor · 16-04-2021 04:53AM

Del Griffith wrote: »

Ryanair stating what's pretty obvious, Ireland getting left behind for investment in traffic links due to this shambles and lack of any plan.

https://www.newstalk.com/news/ireland-is-last-on-our-list-for-investment-ryanair-ceo-warns-1180488

Well if Ryanair say so .........

From the company that brought us.

I'm sure people are still trying to get a refund. If you believe anything they say it's on you at this stage.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/transport-and-tourism/ryanair-jab-and-go-advertisement-falls-foul-of-watchdog-1.4465460

Ryanair ‘jab and go’ advertisement falls foul of watchdog
Advertising Standards Authority finds ad to be misleading, irresponsible and in poor taste

A Ryanair advertisement which encouraged viewers to book their Easter and summer holiday flights as “vaccines are coming” should not run in its current format again, a draft report by the Advertising Standards Authority for Ireland (ASAI) said.
The advertising watchdog received 59 complaints about the Ryanair ad, which opened with an image of a syringe alongside a bottle containing a label with the word “VACCINE”.
The text “VACCINES ARE COMING” was accompanied by Ryanair’s logo. The ad encouraged viewers to book their Easter and summer holidays with Ryanair, offering one million seats at reduced prices to sunshine destinations including Spain, Italy, Portugal and Greece.
“So vax and go,” the voiceover said, accompanied by images of young adults in their 20s and 30s swimming and having drinks.
Most of the complaints received by the ASAI challenged whether the advertising had the potential to mislead consumers, considering that there was no guarantee that they would be able to travel by Easter 2021, according to the draft report.

Del Griffith · 16-04-2021 05:05AM

caveat emptor wrote: »

Well if Ryanair say so .........

From the company that brought us.

I'm sure people are still trying to get a refund. If you believe anything they say it's on you at this stage.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/transport-and-tourism/ryanair-jab-and-go-advertisement-falls-foul-of-watchdog-1.4465460

What's the connection between their ad and the fact that Ireland is being left behind for travel link investment?

And ironically 'Jab and go' is what Leo Varadkar is now suggesting by the sounds of it.

Are we there yet? Your second Travel Megathread (threadbans in OP}

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