Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX Read OP For Mod Warnings

normanoffside · 02-03-2021 01:51AM

Here’s a thread of videos from Saturday.
Should out an end to the argument that there were only a few hundred and all intent on violence.

https://twitter.com/philipwatson_/status/1366513575976726535?s=21

Gael23 · 02-03-2021 05:04AM

I recall Varadkar saying they’d like ICU to go to 50. Based on current patterns I don’t se us being too far off that by Easter

W123-80's · 02-03-2021 09:35AM

Silentcorner wrote: »

It is anyone's guess how many jobs will not return in Retail, Pubs, Local Services industries.

Small, Medium, Large towns and cities are all going to feel the effect very quickly.

Anybody who thinks we are going to go back to normal employment levels after what our Government has done here is not paying attention to what is happening, Small business owners across the country (barbers, retail shops, hair salons, pubs etc) have all lost market share they will never get back.

Many are being compensated for now...but for how long?

Who is going to step in with investment or willing to sign long terms leases to start up again?

If a small hair salon, barber or retail shop somehow manages to lose market share to a larger version of those businesses then those larger businesses will need employees.
Although I have no idea how a small barber will lose marker share to a larger barber when they are all closed.

Either way, once they open customers will return and staff will be needed.

I'll give you the pubs. That's an industry that was barely treading water pre Covid. Wet pubs will struggle post Covid.

opinionated3 · 02-03-2021 09:39AM

normanoffside wrote: »

Here’s a thread of videos from Saturday.
Should out an end to the argument that there were only a few hundred and all intent on violence.

https://twitter.com/philipwatson_/status/1366513575976726535?s=21

"Good people".... No mask wearing and gathered together like that?? I wouldn't call them good people ...

Silentcorner · 02-03-2021 09:42AM

W123-80's wrote: »

If a small hair salon, barber or retail shop somehow manages to lose market share to a larger version of those businesses then those larger businesses will need employees.
Although I have no idea how a small barber will lose marker share to a larger barber when they are all closed.

Either way, once they open customers will return and staff will be needed.

I'll give you the pubs. That's an industry that was barely treading water pre Covid. Wet pubs will struggle post Covid.

People are finding their own way of taking care of their hair at home...

This isn't even difficult to understand.

If a barbershop had 100 customers a week last year, the simple cuts are being done at home at this stage.

Gym's are the same, will every one of their customers return when a lot of them have made do with working out from home for the last year.

The interruption has been way too long...this is going to hurt a lot of business in towns and cities all over this country.

Graham · 02-03-2021 09:51AM

Silentcorner wrote: »

This isn't even difficult to understand.

If a barbershop had 100 customers a week last year, the simple cuts are being done at home at this stage.

Gym's are the same, will every one of their customers return when a lot of them have made do with working out from home for the last year.

While there's no doubt businesses are suffering I don't think people are going to permanently stop going to barbers or gyms.

I actually expect most businesses will see more trade than they can cope with when things start to reopen.

I certainly don't buy into the permanent doom some are peddling. Quite the opposite.

Boggles · 02-03-2021 09:58AM

Graham wrote: »

I certainly don't buy into the permanent doom some are peddling. Quite the opposite.

Yeah, the idea that barbers and gyms will never recover and the economy is damaged for infinity is not founded in any economics I ever studied.

Pure and utter doom mongering.

FintanMcluskey · 02-03-2021 09:59AM

opinionated3 wrote: »

"Good people".... No mask wearing and gathered together like that?? I wouldn't call them good people ...

The worst thing to come from the last year is how close you stand beside someone is now deemed an accurate judgement of character

FlubberJones · 02-03-2021 09:59AM

With the "threats and menaces" coming from the leadership people will continue to get more and more frustrated and IF they decide to push this **** out until May I see huge issues during April... they have to do something other than "no easing, stay as you are etc."

While you see the closest neighbor planning on celebrating getting out of it and moving on...

people will explode and whether the restrictions are there or not there will be gatherings and drinking and family and friend get togethers, but not in celebration like most countries, but in defiance and basically saying "**** you, we tried our best but it wasn't good enough" and you the government did your best and it was the worst...

hatrickpatrick · 02-03-2021 09:59AM

opinionated3 wrote: »

"Good people".... No mask wearing and gathered together like that?? I wouldn't call them good people ...

A lot of them genuinely believe (I mean genuinely believe, not virtue-signalling believe) that they've been lied to about how bad the virus is and that it's the rest of us who are the useful idiots for playing along as we have. That's why a lot of them aren't wearing masks or distancing - the whole point of the protest is that they want an end to all of that.

And honestly, before anyone shouts "conspiracy nutjobs" or "fake news", just consider the sheer, unadulterated, relentless stream of lies and bullsh!t we endure from our supposed democratic representatives on literally a daily basis. Forget about COVID for a moment - the seeds of the breakdown in trust were sown long, long before COVID was a thing. My generation alone has lived through, off the top of my head, weapons of mass destruction, rendition flights are not passing through Ireland, Ireland is not getting a bailout from either the ECB or IMF, our Taoiseach doesn't have a bank account, Sgt Maurice McCabe is a troublemaker and there is no wrongdoing in our justice system, there was no corruption between FF and Anglo Irish Bank, Leo did not leak those documents, your cervical smear test was negative, the ECB did not blackmail our finance minister, Enda Kenny and Michael Noonan did not give their advisors illegal pay rises, the American and British governments are not illegally monitoring the entire world's internet usage, etc etc etc etc etc etc. And not in a single one of these cases has anyone been fired, prosecuted, or faced any meaningful consequences for looking the public in the eye and bullsh!tting us.

The sheer level bullsh!t people in Western democracies (presumably in other parts of the world too, I just don't have the first hand experience) put up with literally every single day, it's no wonder such a growing minority assume that the moment a government official opens his or her mouth, to speak about literally any subject, the truth leaves the room until that politician is finished speaking.

This is a problem which is far, far bigger than just a couple of tiny groups of morons on Facebook or Twitter. Governmental dishonesty and corruption has been so rife and endemic in the Western world, at least throughout my lifetime (born 1989) that it's not even remotely surprising that a significant cohort would see an announcement from the government and immediately think "ah here comes the daily pack of lies". We've literally been raised on the paradigm that the word politician is fundamentally synonymous with dishonest.

It shouldn't be that way - of course it shouldn't. It's a totally unfair generalisation. But blaming those who believe it is blaming the wrong people. The public's trust has been violated and annihilated time and time again. The fault lies squarely with those who choose to lie in public office, plain and simple.

Windmill100000 · 02-03-2021 10:03AM

Graham wrote: »

While there's no doubt businesses are suffering I don't think people are going to permanently stop going to barbers or gyms.

I actually expect most businesses will see more trade than they can cope with when things start to reopen.

I certainly don't buy into the permanent doom some are peddling. Quite the opposite.

Neither do I, but again it suits the agenda for some that we are all doomed and will be forever. People are making do at the moment. Will they continue to do so? Who knows? Personally, I don't want to continue cutting my own hair indefinitely and my partner is going to return to his club sport.

Graham · 02-03-2021 10:04AM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

The worst thing to come from the last year is how close you stand beside someone is now deemed an accurate judgement of character

Surely you mean intelligence not character.

It certainly wouldn't be very bright to stand too close to someone in the midst of pandemic that spreads by close contact.

Graham · 02-03-2021 10:07AM

Windmill100000 wrote: »

Neither do I, but again it suits the agenda for some that we are all doomed and will be forever. People are making do at the moment. Will they continue to do so? Who knows? Personally, I don't want to continue cutting my own hair indefinitely and my partner is going to return to his club sport.

Same here. I finally gave in and let the Mrs go at my head with the clippers last week.

While it's better than it was, I'm looking forward to getting back into the barbers!

Don't Chute! · 02-03-2021 10:15AM

Graham wrote: »

Surely you mean intelligence not character.

It certainly wouldn't be very bright to stand too close to someone in the midst of pandemic that spreads by close contact.

Hi Moderator Graham. Intelligence or character it doesn’t change his point. How unbelievably smug of someone to judge somebody else based on a 30 second video of them standing on a street. Thank you Moderator Graham.

Boggles · 02-03-2021 10:17AM

normanoffside wrote: »

Here’s a thread of videos from Saturday.
Should out an end to the argument that there were only a few hundred and all intent on violence.

https://twitter.com/philipwatson_/status/1366513575976726535?s=21

The song couldn't be more apt TBF.

Let's hope no one gets seriously hurt with their selfish folly.

hatrickpatrick · 02-03-2021 10:18AM

Don't Chute! wrote: »

Hi Moderator Graham. Intelligence or character it doesn’t change his point. How unbelievably smug of someone to judge somebody else based on a 30 second video of them standing on a street. Thank you Moderator Graham.

Ah heyor, leave his moderatorness out of it. He's not a CA mod anyway, he has no power here

FintanMcluskey · 02-03-2021 10:18AM

opinionated3 wrote: »

"Good people".... No mask wearing and gathered together like that?? I wouldn't call them good people ...

Graham wrote: »

Surely you mean intelligence not character.

It certainly wouldn't be very bright to stand too close to someone in the midst of pandemic that spreads by close contact.

The OP stated they they were not “good people” on the basis that they gathered together

Graham · 02-03-2021 10:19AM

Don't Chute! wrote: »

Hi Moderator Graham. Intelligence or character it doesn’t change his point. How unbelievably smug of someone to judge somebody else based on a 30 second video of them standing on a street. Thank you Moderator Graham.

During the middle of a pandemic lots of people will naturally judge those that abandon basic precautions.

Why? Because it's dumb.

No smugness involved.

Silentcorner · 02-03-2021 10:24AM

Graham wrote: »

While there's no doubt businesses are suffering I don't think people are going to permanently stop going to barbers or gyms.

I actually expect most businesses will see more trade than they can cope with when things start to reopen.

I certainly don't buy into the permanent doom some are peddling. Quite the opposite.

It's easy not to buy into to the reality facing a lot of business owners and their employees, but let us be under no illusion....it was the doom and gloom merchants that were projecting 120,000 deaths in Ireland that encouraged our Government to stick with the longest strictest lock down in Europe.

That decision has consequences, people need to face up to them and so will our economy.

We have changed buying habits...

Some industries will boom, home improvements, cars...but outside of that, who knows!

Think of the suburban or town streets, pubs, retail shops, barbers, beauty salons....all going to be down, well down.

Anyone who thinks we are going to boom is probably an expert in variants and little else!!!

Don't Chute! · 02-03-2021 10:28AM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Ah heyor, leave his moderatorness out of it. He's not a CA mod anyway, he has no power here

But one of his little friends has taken to calling him that! I just thought that’s how we all must address him now!😂

Polar101 · 02-03-2021 10:31AM

opinionated3 wrote: »

"Good people".... No mask wearing and gathered together like that?? I wouldn't call them good people ...

People who agree with me = good people, independent thinkers
People who disagree with me = the opposite

02-03-2021 10:31AM

Graham wrote: »

During the middle of a pandemic lots of people will naturally judge those that abandon basic precautions.

Why? Because it's dumb.

No smugness involved.

I think Moderator Graham is spot on here.

There's nothing smug about pointing out the obvious: that people should have the decency to adhere to public health guidance in a responsible manner, so that we can at least make the argument that society is mature enough not to throw the progress down the drain and let us open up to a sensible degree.

W123-80's · 02-03-2021 10:40AM

Silentcorner wrote: »

People are finding their own way of taking care of their hair at home...

This isn't even difficult to understand.

If a barbershop had 100 customers a week last year, the simple cuts are being done at home at this stage.

Gym's are the same, will every one of their customers return when a lot of them have made do with working out from home for the last year.

The interruption has been way too long...this is going to hurt a lot of business in towns and cities all over this country.

If the market decide, as a result of covid19, they are happy to do the simple hair cuts themselves from now on or work out from home then that is not the governments fault. That is an individual making a free choice based on personal experience.

I don't agree though.
I think barbers will do just as well post covid. I don't know anyone who is happy cutting their own hair.
Just because the country went daft baking banana bread it doesn't mean when bakeries reopen people wont want their product.

Covid has hit business hard, I'm not for a second denying that.
But customers will return if there is a genuine market for the product/service.

Windmill100000 · 02-03-2021 10:40AM

Silentcorner wrote: »

It's easy not to buy into to the reality facing a lot of business owners and their employees, but let us be under no illusion....it was the doom and gloom merchants that were projecting 120,000 deaths in Ireland that encouraged our Government to stick with the longest strictest lock down in Europe.

That decision has consequences, people need to face up to them and so will our economy.

We have changed buying habits...

Some industries will boom, home improvements, cars...but outside of that, who knows!

Think of the suburban or town streets, pubs, retail shops, barbers, beauty salons....all going to be down, well down.

Anyone who thinks we are going to boom is probably an expert in variants and little else!!!

I suppose it depends how you want to look at it. After recessions in the past we have bounced back. People may change careers (I was forced to in 2010 ) but life will go on for the vast majority of people.

It was fear that had people believing there might be 120,000 deaths. We didn't know what was going happen. We know now that that death rate was wrong, but we also know that cases can rise very quickly and overwhelm ICU across the country. That is what has kept us locked down in level 5.

Some people seem to think the government is not aware that people are finding it hard. They think sending an email to TDs is going to make them go "oh God, look at what is happening out there!!!" A protest wasnt necessary to make them see that - they know. Until case numbers are down, and ICU numbers, very little will change. Some accept this, some don't.

People can say they have had enough and flout lockdown rules and keep cases up, but I have very little sympathy for their anger when they themselves continue to contribute to the problem.

FlubberJones · 02-03-2021 10:52AM

W123-80's wrote: »

If the market decide, as a result of covid19, they are happy to do the simple hair cuts themselves from now on or work out from home then that is not the governments fault. That is an individual making a free choice based on personal experience.

I don't agree though.
I think barbers will do just as well post covid. I don't know anyone who is happy cutting their own hair.
Just because the country went daft baking banana bread it doesn't mean when bakeries reopen people wont want their product.

Covid has hit business hard, I'm not for a second denying that.
But customers will return if there is a genuine market for the product/service.

Agree with the above, I am asking my partner to cut my hair as I am forced to, the moment I don't have to it will stop and I will happily pay 20 sheets to get it done properly and maybe pick up some banana bread on the way home

Silentcorner · 02-03-2021 10:54AM

W123-80's wrote: »

If the market decide, as a result of covid19, they are happy to do the simple hair cuts themselves from now on or work out from home then that is not the governments fault. That is an individual making a free choice based on personal experience.

I don't agree though.
I think barbers will do just as well post covid. I don't know anyone who is happy cutting their own hair.
Just because the country went daft baking banana bread it doesn't mean when bakeries reopen people wont want their product.

Covid has hit business hard, I'm not for a second denying that.
But customers will return if there is a genuine market for the product/service.

Look, I am not going to get into the different buying habits, my point is they have been forced to change, which will have consequences.

I haven't even touched on the Corporate Business and it's impact on local hotels and restaurants.

People who think we will come out of this quickly are in for a shock.

Of course countries all over the world are suffering but the longer the stricter the lockdown, the greater the damage.

W123-80's · 02-03-2021 11:11AM

Silentcorner wrote: »

Look, I am not going to get into the different buying habits, my point is they have been forced to change, which will have consequences.

I haven't even touched on the Corporate Business and it's impact on local hotels and restaurants.

People who think we will come out of this quickly are in for a shock.

Of course countries all over the world are suffering but the longer the stricter the lockdown, the greater the damage.

Ya, I agree. We won't necessarily recover from this very quickly.
There will be fallout. Economic & social.

I agree hospitality is going to struggle. I don't see wet pubs opening at all this year, and any hospitality that does open will be under very strict restrictions.
Hotels turnover from large weddings is going to decimated. I think this pandemic could be the beginning of the end for the huge Irish hotel wedding.
That money will go into some other part of the economy though.

Changed buying habits, even if they are forced due to a recession or a pandemic, will obviously have consequences.
But I don't agree that they are all negative consequences.

paw patrol · 02-03-2021 11:20AM

Graham wrote: »

Surely you mean intelligence not character.

It certainly wouldn't be very bright to stand too close to someone in the midst of pandemic that spreads by close contact.

I believe the reasoning to this has been answered many times in this thread , esp by me. I was there on sat, maskless too as is my wont and I will again if there is another.

You want to challenge my intelligence, fine. I'm not too bothered by your judgement.

Covid is here to stay , it's not going anywhere . My life has a limited amount of time - it's a persons most precious thing. Time is the one thing we can't get back. I'm not wasting my time hiding from that 99.5% survival rate.
If I get covid , i'll take my chances.

Nothing to do with intelligence but everything to do with belief

02-03-2021 11:39AM

paw patrol wrote: »

I believe the reasoning to this has been answered many times in this thread , esp by me. I was there on sat, maskless too as is my wont and I will again if there is another.

You want to challenge my intelligence, fine. I'm not too bothered by your judgement.

Covid is here to stay , it's not going anywhere . My life has a limited amount of time - it's a persons most precious thing. Time is the one thing we can't get back. I'm not wasting my time hiding from that 99.5% survival rate.
If I get covid , i'll take my chances.

Nothing to do with intelligence but everything to do with belief

I think Moderator Graham was making a wider point; namely, that if everyone had the laissez-faire attitude that you have, it would mean uncontrolled viral spread - which could easily overwhelm the health service.

At that stage, it stops becoming a matter of individualism, but rather a collective societal and governmental response.

Therefore the right and intelligent decision must be for people to adhere to public health guidance but also to oppose any draconian measures that go way over the top.

Backstreet Moyes · 02-03-2021 11:41AM

Graham wrote: »

While there's no doubt businesses are suffering I don't think people are going to permanently stop going to barbers or gyms.

I actually expect most businesses will see more trade than they can cope with when things start to reopen.

I certainly don't buy into the permanent doom some are peddling. Quite the opposite.

Yes and it will see a surge in cases like it did the last time we open up

People need clothes and haircuts etc and will flock to the shops once they open

Having these open at the moment would be a much better strategy but this is Ireland and we put no thought or effort into this

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IX Read OP For Mod Warnings