COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

04-04-2021 12:50PM

charlie14 wrote: »

I would have no problem with attempting to educate that 15%, but I would most definitely draw the line at offering them "free" goodies at taxpayers expense to avail of a vaccine that is also being provided "free" of charge at taxpayers expense.

If for whatever reason they do not wish to avail of a vaccine that is for the benefit of the rest of population, then they should be made very much aware that the benefits the rest of the population will gain from being vaccinated will not be extended to them or the 6% who say they will refuse to avail of the vaccine, other than from them having up to date negative test results.

So coercion in other words.

Tyrone212 · 04-04-2021 12:53PM

Del Griffith wrote: »

How is the attached possible, assuming the EU distribute vaccines per capita?

Excluding Malta. Some countries within it ordered more AstraZeneca than the others as it was cheaper so they will have a lower % vaccinated. I read recently the initial deal was held up due to the Polish government complaining about the price as well.

Chris_5339762 · 04-04-2021 12:53PM

irishlad. wrote: »

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cUZy6AMCwuA2zhtRuKK7cqMVgmhdDsGsZrFWJTkw9DY/edit#gid=502588836

Half of all over 70's have now got their first dose

And still not my parents, sadly.

No vaccine supply at my GP apparently next week, MAYBE the week after, and they are still clearing up 75+ year olds with no dates available on when they'll start with the 70+ year olds.

First dose by 12th April is a pipe dream.

04-04-2021 12:56PM

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

Percentage of people born outside Ireland is actually higher here than same percentage in uk of people born outside uk, we don’t notice as here migrants integrate and don’t ghettoise like uk with its caste like society

People born outside Ireland can be Irish. They are not all immigrants

Wolf359f · 04-04-2021 01:02PM

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

And still not my parents, sadly.

No vaccine supply at my GP apparently next week, MAYBE the week after, and they are still clearing up 75+ year olds with no dates available on when they'll start with the 70+ year olds.

First dose by 12th April is a pipe dream.

Same here. Local GP has had 1 vaccination day 3 weeks ago. Nothing since. I know there would be snags with some GP's with deliveries etc... Just fustrating when it's your own parents waiting. Surely if some GP's haven't gotten deliveries or can't cope with being able to vaccinate, they should be able to refer their patients to other clinics/MVC to be done.

charlie14 · 04-04-2021 01:06PM

hmmm wrote: »

I can't see any moral justification for adhering to restrictions once everyone has been offered a vaccine and has received one, but there is the practical problem of a large unvaccinated group filling up our hospitals.

Other countries are in intensive discussions about vaccine passports as a means of reducing the risk from unvaccinated people, but I don't find much discussion in Ireland. This is like the vaccines all over again - vaccine passports are more-than-likely inevitable, it's not acceptable for the government to wait until June/July to start considering this. They should be doing this now.

Totally agree. Vaccine passports are more-than-likely inevitable and the state should be providing them to those fully vaccinated asap along with information as to their benefits, as well as their requirements, when we start opening up.

leahyl · 04-04-2021 01:11PM

Wolf359f wrote: »

Same here. Local GP has had 1 vaccination day 3 weeks ago. Nothing since. I know there would be snags with some GP's with deliveries etc... Just fustrating when it's your own parents waiting. Surely if some GP's haven't gotten deliveries or can't cope with being able to vaccinate, they should be able to refer their patients to other clinics/MVC to be done.

Same with my mum - still hasn’t heard anything. She was onto her doctor the other day about something else and just mentioned it in passing and they just said they’d ring her. They are administering vaccines, cos I know of at least 2 people in lates 70s and early 80s who have had one or two doses from same practice. Then apparently a neighbour of ours who goes to the same GP has had their appt cancelled 3 times - that can’t be right? She’s around the same age as my mum too.

charlie14 · 04-04-2021 01:16PM

Deleted User wrote: »

So coercion in other words.

No more coercive than the requirement to pass a driving test before being allowed drive on public roads.
Less so in fact in that those refusing to avail of a free vaccination could still do so without endangering others by having an up to date negative test result at their own expense.

TheDoctor · 04-04-2021 01:19PM

Do we have a final figure for Q1?

irishlad. · 04-04-2021 01:22PM

TheDoctor wrote: »

Do we have a final figure for Q1?

No, will be sometime next week when they say what deliveries we got in week 13

Approximately 1.1m though

Wolf359f · 04-04-2021 01:26PM

leahyl wrote: »

Same with my mum - still hasn’t heard anything. She was onto her doctor the other day about something else and just mentioned it in passing and they just said they’d ring her. They are administering vaccines, cos I know of at least 2 people in lates 70s and early 80s who have had one or two doses from same practice. Then apparently a neighbour of ours who goes to the same GP has had their appt cancelled 3 times - that can’t be right? She’s around the same age as my mum too.

Sounds definitely a supply issue. Here's hoping with Pfizer delivering nearly double a week from now on, those 70+ will at least get a date. I understand it's hard for GP's to give date when delivers may not be reliable.
That has to change with the increased Pfizer deliveries.

Strazdas · 04-04-2021 01:38PM

Paul Reid said on R1 just now that when you register with the online portal (later this month), you will very soon after have confirmation of the vaccination date and the place you will receive it.

JTMan · 04-04-2021 01:49PM

charlie14 wrote: »

I would have no problem with attempting to educate that 15%, but I would most definitely draw the line at offering them "free" goodies at taxpayers expense to avail of a vaccine that is also being provided "free" of charge at taxpayers expense.

The state does not need to provide the incentives. It simply has to allow it occur. Once we have vaccinated the aprox. 77% who want the vaccine, and numbers attending vaccine centres start to level off, local businesses might choose to give free donuts or pizzas etc to those who show up. This has happened in Israel and the US. Free publicity for the business. Krispy Kreme have got a lot of publicity out of this in the US. Might sounds crazy but if we are to get to herd immunity every percentage vaccinated counts and freebies like this will get a certain portion of the aprox. 15% who 'could not be bothered' or are 'not sure' out for a vaccine.

Obviously that's the carrot and the other incentive is the stick whereby people will not be allowed in very large gatherings like stadiums and concerts without a vaccine passport.

hmmm wrote: »

Other countries are in intensive discussions about vaccine passports as a means of reducing the risk from unvaccinated people, but I don't find much discussion in Ireland. This is like the vaccines all over again - vaccine passports are more-than-likely inevitable, it's not acceptable for the government to wait until June/July to start considering this. They should be doing this now.

100%. We seem to be constantly slow to have foresight about what is going to happen next. The government should engage with good app developers now on a passport. The government should also be engaging in active advanced planning now with how they will manage vaccines for children, contingency planning for boosters this Autumn and planning for how international travel will resume. Stay one step ahead.

04-04-2021 01:57PM

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

Beside being Irish they can be a minority, I didn’t say anything about citizenship

My point still stands as per last census we do have more non “natives” as percentage of population than uk, we also don’t have ghettos as you can see in parts of uk

I didnt say anything about citizenship either. most people I know who were 'foreign born' are completely Irish.

TheDoctor · 04-04-2021 02:00PM

Strazdas wrote: »

Paul Reid said on R1 just now that when you register with the online portal (later this month), you will very soon after have confirmation of the vaccination date and the place you will receive it.

Well I shall be on it day 1 but will be stunned if it doesn’t crash!

stephenjmcd · 04-04-2021 02:03PM

TheDoctor wrote: »

Well I shall be on it day 1 but will be stunned if it doesn’t crash!

Course it will. Happens with even the biggest websites when you get a large volume trying to log in at one go which is why people will need to be told they've a few days to register and can also register by phone.

The revenue site was slow and crashing for a day or two when everyone was trying to log in to see what their tax liability was for PUP after Christmas. It happens, a bit of patience will be needed and not everyone trying to log in at the exact same time. Likewise if someone isn't entitled to log in to register yet they should stay clear and not hog up resources

irishlad. · 04-04-2021 02:06PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Course it will. Happens with even the biggest websites when you get a large volume trying to log in at one go which is why people will need to be told they've a few days to register and can also register by phone.

The revenue site was slow and crashing for a day or two when everyone was trying to log in to see what their tax liability was for PUP after Christmas. It happens, a bit of patience will be needed and not everyone trying to log in at the exact same time. Likewise if someone isn't entitled to log in to register yet they should stay clear and not hog up resources

You could start a bingo card for when it does crash, we will definitely hear it being called a:

SHAMBLES :pac:

Cushtie · 04-04-2021 02:08PM

Suppose they could allocate the slots based on DOB..... At least initially. Not how soon you register. Make the public aware of that. No point in hammering the F5 key the morning it goes live.

Happydays2020 · 04-04-2021 02:12PM

Cushtie wrote: »

Suppose they could allocate the slots based on DOB..... At least initially. Not how soon you register. Make the public aware of that. No point in hammering the F5 key the morning it goes live.

Well at least there will not be a friends of HSE early registration issue

Tippbhoy1 · 04-04-2021 02:15PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Course it will. Happens with even the biggest websites when you get a large volume trying to log in at one go which is why people will need to be told they've a few days to register and can also register by phone.

The revenue site was slow and crashing for a day or two when everyone was trying to log in to see what their tax liability was for PUP after Christmas. It happens, a bit of patience will be needed and not everyone trying to log in at the exact same time. Likewise if someone isn't entitled to log in to register yet they should stay clear and not hog up resources

We are a population of less than 5million. In this day and age it actually is possible to create a robust system that will handle that volume easily. IT systems wouldn’t be the government forte however.

iamwhoiam · 04-04-2021 02:18PM

As far as I recall they said certain groups will be asked to register . So first the 65-70 will be asked and then the next group etc

04-04-2021 02:25PM

charlie14 wrote: »

No more coercive than the requirement to pass a driving test before being allowed drive on public roads.
Less so in fact in that those refusing to avail of a free vaccination could still do so without endangering others by having an up to date negative test result at their own expense.

I just think it's a potentially very dangerous road to go down. Our ancient liberties contingent on displaying an app to do everyday activities and to take part in society. There is also the potential for it to morph into a social credit system.

I find what's going on in Israel to be horrifying. A two-tiered society. Seats in restaurants for the vaccinated only, the unvaccinated cut off from society. Once the government can coerce people into taking a medical treatment the people cease to be free.

Once there is sufficient herd immunity in the population then normal life should resume. No coercion, no threats of exclusion from activities and public places. I would have no problem with vaccination being required for international travel. That's the case already for yellow fever, for example.

Stheno · 04-04-2021 02:28PM

Tippbhoy1 wrote: »

We are a population of less than 5million. In this day and age it actually is possible to create a robust system that will handle that volume easily. IT systems wouldn’t be the government forte however.

Iirc Amazon offered to provide cloud resources if needed

Exactly what would be useful to handle a surge in capacity

timsey tiger · 04-04-2021 02:59PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I just think it's a potentially very dangerous road to go down. Our ancient liberties contingent on displaying an app to do everyday activities and to take part in society. There is also the potential for it to morph into a social credit system.

I find what's going on in Israel to be horrifying. A two-tiered society. Seats in restaurants for the vaccinated only, the unvaccinated cut off from society. Once the government can coerce people into taking a medical treatment the people cease to be free.

Once there is sufficient herd immunity in the population then normal life should resume. No coercion, no threats of exclusion from activities and public places. I would have no problem with vaccination being required for international travel. That's the case already for yellow fever, for example.

Can you really be part of a society, if you are unwilling to do something to protect others in that society?

Turtwig · 04-04-2021 03:05PM

timsey tiger wrote: »

Can you really be part of a society, if you are unwilling to do something to protect others in that society?

Israel's vaccination programme has been heavily segregated. Not everyone will be offered a vaccine.

Van.Bosch · 04-04-2021 03:17PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

As far as I recall they said certain groups will be asked to register . So first the 65-70 will be asked and then the next group etc

So it’s going to be opened up, people register and then it allocated you a date/centre. That makes sense, easier than letting people choose etc

iamwhoiam · 04-04-2021 03:19PM

Van.Bosch wrote: »

So it’s going to be opened up, people register and then it allocated you a date/centre. That makes sense, easier than letting people choose etc

Yes . Allocated a centre , alllocated a vaccine too . You cannot choose either apparently

timsey tiger · 04-04-2021 03:20PM

Turtwig wrote: »

Israel's vaccination programme has been heavily segregated. Not everyone will be offered a vaccine.

How is this relevent to the discussion on anti-vaxxer freeloaders expecting the benefits of society without shouldering any of the responsibilities?

timsey tiger · 04-04-2021 03:22PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Yes . Allocated a centre , alllocated a vaccine too . You cannot choose either apparently

The idea is to get it done quickly, choice would lead to unnecessary delays.

Van.Bosch · 04-04-2021 03:22PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Yes . Allocated a centre , alllocated a vaccine too . You cannot choose either apparently

Sounds good, I assume you enter what county you live in and then it goes from there. Takes the pressure off the system too in that it has its list of people and it then just allocated them to the MVC’s based off address.

COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 3 - Read OP

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