Smart meter opt out

Reati · 25-09-2019 7:21am

CelticRambler wrote: »

How does the dole office tell the difference between a kettle kilowatt and a fridge kilowatt? :rolleyes

It’s amazing the logic of some people that his worry in this is someone commiting welfare fraud might get caught out.

howyegettinon1 · 25-09-2019 10:06am

boege wrote: »

You do have control, the data cannot be shared without your permission.

I would have control if i had access to the sim, the ability to wipe the stored data. what we do have now is trust in a third party to do what they say. there is a difference between the two

howyegettinon1 · 25-09-2019 10:10am

CelticRambler wrote: »

How does the dole office tell the difference between a kettle kilowatt and a fridge kilowatt? :rolleyes:

I'm in France, so my bills wouldn't be particularly relevant, but I've saved about 400€ since I (willingly) let the man in to install a smart meter. Why? Because just seeing the figures on chart alerts me to "exceptional usage" and I can take action straight away instead of waiting for my end-of-year bill.

It's also great to be able to log into my own meter when I'm working away and see whether or not there's a trickle of watts being used by the fridge, the phone/router, the stereo, etc. Living in an area prone to lightning strikes that trip the main fuse, it's a great way to know that I need to send someone 'round to flick the switch before my freezer defrosts.

i am not against the idea of monitoring your usage as long as you have full control of the data

you get annual bills? we can submit our readings and get bills every two months, which means you can get on top off excess usage sooner i suppose

it is nice to know when your electricity goes out, i already have this in place and get alerted when it goes down and comes back up

howyegettinon1 · 25-09-2019 10:26am

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I have no issues with a smart meter but that's light years away from revenue knowing how many coffees you buy and where you buy them. There are several threads on the public social card or whatever its called. People afraid of big brother yet the same people tap their card dozens of times per day leaving a much bigger footprint & think nothing of it. Every time you check Facebook or twitter you leave a footprint of where you are.

i think overall we are giving up our privacy inch by inch and we are doing it so willingly and metering your home is a small part of that. you leave a footprint if you interact with the internet full stop, each site you visit scripts are ran to third party sites. facebook, google and amazon are notorious for collecting this data and if you run ublock you can see how many domains are poling each site you visit. you do not need to log into anything to identify yourself on the internet already.
tapping your card everywhere, purchasing online leaves a huge footprint as you said
then if you look at facial recognition and social credits in china, which is leaking over to us slowly(london has already trialed facial recognition systems on public streets) silicon valley is now introducing social credit system. police in america are granted access to your doorbell cameras to monitor your street. the list is huge and i think we should take privacy a bit more seriously rather than brushing everything under the tinfoil hat carpet

CelticRambler · 25-09-2019 11:51am

howyegettinon1 wrote: »

you get annual bills? we can submit our readings and get bills every two months, which means you can get on top off excess usage sooner i suppose

I (used to) get a bill based on estimated annual consumption, paid by DD over 10 months, and then a top-up or rebate in the 11th month depending on a formal reading. The company was quite happy for me to send them periodic DIY readings, but they still wanted their guy to see it for himself at least once a year.

But even a two-monthly reading gives you no idea of how/when/why you've used way more electricity than you think you should. Was it all in one day? Was it a steady drain? Was the last reading erroneously low? Now I have a day-by-day display (I could authorise them to provide me with a 30-minute read-out, but that'd just clog up my own brain with too much data :pac: ) and if there's a spike, I've a reasonable chance of remembering what was plugged in and switched on that day, and decide for myself what to do about it.

For the paranoics amongst you: here's my consumption over the last month. Can you tell when I was at home and/or what I was doing and/or what appliances we on/off/standing-by?

Bronco Bullfrog · 09-12-2019 12:16pm

Atticus Beautiful Rocket wrote: »

Of course, the savings are made by the customer not the energy company :rolleyes:

Apparently that is not the case. Comparing what has happened in UK.
Every household, whether they want a smart meter or not, is being forced to fork out £420 to help fund the £11billion smart meter project. The cash is being pickpocketed from consumer's energy bills – rising up to 10 per cent this year to an average £1,150.
With the cost per household of the project estimated at £420, it will take decades for smart meters to provide savings to households.
Gordon Hughes is professor of economics at the University of Edinburgh and a former senior adviser on energy and environmental policy at the World Bank.
He says: 'The introduction of the smart meter is a dog's breakfast. At best it is misconceived and an astonishingly expensive project. For those claiming it will bring major savings, I say they need to grow up. Click the link:
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-4846700/Smart-meters-cost-household-420.html
Will it be any different here in Ireland? Also inept installations, increased bills and the technology not working properly:-
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49680943

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/jul/28/smart-meters-bad-installations-customers-in-debt-in-dark

Supernintento Chalmers · 17-01-2020 7:04pm

Sleeper12 wrote: »

A company can't share this information with the social welfare. This has been illegal long before GDPR. However revenue can look at your bank account and all the transactions made by card. This is a more scary thing than a smart meter imo

Are you sure? They can share it with the Guards.

Plus, under GDPR, you can opt for your supplier to not store the usage data, not that it matters.
ESB Networks will store it, you prob can't opt out from that.

A smart meter can only benefit a user.
A wider range of tariffs than Night/Day will probably be available.
It currently costs, I think, over €200 to switch to a Day/Night meter, with a Smart Meter I'd imagine it'd be free.

The only people who should be worried are meter tamperers and drug cultivators and the latter can prob already be detected, from unusually high monthly usage.

stickman1019 · 05-02-2020 7:33am

Anybody have any details on the models of these meters? Or have one installed that they could take a photo of?

Will these meters read both both true and displacement power factors ?

Can anybody confirm ?

Hotblack Desiato · 07-02-2020 3:53am

Gormal wrote: »

We opted out earlier in the year, they are not mandatory. All the info is here

Wow. That site is loony.

hawthorne · 13-02-2021 3:21pm

The smart meter is in theory a good idea.
In reality it is a waste of resources and not environmental friendly at all.

Tests done confirmed that the vast majority of consumers did not save a single penny. The most it was about 3%- which was offset with the long term charges of the installations.
The meter itself has a limited lifespan. While an analogue meter easily works fine over 50 years, the smart meter needs to be replaced every 7 years or so. The smart reading won't be that smart at all after that time- in fact the reading is a lot of phantasy. Which costs you at lot.
Ever looked inside one of those meters? Full of electronic components- which need to be produced. An analogue meter is a very simple thing easily made. What will happen with the meter when it gets replaced? Will it be recycled? Bet it will- like the over 80% of all EU produced electronic junk ends in Ghana or some other country. The damage the production causes are considerable as well.
The job of the meter reader is gone- like so many other jobs simply vanish. We are told the jobs will be created somewhere else- but they won't. Look around you. It happens all over the place.
I have no problem with OP if he wishes to opt out. It is a wise move.

coylemj · 13-02-2021 3:56pm

hawthorne wrote: »

Ever looked inside one of those meters? Full of electronic components- which need to be produced.

Electronic components you say :eek:

I opened my smart meter and this is what I found....

hawthorne · 13-02-2021 4:12pm

LOL!
Make sure it does not run out of food!

Del2005 · 13-02-2021 4:27pm

My parents and sister got smart meters installed recently. Neither got anything for them to monitor their usage, is that not supposed to be the point of installing them?

13-02-2021 4:37pm

My house got smart meter installed recently. Found it weird that we had to get an injection off the installer, and smell that weird stuff he had in the bottle, that made us all so sleepy, but we're definitely happy with the new meter.

More seriously though, can I ask, My meter is beside my front door, as in, it's actually part of the door. On the left of the front door, there's a panel, with a window on the top half and a little hinged door on the bottom half (you open this to access the meter). Now that we have a smart meter, can we cover this over? (ie; get rid of the hinged door?). Or does it still need to be accessible? (looking at new front doors, and getting one with a door for the meter is proving difficult).

beachhead · 14-02-2021 1:58am

listermint wrote: »

The network provider.

This nonsense thread has to stop.

How in the world do you think we are going to be able to manage smart networks and renewable energies without smart meters. There's a fierce amount of bellends that can't see their arse from their elbow.

Go off and lookup FIT.

The consumer is paying for the present upgrade and future upgrades.There is no gov/eu grant to cover the installations.

cubatahavana · 14-02-2021 2:03am

I’m with Flogas. Do you good know if I can get one?

coylemj · 14-02-2021 2:36am

FFVII wrote: »

https://www.ovoenergy.com/help/after-your-smart-meter-installation#will-my-smart-meter-last-me-for-life

They are certified for 10 years...and then must be replaced. You're off to a bad start.

'They'.. you mean UK smart meters?

That document refers to a meter with a keypad which the customer can use to extract data so it is of no relevance to Irish consumers. The smart meters installed here have no physical interface, no keypad or buttons.

But please keep trawling the internet, you can always find something to match your narrative.

hawthorne · 14-02-2021 11:47am

coylemj wrote: »

Wrong question. Instead, ask for the source of that nonsense claim. And the claim that only 3% will see a reduction in their bill.

The post you're referring to was pure black propaganda with not one source quoted for a series of spurious 'facts'.

What on earth are you smoking?

Annasopra · 14-02-2021 11:50am

howyegettinon1 wrote: »

2mm aluminium sheets do a better job and last longer

Do you make nice hats from it

hawthorne · 14-02-2021 11:58am

coylemj wrote: »

'They'.. you mean UK smart meters?

That document refers to a meter with a keypad which the customer can use to extract data so it is of no relevance to Irish consumers. The smart meters installed here have no physical interface, no keypad or buttons.

But please keep trawling the internet, you can always find something to match your narrative.

Every electronical component lasts only a limited time. One of the most common parts to fail after a while is a capacitor. Simply due to the way it is constructed.
There is no way around it.
And if you believe it or not- some models have even batteries installed to keep certain functions alive. And I have not seen a battery which could outlive an analogue meter.
It is correct- the meters are certified for 10 years- but show signs of age already a bit earlier.
Would you like to pay for energy you never used- but which might be clocking up on your meter? Of course it could be all in your favour- but that means the ESB is loosing out....and somebody has to pay again for the losses- which is most likely all customers.
The ESB will replace all meters again in the future- but all customers will pay through their bills over time for that service.
I see that it is completely useless to post any links here- since you will condemn them outright as not being relevant to this country or just being "a catch on the internet".
Obviously you are not interested in a mature discussion of the subject.

14-02-2021 7:47pm

listermint wrote: »

The network provider.

That's fine then, once they don't come to me in 7/10 years or whenever and ask me to pay for a replacement smart meter. I didn't request this change and am quite happy with the regular meter that has been in situ for the last 25 years.

Stoner · 15-02-2021 3:04pm

All,

There has been a couple of reported posts. I ignored them as the reporters continued on with some back and forth afterward.

Please use the report a post function and leave it at that. Please don't report the the post and continue to engage with the other poster afterwards

Stoner · 15-02-2021 5:03pm

All

Please stop reporting each others posts.

I've deleted most of the threads now.

Recognize your own part in escalating an issue and please stop being personal in your responses..

air · 18-02-2021 8:32am

Supernintento Chalmers wrote: »

It currently costs, I think, over €200 to switch to a Day/Night meter, with a Smart Meter I'd imagine it'd be free.

It's free to switch to a night rate tariff currently, not sure there has ever been a charge for the actual switch. Your standing charge does increase.

ted1 · 18-02-2021 11:01am

hawthorne wrote: »

The smart meter is in theory a good idea.
In reality it is a waste of resources and not environmental friendly at all.

Tests done confirmed that the vast majority of consumers did not save a single penny. The most it was about 3%- which was offset with the long term charges of the installations.
The meter itself has a limited lifespan. While an analogue meter easily works fine over 50 years, the smart meter needs to be replaced every 7 years or so. The smart reading won't be that smart at all after that time- in fact the reading is a lot of phantasy. Which costs you at lot.
Ever looked inside one of those meters? Full of electronic components- which need to be produced. An analogue meter is a very simple thing easily made. What will happen with the meter when it gets replaced? Will it be recycled? Bet it will- like the over 80% of all EU produced electronic junk ends in Ghana or some other country. The damage the production causes are considerable as well.
The job of the meter reader is gone- like so many other jobs simply vanish. We are told the jobs will be created somewhere else- but they won't. Look around you. It happens all over the place.
I have no problem with OP if he wishes to opt out. It is a wise move.

never heard such rubbish

ted1 · 18-02-2021 11:07am

Del2005 wrote: »

My parents and sister got smart meters installed recently. Neither got anything for them to monitor their usage, is that not supposed to be the point of installing them?

Its coming. The telecoms side is going live end of this month. Electric Ireland are starting a soft launch over the next few days with beta testers. it'll give the option of 24 hour tariffs or, night, day and Peak. half hour data will be made available to the user and the system should learn and display what devices were on to cause peaks. I guess they can learn the profile of electric showers, cookers etc easy enough. also there is an option for monthly billing

KCross · 18-02-2021 11:54am

ted1 wrote: »

Its coming. The telecoms side is going live end of this month. Electric Ireland are starting a soft launch over the next few days with beta testers. it'll give the option of 24 hour tariffs or, night, day and Peak. half hour data will be made available to the user and the system should learn and display what devices were on to cause peaks. I guess they can learn the profile of electric showers, cookers etc easy enough. also there is an option for monthly billing

Thats good to hear. The last time I tried to get a smart meter they wouldnt allow day/night rate so I had to reject it.

With a Solar PV Feed-in-tariff coming in July 2021 its important that the smart meters support the day/night tariff.

Gestureapo · 18-02-2021 12:03pm

KCross wrote: »

Thats good to hear. The last time I tried to get a smart meter they wouldnt allow day/night rate so I had to reject it.

With a Solar PV Feed-in-tariff coming in July 2021 its important that the smart meters support the day/night tariff.

Strange

When the switch to digital meters first came in ,.they had the day/night built-in

That's going back about 15 years or more if I recall

John.G · 18-02-2021 12:27pm

I have nothing against modern technology and will be getting one of these meters, I have a 50 year old Ferranti which has a rotating disc, very handy for calculating power, I know most people have no usage for such but the new meters I believe don't even display one decimal point of kwh, it should also have been relatively easy to display the power in watts.

KCross · 18-02-2021 12:32pm

Gestureapo wrote: »

Strange

When the switch to digital meters first came in ,.they had the day/night built-in

That's going back about 15 years or more if I recall

The new smart meters already supported day/night but I believe the back office systems to process the data were not yet setup for day/night. That was over a year ago.

Looks like they have that sorted now (or at least close to having it sorted).

Gestureapo · 18-02-2021 12:34pm

John.G wrote: »

I have nothing against modern technology and will be getting one of these meters, I have a 50 year old Ferranti which has a rotating disc, very handy for calculating power, I know most people have no usage for such but the new meters I believe don't even display one decimal point of kwh, it should also have been relatively easy to display the power in watts.

Better off without the decimal place imo, causes confusion in relation to meter reading

People sometimes get confused between display display and accuracy

Just because you have a digital readout doesn't necessarily means it's accurate

km991148 · 18-02-2021 12:35pm

Del2005 wrote: »

My parents and sister got smart meters installed recently. Neither got anything for them to monitor their usage, is that not supposed to be the point of installing them?

No, the point is really for the power companies (better control over those that cannot pay - a growing concern as fuel costs increase) and more data to monetise (as well as being a bit of a gravy train for the companies that get the contracts to build and install them).

The rest is just dross being touted as beneficial to the (generally) non tech savvy consumer.

For clarity - I am not anti-vaxx, I don't own a tinfoil hat, I don't believe the guberment want to put microchips on our brains etc. This is actually one of the dangers modern day conspiracy theories present - its very easy to dismiss anything as a conspiracy theory because there is so much noise out there, even when there are valid concerns - such as the storage and usage of consumer data or the awarding of huge contracts etc.

Gestureapo · 18-02-2021 12:38pm

km991148 wrote: »

No, the point is really for the power companies (better control over those that cannot pay - a growing concern as fuel costs increase) and more data to monetise (as well as being a bit of a gravy train for the companies that get the contracts to build and install them).

The rest is just dross being touted as beneficial to the (generally) non tech savvy consumer.

For clarity - I am not anti-vaxx, I don't own a tinfoil hat, I don't believe the guberment want to put microchips on our brains etc. This is actually one of the dangers modern day conspiracy theories present - its very easy to dismiss anything as a conspiracy theory because there is so much noise out there, even when there are valid concerns over the storage and usage of consumer data.

Reality is moving into what was once conspiracy theory territory

Slowly but it's definitely happening

CoBo55 · 18-02-2021 12:58pm

Gestureapo wrote: »

Reality is moving into what was once conspiracy theory territory

Slowly but it's definitely happening

Ha ha, post of the day, the twilight zone tune is in my head:D:D

Gestureapo · 18-02-2021 1:03pm

CoBo55 wrote: »

Ha ha, post of the day, the twilight zone tune is in my head:D:D

Never would have thought it myself but there's definitely crossover now

CoBo55 · 18-02-2021 1:06pm

Gestureapo wrote: »

Never would have thought it myself but there's definitely crossover now

Digging digging digging... Mind your sammiges...

KCross · 18-02-2021 1:09pm

km991148 wrote: »

No, the point is really for the power companies (better control over those that cannot pay - a growing concern as fuel costs increase) and more data to monetise (as well as being a bit of a gravy train for the companies that get the contracts to build and install them).

And we are paying €1b to deploy these smart meters... a billion, not a million! :eek:

I like the idea of the smart meters and I dont buy into the conspiracy theory stuff on here, but the cost is eye watering for what it actually returns.

John.G · 18-02-2021 1:25pm

Gestureapo wrote: »

Better off without the decimal place imo, causes confusion in relation to meter reading

People sometimes get confused between display display and accuracy

Just because you have a digital readout doesn't necessarily means it's accurate

Can't see why it it should cause confusion as the meters will only be manually read for a very brief period.

I am very disappointed though that the power isn't displayed, if it isn't accurate then the kwh will not be accurate as the kwh is the accumulation of the power in kw, just using a example from 30 years ago and some digital metering that we had, the scan time was relatively slow at 2 secs, so every 2 secs the measured kw way multiplied by a factor of 0.0005556 (2/3600) and accumulated, so if the power measurement was incorrect the energy measurement was too.

There was very smart metering out well over half a century ago and these caused no confusion whatsoever in meter reading as in the example below only the first 4 digits were read and the "units" were then X 100 for billing purposes but one could still get a very accurate reading of the energy usage as it was displayed, why the big deal in not supplying a little more info to the consumer with these smart meters??.

Gestureapo · 18-02-2021 3:08pm

John.G wrote: »

Can't see why it it should cause confusion as the meters will only be manually read for a very brief period.

I am very disappointed though that the power isn't displayed, if it isn't accurate then the kwh will not be accurate as the kwh is the accumulation of the power in kw, just using a example from 30 years ago and some digital metering that we had, the scan time was relatively slow at 2 secs, so every 2 secs the measured kw way multiplied by a factor of 0.0005556 (2/3600) and accumulated, so if the power measurement was incorrect the energy measurement was too.

There was very smart metering out well over half a century ago and these caused no confusion whatsoever in meter reading as in the example below only the first 4 digits were read and the "units" were then X 100 for billing purposes but one could still get a very accurate reading of the energy usage as it was displayed, why the big deal in not supplying a little more info to the consumer with these smart meters??.

What is the use of a decimal place on a meter readout?

It adds to confusion on the old system too where customers take readings themselves

coylemj · 18-02-2021 4:05pm

km991148 wrote: »

No, the point is really for the power companies (better control over those that cannot pay - a growing concern as fuel costs increase) and more data to monetise (as well as being a bit of a gravy train for the companies that get the contracts to build and install them).

The rest is just dross being touted as beneficial to the (generally) non tech savvy consumer.

Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture. The principal reasons for rolling out smart meters is so that variable tariffs (based on time of day) can be applied to people who only have a single meter.

The underlying motive is to flatten the demand curve, especially during the peak period in the late afternoon/early evening (5-7) when (in normal times) offices are still open, children are home from school and a lot of people are home from work. Charging peak rates during this period (when your smart meter shows 'T3') will be designed to discourage people from using the likes of dishwashers and washing machines until later in the day.

Eliminating or reducing spikes in demand will result in reductions in the amount of power required in the grid, this will yield savings in power generation and reductions in CO2 emissions. And will require less new generation infrastructure. All of which will be a positive development.

km991148 · 18-02-2021 4:39pm

coylemj wrote: »

Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture. The principal reasons for rolling out smart meters is so that variable tariffs (based on time of day) can be applied to people who only have a single meter.

The underlying motive is to flatten the demand curve, especially during the peak period in the late afternoon/early evening (5-7) when (in normal times) offices are still open, children are home from school and a lot of people are home from work. Charging peak rates during this period (when your smart meter shows 'T3') will be designed to discourage people from using the likes of dishwashers and washing machines until later in the day.

Eliminating or reducing spikes in demand will result in reductions in the amount of power required in the grid, this will yield savings in power generation and reductions in CO2 emissions. And will require less new generation infrastructure. All of which will be a positive development.

That's fair enough - but I can still see why some people would refuse them - as the powers that be (I mean energy companies etc not some secret lizard cabal) will act like cheap ass opportunistic bar-stewards and pay scant attention to data security and shoehorn in a bunch of self serving "features".

Lets not pretend that energy companies are really interested in either (a) selling less energy or (b) the consumer.

km991148 · 18-02-2021 4:42pm

KCross wrote: »

And we are paying €1b to deploy these smart meters... a billion, not a million! :eek:

I like the idea of the smart meters and I dont buy into the conspiracy theory stuff on here, but the cost is eye watering for what it actually returns.

yeah look - its not a conspiracy - its just the usual mix of:

a) will the system be secure (probably not as security costs money)
b) will your data be secure (again, probably as secure as you would like)
b) Will the system be exploited to some degree while the energy companies work out ways to further monetise (including the ability to cut people off).

You only need to look across the Atlantic to see currently how energy companies are screwing over the consumers.

and that's it.. just another ****ty stick for the the end user to take (while paying through the nose for it).

Gestureapo · 18-02-2021 4:46pm

coylemj wrote: »

Sometimes you have to look at the bigger picture. The principal reasons for rolling out smart meters is so that variable tariffs (based on time of day) can be applied to people who only have a single meter.

The underlying motive is to flatten the demand curve, especially during the peak period in the late afternoon/early evening (5-7) when (in normal times) offices are still open, children are home from school and a lot of people are home from work. Charging peak rates during this period (when your smart meter shows 'T3') will be designed to discourage people from using the likes of dishwashers and washing machines until later in the day.

Eliminating or reducing spikes in demand will result in reductions in the amount of power required in the grid, this will yield savings in power generation and reductions in CO2 emissions. And will require less new generation infrastructure. All of which will be a positive development.

They could have implemented the peak rate with a regular digital meter could they not?

I remember when the digital meters first came in c. 15-20 yrs ago they had a T1 and a T2 plus a T1+T2 readouts if I recall.

What would be the main reasons leaving aside the 'big brother' possibilities?

Remote meter readings..

Remote change of tarriffs..

Remote disconnection ...

Remote Real-time readouts

Consumer smart readings, usage ,billing, etc

Off the top of my head , could be off on some of them

ted1 · 18-02-2021 4:48pm

km991148 wrote: »

That's fair enough - but I can still see why some people would refuse them - as the powers that be (I mean energy companies etc not some secret lizard cabal) will act like cheap ass opportunistic bar-stewards and pay scant attention to data security and shoehorn in a bunch of self serving "features".

Lets not pretend that energy companies are really interested in either (a) selling less energy or (b) the consumer.

Let’s not forget we have the toughest data protection. rules and commission on Europe. Possibly the world.

Your concerns are not really valid

gussieg · 18-02-2021 4:54pm

im surprised all you tech heads have not factored in the main reason you dont want one...who do you think is paying for the calls the smartmeter sim is making to relay all this information back to base? and if it runs on wifi, well thats assuming you have wifi and again theyre using yours, not theirs.
and as for chips in our heads, sure theyre injecting it in with the vaccines

km991148 · 18-02-2021 5:10pm

ted1 wrote: »

Let’s not forget we have the toughest data protection. rules and commission on Europe. Possibly the world.

Your concerns are not really valid

yeah ok.. My 20+ years industry experience tells me different..

A slap on the wrist fine from a toothless regulator for a data breech is not a deterrent*, rather just the cost of doing business (i.e. the cheapest of doing something correctly vs not having to bother).

I would go and find a whole lot of examples and pasted them here, but a 2 second google will back me up here..

Meanwhile, feel free to enjoy the 'benefits' you get from downloading some crappy half arsed phone app that drains your battery and requires GPS and every other permission..

*(In fairness fines have increased, but I am not sure its enough to make a real difference, not when you consider the numbers involved)

coylemj · 18-02-2021 5:56pm

km991148 wrote: »

I would go and find a whole lot of examples and pasted them here, but a 2 second google will back me up here..

Will it now?

A 2 second Google search will also get you proof of the existence of the Loch Ness Monster.

John.G · 18-02-2021 6:23pm

On the old systems one just read the white numbers.

Whatever about displaying a decimal point how is one supposed to monitor their usage if the load isn't displayed?, do you not think it just might be "smart" to do so except that there is some technical reason for it?, maybe the smart people who design them do so for dumb customers.

km991148 · 18-02-2021 6:23pm

coylemj wrote: »

Will it now?

A 2 second Google search will also get you proof of the existence of the Loch Ness Monster.

Cute :-)

But you know the point I'm making. Data breaches happen all the time. There is no real deterant. No real need to try and undermine the point if you don't agree with it?

Gestureapo · 18-02-2021 6:25pm

You can't take regulation in isolation

Regulation, enforcement, compliance ,breaches,

Smart meter opt out

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