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Covid 19 Part XXXII-215,743 ROI (4,137 deaths)111,166 NI (2,036 deaths)(22/02)Read OP

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Comments

  • #8732
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    jackboy wrote: »
    So restricting activities that have no impact on spread of the virus is ok? Your suggesting we legally can’t control house parties but we can fine someone for walking on a beach. Surely you can see the governments strategy is ineffective to say the least.
    Restrictions aimed at keeping people apart are the only way in the absence of tools which allow us to test very quickly. Vaccinations will be the tool into the future. I don't disagree on the restrictions but you seem to think the virus will do the right thing if we can only pick the right targeted strategy.


  • #8733
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,264 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    AdamD wrote: »
    Hang on. You think then mere opening of a few shops would lead to the collapse of our health system? :confused:


    I literally visit the supermarket every day, how have I not caught covid yet in this danger ravaged environment?

    At the very least click and collect should be opened immediately .
    Shoe shops should be open and one in at a time
    Clothes shops with street entry and limited entry open
    Peolple need shoes and clothes now and children need their feet measured and new shoes . My daughter had to borrow shoes for her baby as Clarks delivery is incredibly slow .


  • #8734
    screamer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭screamer


    Christmas-a lot of people just went back to their normal routines, large family dinners, visiting etc. The nail bars and hairdressers were packed, queues outside barbers. People weren’t getting all that done to sit home with their own household. Then of course giving presents, what a great way to spread Covid. People went nuts at Christmas, the government totally messed up with messaging and what they allowed people to do, and like I said back then, lockdown level 6 would follow, and being honest this lockdown is most harsh.


  • #8735
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Turtwig wrote: »
    This time last year there no were official cases linked to pubs, restaurants and retail. Ergo, covid doesn't spread in these places.
    Retail is logically the least risky on account of the very limited contact with individuals, a year of shopping, with 6 months of it without masks is evidence enough of that.


  • #8736
    wadacrack
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,172 ✭✭✭wadacrack


    AdamD wrote: »
    Hang on. You think then mere opening of a few shops would lead to the collapse of our health system? :confused:


    I literally visit the supermarket every day, how have I not caught covid yet in this danger ravaged environment?

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/doctors-blame-virus-outbreaks-on-shoppers-complacency-40086220.html

    The virus spread predominantly indoors. Shops are obviously a risk.
    Naive to base opinion just on personal experience.


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  • #8737
    jackboy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,072 ✭✭✭jackboy


    is_that_so wrote: »
    I don't disagree on the restrictions but you seem to think the virus will do the right thing if we can only pick the right targeted strategy.

    Yes I do, focus on the restrictions that actually control the virus.

    Tens of thousands of people are currently working in busy multi nationals where the virus spread is easily controlled with a few very minor actions. Limited numbers in meeting rooms, canteen tables well spaced out, wear a mask when walking around the site. These simple actions mean that even the new variants can’t get a foothold. Retail with even more stringent precautions should not have an issue.


  • #8738
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    wadacrack wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/doctors-blame-virus-outbreaks-on-shoppers-complacency-40086220.html

    The virus spread predominantly indoors. Shops are obviously a risk.
    Naive to base opinion just on personal experience.
    Yeah that's a germaphobe GP. The data suggests she is giving her own personal opinion, for all the scientific evidence that has.


  • #8739
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    It seems (report in the Sunday Times) that the advice from NPHET is that reopening is being linked to making progress on hospital waiting lists.


  • #8740
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    Although a few weeks old now, this is a great slide deck

    https://assets.gov.ie/123703/17c91fec-ec9f-46bc-a8f0-cb98303684d8.pdf


  • #8741
    Gruffalux
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,023 ✭✭✭Gruffalux


    I know people are pissed off and bored. I get it a bit sometimes and I miss some people a lot. But its worth mantaining rational perspective. Was just thinking back historically. Humans have been living a long time in dire danger and madness. The mongols were slaughtering.The barbarians from the north were slaughtering. The saracens were slaughtering. The christian troops were slaughtering. Etc ad infinitum. And when whole areas were not being put to the sword we were dying of plague, pestilence, childbirth and septic wounds. That has been thr general lot of our species. The slaughter is not old history either. 80 years ago Europeans were slaughtering each other in incomprehensible numbers. 20 years ago the west was bombing parts of the middle east back to brutal subsistence and slaughtering up to a million people. And even in the unusual peaceful plenty of recent decades plenty of individuals in our midst have been coping every day with unbearable sorrow, sickness, suicide, no job, bereavement etc.
    Anyway - all to say, we are still doing okay generally. Theres a nice bit of spring sunshine out.


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  • #8742
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    jackboy wrote: »
    Yes I do, focus on the restrictions that actually control the virus.

    Tens of thousands of people are currently working in busy multi nationals where the virus spread is easily controlled with a few very minor actions. Limited numbers in meeting rooms, canteen tables well spaced out, wear a mask when walking around the site. These simple actions mean that even the new variants can’t get a foothold. Retail with even more stringent precautions should not have an issue.
    Retail never had an issue. MNCs with large well-ventilated open spaces and a WFH option are really not many other places. Socialisation in poorly ventilated spaces is and has always been the problem area. As much as can be closed off is but you cannot micro manage how people live their lives and who they meet.


  • #8743
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    It seems (report in the Sunday Times) that the advice from NPHET is that reopening is being linked to making progress on hospital waiting lists.
    How exactly are those two things connected? Waiting lists are not NPHET's purview.


  • #8744
    SeaMermaid
    Closed Accounts Posts: 62 ✭✭SeaMermaid


    We seem to be plateauing at approx 1000 cases a day. People are getting bored and fed up and there will be a reopening soon one way or another.

    Reopening or the population not following the restrictions from a starting point of 1000 cases a day will be a disaster. I can't see case numbers come down more for a reopening. There's nothing else to add to lockdown to make it more stringent to get the numbers to drop further for a reopening.

    Covid is going to spread like wildfire from now. It definitely feels like a piss into the wind against all the measures we took over the past year.


  • #8745
    jackboy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,072 ✭✭✭jackboy


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Retail never had an issue. MNCs with large well-ventilated open spaces and a WFH option are really not many other places. Socialisation in poorly ventilated spaces is and has always been the problem area. As much as can be closed off is but you cannot micro manage how people live their lives and who they meet.

    If that is true then we cannot control the virus and it is level 5 for at least another 6 months until enough are vaccinated.


  • #8746
    Locotastic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭Locotastic


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    It seems (report in the Sunday Times) that the advice from NPHET is that reopening is being linked to making progress on hospital waiting lists.

    I saw that, Nphet has told the government to keep the present level of lockdown until hospitals begin to reduce their record waiting lists.

    We'll be in lockdown forever!


  • #8747
    Turtwig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    is_that_so wrote: »
    How exactly are those two things connected? Waiting lists are not NPHET's purview.

    NPHET's remit is preservation of public services and healthcare. Pretty much every letter the CMO sends the minister of health is written with a view to keeping the impact on non covid care and extremely vulnerable groups such as mental disabilities as minimal as possible. This was the rationale for the 2nd level 5 lockdown.

    The last wave has utterly fcked all these services. Recovery, if it's even possible, is going to take considerable time. Simply put we do not want more covid burden on our health system.


  • #8748
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    is_that_so wrote: »
    How exactly are those two things connected? Waiting lists are not NPHET's purview.

    I don’t know if that is the advice or a journalist’s “interpretation” of advice.

    It makes sense on one level. If people are locked up, if there are no sports games, no alcohol related fights, less car accidents etc etc then the health service will have an opportunity to catch up.


  • #8749
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    jackboy wrote: »
    If that is true then we cannot control the virus and it is level 5 for at least another 6 months until enough are vaccinated.
    That is not something that can be sold nor feasible and a lot more people will begin to ignore restrictions soon enough if they're told it'll be six months more.


  • #8750
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    I don’t know if that is the advice or a journalist’s “interpretation” of advice.

    It makes sense on one level. If people are locked up, if there are no sports games, no alcohol related fights, less car accidents etc etc then the health service will have an opportunity to catch up.
    I'd go with a journalist's interpretation. It is none of their business, it's a HSE call.


  • #8751
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    Locotastic wrote: »
    I saw that, Nphet has told the government to keep the present level of lockdown until hospitals begin to reduce their record waiting lists.

    We'll be in lockdown forever!

    Easy for those who get paid by the State to recommend actions which continue to suppress the private sector.


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  • #8752
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    Easy for those who get paid by the State to recommend actions which continue to suppress the private sector.

    I wonder where exactly do they think the money to run such things as the health service is generated?


  • #8753
    Sofa King Great
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 872 ✭✭✭Sofa King Great


    Gruffalux wrote: »
    I know people are pissed off and bored. I get it a bit sometimes and I miss some people a lot. But its worth mantaining rational perspective. Was just thinking back historically. Humans have been living a long time in dire danger and madness. The mongols were slaughtering.The barbarians from the north were slaughtering. The saracens were slaughtering. The christian troops were slaughtering. Etc ad infinitum. And when whole areas were not being put to the sword we were dying of plague, pestilence, childbirth and septic wounds. That has been thr general lot of our species. The slaughter is not old history either. 80 years ago Europeans were slaughtering each other in incomprehensible numbers. 20 years ago the west was bombing parts of the middle east back to brutal subsistence and slaughtering up to a million people. And even in the unusual peaceful plenty of recent decades plenty of individuals in our midst have been coping every day with unbearable sorrow, sickness, suicide, no job, bereavement etc.
    Anyway - all to say, we are still doing okay generally. Theres a nice bit of spring sunshine out.

    There are hundreds of thousands out of work, people haven't seen loved ones for months on end, the economy is in ruins and there is a pandemic sweeping the globe. I feel like "bored" is a bit condescending

    But sure its grand, if it was a few hundred years ago the mongols would be slaughtering us and its sunny out


  • #8754
    Locotastic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 754 ✭✭✭Locotastic


    Doctor Jimbob wrote: »
    I'm fed up of the constantly moving goalposts.

    We need to flatten the curve.

    We need to get case numbers as low as possible.

    We need to wait for vaccinations.

    We need to see how variants play out.

    We need to get the waiting lists down.

    They must think we're a nation of idiots, the communications recently have shown just how little regard they have for the 'common' people.

    Whatever about previous government, at least they had some sense about trying to keep the nation on side.


  • #8755
    Turtwig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    Easy for those who get paid by the State to recommend actions which continue to suppress the private sector.

    Many elements of the private sector have prospered greatly from this. Many are also paid by the state.

    The division of state and private isn't a binary one. The state at least will attempt to provide support to the areas shafted by this.


  • #8756
    Kha1993
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37 ✭Kha1993


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    It seems (report in the Sunday Times) that the advice from NPHET is that reopening is being linked to making progress on hospital waiting lists.

    So who leaked this then? NPHET? Government?

    Another day - the goalposts being changed again. It’s been:
    - cases under 100
    - 4 weeks of cases under 100
    - critical mass vaccinated
    - waiting lists to be cleared.


  • #8757
    jackboy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,072 ✭✭✭jackboy


    Turtwig wrote: »
    The division of state and private isn't a binary one. The state at least will attempt to provide support to the areas shafted by this.

    All the small businesses being destroyed by this will be left to die after this, there is no doubt about that. The real hardship for many will begin after the pandemic is under control.


  • #8758
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Kha1993 wrote: »
    So who leaked this then? NPHET? Government?

    Another day - the goalposts being changed again. It’s been:
    - cases under 100
    - 4 weeks of cases under 100
    - critical mass vaccinated
    - waiting lists to be cleared.
    The first two are a given, for any change, the third one for more significant relaxations and that last one has to be made up.


  • #8759
    TonyMaloney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,150 ✭✭✭TonyMaloney


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    Easy for those who get paid by the State to recommend actions which continue to suppress the private sector.

    I work in the private sector, therefore I'm happy to see people in the public sector out of work.

    No, wait. That's ****ing stupid.


  • #8760
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Locotastic wrote: »
    They must think we're a nation of idiots, the communications recently have shown just how little regard they have for the 'common' people.

    Whatever about previous government, at least they had some sense about trying to keep the nation on side.
    In retrospect, despite the grim times, they probably had an easier job of it as it was all about the restrictions and the emergence from those restrictions went smoothly enough. That said we only really heard from two people all the way through, Leo & Harris, now it's any TD.


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  • #8761
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    TonyMaloney wrote: »
    I work in the private sector, therefore I'm happy to see people in the public sector out of work.

    No, wait. That's ****ing stupid.

    Are you a business owner? Are you self employed? Is your business closed?

    There are 1000’s of businesses closed now and those people still have bills to pay. Hundreds of thousands of people are out of work.


This discussion has been closed.
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