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Covid 19 Part XXXI-187,554 ROI (2,970 deaths) 100,319 NI (1,730 deaths)(24/01)Read OP

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Comments

  • #6542
    caveat emptor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,134 ✭✭✭caveat emptor


    CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »
    Dr Holohan has talked plenty about the dangers of travel. NPHET have consistently recommended restrictions on foreign travel but political leadership feel happy to ignore it.

    Honestly this is crazy at this stage I think it comes down to politicians looking out for their friends. How else will they get to their villas in Europe?


  • #6543
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,308 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    TonyMaloney wrote: »
    I think that's wildly optimistic unfortunately.

    Maybe it is maybe it is not. Nobody knows either way.


  • #6544
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    CrabRevolution wrote: »
    I think this could be a big problem. There'll be a press release in February stating 99% HCWs and nursing home residents have been vaccinated, and people will take that to mean it's all over and we can just act as if the virus is gone.

    I'm taking all contact numbers and claimed sources of infection with a pinch of salt. We only have the infected person's word for it, and I simply don't believe that they're owning up to having relatives over for tea or meeting up for cans in a friend's house. We saw yesterday a doctor saying a person who tested positive claiming their only human interaction was picking up their shopping from a person standing 3 meters away. Not a chance of it.
    Sure but even at an average level of 2-3 you are also going to find people with 5 or more contacts.


  • #6545
    c68zapdsm5i1ru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,709 ✭✭✭c68zapdsm5i1ru


    CrabRevolution wrote: »
    I think this could be a big problem. There'll be a press release in February stating 99% HCWs and nursing home residents have been vaccinated, and people will take that to mean it's all over and we can just act as if the virus is gone.

    I'm taking all contact numbers and claimed sources of infection with a pinch of salt. We only have the infected person's word for it, and I simply don't believe that they're owning up to having relatives over for tea or meeting up for cans in a friend's house. We saw yesterday a doctor saying a person who tested positive claiming their only human interaction was picking up their shopping from a person standing 3 meters away. Not a chance of it.

    Yes I really do wonder how many of those saying they really don't know how they got it, they've hardly been out of the house are telling the truth and how many are not bothering to mention the couple of friends who called around for coffee, the neighbours who just dropped in for a drink on New Year's Eve, the hugs they got from their grandchildren etc.


  • #6546
    Icyseanfitz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,533 ✭✭✭Icyseanfitz


    What are the hospital numbers today?


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  • #6547
    caveat emptor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,134 ✭✭✭caveat emptor


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    Zero Covid is not possible. That is not to say that measures cannot be taken and mistakes were not made. I advocated for PCR testing months ago but a strict quarantine policy (with the open border) would be the single biggest economic own goal in 100 years.

    Do you not think that the gradual dumbing down of the next generation is an issue? Not to mention the effect it has on their developing social skills. If this goes on much longer their will be serious long term consequences.

    It's terrible to say it but we might have to change the currency to be denominated in 3s as that's as far as they got in the times tables for example.

    scary stuff.


  • #6548
    DOCARCH
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,931 Mod ✭✭✭✭DOCARCH


    Icyseanfitz wrote: »
    What are the hospital numbers today?

    1923 hospitalized/195 in ICU.


  • #6549
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    caveat emptor wrote: »
    Do you not think that the gradual dumbing down of the next generation is an issue? Not to mention the effect it has on their developing social skills. If this goes on much longer their will be serious long term consequences.

    It's terrible to say it but we might have to change the currency to be denominated in 3s as that's as far as they got in the times tables for example.

    scary stuff.

    There is no reason why schools cannot open in 3/4 weeks time. And no reason why we cannot add a few weeks on at the end without damaging education. At the same time, an unworkable ZC strategy will do more harm than good.


  • #6550
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    DOCARCH wrote: »
    1923 hospitalized/195 in ICU.
    Donnelly also just said that ICU peak is expected to be 1-2 weeks away. The only positive is that the rate of increase in ICU patients seems to have slowed a good bit.


  • #6551
    ginoginelli
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭ginoginelli


    caveat emptor wrote: »
    Honestly this is crazy at this stage I think it comes down to politicians looking out for their friends. How else will they get to their villas in Europe?

    If this was the army they would be courtmartshalled. They have repeatedly and inexplicably ignored the scientific advice since march and sabotaged the country and its people.


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  • #6552
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    Zero Covid is not possible. That is not to say that measures cannot be taken and mistakes were not made. I advocated for PCR testing months ago but a strict quarantine policy (with the open border) would be the single biggest economic own goal in 100 years.

    Surely the fact several countries have achieved it,shows zero covid is possible??

    The UK has a quarantine policy now aswell.....surely it makes sense to approach it,on an all island basis?


  • #6553
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    ginoginelli wrote: »
    If this was the army they would be courtmartshalled. They have repeatedly and inexplicably ignored the scientific advice since march and sabotaged the country and its people.
    The "ignoring science" bit has only really happened twice, once in October and once in the run-up to Christmas.


  • #6554
    CrabRevolution
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,959 ✭✭✭CrabRevolution


    Henley Tangy User wrote: »
    Yes I really do wonder how many of those saying they really don't know how they got it, they've hardly been out of the house are telling the truth and how many are not bothering to mention the couple of friends who called around for coffee, the neighbours who just dropped in for a drink on New Year's Eve, the hugs they got from their grandchildren etc.
    I find it a bit bizarre how we place so much stock in a number so obviously prone to selective reporting and bias. It's the same way that hospitality could claim only a fraction of a percent of infections occurred in pubs, because very few people were going to admit they caught Covid from a lock in at a pub with dozens of others.


  • #6555
    Purple Papillon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 36 ✭Purple Papillon


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Milder is not the issue, vaccinating those at highest risk should mean few to no hospitalisation and it being seen as little more than a common cold.

    My understanding of ICU care in hospitals is that old people like nursing home residents are not placed into ICUs for the most part because ICU doesnt benefit them. The people currently sent to hospital with this virus range in age from 37 to 75. That's from the article from the GPs yesterday. Many of these people fall low on the vaccination list yet they are still going to hospital. Vaccinating the nursing home and health care workers is not going to be a magic bullet. There will be many people in the population still vulnerable to this virus.


  • #6556
    TonyMaloney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,150 ✭✭✭TonyMaloney


    The people that are inexplicably opposed to zero covid don't seem to realise that we're experiencing most of the downside to zero covid anyway, and none of the upside.


  • #6557
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Purple Papillon wrote: »
    My understanding of ICU care in hospitals is that old people like nursing home residents are not placed into ICUs for the most part because ICU doesnt benefit them. The people currently sent to hospital with this virus range in age from 37 to 75. That's from the article from the GPs yesterday. Many of these people fall low on the vaccination list yet they are still going to hospital. Vaccinating the nursing home and health care workers is not going to be a magic bullet. There will be many people in the population still vulnerable to this virus.
    And as I've said it's frustrating to see how slow research is on the why and who of that.


  • #6558
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Surely the fact several countries have achieved it,shows zero covid is possible??

    The UK has a quarantine policy now aswell.....surely it makes sense to approach it,on an all island basis?

    Countries who have achieved this are primarily islands economies. We are part of the European Union and we also share an open border with a third country. We are a trading economy (services and goods).

    When we look at the data at the end of May, we will likely see that we will be far from the worst in terms of our response to the virus and will be up there with the best in providing supports for business and individuals.

    Mistakes have been made, but we have probably got more right than wrong. We are not NZ, Australia, or Taiwan...


  • #6559
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    TonyMaloney wrote: »
    The people that are inexplicably opposed to zero covid don't seem to realise that we're experiencing most of the downside to zero covid anyway, and none of the upside.

    Looking through a narrow prism then yes. But you don't take into account the most significant downsides of zero covid.

    Plus 12 months ago and 24 months ago and 36 months ago and so on and so forth our health service was overrun.


  • #6560
    ginoginelli
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭ginoginelli


    TonyMaloney wrote: »
    The people that are inexplicably opposed to zero covid don't seem to realise that we're experiencing most of the downside to zero covid anyway, and none of the upside.

    It doesnt even have to be zero covid. The Korean approach has proven to control the virus.

    Strict 2 week quarantine for all arrivals. (This is key)
    Effective track and trace.
    Appropriate mask use.

    Once we reduced the numbers significantly in the community we could then comfortably "live with covid" until widespread vaccination.


  • #6561
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Happydays2020 wrote: »
    Countries who have achieved this are primarily islands economies. We are part of the European Union and we also share an open border with a third country. We are a trading economy (services and goods).

    When we look at the data at the end of May, we will likely see that we will be far from the worst in terms of our response to the virus and will be up there with the best in providing supports for business and individuals.

    Mistakes have been made, but we have probably got more right than wrong. We are not NZ, Australia, or Taiwan...

    Correct if im wrong....are we not an island nz,relies on oz for trade,travel etc to similar extent eire and the uk/eu



    IBEC and other business lobby groups have failed their membership for not pushing government to persue a zero covid stragedy.....these repeated lockdowns have wiped out many small/medium independant retailers and businesses


    The uk now has a quarantine stragedy,we should persue this on an all ireland basis as no excuse not to exists anymore...and be back effecrively fully open by easter (april 4th)

    or else we will still be pricking around with lockdowns pretending we are world leaders and needing another lockdown next september to get schools open




    Our stragedy to live with a highly contagious virus that kills the old and sick was been spectacurlarly stupid and short sighted,done more damage than it worth....has the cost/benefit anaysis been released yet on opening up for xmas vs what this lockdown is going to cost us??


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  • #6562
    GeorgeBailey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭GeorgeBailey


    The lack of quarantine on people coming into the country has been the most infuriating part of the last 12 months for me. Any time a politician is asked about it they are allowed get away with soft-ball answers and "arra shur there's the north anyway, there'd be no point" and they move on to something else.

    Seeing pictures of Gardai enforcing the 5km limit makes it all the more galling. I can't travel more than 5km but anyone who wants to can come into the country no problem. Enforce restrictions on those who are here already doing our best to follow guidelines but Paddy Mammysboy can come on back from wherever with his new more infectious variant.


  • #6563
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Correct if im wrong....are we not an island nz,relies on oz for trade,travel etc to similar extent eire and the uk/eu



    IBEC and other business lobby groups have failed their membership for not pushing government to persue a zero covid stragedy.....these repeated lockdowns have wiped out many small/medium independant retailers and businesses


    The uk now has a quarantine stragedy,we should persue this on an all ireland basis as no excuse not to exists anymore...and be back effecrively fully open by easter (april 4th)

    or else we will still be pricking around with lockdowns pretending we are world leaders and needing another lockdown next september to get schools open




    Our stragedy to live with a highly contagious virus that kills the old and sick was been spectacurlarly stupid and short sighted,done more damage than it worth....has the cost/benefit anaysis been released yet on opening up for xmas vs what this lockdown is going to cost us??

    We are part of a wider economic single market with freedom of movement for people and goods. We share the island with a 3rd country jurisdiction and neither jurisdiction is aligned in their policies. We have an open border which will not be closed for multiple reasons.

    The nature of our trade is that we rely on hauliers. We do not have the infrastructure for the alternative.

    what are your variables for your cost benefit analysis?

    Do you want to benchmark against the UK?


  • #6564
    Donald Trump
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,327 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    podgeandrodge wrote: »
    do we have figures for ages hospitalised with covid?




    Cumulative cases to 14th Jan


    Up to 5: 86
    5-15: 82
    15-25: 332
    25-35: 573
    35-45: 673
    45-55: 1025
    55-65: 1211
    65+: 4692


  • #6565
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,382 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Our attitude to the virus has been very bad from the start.

    No masks til the summer, no quarantine, no test upon arrival, little enforcement of rules, non compliance from the public etc.

    Had we a different chief medical officer, we may have handled things better.


  • #6566
    Antares35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,845 ✭✭✭Antares35


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    Our attitude to the virus has been very bad from the start.

    No masks til the summer, no quarantine, no test upon arrival, little enforcement of rules, non compliance from the public etc.

    When I see people wearing them around their necks I just lose faith in our ability to beat this.

    Also yes I remember at one point during the summer, we had a 5km restriction imposed but there were tourists from the US traveling around Kerry?


  • #6567
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,382 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Antares35 wrote: »
    When I see people wearing them around their necks I just lose faith in our ability to beat this.

    Also yes I remember at one point during the summer, we had a 5km restriction imposed but there were tourists from the US traveling around Kerry?

    It turns out the quarantine measures probably would have saved us more money as well.


  • #6568
    Purple Papillon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 36 ✭Purple Papillon


    GeorgeBailey wrote: »
    The lack of quarantine on people coming into the country has been the most infuriating part of the last 12 months for me. Any time a politician is asked about it they are allowed get away with soft-ball answers and "arra shur there's the north anyway, there'd be no point" and they move on to something else.

    Seeing pictures of Gardai enforcing the 5km limit makes it all the more galling. I can't travel more than 5km but anyone who wants to can come into the country no problem. Enforce restrictions on those who are here already doing our best to follow guidelines but Paddy Mammysboy can come on back from wherever with his new more infectious variant.

    It's stomach churning


  • #6569
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    There is an incredible amount of revisionism going on today. We have go our numbers down before and will do so again. The numbers over the last few days are 50% off the peak. Hopefully next Sunday they will be down to 2000 and heading towards 1000 the following week. The vast vast majority of people are compliant.


  • #6570
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    It turns out the quarantine measures probably would have saved us more money as well.

    Which ignores the fact that the export oriented side of the economy which has stayed open (and will be impacted by quarantining) is supporting the rest of the economy.


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  • #6571
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,086 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    A resident has a residence....somewhere to go and be tracked. A tourist does not (but there ate no tourists anyway). It’s risk mitigation, not elimination. Elimination, IMO, is not practically possible for a single country in Europe.....it could only be done on an EU wide coordinated basis

    But we won’t agree on ZC, so will leave it there

    Well your correct in we won’t agree but experience so far suggests residents that are asked to quarantine at home doesn’t happen.
    You still didn’t answer how a resident gets to their house without interacting with people.
    You haven’t answered how they’ll be made stay in their house, or how this will affect other members of their house that haven’t left Ireland.


This discussion has been closed.
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