Civil Servcie mobility scheme

The Third Policeman · 25-06-2020 7:17pm #1

Anyone have any indication when mobility will come back on stream for the civil service?

I'm a HEO the last few years and I'm happy out at the grade but a move wouldn't go amiss. Need a change of scene and a bit more experience under the belt.

SouthWesterly · 26-06-2020 8:48am

All, seem to be on, hold for now. Check with people point.

Aglomerado · 26-06-2020 11:25am

Seems to be stalled for COs and EOs at the moment. I would say the rollout to HEOs and APs is also delayed but best to check.

Skippette · 14-07-2020 1:05pm

Does anyone know, do you have to have 2 years service at HEO grade in order to get a "head to head" interdepartmental transfer?

I've been doing some searching but can't find anything definite for interdepartmental.

I know for the official mobility scheme it has to be 2 years at that grade in that location......

Would think the location thing might go because of WFH and would be 2 years with that Employer eg Revenue, Social Welfare, Agriculture??

doc22 · 14-07-2020 8:54pm

Skippette wrote: »

Does anyone know, do you have to have 2 years service at HEO grade in order to get a "head to head" interdepartmental transfer?

I've been doing some searching but can't find anything definite for interdepartmental.

I know for the official mobility scheme it has to be 2 years at that grade in that location......

Would think the location thing might go because of WFH and would be 2 years with that Employer eg Revenue, Social Welfare, Agriculture??

I doubt it, even WFH your still headquartered somewhere.

BRYAN Is Ainm Dom · 14-09-2020 12:10am

Anybody know why this is on hold at the moment. I know that they are staying it's because if covid but there appears to be quite a number of secondment opportunities happening at the moment.

The Third Policeman · 14-09-2020 8:45am

Covid is still the rationale it seems. Hopefully it will roll out soon. With the majority of civil servants working from home now they can't really justify having it on hold for much longer. Hopefully Forsa are pushing on the background.

R75MM · 15-09-2020 9:14am

BRYAN Is Ainm Dom wrote: »

Anybody know why this is on hold at the moment. I know that they are staying it's because if covid but there appears to be quite a number of secondment opportunities happening at the moment.

Where are you seeing these secondment opportunities?

Thanks,
-R7

BRYAN Is Ainm Dom · 17-09-2020 12:21pm

R75MM wrote: »

Where are you seeing these secondment opportunities?

Thanks,
-R7

Usually send via HR, maybe your HR unit is not sending them on. There has plenty of vacancies send since covid from Transport, Taoiseach (one today), Finance, OGP, AGS, just to name 5.

R75MM · 17-09-2020 2:52pm

BRYAN Is Ainm Dom wrote: »

Usually send via HR, maybe your HR unit is not sending them on. There has plenty of vacancies send since covid from Transport, Taoiseach (one today), Finance, OGP, AGS, just to name 5.

:-(
I see none of them at all. Are you in a Government department or a sub-agency? I'm in a sub-agency under Health so perhaps that's why.

doc22 · 17-09-2020 4:01pm

BRYAN Is Ainm Dom wrote: »

Usually send via HR, maybe your HR unit is not sending them on. There has plenty of vacancies send since covid from Transport, Taoiseach (one today), Finance, OGP, AGS, just to name 5.

Whats your grade

AndrewJRenko · 17-09-2020 8:23pm

R75MM wrote: »

:-(
I see none of them at all. Are you in a Government department or a sub-agency? I'm in a sub-agency under Health so perhaps that's why.

Most of these secondments are open to civil AND public servants, so you might want to get onto your own HR and/or your union to start getting them circulated in your agency.

OllieDro · 27-10-2020 9:57pm

Phase 2B HEO mobility going live in Jan 2021 !! Interestingly - Phase 2C AP mobility going live in Nov 2020. Typical eh!!!

doc22 · 27-10-2020 10:56pm

AP mobility liability seems to be taken from open panel while EOs who transfer taken promotion from Inter candidates

Skippette · 28-10-2020 12:30pm

Wonder why they're not going to run 2a first?
Looks like we will have to wait for positions to be advertised for 2b...

Phase 2A: general civil service grades of HEO and AO for list-based Mobility (similar to that for Phase 1 for the CO and EO grades)

Phase 2B: general civil service grades of HEO and AO for advertisement-based Mobility for positions that require qualifications or more specialist expertise. This will lead to more efficient use of existing skill sets within the Civil Service (e.g. ICT, HR, Finance, IGEES).

AlanPG · 28-10-2020 1:04pm

OllieDro wrote: »

Phase 2B HEO mobility going live in Jan 2021 !! Interestingly - Phase 2C AP mobility going live in Nov 2020. Typical eh!!!

I'd imagine the reason for this is that at least HEO's have an increased ability over AP's to move through union transfers (notwithstanding they are not easy to do). AP's have had no mobility options really, certainly not through the hapless AHCPS.

oooosk · 28-10-2020 1:14pm

AlanPG wrote: »

I'd imagine the reason for this is that at least HEO's have an increased ability over AP's to move through union transfers (notwithstanding they are not easy to do). AP's have had no mobility options really, certainly not through the hapless AHCPS.

Seemingly to do with difficulty filling HEO posts according to the Fórsa website:

"The union had been advised by the department that mobility for clerical and executive officers (COs and EOs) would resume, and that the scheme would be launched for administrative officers (AOs) and assistant principals (APs). However, there was concern among senior civil service management about commencing the scheme for HEOs due to ongoing difficulties in filling HEO posts."

https://forsatradeunion.newsweaver.com/designtest/sg472l11ylh?lang=en&a=2&p=58013183&t=30063856

paintitwhite · 28-10-2020 5:50pm

Is the 2 years service at current grade and location a strict rule that is never broken? Or if positions come up would it be possible to get a move after say 18 months?

mollzer13 · 28-10-2020 11:41pm

I was offered a transfer today (CO), and a bit quicker than I’d expected. Glad it’s up and running again!

customerunhap · 04-11-2020 1:13pm

Hi all,

I am a public servant coming up on two years service, so will be eligible when the HEO Mobility opens in January.

I have a few queries around it, which would be great to get some clarity on from other public servants.

I have looked at the mobility map zone, and FAQ’s for other grades, CO/EO etc. and wanted to clarify a few things with those who have already been through the process etc.

-If you apply and offered a job at an organisation, must you go through with it?

-Does the new organisation look at your current role, your qualifications/experience in relevant area and likely to give you similar work?

-Can you find out about what role will be in new organisation before accepting?

-My read is your current organisation can hold your application up for six months and then its reviewed. Have any Cos or Eos had applications for Mobility blocked by ‘parent organisations’ who don’t want to lose them?

-Any other factors to take in to consideration or experiences from COs or EOS?

-Bizarely, for those of us in Dublin it looks like you can essentially move around the city centre, and not to suburbia, I am looking at the blue four kilometre circle thing.

-The booklet states you may not have working from home option depending on agency where you go to?

-I am relatively new to the public sector, well and truly over my probation, but trying to find out which and I know it’s a very general question, but which departments generally provide the best opportunities to progress?

Imagine the likes of Taoiseach, Finance etc?

EamonS84 · 18-11-2020 9:28am

mollzer13 wrote: »

I was offered a transfer today (CO), and a bit quicker than I’d expected. Glad it’s up and running again!

Hi can I ask what part of the country you got your transfer in? I'm on the Limerick panel for Revenue and it doesn't seem to be moving at all.

Kirbi · 20-11-2020 10:21am

Hi, I'm going to reply based on the current rules. It's possible that they will have new ones for the launch (but doesn't seem too likely).

customerunhap wrote: »

-If you apply and offered a job at an organisation, must you go through with it?

If you receive a formal offer you can decline - but if you do, you'll forfeit all application to that Zone and will need to apply again to the bottom of the list.
Additionally, if you decline a formal offer to the same list twice, you'll be blocked from applying to it again for a while.

customerunhap wrote: »

-Does the new organisation look at your current role, your qualifications/experience in relevant area and likely to give you similar work?

No. They'll be looking at the vacancy they have, and just pulling from the top of the list to fill that position.

customerunhap wrote: »

-Can you find out about what role will be in new organisation before accepting?

Yes, but you'll need to reach out to them (the offering HR) for this. In general you should do this at pre-offer stage, where you have 3 days to cancel with less downside.

customerunhap wrote: »

-My read is your current organisation can hold your application up for six months and then its reviewed. Have any Cos or Eos had applications for Mobility blocked by ‘parent organisations’ who don’t want to lose them?

You seem to be talking about the location hold here (re the 6 months). That's not how that works - a location hold is applied to everyone in a single location (generally a building), not on an individual level. Additionally, it doesn't apply to an active process (has been moved to pre-offer already).

The suitability process, which can also restrict a move, can only be used in certain circumstances (disciplinary investigations or issues, sick leave review, etc.).

Basically, they're not allowed to just keep you because you're good.

They might be able to delay your start date for a little while to finish up a project or something though.

customerunhap wrote: »

-Any other factors to take in to consideration or experiences from COs or EOS?

Make sure you're set up correctly to receive the notifications from the system (home email on the system, be aware of the spam filter, etc), and pay attention to the deadlines involved.

customerunhap wrote: »

-The booklet states you may not have working from home option depending on agency where you go to?

This will depend on the role. Also, some training could need do be done in person, even if the role can be done at home.

customerunhap wrote: »

-I am relatively new to the public sector, well and truly over my probation, but trying to find out which and I know it’s a very general question, but which departments generally provide the best opportunities to progress?

Imagine the likes of Taoiseach, Finance etc?

I would add Revenue to that; they're the most modern and quick-moving of the larger organisations - the biggest other ones being DSP, Agriculture, Courts. These departments all have offices all over the country, which could mean potential to apply for a physical move in internal competitions.
They have their own internal promotion competitions fairly regularly, have a number of different areas, and are at the forefront of automation use in the civil service.

If you're thinking Dublin-specific, then Public Expenditure & Reform could be a good addition to your list - they'd be similar to Finance in some respects.

Strider84 · 20-11-2020 11:44am

Hi Folks, if I cancel an application for one organisation within a zone but I'm on wait list for the rest, is my application still good for the other departments? Just that it hasn't moved since mobility started up again. Thanks.

EB_2013 · 20-11-2020 12:21pm

Kirbi wrote: »

If you receive a formal offer you can decline - but if you do, you'll forfeit all application to that Zone and will need to apply again to the bottom of the list.

Thats not true, it only applies to that offer. If you have other applications in they will still apply.

grape86 · 20-11-2020 12:29pm

Hi, all. I see there is a separate form for the Irish Prison Service that you need to complete for mobility. Does anyone have any experience working in this Dept or can advise what the work is like? I know they have a slightly higher pay scales(EO) as they work a longer week and some weekends and have additional duties. I think the titles are PCO's and PEO's or something....

Kirbi · 20-11-2020 12:41pm

EB_2013 wrote: »

Thats not true, it only applies to that offer. If you have other applications in they will still apply.

You're thinking of pre-offer cancellation, I think. If you decline a formal offer, after you've already gone through pre-offer, you lose the Zone.

See questions 85 and 90 for reference on the current FAQs - https:// hr.per.gov.ie/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/FAQs-Civil-Service-Mobility-scheme-October-2020. pdf
(I've had to put some spaced in the url to post it - after the first slashes and before pdf.)

Other Zones are unaffected.

JP2020 · 03-12-2020 10:51am

Hi there
Can you apply for mobility after 1 or 2 years service, starting soon but relucatant based on initial mileage

Kirbi · 03-12-2020 11:03am

JP2020 wrote: »

Hi there
Can you apply for mobility after 1 or 2 years service, starting soon but relucatant based on initial mileage

You can (and probably should) apply immediately, but you need a minimum of 2 years service to receive an offer.

If you're not sure if you want the applications, just put them on hold until you've made your final decision.

There's no harm in having some applications - if you end up not wanting to move you can just cancel them later, cancel at pre-offer, or turn down the formal offer.

Kirbi · 03-12-2020 11:04am

Sorry, I should have mentioned that it's better to apply soon because you're mainly queued by date of application - so the earlier you apply, the higher up the list you'll be.

JP2020 · 03-12-2020 12:38pm

Kirbi wrote: »

Sorry, I should have mentioned that it's better to apply soon because you're mainly queued by date of application - so the earlier you apply, the higher up the list you'll be.

Thanks a million

Skippette · 12-01-2021 4:28pm

I see phase 2A is going live next week!

Unfortunately, it doesn't look like I'm eligible until Sept. (promoted June - moved office Sept)

I was looking at the interactive map and it shows up the departments in a location with a staff breakdown. But, I was wondering, the staff breakdown.......is that the amount of available positions or what they currently have on file?

All insights appreciated!!

Kirbi · 12-01-2021 4:35pm

It should be the total number of positions including those that are currently filled.

But I've heard that there's been delays getting the information for AO & HEO out of some depts - namely DSP; I think all of the DSP entries might still be blank for the new grades.

billyhead · 12-01-2021 6:03pm

Kirbi wrote: »

It should be the total number of positions including those that are currently filled.

But I've heard that there's been delays getting the information for AO & HEO out of some depts - namely DSP; I think all of the DSP entries might still be blank for the new grades.

It will be hard getting a mobility spot to a region in DEASP. There will already be an internal waiting list in place who will get 1st preference.

doc22 · 12-01-2021 7:10pm

billyhead wrote: »

It will be hard getting a mobility spot to a region in DEASP. There will already be an internal waiting list in place who will get 1st preference.

Are the lists long? if so the 1/6 positions will mean a long wait/never. Lots of young HEO/AOs too that will be in positions a long time....

Roast_Spuds · 13-01-2021 12:00am

Anyone know what it's like to work in Revenue? Having a look at the map at the moment for Cork and seems to be an option with a decent amount of staff.

beauf · 13-01-2021 1:11am

Probably quite taxing...

DUB142 · 18-01-2021 2:54am

I wonder how long it will take to get a decision back? I would imagine there will be a lot of applications.

Skippette · 18-01-2021 1:04pm

Fingers crossed things move quickly!

I've applied for different departments myself but I was in such a rush I think I'll have to change one or 2 of them because there doesn't appear to be a HEO listed there, though as far as I know they do have HEO's. Maybe they haven't updated their listing. BTW, its not Social Welfare, I don't fancy working there in my own town.

Mac0783 · 18-01-2021 4:39pm

Skippette wrote: »

Fingers crossed things move quickly!

I've applied for different departments myself but I was in such a rush I think I'll have to change one or 2 of them because there doesn't appear to be a HEO listed there, though as far as I know they do have HEO's. Maybe they haven't updated their listing. BTW, its not Social Welfare, I don't fancy working there in my own town.

Any worked in SW as a HEO? What's it like? What type of work generally?

Kirbi · 18-01-2021 6:10pm

Skippette wrote: »

Fingers crossed things move quickly!

I've applied for different departments myself but I was in such a rush I think I'll have to change one or 2 of them because there doesn't appear to be a HEO listed there, though as far as I know they do have HEO's. Maybe they haven't updated their listing. BTW, its not Social Welfare, I don't fancy working there in my own town.

From the map it looks like a bunch of Departments haven't provided figures at all. I count:

DSP
DFA
CSO
D/Children
D/Education
D/Health
D/Housing
D/Tourism
NCCA
Ombudsman for Children

I guess it's possible that some of the smaller ones don't have any generalist posts at these grades, but it doesn't seem likely.

BRYAN Is Ainm Dom · 18-01-2021 8:53pm

Kirbi wrote: »

From the map it looks like a bunch of Departments haven't provided figures at all. I count:

DSP
DFA
CSO
D/Children
D/Education
D/Health
D/Housing
D/Tourism
NCCA
Ombudsman for Children

I guess it's possible that some of the smaller ones don't have any generalist posts at these grades, but it doesn't seem likely.

A colleague told me months ago they contacted People Point on this, as was same with some EO positions and it was a case of when the map was being updated that Departments didn't provide the up to date info.

Skippette · 19-01-2021 9:25am

Mac0783 wrote: »

Any worked in SW as a HEO? What's it like? What type of work generally?

No sorry, haven't worked in SW, I probably wasn't clear, apologies.

I just don't fancy working there in my hometown, would know too many people and I wouldn't want to know their business plus I don't know how comfortable some people would be, me knowing their business.

I worked in a building that had a SW there, someone I knew but not friends with them, cycled up, chained up his bike, adjusted his posture and started to limp in the door, obviously claiming god knows what. Don't think I could bite my tongue if a case like that came into me and then you get into the dangerous territory of proof.

So as much as I want to move jobs to my hometown (and I really, really do), I don't want to be bringing extra hassle on myself.

Skippette · 19-01-2021 9:29am

I was checking my applications this morning and I see I've fallen back in the order. In some cases going from 1 to 3 and another case going from 2 to 6. Is this because there are Internal transfer panels and they were able to input a legacy date, therefore jumping to the front of the queue? Which is fair enough, I suppose.

Has anyone else noticed the place changing? Has it moved much for ye?

DUB142 · 19-01-2021 9:37am

Could HEO’s only apply from yesterday or have people applied before the 18th for their desired departments/locations?

Skippette · 19-01-2021 9:45am

In my case, I was able to apply for an internal transfer within my department for a change of location. Some would also use it to change section within a location. So when it launched yesterday, I was able to put in a legacy date for my department. There must be others also because I went from 1 to 3 today on the list.

Previously, I reached out to other Department's HR and asked to be put on an Expression of Interest panel. Some obliged, some got me to fill in a CV and one Department, told me they would keep my email on file, but to just note they never actually pulled from that file! So, I was only able to put in yesterday's date when applying for those departments.

rostalof · 19-01-2021 9:53am

Skippette wrote: »

Fingers crossed things move quickly!

I've applied for different departments myself but I was in such a rush I think I'll have to change one or 2 of them because there doesn't appear to be a HEO listed there, though as far as I know they do have HEO's. Maybe they haven't updated their listing. BTW, its not Social Welfare, I don't fancy working there in my own town.

Don't change anything yet, a lot of departments have yet to add their numbers for HEO, AO, AP and PO. If you change anything, you get a new application date for each organisation and location.

DUB142 · 19-01-2021 10:34am

Skippette wrote: »

In my case, I was able to apply for an internal transfer within my department for a change of location. Some would also use it to change section within a location. So when it launched yesterday, I was able to put in a legacy date for my department. There must be others also because I went from 1 to 3 today on the list.

Previously, I reached out to other Department's HR and asked to be put on an Expression of Interest panel. Some obliged, some got me to fill in a CV and one Department, told me they would keep my email on file, but to just note they never actually pulled from that file! So, I was only able to put in yesterday's date when applying for those departments.

I done the same with some departments but it doesn’t count now I think as you said.

I seem to be really low down in some of my not first choice departments, how does it work if I put them on hold? As I don’t want to refuse a offer as it will put me out of the running for other departments in that zone and will have to reapply.

Kirbi · 19-01-2021 10:43am

Skippette wrote: »

I was checking my applications this morning and I see I've fallen back in the order. In some cases going from 1 to 3 and another case going from 2 to 6. Is this because there are Internal transfer panels and they were able to input a legacy date, therefore jumping to the front of the queue? Which is fair enough, I suppose.

Has anyone else noticed the place changing? Has it moved much for ye?

There'll be loads of changes until the Day 1 and Legacy Date periods end - I wouldn't put much stock in the numbers at the moment.

Kirbi · 19-01-2021 1:55pm

DUB142 wrote: »

I seem to be really low down in some of my not first choice departments, how does it work if I put them on hold? As I don’t want to refuse a offer as it will put me out of the running for other departments in that zone and will have to reapply.

A hold doesn't affect waitlist placing - you'll still move up the lists like everyone else (or stay put if there's been no movement).

You probably don't need to worry about this too much yet - there was an email* to all applicants before CO/EO mobility went live for offers, and similar should happen here.
*For HRSS/Peoplepoint customers anyway - not sure about Garda Civs, etc.

Even if there's not an email for some reason; it can't go live for offers until 12/04/2021 at the earliest.
So that's after the 20 working day period for Legacy Date verification is complete, with 12/03/2021 as the last day anyone can apply a Legacy Date. (And assuming they do all verification in a single batch).
I'm lazy, so I didn't factor in the Bank Holidays, but I think Easter might be around there, and St Patrick's Day definitely is.

redmgar · 19-01-2021 1:59pm

Has anyone moved before the two years at their departments discretion?

Kirbi · 19-01-2021 2:01pm

Not that I've ever heard of - it'd have to be a really unique circumstance, I think.

HRs don't have the power to request it on their own, because it contravenes the scheme rules; the scheme owners in PER would have to ok it as well.

Edit: I just want to clarify that I was referring to the Mobility scheme only. As others have mentioned below, your HR could potentially move you outside the scheme.

Civil Servcie mobility scheme

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