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The Next Chapter - Being Better Than Most People At Most Things

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    A) Power Clean Tekkers - tall / atk / btk / floor:
    60kg, 70kg, 80kg, 90kg x1

    B) HB Squat (with belt):
    130kg. x3
    140kg x3
    150kg x3 @8ish

    EMOM8 - odds/evens:
    C1) Dips: +10kg x10
    C2) Pull Ups: +5kg x6

    D) Bent Over Row (underhands):
    60kg 3x12 w/ 90s rest

    E) Trap3 Raise:
    5kg 3x12 w/ 90s rest

    EMOM8 - odds/evens:
    F1) Barbell Curls: 32.5kg 4x10
    F2) Superman Extension: 4x10

    G) Alternating Hammer Curl:
    15kg x4-4-4-4 (x3) w/ 90s rest

    H1) Reverse Curl: 20kg 3x15
    H2) Band Pushdown: Green 3x20, rest 60s

    Great session. All done inside 70 mins. Felt VERY strong off yesterdays rest day. Tried very hard not to overcook it today so I could be fresh for the rest of the week. Worked hard, but within myself.

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    (53/53)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    8.02km @ 5m 56s
    47m 39s
    76% MHR / 69% HRR

    Finally hit the inflection point of more days than training sessions this year. Proud to have made it this far and may stick in some bike recovery work to rebalance things.

    The latest series of government announcements and leaks since Thursday have knocked the absolute ****e outta me and I've really struggled to get any training done. We're a two person self employed household both running our own businesses doing reasonably ok financially, but can't get a mortgage to save our lives because of COVID as we're both in effected industry.

    Currently paying 2x in rent what a mortgage would cost, and have a decent oul deposit. I don't want much but a little bit of ****ing housing security would be great.

    Due for a recovery week these week anyway on the run plan, so trying not to worry too much about messing things up.

    Strava is really pissing me off too. Googled mapped the route today. Shoulda been 8.2km. Apple watched showed 8.02km. Strava somehow comes in with a monumentally bollox 7.71km.

    Don't expect this to be a merry log for the next while.

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    (54/55)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    EMOM8 - odds / evens
    A1) Pull Ups: x17, 7, 5, 5
    A2) Dips: x25, 12, 8, 8

    B) Bradford Press:
    40kg 4 sets resting 90s, still didn't get 10s

    EMOM8 - odds / evens
    C1) Plate Raise: 20kg 4x10
    C2) 90deg Lat Raise: 5kg 4x10

    EMOM8 - odds / evens
    D1) Barbell Curl: 32.5kg 4x10
    D2) Superman Ex: #10 4x10

    E) Alternating Hammer Curl w/ Neck Brace
    15kg x4-4-4 (x3), rest 90s

    F1) Reverse Curl: 22.5kg 3x15
    F2) Band Pushdown: Green 3x20, rest 60s

    Gonna experimenting with dropping leg work to 1x per week to see if it helps recovery / motivation. Should be enough to keep the muscle there if nothing else. Will continue to push the upper body and try and reclaim some mass.

    The pull ups and dips are approaching all time PRs, if not there already. The additional arm work is probably having some kind of positive impact on both. And I leave each session feeling outrageously pumped. Which is really all I want these days.

    Hoping to get out for a gentle 30 minute run this evening while wife puts baby down.

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    (55/56)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    5.48km @ 6m 01s
    33m 01s
    74% MHR / 64% HRR

    Yah that was bollox. Everything hurt. Felt uncoordinated, stiff and was too apathetic to even care about how little I cared.

    Real training slump at the mo, but we'll keep showing up and get thru it.

    Productive day otherwise.

    Nice walk with the fam. Got some cookies in Cornelscourt. Washed the car. Cleaned / Polished our winter boots to put away until next year. Upcycled a chair I'd been staring at for ages. And then got a run in.

    Swings and roundabouts.

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    (56/57)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    9ish km @ 6m 05ish avg
    55ish mins
    79% MHR
    inc. 6x12s hills + 6x 200m strides

    Did something rare and took 2 days off completely from training over the weekend. Can't remember the last time I did that . Was so ****ing wrecked I felt like it was a last resort before a doctor visit!!!! Feel grand after it.

    Run today was ok. First 2-3km were a bit of a shakedown and by hte time the hills rolled around I was feeling very light on my feet.

    Feels like I barely trained at all last week despite running 2x and lifting 2x. Moving goal posts much?

    Anyway - gonna confine my running to 4x per week for the next few weeks and see how that goes, and may drop a few kms off the planned total weekly mileage to help better managed fatigue.

    Again, once I keep moving consistently over the rest of the year I know I'll finish better than when I started, and that's enough.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    A) Power Clean Tekkers - tall / atk / btk / floor:
    60kg, 70kg, 80kg, 90kg x1

    B) Comp Squat w/ Belt:
    130kg x3
    150kg x3
    160kg x3
    170kg x3 @8ish

    EMOM6
    C1) Dips: 10kg x10
    C2) Pull Ups: 5kg x6

    D) Barbell Row:
    60kg 3x12 - 90s rest

    E) Bradford Press:
    40kg 3x10 - 90s rest

    EMOM6
    F1) Plate Raise: 20kg x10
    F2) 90deg Lat Raise: 5kg x10

    EMOM6
    G1) Barbell CurL: 35kg x10
    G2) Superman Extension: #11 x10

    H) Alternating Hammer Curl w/ Neck Brace:
    15kg x5-5-5 (x3) - 90s rest

    I1) Reverse Curl: 25kg 3x15
    I2) Band Pushdown: Green 3x20 - 60s rest

    That was a weird session. Nothing felt particularly hard. Everything felt very strong. And there was no real fatigue. Guess the weekend off musta done me good.

    Particular shout out to the clean complex for feeling INCREDIBLY good today, my legs for being sound and giving me my heaviest squats in quite some time, and to my shoulders for waking the hell up for the first time in ages.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    11.35km @ 5m 54s
    1hr 6min
    81% MHR avg
    inc. 3x8min LT efforts with 3 min jog recovery

    I missed a LT session 2 weeks ago and it was really bugging me. So when I set off on todays run and was feeling good, I decided that since I had 11km to play with, I could squeeze it in today if I didn't run it TOO hard and finished the second half of the run easy.

    Kinda went to plan. Ish.

    My estimated tempo pace is around 5m 05s. Missed that by quite a bit, but was still around the HR parameters. Session as follows;

    #1 - 5m 17s avg @ 83%
    #2 - 5m 27s avg @ 85%
    #3 - 5m 11s avg @ 88%

    Found a nice rhythm without suffering too much on the third one and achieved my goal of getting a slightly faster run in without killing myself.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    *Warm Up*
    Played around with some jefferson deadlifts, crossbody deadlifts, lateral lunge deadlifts and side bends

    A) Tall Cleans:
    80kg 3x3

    B) HB Squat, no belt:
    110kg 3x5

    EMOM6
    C1) Pull Ups 3x10
    C2) Dips 3x15

    D) KB Row:
    24kg 3x10 - 90s rest

    E) Military Press:
    45kg 3x10 - 90s rest

    F) Lean Away Lateral Raise:
    5kg 3x12 - 60s rest

    G) 90deg Rotations:
    2.5kg 3x12 - 60s rest

    EMOM6
    H1) Fat Bar Curls: 20kg 3x10
    H2) Fat Bar Skull Crusher: 20kg 3x10

    I) Seated Alternating Single Arm Hammer Curl:
    15kg x5-4-3 (x3) - 90s rest

    Trying to touch all the major upper body muscle groups 2-3x per week. Keep SOME squatting in my legs. And get back to grips with power cleans. Quite a bit of work there, but nothing *TOO* stressful. Just adopting a frequency based approach to upper body training now while trying to focus on the 5k plan.

    Felt fab after it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    [place holder]


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    10.6km @ 5m 43s
    1hr 01min
    81% MHR
    inc. 5x1,000m V02 max intervals w/ 4 minute recovery

    This morning was a complete mess. Life / work stuff went sideways and I went from waking up eager to run to putting the baby down and considering reasons NOT to do it. Felt like it was gonna be a rough session but it was sunny out so I put on some music and said I'd take whatever came on the chin.

    All in all, I'm reasonably happy with the below efforts. Second V02 max session as a "runner". Managed to keep the HR%s about 2% above the last time I did one so I seem to be getting more comfortable with uncomfortable.

    Can't say I'm too happy with the paces, but HR says they're a good honest effort and all I can do is ask my body to give me what it has right now. Certainly coulda dug a little bit deeper and pushed a little bit harder, but for me progress is about stringing sessions together, not knocking any single one outta the park.

    Intervals as follows; (plan said 50-90% of interval time for recovery jog, so picked 4 min for simplicity which works out around 83-85% of interval time across all)

    #1 - 4m 53s @ 88%
    #2 - 4m 48s @ 88%
    #3 - 4m 44s @ 89%
    #4 - 5m 03s @ 88%
    #5 - 4m 32s @ 88%

    Fairly happy with the consistency. 2 and 4 were done into reasonable headwinds so that MAY explain why they were slower. I'm pretty happy I smashed the 5th one outta the park. Just tried to relax into it, stay tall and keep the legs turning over.

    Cadence average for the whole run was 171spm, which is actually a PR too.

    No idea what the paces above indicate for potential 5km test splits, but sure look, it's week 4 of a 12 week plan so plenty of time left to figure that out.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    15km @ 6m 03s
    1hr 30ish min
    80% MHR avg / 72% HRR

    Missed yesterdays long run so did it today.

    Was baby's first day at creche so was at a loss for what to do with myself :D

    The weather was glorious so I went on an explore and headed up the Kilruddery Trail. The pic below is home from the 7.5k turnaround point.

    HR was a bit higher than I'd like but there's a lot of climbing to there and it was a few %s points lower on the way home :)

    Outstanding little run.

    Screenshot-2021-03-08-at-13-54-52.png


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,182 ✭✭✭demfad


    A) Squats:
    140kg 30x1, going every 30s

    B) Comp Bench:
    137.5kg x1 @8
    130kg x3 @7.5
    125kg 4x3

    C) Inverted Rows:
    5x10

    Other:
    5x12 band pull aparts

    Nice little 52 minute session. All feels kind pointless. Doing enough to maintain muscle is about all I'm up for now. If I can do that while losing a few kg over the rest of the year I'll be happy.

    Bodyweight was a 2020 Tuesday low of 95.7kg. Normally my lowest weight is Thursday/Friday morning.

    Changed squatting around a bit to try and preserve my legs with the run volume picking up.

    5k planned tomorrow morning, 20 minute easy run the day after and then a longer one at the weekend to knock off the my first 4x/week before starting the hal higdon half marathon plan next week.

    Dead lifts great compliment to squats for running strenght. Can recommend a circuit or two if youre interested.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    demfad wrote: »
    Dead lifts great compliment to squats for running strenght. Can recommend a circuit or two if youre interested.

    Thanks :):)

    I've a few years powerlifting in me, pulled 280kg at peak strength levels 4 years ago so I reckon my strength reserve's good enough for now.

    Actually ended up getting quite a bit of QL / rib issues towards the end of my last training cycle so backed them off a bit. Have been playing around with some power cleans the last couple of months and figure the positional work from those should help keep my p-chain together.

    Deadlift wise, I THINK I pulled 200x3 in the last 6 weeks or so.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,182 ✭✭✭demfad


    Thanks :):)

    I've a few years powerlifting in me, pulled 280kg at peak strength levels 4 years ago so I reckon my strength reserve's good enough for now.

    Actually ended up getting quite a bit of QL / rib issues towards the end of my last training cycle so backed them off a bit. Have been playing around with some power cleans the last couple of months and figure the positional work from those should help keep my p-chain together.

    Deadlift wise, I THINK I pulled 200x3 in the last 6 weeks or so.

    Jesus, I'm a relative beginner at the weight lifting game.a little extra help to keep the running strenght going. A chap called Jay Dicharry has strenght workouts for runners which i hope to renew when gym reopens.
    The hair is fully grey now so need to keep the strenght somehow.

    While |I'm here: Any home made subs for weights apart from squatting children?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    demfad wrote: »
    Jesus, I'm a relative beginner at the weight lifting game.a little extra help to keep the running strenght going. A chap called Jay Dicharry has strenght workouts for runners which i hope to renew when gym reopens.
    The hair is fully grey now so need to keep the strenght somehow.

    While |I'm here: Any home made subs for weights apart from squatting children?

    Bit of lifting once the hair starts to go grey will do incredible things to keep you strong and healthy alright. The typical muscle wastage stats for adults who don't lift as they age is nasty.

    Weight wise you've a couple of options... And it depends on strength levels.

    You can double bag these guys and they'll hold up to 30kg no problem; (white back on the inside)
    https://brooksonline.ie/empty-sand-bags-poly-type-jan016-un2138
    https://brooksonline.ie/empty-sand-bags-hessian-type-jan015-25kg-un2137?gclid=Cj0KCQiAs5eCBhCBARIsAEhk4r7qlS3E7r6Yik2-I2pVymb7tQLXJnYrQJxE5qsB9MNIclAjPiK6jMcaAqcxEALw_wcB

    Get sand in woodies;
    https://www.woodies.ie/25kg-sand-1027429

    Or if you want something substantially heavier;
    https://www.strengthshop.ie/double-layer-strongman-sandbag-v2.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiAs5eCBhCBARIsAEhk4r7L2BGd0OJe0thfL2Pv75t2ZahDpBzsqAVtoSwSZXPEh5Ul57mCeMAaAs8rEALw_wcB

    ...and buy sand quantities accordingly. You'd make a good variety of sets quite cheaply using the above combinations.

    Then to squat them you can bear hug it, throw it over one shoulder and alternated set to set. Or you can hold it zercher style, which is really nice for lunges.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,182 ✭✭✭demfad


    Bit of lifting once the hair starts to go grey will do incredible things to keep you strong and healthy alright. The typical muscle wastage stats for adults who don't lift as they age is nasty.

    Weight wise you've a couple of options... And it depends on strength levels.

    You can double bag these guys and they'll hold up to 30kg no problem; (white back on the inside)
    https://brooksonline.ie/empty-sand-bags-poly-type-jan016-un2138
    https://brooksonline.ie/empty-sand-bags-hessian-type-jan015-25kg-un2137?gclid=Cj0KCQiAs5eCBhCBARIsAEhk4r7qlS3E7r6Yik2-I2pVymb7tQLXJnYrQJxE5qsB9MNIclAjPiK6jMcaAqcxEALw_wcB

    Get sand in woodies;
    https://www.woodies.ie/25kg-sand-1027429

    Or if you want something substantially heavier;
    https://www.strengthshop.ie/double-layer-strongman-sandbag-v2.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiAs5eCBhCBARIsAEhk4r7L2BGd0OJe0thfL2Pv75t2ZahDpBzsqAVtoSwSZXPEh5Ul57mCeMAaAs8rEALw_wcB

    ...and buy sand quantities accordingly. You'd make a good variety of sets quite cheaply using the above combinations.

    Then to squat them you can bear hug it, throw it over one shoulder and alternated set to set. Or you can hold it zercher style, which is really nice for lunges.

    Fantastic! I owe you one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    *Warm Up*
    Played around with some jefferson deadlifts, crossbody deadlifts, lateral lunge deadlifts and side bends

    A) Power Cleans:
    60kg / 80kg / 90kg x3
    100kg 2x3

    B) Comp Squat:
    135kg x3, 3, 3, 10 @8ish

    C) Underhand Pendlay Row:
    60kg 3x12 - 90s rest

    EMOM6
    D1) Dips: 10kg x10
    D2) Pull Ups: 5kg x6

    E) Bradford Press:
    40kg 3x10 - 90s rest

    EMOM6
    F1) Plate Raise: 20kg x12
    F2) 90deg Lat Raise: 5kg x12

    EMOM6
    G1) Barbell Curl: 35kg x10
    G2) Superman Extension: #11 x10

    H) Alt Hammer Curl:
    17kg x4-4-3
    15kg x4-4-4 (x2) - 90s rest

    I1) Reverse Barbell Curl: 25kg 3x15
    I2) Band Pushdown: Green 3x20

    Workout ran a bit long at 85 minutes. Got distracted earlier on and rested longer than I should during the p. cleans. Got into a decent groove with them towards the end. Must remember to push my toes down and get over the bar more.

    Pushed the squats a bit today just to see. Prolly woulda bullied out a few extra ugly reps if needed. I still feel embarrassingly weak (for me, obv) but at least I kinda remember how to squat.

    Everything else was just standard pump-y muscle bull****. But it's done and I can go for a run in peace tomorrow now.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    BikeErg
    21km or so in 45 minutes
    70% MHR avg or thereabouts.

    The weather wasn't bad today. But it wasn't good either. And I didn't wanna be outside in it. So I hopped on the bike just to get something done.

    Not as good as the planned run, but better than nothing.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,208 ✭✭✭shotgunmcos


    BikeErg
    21km or so in 45 minutes
    70% MHR avg or thereabouts.

    The weather wasn't bad today. But it wasn't good either. And I didn't wanna be outside in it. So I hopped on the bike just to get something done.

    Not as good as the planned run, but better than nothing.

    Fair play for getting something done. However, these are the days you need to win over. Get out the door, the rest will take care of itself.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    Two Parter Today...

    AM - Gun Show

    A1) Fat Bar Reverse Curl: 10kg + bar 3x12
    A2) Seated Alt Arm Hammer Curl: 15kg x4-4-4 (x3)
    A3) Fat Bar Curl: 10kg + bar 3x12 - 2 minute recovery
    B1) Dips @ 4010: bodyweight 3x1/fail
    B2) Fat Bar Skull Crusher: 20kg + bar 3x1/fail
    B3) Green Band Pushdown: 3xMMF - 2 minute recovery

    All done in half an hour. Arms felt about the size of my legs by the end of it.

    PM - shortened tempo run

    5.96km @ 5m 24s
    32m 11s
    81% MHR avg
    inc. 20 minute tempo run

    That tempo run was supposed to happen as part of a longer session but I'm short on time this week so did a quick warm up and just got stuck in.

    Tracked it in 5 minute segments as I knew that'd be around 1km a piece.

    I did a semi test (3km TT) to establish paces at the start of all this on 30/01 and averaged 4m 45s over 3km topping out at about 92% MHR. It was a good honest effort and quite tough. So I took that as a rough 5k TT pace.

    ...then estimated a 5m 10s tempo pace off that and got to work.

    Today on the 20 minute tempo run I ran kms in 5:09/4:48/4:43/4:43 averaging 85% MHR, and woulda stuck on a 5th at 4m 43s too. It felt challenging but nowhere near "holy **** how is this so hard it's only 1km in" effort.

    I was extremely surprised at how well it went.

    Had honestly been questioning if the plan was working at all earlier this week, wondering if I'd even get under 25 minutes for 5km at this rate. But now... well I've no idea.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    Fair play for getting something done. However, these are the days you need to win over. Get out the door, the rest will take care of itself.

    That was helpful. Thank you. It's the main reason why today's shortened tempo run happened. Still didn't get a full session in, but I got the important work done.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,770 ✭✭✭✭Murph_D


    Fair play for getting something done. However, these are the days you need to win over. Get out the door, the rest will take care of itself.

    This is the best advice you've been given so far. To improve, the most important thing is to run more miles, regardless of pace. That's much easier to do when you take factors like weather out of the equation. Within reason - but our temperate climate is runnable all year round, except on the rare occasions where ice makes things a bit risky.

    Edit: Make sure to build mileage at a sustainable rate - rule of thumb is no more than 10% average increase per week, with step backs every few weeks, as you may well know already.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,808 ✭✭✭skyblue46


    Just one thing I noticed about your posts...for your 3k TT you assumed you could use it as a 5k TT pace and you mentioned you could have thrown in another 4:43 on the tempo with no problem. Many a race, TT or session have crumbled towards the end. I would be inclined to use completed runs to set paces. A 3k and 5k TT are different beasts.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,237 ✭✭✭Wottle


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    Just one thing I noticed about your posts...for your 3k TT you assumed you could use it as a 5k TT pace and you mentioned you could have thrown in another 4:43 on the tempo with no problem. Many a race, TT or session have crumbled towards the end. I would be inclined to use completed runs to set paces. A 3k and 5k TT are different beasts.

    Totally agree, you should be adding 10 to 15 seconds per km to get a rough ball park figure for 5k.

    You seemed to have held a similar pace for the 20 minute Tempo, albeit with an easier start, so you're 3k TT might be a little quicker than what you ran, maybe 4'35 pace. So your 5k pace I'd say is very close to 4'45/50 and next time you do 5x1k it should be between these numbers.
    The 5'00 to 4'30 you ran last time is too big a difference. I know the wind was a factor though. You should look into finding a local 1k loop, so that each rep is the exact same, gives way better feedback.
    I think the 4 minutes is too long as well and I'd imagine for each rep your spending the first 2 mins getting into the zone.

    Regarding strength work and ageing, I hate doing weights but in my early 40s and I've read a lot about muscle wastage as we get older.
    Would 2x30 mins of lifting a week cut it?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    A) Tall Cleans:
    80kg 3x3

    B) HB Squat:
    110kg 3x5

    C) KB Row:
    24kg x8-8-8 (x3) - 90s rest

    D) Military Press:
    47.5kg 3x10 - 90s rest

    E) Lean Away Lateral Raise:
    7.5kg 3x15 - 60s rest

    EMOM10
    F1) Fat Bar Curls: 25kg + bar x10
    F2) Fat Bar Skull Crusher: 25kg + bar x10

    That was Friday's workout. Took about 50 minutes. Dragged myself thru it a bit but was glad it got done.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    10km @ 6m 24s
    1hr 04min
    72% MHR / 63% HRR

    Tried really hard just to get out and run sloooooow today.

    Was a great success.

    Awfully boring tho.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    Murph_D wrote: »
    This is the best advice you've been given so far. To improve, the most important thing is to run more miles, regardless of pace. That's much easier to do when you take factors like weather out of the equation. Within reason - but our temperate climate is runnable all year round, except on the rare occasions where ice makes things a bit risky.

    Edit: Make sure to build mileage at a sustainable rate - rule of thumb is no more than 10% average increase per week, with step backs every few weeks, as you may well know already.

    Yah fair point. I just HATE being wet and cold.

    The advice mentioned is why I got out again today. Didn't have the will to do a full session so just banked an easy 10km. Better than noting right?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 106 ✭✭edinrunna


    I would say yes, absolutely better than nothing! One missed session isn't going to make or break you, but getting out and running even when you aren't really feeling it is always a win in my book.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 295 ✭✭BeginnerRunner


    skyblue46 wrote: »
    Just one thing I noticed about your posts...for your 3k TT you assumed you could use it as a 5k TT pace and you mentioned you could have thrown in another 4:43 on the tempo with no problem. Many a race, TT or session have crumbled towards the end. I would be inclined to use completed runs to set paces. A 3k and 5k TT are different beasts.

    I've done quite a few row based TTs and I know all about fly and die. The 20 minute tempo run was genuinely that comfortable tho. I think I only spent 2 minutes in the 90+% range.

    The 3k TT day was absolutely disgusting weather wise. Pissing rain and 40kmh crosswinds. I was basing the "coulda held another 2km" on those qualifying factors. It was a guess to be fair, but based off the 20 minute tempo run I HOPE it's close enough not to completely destroy me.

    I got some advice in the random Qs thread to use the target bases as targets and then actually train off RPE. My understanding of tempo work is it should be 80-90% MHR and V02 max should be 90-100% so my thinking is if I take those numbers as RPE % effort feels it should keep me mostly on track?
    Wottle wrote: »
    Totally agree, you should be adding 10 to 15 seconds per km to get a rough ball park figure for 5k.

    You seemed to have held a similar pace for the 20 minute Tempo, albeit with an easier start, so you're 3k TT might be a little quicker than what you ran, maybe 4'35 pace. So your 5k pace I'd say is very close to 4'45/50 and next time you do 5x1k it should be between these numbers.

    Yah I probably coulda suffered a bit harder on the 3k TT and as noted above there to skyblue, it was a truly miserable day.

    Good to hear it sounds like I'm roughly in range tho.
    The 5'00 to 4'30 you ran last time is too big a difference. I know the wind was a factor though. You should look into finding a local 1k loop, so that each rep is the exact same, gives way better feedback.
    I think the 4 minutes is too long as well and I'd imagine for each rep your spending the first 2 mins getting into the zone.

    Deffo fair on the 5m to 4m 30s gap. One was too slow and the other was too fast :D

    I think I've still < 10 tempo/V02 max runs done in, well.... ever, so I'm finding my feet pacing wise. Really hoping as the weeks and months wear on it'll start to get tighter.

    I'll pull rest periods down to 70-75% of interval time for the next one and see how I feel, because as you said - my HR probably wasn't in the appropriate range for most of it :)
    Regarding strength work and ageing, I hate doing weights but in my early 40s and I've read a lot about muscle wastage as we get older.
    Would 2x30 mins of lifting a week cut it?

    How long is a piece of string really...

    It's a simple and complex topic.

    The simple answer is - if youre running multiple times per week and lifting 2x, that's probably enough to get the majority of the benefit.

    The impact from running will have positive effects on tendon and ligament strength, along with bone density.

    And if you're regularly gonna do 2x sessions per week and accrue 100 over a year consistently - that's way better than me saying "no you have to do 3-4x or there's no point" when it would probably cause you to miss days, weeks and possibly months all over the gaff to close maybe the extra 5-10% benefit that training 2x would get you.

    The nature of the training and program you follow will obviously have an effect but assuming you're looking to preserve current muscle/bone density loss as opposed to optimising for additional growth, what you're doing sounds good enough!!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,237 ✭✭✭Wottle



    How long is a piece of string really...

    It's a simple and complex topic.

    The simple answer is - if youre running multiple times per week and lifting 2x, that's probably enough to get the majority of the benefit.

    The impact from running will have positive effects on tendon and ligament strength, along with bone density.

    And if you're regularly gonna do 2x sessions per week and accrue 100 over a year consistently - that's way better than me saying "no you have to do 3-4x or there's no point" when it would probably cause you to miss days, weeks and possibly months all over the gaff to close maybe the extra 5-10% benefit that training 2x would get you.

    The nature of the training and program you follow will obviously have an effect but assuming you're looking to preserve current muscle/bone density loss as opposed to optimising for additional growth, what you're doing sounds good enough!!

    Thanks for that, I've used Stronglifts 5x5 last year doing 3 sessions a week. I enjoy the simplicity of it, got me strong without getting big, which I like. As you progress though, it just takes a lot more time.
    Will probably start with SL again but twice a week and when it starts going over the 30/40 mins, I'll look for sth else, might be back to you :-)


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