Are we there yet? Your second Travel Megathread (threadbans in OP}

Golfman64 · 08-04-2021 02:34PM

themacattack. wrote: »

anyone that thinks this is acceptable and is actually stopping covid varients getting in the country needs their heads examined.....irish government should be ashamed of themselves

A complete and utter joke. I am so ashamed to be Irish at the moment. Somethings needs to change to remove these incompetent eejits from office before our country is destroyed for the longer term.

08-04-2021 02:35PM

Corholio wrote: »

I think it is now €2000, came in officially a few days ago I believe.

Comes in on 12th april
Satutory instrument 158/2021

Wallander · 08-04-2021 02:38PM

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

You would be better off spending your time reading what your freedom of travel actually entitles you to and the limits that a country can place on them

Next up prove that you have been denied the right to move to another country.

Good luck with that

Thanks for advice but I'm very prepared to argue my rights and allow for the relevant authorities to decide how to enforce them. The EU Commission has already threatened six countries with legal action this year over travel restrictions, it's hard to see how Ireland's 2k per person charge on entry for quarantine doesn't obstruct freedom of travel:

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-border-restrictions-coronavirus-brussels-versus-capitals/

Ray Donovan · 08-04-2021 02:38PM

dalyboy wrote: »

There’s a “don’t fly nonessential” at the moment in the north and UK however ...
It’s an ever evolving situation in the north at the moment ie they’re yet to confirm their international travel plans for this summer but there’s no way in hell they’re going to follow us into tourist industry oblivion.

I guess they’re awaiting bojos confirmation next week which is suggesting a traffic light system akin to the Euro system.

I’d be waiting 4-6 weeks to book via Belfast at this point just to affirm a confident realistic holiday option.

Yes they’re saying Green countries will be no quarantine at home when you return. But quarantine at home if amber or red. So if quarantine at home was not a problem then travel to amber or red countries from Belfast is still very feasible and is without the threat of a fine is how I currently read it.

Dr. Em · 08-04-2021 02:56PM

dalyboy wrote: »

There’s a “don’t fly nonessential” at the moment in the north and UK however ...
It’s an ever evolving situation in the north at the moment ie they’re yet to confirm their international travel plans for this summer but there’s no way in hell they’re going to follow us into tourist industry oblivion.

I guess they’re awaiting bojos confirmation next week which is suggesting a traffic light system akin to the Euro system.

I’d be waiting 4-6 weeks to book via Belfast at this point just to affirm a confident realistic holiday option.

The only place you can go from Belfast at the moment is the rest of the UK, judging by the current departures. If you fly out of the UK for nonessential travel you can be fined 5000 pounds. If are flying back, even transiting through Heathrow on the way to Belfast, you are subject to mandatory hotel quarantine from redlist countries and all other quarantine regulations. They are far more strict and are not messing. This 'opening up' they talk about is likely to require testing even from green list destinations. If their traffic light system is anything like the current EU system, practically no country in Europe will be green. Going through Belfast is a fantasy.

08-04-2021 03:00PM

Dr. Em wrote: »

The only place you can go from Belfast at the moment is the rest of the UK, judging by the current departures. If you fly out of the UK for nonessential travel you can be fined 5000 pounds. If are flying back, even transiting through Heathrow on the way to Belfast, you are subject to mandatory hotel quarantine from redlist countries and all other quarantine regulations. They are far more strict and are not messing. This 'opening up' they talk about is likely to require testing even from green list destinations. If their traffic light system is anything like the current EU system, practically no country in Europe will be green. Going through Belfast is a fantasy.

Boris has already said that unencumbered travel to the USA is likely to in place before the EU. To the extent that the travel sections in the Sunday paper was leading with USA travel articles

Dr. Em · 08-04-2021 03:03PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Boris has already said that unencumbered travel to the USA is likely to in place before the EU. To the extent that the travel sections in the Sunday paper was leading with USA travel articles

Fair enough, they might open up to the US. I expect there will be 101 catches though - only on certain days of the week to those vaccinated who stand on one leg, etc. I'm sure the airlines want to put the most positive spin on it.

Ray Donovan · 08-04-2021 03:31PM

Dr. Em wrote: »

The only place you can go from Belfast at the moment is the rest of the UK, judging by the current departures. If you fly out of the UK for nonessential travel you can be fined 5000 pounds. If are flying back, even transiting through Heathrow on the way to Belfast, you are subject to mandatory hotel quarantine from redlist countries and all other quarantine regulations. They are far more strict and are not messing. This 'opening up' they talk about is likely to require testing even from green list destinations. If their traffic light system is anything like the current EU system, practically no country in Europe will be green. Going through Belfast is a fantasy.

The Summer is what I’m talking about. There’s loads of flights scheduled out of Belfast for holiday destinations in the EU?

So hypothetically I fly to and come back from a red list country into Belfast whats the story likely to be. Fill in my passenger locator form and quarantine at home? If so, thats all good with me.

Chuck Norris 2021 · 08-04-2021 03:33PM

Golfman64 wrote: »

A complete and utter joke. I am so ashamed to be Irish at the moment. Somethings needs to change to remove these incompetent eejits from office before our country is destroyed for the longer term.

I was born and raised FF, and to be honest, the only thing that would make me vote for them in the next election is to keep SF out! At least they're not in power, they think the world is flat and that we'll fall off the edge if we stray past Belfast :pac:

Dr. Em · 08-04-2021 03:38PM

Ray Donovan wrote: »

The Summer is what I’m talking about. There’s loads of flights scheduled out of Belfast for holiday destinations in the EU?

So hypothetically I fly to and come back from a red list country into Belfast whats the story likely to be. Fill in my passenger locator form and quarantine at home? If so, thats all good with me.

They won't have any direct flights from red-list countries to Belfast. They will only have red-list flights to 5 airports in England as long as they have mandatory hotel quarantine from redlist countries, even if you are only transiting.

Quote/ If you are travelling back to Northern Ireland from a country outside the Common Travel Area, via Great Britain or the Republic of Ireland, even if this is just to change flights in an airport, you must follow any requirements that have been introduced for that country. You should be aware that this may include mandatory hotel quarantine and testing in that country. /unquote
https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/coronavirus-covid-19-international-travel-advice

And all those flights to EU holiday spots from Belfast? If the rules don't change to allow easy travel before then, they might just fly empty. One of my flights did that in Jan.

Chuck Norris 2021 · 08-04-2021 03:39PM

Ray Donovan wrote: »

The Summer is what I’m talking about. There’s loads of flights scheduled out of Belfast for holiday destinations in the EU?

So hypothetically I fly to and come back from a red list country into Belfast whats the story likely to be. Fill in my passenger locator form and quarantine at home? If so, thats all good with me.

They may force people into hotels up there, or share your information with our own gestapo (the Dept of health - not the Gardai, they're doing their best to be fair). From what the all knowing egg said earlier, if someone flies into NI they should have quarantine booked. You watch and wait, they'll announce a €2500 fine and/or 6 months prison for anyone trying to enter through NI. They'll have the curtain twitches posting all over twitter about the dodgers. On the other hand, entry from green/amber countries may slip under the radar if we're 100% MHQ.

BobbyBolivia · 08-04-2021 03:49PM

Chuck Norris 2021 wrote: »

They may force people into hotels up there, or share your information with our own gestapo (the Dept of health - not the Gardai, they're doing their best to be fair). From what the all knowing egg said earlier, if someone flies into NI they should have quarantine booked. You watch and wait, they'll announce a €2500 fine and/or 6 months prison for anyone trying to enter through NI. They'll have the curtain twitches posting all over twitter about the dodgers. On the other hand, entry from green/amber countries may slip under the radar if we're 100% MHQ.

They cant do this, it would violate the terms of the good friday agreement.

Especially in light of an increase in tensions as a result of Brexit. There will be absolute freedom of movement from north to south, regardless of what anybody in government think.

All that matters for us in the Republic is being able to get to Belfast without being fined, and the countries on the UKs green list or any travel corridors they might set up. Once they allow travel again you arent going to need to isolate returning home from a green list country if vaccinated already. So just drive home from Belfast.

I wouldnt take notice about Donnellys comments regarding NI quarantine hotels. Unenforceable, pie in the sky stuff. It's the same situation as last summer when they told people dont travel, but here is a green list, but dont use it, but we arent officially telling you not to travel, but dont travel.

Gael23 · 08-04-2021 03:49PM

Chuck Norris 2021 wrote: »

They may force people into hotels up there, or share your information with our own gestapo (the Dept of health - not the Gardai, they're doing their best to be fair). From what the all knowing egg said earlier, if someone flies into NI they should have quarantine booked. You watch and wait, they'll announce a €2500 fine and/or 6 months prison for anyone trying to enter through NI. They'll have the curtain twitches posting all over twitter about the dodgers. On the other hand, entry from green/amber countries may slip under the radar if we're 100% MHQ.

Don’t think they can legally do that

Chuck Norris 2021 · 08-04-2021 03:52PM

BobbyBolivia wrote: »

They cant do this, it would violate the terms of the good friday agreement.

Especially in light of an increase in tensions as a result of Brexit. There will be absolute freedom of movement from north to south, regardless of what anybody in government think.

All that matters for us in the Republic is being able to get to Belfast without being fined, and the countries on the UKs green list or any travel corridors they might set up. Once they allow travel again you arent going to need to isolate returning home from a green list country if vaccinated already. So just drive home from Belfast.

I wouldnt take notice about Donnellys comments regarding NI quarantine hotels. Unenforceable, pie in the sky stuff. It's the same situation as last summer when they told people dont travel, but here is a green list, but dont use it, but we arent officially telling you not to travel, but dont travel.

Could they share passenger information with the south? I know it's unlikely to happen as they'd end up messing it up?

dalyboy · 08-04-2021 03:57PM

Dr. Em wrote: »

The only place you can go from Belfast at the moment is the rest of the UK, judging by the current departures. If you fly out of the UK for nonessential travel you can be fined 5000 pounds. If are flying back, even transiting through Heathrow on the way to Belfast, you are subject to mandatory hotel quarantine from redlist countries and all other quarantine regulations. They are far more strict and are not messing. This 'opening up' they talk about is likely to require testing even from green list destinations. If their traffic light system is anything like the current EU system, practically no country in Europe will be green. Going through Belfast is a fantasy.

Thanks. Yes. That’s why I said it’s evolving. The 5k fine is under the “don’t travel nonessential” at the moment but will that be happening in June or July when they’ve selected their traffic light system. No. It’ll be rightly binned as they’ll be nearly fully vaccinated in the UK

Belfast option is a long way from a “fantasy”
If it’s only a test that’s required to produce upon landing back in Belfast then away we go. Hell of a lot better than landing in Dublin with a 2 week hotel imprisonment and €2000 down. (And that’s even if you are fully vaccinated.. WTF are the Irish government thinking)

Btw I’m not saying you shouldn’t be quarantine in your home when you get back to your house post holiday. PCR after 5 days is not unreasonable imo and I for one will not live under the baying mob rule which seems to be dictating our latest travel restrictions in Ireland. Not if there’s a feasible way around it.

BobbyBolivia · 08-04-2021 03:58PM

Dr. Em wrote: »

They won't have any direct flights from red-list countries to Belfast. They will only have red-list flights to 5 airports in England as long as they have mandatory hotel quarantine from redlist countries, even if you are only transiting.

Quote/ If you are travelling back to Northern Ireland from a country outside the Common Travel Area, via Great Britain or the Republic of Ireland, even if this is just to change flights in an airport, you must follow any requirements that have been introduced for that country. You should be aware that this may include mandatory hotel quarantine and testing in that country. /unquote
https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/coronavirus-covid-19-international-travel-advice

And all those flights to EU holiday spots from Belfast? If the rules don't change to allow easy travel before then, they might just fly empty. One of my flights did that in Jan.

I wouldnt recommend anybody book anything for a while yet. The play here is to wait and see what happens with the UK travel policy over the next month or two or three, see when you are getting your jab, and be prepared to book/go at short notice. This is not the type of thing to be gambling with bookings months in advance for.

The UK are introducing a green list at some point, and they are also likely to be interested in travel corridors with the likes of the USA. We know this. We also know that as Irish people, we are subject to the same rules as them regarding travel, so if a UK vaccinated person can return from a green list or corridor country and not isolate, that's all we need.

If I manage to get further than the UK later in the year it will be after vaccination, probably on a flight I have booked just days before.

I realise that families and people who need to apply for leave months in advance will find this very difficult but this is the only way I see the Belfast option working seamlessly.

BobbyBolivia · 08-04-2021 04:01PM

Chuck Norris 2021 wrote: »

Could they share passenger information with the south? I know it's unlikely to happen as they'd end up messing it up?

I dont see that happening in any universe. Too many legal questions there. Anyway, if it did it just adds another day of travel as you will fly into a different UK airport and get the Stena Line from Liverpool to Belfast. 8 hour overnight trip.

JDD · 08-04-2021 04:01PM

If hospitality is going to be opened in June (even if its only self catering) that will mean you can travel to anywhere in the country, including across the border. If you travel across the border, you can absolutely fly out anywhere you like from Belfast. As long as Belfast has flights going to say, Greece, you can fly out, fly back and drive back down to Dublin. Belfast isn't going to bring in quarantine hotels and you won't be stopped on the way back down. And there's no way the authorities in the North will start giving Irish passport numbers to authorities in the South, because half of NI citizens travel on Irish passports.

Red Silurian · 08-04-2021 04:02PM

BobbyBolivia wrote: »

I wouldnt recommend anybody book anything for a while yet. The play here is to wait and see what happens with the UK travel policy over the next month or two or three, see when you are getting your jab, and be prepared to book/go at short notice. This is not the type of thing to be gambling with bookings months in advance for.

The UK are introducing a green list at some point, and they are also likely to be interested in travel corridors with the likes of the USA. We know this. We also know that as Irish people, we are subject to the same rules as them regarding travel, so if a UK vaccinated person can return from a green list or corridor country and not isolate, that's all we need.

If I manage to get further than the UK later in the year it will be after vaccination, probably on a flight I have booked just days before.

I realise that families and people who need to apply for leave months in advance will find this very difficult but this is the only way I see the Belfast option working seamlessly.

I disagree I see a lot of the Greek islands targeting 100% vaccination, could be a good year for the a holiday in that neck of the world, especially if you are vaccinated yourself

Like yourself I have family in the UK that I haven't seen in 12 months so it would be high on my list also

08-04-2021 04:03PM

Wallander wrote: »

Thanks for advice but I'm very prepared to argue my rights and allow for the relevant authorities to decide how to enforce them. The EU Commission has already threatened six countries with legal action this year over travel restrictions, it's hard to see how Ireland's 2k per person charge on entry for quarantine doesn't obstruct freedom of travel:

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-border-restrictions-coronavirus-brussels-versus-capitals/

Did you read that article? The people you want to assist you recommend quarantine.

"Commission Vice President Maroš Šefčovič told the press conference.

He said EU countries should avoid “blanket travel bans” for citizens — such as the one currently enforced by Belgium — and said that countries should instead opt for targeted measures: “Mandatory quarantine is an effective tool to discourage touristic travel, if properly enforced.”

Add in that he also admits there's no set rule again border restrictions and that each country can restrict entry, I'm baffled how you think this will work

Also see in your original link the party that states individual cases must start in local courts and they don't fight them.

But hey, it's your time and in level 5, there's plenty of it.

dalyboy wrote: »

But even if they check your passport it wouldn’t show up the prior trip.
That tech doesn’t exist yet on our passports.

as has been said a dozen times before by multiple users, you have boarding cards when you travel. You scan them when you travel. Travel information is shared within Europe and certain third party countries.

So the system is there. The resources and time being out put into tracking however, is unlikely.

Chuck Norris 2021 wrote: »

He needs to look beyond the Irish courts. I'm starting to wonder if organised lobbying of our MEPs would yield anything?

You can't bypass the Irish courts like that. European courts won't entertain you until you have exhausted local systems.

08-04-2021 04:04PM

BobbyBolivia wrote: »

I dont see that happening in any universe. Too many legal questions there. Anyway, if it did it just adds another day of travel as you will fly into a different UK airport and get the Stena Line from Liverpool to Belfast. 8 hour overnight trip.

It's been happening for years. There's multiple cross border agreements.

BobbyBolivia · 08-04-2021 04:06PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

I disagree I see a lot of the Greek islands targeting 100% vaccination, could be a good year for the a holiday in that neck of the world, especially if you are vaccinated yourself

Like yourself I have family in the UK that I haven't seen in 12 months so it would be high on my list also

If you were only going as far as the UK you could pretty much do that as soon as they remove the county travel restrictions. Irish people dont have to isolate on arrival even right now.

I know I'll be going over myself (just to the UK) many times in the 2nd half of this year. I have season tickets for a premier league team who are gearing up for a full return of fans,.

Dr. Em · 08-04-2021 04:11PM

dalyboy wrote: »

Thanks. Yes. That’s why I said it’s evolving. The 5k fine is under the “don’t travel nonessential” at the moment but will that be happening in June or July when they’ve selected their traffic light system. No. It’ll be rightly binned as they’ll be nearly fully vaccinated in the UK

Belfast option is a long way from a “fantasy”
If it’s only a test that’s required to produce upon landing back in Belfast then away we go. Hell of a lot better than landing in Dublin with a 2 week hotel imprisonment and €2000 down. (And that’s even if you are fully vaccinated.. WTF are the Irish government thinking)

Btw I’m not saying you shouldn’t be quarantine in your home when you get back to your house post holiday. PCR after 5 days is not unreasonable imo and I for one will not live under the baying mob rule which seems to be dictating our latest travel restrictions in Ireland. Not if there’s a feasible way around it.

Yes, you are right that it is an evolving situation, and I don't know where the debacle with MHQ is going to end up. It is like they are windmilling without a plan.
But everyone is going to be massively disappointed with whatever travel plan the UK unveils. With the current virus surge all across Europe, and now they are talking about a new surge in the US, any reopening of travel, even through the UK is most likely going to happen much later than advertised, and probably be more limited and more expensive than expected.

dalyboy · 08-04-2021 04:21PM

Dr. Em wrote: »

I agree with most of that, but I think everyone is going to be massively disappointed with whatever travel plan the UK unveils. With the current virus surge all across Europe, and now they are talking about a new surge in the US, any reopening of travel, even through the UK is most likely going to happen much later than advertised, and probably be more limited and more expensive than expected.

Yeah , true the rising cases in France and Spain (the usual travel destinations) have raised eyebrows in regards to travel desirability.

Only thing that has me positive on that front is that this time last year those 2 countries had huge infection numbers however they managed to bring them way down come June to the extent that they were in position to open to travellers.

This could naturally repeat itself with lowered infection numbers (and this is before we account for bonus reduction associated with vaccine rollout)

It’s up in the air atm and I certainly would be awaiting 6-8 weeks before booking anything.

Dr. Em · 08-04-2021 04:24PM

dalyboy wrote: »

Yeah , true the rising cases in France and Spain (the usual travel destinations) have raised eyebrows in regards to travel desirability.

Only thing that has me positive on that front is that this time last year those 2 countries had huge infection numbers however they managed to bring them way down come June to the extent that they were in position to open to travellers.

This could naturally repeat itself with lowered infection numbers (and this is before we account for bonus reduction associated with vaccine rollout)

It’s up in the air atm and I certainly would be awaiting 6-8 weeks before booking anything.

We can hope cases come down everywhere quickly. I would be very glad to eat my every pessimistic word!

Red Silurian · 08-04-2021 04:24PM

BobbyBolivia wrote: »

If you were only going as far as the UK you could pretty much do that as soon as they remove the county travel restrictions. Irish people dont have to isolate on arrival even right now.

I know I'll be going over myself (just to the UK) many times in the 2nd half of this year. I have season tickets for a premier league team who are gearing up for a full return of fans,.

You might be right and to be fair there is likely to be very low rates of disease in the UK by the time I'm looking to go over (you too most likely)

My only worry would be that we will probably need a negative PCR test 3 days pre-departure... What happens if it's a positive?

Red Silurian · 08-04-2021 04:27PM

dalyboy wrote: »

Yeah , true the rising cases in France and Spain (the usual travel destinations) have raised eyebrows in regards to travel desirability.

Only thing that has me positive on that front is that this time last year those 2 countries had huge infection numbers however they managed to bring them way down come June to the extent that they were in position to open to travellers.

This could naturally repeat itself with lowered infection numbers (and this is before we account for bonus reduction associated with vaccine rollout)

It’s up in the air atm and I certainly would be awaiting 6-8 weeks before booking anything.

The thing is that this year there will be locations potentially like Gibraltar, Florida, Greek Islands and even south UK that will have much lower risk than France or Spain of contracting the disease

Father Hernandez · 08-04-2021 04:27PM

naughtysmurf wrote: »

A fully vaccinated lady from Israel with negative PCR test who arrived in Dublin via Germany today to work whisked off to the Holiday Inn express to do her quarantine by the army, while others traveling on the same flight go about their business, you really couldn’t make this stuff up, great little country all the same, she was on Liveline

This is utter lunacy.

Dr. Em · 08-04-2021 04:27PM

Red Silurian wrote: »

You might be right and to be fair there is likely to be very low rates of disease in the UK by the time I'm looking to go over (you too most likely)

My only worry would be that we will probably need a negative PCR test 3 days pre-departure... What happens if it's a positive?

You would have to stay home and self-isolate. Most airlines have waived change fees, but some of them dictate that the changes have to be made 2-3 days before flying. I don't know if they would charge a fee in that case.

Chuck Norris 2021 · 08-04-2021 04:28PM

dalyboy wrote: »

Yeah , true the rising cases in France and Spain (the usual travel destinations) have raised eyebrows in regards to travel desirability.

Only thing that has me positive on that front is that this time last year those 2 countries had huge infection numbers however they managed to bring them way down come June to the extent that they were in position to open to travellers.

This could naturally repeat itself with lowered infection numbers (and this is before we account for bonus reduction associated with vaccine rollout)

It’s up in the air atm and I certainly would be awaiting 6-8 weeks before booking anything.

Very good point. Italy went from complete carnage to green list last year in a similar timeline to where we are now. It'll take a lot of vaccination though as this current variants are much more transmittable.

Which brings us to the next problem. NPHET will still be chasing variants. I think that's the most stressful part of all this, not know what they'll invent next.

Are we there yet? Your second Travel Megathread (threadbans in OP}

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