COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 2 [Mod Warning - Post #1]

eoinbn · 06-02-2021 12:07PM

chrisbonnie wrote: »

I'm not an expert on the matter, far from it actually. But im fairly sure the CureVac has been funded massively by the EU, so any orders from them, be it 1st or 2nd generation, you would imagine we'll have good access to.

The EU has put in some money but most of it came directly from Germany. We will have to give them billions for a vaccine that we won't use as it will be delivered too late.
Curevac have signed over the rights to GSK for their second gen vaccines - except for in Germany, Austria and Switzerland. The rest of the EU will have to deal with GSK which will very likely take a UK first approach.

Stheno · 06-02-2021 12:11PM

Happydays2020 wrote: »

I think the Government (the CMO) were right. It would be a mess otherwise. Best to have certainty than people having ‘options’ - and all the issues that would go with that in terms of which vaccines go where. Plus Pfizer and Moderna will give greater efficacy at an earlier date (AZ is 12 weeks between shots) so there are benefits there also.

But they also need to see how they use this as an opportunity for getting AZ to less vulnerable.

What gets me is the poor communications. There should really be an effort to ensure the messaging is consistent

KlArmy · 06-02-2021 12:14PM

Stheno wrote: »

What gets me is the poor communications. There should really be an effort to ensure the messaging is consistent

It's been very poor

We literally have our leaders leaking and talking soundbytes and flying kites here and there

Awful stuff

Danzy · 06-02-2021 12:14PM

eoinbn wrote: »

The EU has put in some money but most of it came directly from Germany. We will have to give them billions for a vaccine that we won't use as it will be delivered too late.
Curevac have signed over the rights to GSK for their second gen vaccines - except for in Germany, Austria and Switzerland. The rest of the EU will have to deal with GSK which will very likely take a UK first approach.

Britain will be largely done by the time GSK is approved. So it will probably all be for the EU then.

As you say, it will be late, end of year.

It may be a boon to the EU as it looks like it will still be vaccinating significantly for s year to come.

Happydays2020 · 06-02-2021 12:26PM

Stheno wrote: »

What gets me is the poor communications. There should really be an effort to ensure the messaging is consistent

The problem is that too many people are talking. There is a reason why there needs to be an element of secrecy in policy making until the final decision is made.

KlArmy · 06-02-2021 12:31PM

Danzy wrote: »

Britain will be largely done by the time GSK is approved. So it will probably all be for the EU then.

As you say, it will be late, end of year.

It may be a boon to the EU as it looks like it will still be vaccinating significantly for s year to come.

Will it though?

The UK and Israel will have moved onto the next-gen vaccines well before the rest

ACitizenErased · 06-02-2021 12:34PM

Not sure why there’s previous posts suggesting NIAC were overruled, that is simply not true.

NIAC recommended that if possible people over 70 should get an RNA vaccine. The HSE decided this is possible, so it’s happening.

JTMan · 06-02-2021 12:37PM

The Times reports here (paywall) on the leaked real timetable for vaccinations in the UK. Vaccinations might be largely finished by the end of May. Although some say it might be June.

- All the over-50s will be inoculated by the end of April.
- The great majority of adults will have received a coronavirus jab by the end of May.
- Pressure to remove all restrictions by the end of April.

Again, hopefully the UK will start sending excess supply here in May, in part to help protect Northern Ireland.

KlArmy · 06-02-2021 12:39PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Not sure why there’s previous posts suggesting NIAC were overruled, that is simply not true.

NIAC recommended that if possible people over 70 should get an RNA vaccine. The HSE decided this is possible, so it’s happening.

Not fully accurate

NIAC said vaccination of over 70s shouldn't be delayed

Dr Holohans advice means it will be delayed

ACitizenErased · 06-02-2021 12:41PM

KlArmy wrote: »

Not fully accurate

NIAC said vaccination of over 70s shouldn't be delayed

Dr Holohans advice means it will be delayed

?
The only thing delaying it is the delivery of the RNA vaccines and as time passes due to the reduced two dose schedule it’ll all work out the same anyway?

polesheep · 06-02-2021 12:44PM

Stheno wrote: »

Apparently Holohan did

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/no-one-in-government-has-appetite-to-push-back-against-holohan-1.4477368?mode=amp

Why would anyone continue to serve on the NIAC?

Doc07 · 06-02-2021 12:45PM

KlArmy wrote: »

Not fully accurate

NIAC said vaccination of over 70s shouldn't be delayed

Dr Holohans advice means it will be delayed

That’s not fully accurate either but I appreciate various sound bites and articles have not always been as clear as they could have.

If there were half a million doses of AZ ready to go across GPs and community pharmacies then yes, the preferences for mRNA vaccines would be a delay. But in the grand scheme of things there are feck all doses of AZ coming next couple weeks.

CMO request to HSE is to get on and vaccinate using the preferred vaccines WITHOUT delaying.
It will be a challenge but it is not an automatic acceptance of any major delay for that age/priority group. The HSE and GP partners etc now have the challenge to deliver and they will aim to do that without any significant delay.

ACitizenErased · 06-02-2021 12:47PM

Doc07 wrote: »

That’s not fully accurate either but I appreciate various sound bites and articles have not always been as clear as they could have.

If there were half a million doses of AZ ready to go across GPs and community pharmacies then yes, the preferences for mRNA vaccines would be a delay. But in the grand scheme of things there are feck all doses of AZ coming next couple weeks.

CMO request to HSE is to get on and vaccinate using the preferred vaccines WITHOUT delaying.
It will be a challenge but it is not an automatic acceptance of any major delay for that age/priority group. The HSE and GP partners etc now have the challenge to deliver and they will aim to do that without any significant delay.

This, exactly.

Doc07 · 06-02-2021 12:49PM

polesheep wrote: »

Why would anyone continue to serve on the NIAC?

NIAC have no problem with the CMO. It might suit newspapers to pit NIAC versus Tony or Tony versus Government or NPHET versus Rocky IV or whatever but it doesn’t mean that they are not all actually trying to work together in best interest of us most of the time anyway.

stephenjmcd · 06-02-2021 12:49PM

JTMan wrote: »

The Times reports here (paywall) on the leaked real timetable for vaccinations in the UK. Vaccinations might be largely finished by the end of May. Although some say it might be June.

- All the over-50s will be inoculated by the end of April.
- The great majority of adults will have received a coronavirus jab by the end of May.
- Pressure to remove all restrictions by the end of April.

Again, hopefully the UK will start sending excess supply here in May, in part to help protect Northern Ireland.

"A coronavirus jab" in other words first dose. They won't be finished by then, they need the 2nd dose.

So they might have partial protection but to declare the vacinations complete/finished wouldn't be accurate.

Doc07 · 06-02-2021 12:53PM

JTMan wrote: »

The Times reports here (paywall) on the leaked real timetable for vaccinations in the UK. Vaccinations might be largely finished by the end of May. Although some say it might be June.

- All the over-50s will be inoculated by the end of April.
- The great majority of adults will have received a coronavirus jab by the end of May.
- Pressure to remove all restrictions by the end of April.

Again, hopefully the UK will start sending excess supply here in May, in part to help protect Northern Ireland.

I presume that means first doses given, very admirable but remember you got to add on another
3 months before you can say those groups have been vaccinated.

Danzy · 06-02-2021 12:55PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

"A coronavirus jab" in other words first dose. They won't be finished by then, they need the 2nd dose.

So they might have partial protection but to declare the vacinations complete/finished wouldn't be accurate.

No, but there over 50s ,at least, will be done fully by then.

It's very impressive either way.

lbj666 · 06-02-2021 01:10PM

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/covid-19-what-are-the-vaccination-timelines-for-the-months-ahead-1.4477288

Think it is a repost but sums up the situation quiet well at the minute.

9 big MCVs, 25 Medium MCVs which is good to see.

Breege_M · 06-02-2021 01:21PM

Has any EU country decided to vaccinate over 70s with AstraZenica?
Most of the larger EU countries are not going to give it to over 65s.

If we had taken a different approach and followed the UK, I can just imagine the media’s response, with a consequential undermining of the vaccine program.

Happydays2020 · 06-02-2021 01:22PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Not sure why there’s previous posts suggesting NIAC were overruled, that is simply not true.

NIAC recommended that if possible people over 70 should get an RNA vaccine. The HSE decided this is possible, so it’s happening.

I have switched off RTÉ at this point and I am close to cancelling my IT subscription. The media here are a joke and a disgrace.

ACitizenErased · 06-02-2021 03:10PM

https://twitter.com/roinnslainte/status/1358054206331121670?s=20

cameramonkey · 06-02-2021 03:15PM

https://twitter.com/redouad/status/1358053423158075395

malta paying double price to get vaccines quickly.

astrofool · 06-02-2021 03:21PM

cameramonkey wrote: »

https://twitter.com/redouad/status/1358053423158075395

malta paying double price to get vaccines quickly.

Here's the important thing.

Malta is small enough that it can do that without really effecting rollout elsewhere.

If everyone were to do that, Ireland would lose out because we would be outbid by multiple other countries.

Which is the point of buying things as the EU.

3.2.1. to an idiot suggesting otherwise.

is_that_so · 06-02-2021 04:10PM

Stheno wrote: »

Apparently Holohan did

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/no-one-in-government-has-appetite-to-push-back-against-holohan-1.4477368?mode=amp

Yeah, the IT, for some reason, have really had it in for the CMO since March. It bemuses me to see they can still put all of this down to a single solitary person, despite the 50 odd people on NPHET and the NIAC and HSE input on all of this. You can now add Spain to the growing list of countries who've done the same on AZ. It really is all about the low numbers of older people in their trial.

RugbyLad11 · 06-02-2021 04:40PM

cameramonkey wrote: »

https://twitter.com/redouad/status/1358053423158075395

malta paying double price to get vaccines quickly.

So much for European solidarity. I'm just hoping that the UK send us some doses when they are finished because the EU is doing a sh*t job and people are going to lose their lives over it.

06-02-2021 04:51PM

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

So much for European solidarity. I'm just hoping that the UK send us some doses when they are finished because the EU is doing a sh*t job and people are going to lose their lives over it.

Outside a handful of countries, which happen to include 2 that we consume as lot of media from, nearly all the countries near the top of the vaccine rollout list are EU countries. What the EU have done is ensure the entire bloc has equal access. In the absence of this type of deal it would be an ugly free for all with some places with no access as prices get pushed higher and higher.

For context look at how the likes of Canada, Australia and Japan are doing

Water John · 06-02-2021 04:59PM

People would be really upset if they were in the US, where something over half the vaccines distributed are actually administered at this point.

ACitizenErased · 06-02-2021 05:10PM

Happy Saturday!
https://twitter.com/DonnellyStephen/status/1358083299370029066?s=20

NeuralNetwork · 06-02-2021 05:11PM

That Maltese situation is a bit ridiculous. If it's going to be a case that we all invested money in buying vaccines together and then some countries are just going to slip the companies extra money to skip the queue the whole thing will fall apart.

Whatever about buying vaccines outside the programme, that sounds like they've been paying companies off to speed up delivery of the EU vaccines and it needs to be clarified.

Being small is one thing, but if that were done by a larger country the whole programme could be screwed up.

What's the point of the European joint-purchase programme if that's going to be the way things operate.

It is supposed to be completely proportionate allocation based on population.

hynesie08 · 06-02-2021 05:15PM

WRT Malta, what the hell does this bit mean?

Deputy Prime Minister and Health Minister Chris Fearne said Malta will be buying more vaccine doses than it needs. He explained that while some doses from those ordered might not arrive, any doses in excess will be given to other countries in need.

Who are they buying from?

COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 2 [Mod Warning - Post #1]

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