The Dominance of Dublin GAA Mod warning post#1

NW_10 · 22-12-2020 09:54PM

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

You say that so confidently.
If that was the case you'd have examples where interest has completely died off. and could show that people werent playing any more. Are playing numbers down in any of these counties in Leinster and its shown that Dublin winning is the reason.

People will still play for their club. At least that hasn't been rigged by Dublin yet.

Enquiring · 22-12-2020 09:57PM

ArielAtom wrote: »

Now, if you had bothered to go back through the thread you would see that the initial funding exercise ended in 2017. Dublin are now back in line with other counties funding, and below quite a few. Again look back through thread to see evidence. The travel expenses is an interesting one, the GAAs biggest problem here is the creative submitting of expenses that has taken place in the past, as identified several ex inter county players stating they would car pool are submit 4-5 expense claims, one for each member of the squad in the car.

This again is untrue. A feature of Dublin posters on this thread. The 2 decade funding exercise has not finished. Dublin still receive 1.3 million for games development every year and in total, it's close to 3 million spent on coaches every year.

Mrsmum · 22-12-2020 10:03PM

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

No they wont. If that was the case in GAA and across all sports then there wouldnt be any GAA in wicklow considering how poor their inter county side is. Or in rugby for years when Connacht were very poor. Or soccer. or any sport.

I don't think interest will wane either because after all playing sport is healthy so parents like to start their kids playing games young. The Gaa is the most local and community based thing you can be involved in and then there are lots of benefits outside of winning All Ireland's. However I think people, outside of Dublin and some within, will have less respect, not more, for Dublin as they rake up easy All Irelands, especially when not with a particular team but a constant conveyer belt of players. The enormous advantages Dublin has will be cited over and over until all eyes are open to it. And surely not much joy for Dublin either without competitive games. Meeting a worthy opponent is a worthwhile event. Beating a far more disadvantaged team is useless. Dublin dominance is a lose lose all round.

tobefrank321 · 22-12-2020 10:12PM

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

No they werent. The GAA saw a county that had/has well over 20% of the countrys population as needing help to counter and compete better with other sports which were getting much stronger and losing out in Dublin wouldnt have been good for the sport nationwide

So these other sports don't exist in other counties? No rugby, soccer, athletics, basketball in Cork, Kildare, Limerick, etc?

Duffy the Vampire Slayer · 22-12-2020 10:14PM

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

No they wont. If that was the case in GAA and across all sports then there wouldnt be any GAA in wicklow considering how poor their inter county side is. Or in rugby for years when Connacht were very poor. Or soccer. or any sport.

There really wasn't much rugby in connacht until recently.

Coillte_Bhoy · 22-12-2020 10:17PM

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

There really wasn't much rugby in connacht until recently.

I must have missed all the new clubs that sprung up recently???

22-12-2020 10:19PM

Rugby just had a bit of a jolt that follows success. Will start dying back off again soon.

ShamoBuc · 22-12-2020 10:22PM

MOD

NW_10 do not post in this thread again please.

ooter · 22-12-2020 10:33PM

If that €3m mentioned is currently being spent on coaching in Dublin and they receive €1.3m in GDF that would pretty much tie in with the figure of 70 GDO's in Dublin that is often mentioned. 70 coaches on €40/50k a year would cost €3m.
Are people suggesting that those coaches should be made redundant or that Dublin should fully finance them from now on?

Quazzie · 22-12-2020 10:38PM

ooter wrote: »

If that €3m mentioned is currently being spent on coaching in Dublin and they receive €1.3m in GDF that would pretty much tie in with the figure of 70 GDO's in Dublin that is often mentioned. 70 coaches on €40/50k a year would cost €3m.
Are people suggesting that those coaches should be made redundant or that Dublin should fully finance them from now on?

Do you think it's fair with one team that have so many professionals in a championship with amateur teams?

StupidLikeAFox · 22-12-2020 10:48PM

ooter wrote: »

If that €3m mentioned is currently being spent on coaching in Dublin and they receive €1.3m in GDF that would pretty much tie in with the figure of 70 GDO's in Dublin that is often mentioned. 70 coaches on €40/50k a year would cost €3m.
Are people suggesting that those coaches should be made redundant or that Dublin should fully finance them from now on?

Ideally the same level of investment should be rolled out to other counties. Unlikely the gaa could afford that.
Let's face it though - Dublin made a massive profit last year and some of the club's these guys are placed in are looking at membership numbers into the 6 figures - they can afford them. I dont see why the richest team in the country should get this special treatment.

awaywithyou · 22-12-2020 10:53PM

ooter wrote: »

If that €3m mentioned is currently being spent on coaching in Dublin and they receive €1.3m in GDF that would pretty much tie in with the figure of 70 GDO's in Dublin that is often mentioned. 70 coaches on €40/50k a year would cost €3m.
Are people suggesting that those coaches should be made redundant or that Dublin should fully finance them from now on?

absolutely no way should coaches be made redundant.... i for one dont have a problem with the funding dublin gaa has access to from central council.. my issue is it is completely wrong for the parent company to be handing out money galore to one of its 32 counties... while giving the rest peanuts... that is not dublins fault... the other 31 counties would want to grow a backbone and let the GAA know that either they get the same funding per player or they are withdrawing their teams from competition.... it is completely completely wrong for central council to show favouritism to one of its memebers over the others.... The issue has nothing to do with dublin... the other 31 counties should be having a go at John Horan Tom Ryan etc... not John Costello

ArielAtom · 22-12-2020 10:56PM

StupidLikeAFox wrote: »

Ideally the same level of investment should be rolled out to other counties. Unlikely the gaa could afford that.
Let's face it though - Dublin made a massive profit last year and some of the club's these guys are placed in are looking at membership numbers into the 6 figures - they can afford them. I dont see why the richest team in the country should get this special treatment.

5 figures?

The Lost Sheep · 22-12-2020 10:57PM

tobefrank321 wrote: »

So these other sports don't exist in other counties? No rugby, soccer, athletics, basketball in Cork, Kildare, Limerick, etc?

Where did i say they dont?

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Rugby just had a bit of a jolt that follows success. Will start dying back off again soon.

Based on what exactly?

StupidLikeAFox wrote: »

Ideally the same level of investment should be rolled out to other counties. Unlikely the gaa could afford that.
Let's face it though - Dublin made a massive profit last year and some of the club's these guys are placed in are looking at membership numbers into the 6 figures - they can afford them. I dont see why the richest team in the country should get this special treatment.

what clubs have membership numbers in 6 figures? Thats surely a typo. Lots of smaller clubs can work more to get development officers/coaches in working with them. Many rugby clubs can and are much smaller than a lot of gaa clubs. so its more than possible.

ArielAtom · 22-12-2020 10:58PM

Quazzie wrote: »

Do you think it's fair with one team that have so many professionals in a championship with amateur teams?

Which team would that be? You do know that these GPOs work with children between the ages of 5-12.

StupidLikeAFox · 22-12-2020 10:59PM

ArielAtom wrote: »

5 figures?

I was talking €€€

Enquiring · 22-12-2020 11:05PM

tritium wrote: »

Still waiting on a proper and detailed answer on how you propose to fairly allocate funding. Would be nice if you could answer that one....

I have already outlined a plan earlier in this thread but there's no reason to provide that to someone who cant even admit to Dublins excessive funding. You have no interest in fair play or the health of Gaelic games outside Dublin.

StupidLikeAFox · 22-12-2020 11:05PM

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

what clubs have membership numbers in 6 figures? Thats surely a typo. Lots of smaller clubs can work more to get development officers/coaches in working with them. Many rugby clubs can and are much smaller than a lot of gaa clubs. so its more than possible.

I was talking in monetary terms - should have been clearer. There are indeed smaller clubs outside Dublin pulling together to get their on development staff in. They generally have to fundraise for this and don't get any help from the GAA. Dublin clubs get subsidised wages for these guys and the huge memberships means they can comfortably afford the rest. It's completely unbalanced.

ooter · 22-12-2020 11:09PM

Quazzie wrote: »

Do you think it's fair with one team that have so many professionals in a championship with amateur teams?

As I've said before it doesn't matter what I think it's what the gaa think and if they deemed the funding necessary they obviously had good reason. But if the gaa told counties they would fund 50% of every GDO/coach they hire I'm not surprised dublin maximised the number of coaches they could employ.

tritium · 22-12-2020 11:12PM

Quazzie wrote: »

Do you think it's fair with one team that have so many professionals in a championship with amateur teams?

My understanding is theyre gdo’s not part of the dublin team. The GAA employs over 300 games development personnel of which these are a subset. Their job is to basically promote and develop the game to the masses

https://www.gaa.ie/my-gaa/administrators/games-development-personnel

70 in dublin is about 23% of the total so about right on a per capita basis (and of course people can argue if that the right basis for the calculation)

Enquiring · 22-12-2020 11:12PM

ArielAtom wrote: »

Which team would that be? You do know that these GPOs work with children between the ages of 5-12.

The development officers work with children up to 18 years of age.

Enquiring · 22-12-2020 11:17PM

tritium wrote: »

My understanding is theyre gdo’s not part of the dublin team. The GAA employs over 300 games development personnel of which these are a subset. Their job is to basically promote and develop the game to the masses

https://www.gaa.ie/my-gaa/administrators/games-development-personnel

70 in dublin is about 23% of the total so about right on a per capita basis (and of course people can argue if that the right basis for the calculation)

Dublin had close to 100 professional coaches while every other county ranged from 1-6 coaches for a number of years.

ooter · 22-12-2020 11:18PM

Why are they called professional coaches when they work in Dublin but they're only coaches in other counties, are they only being paid in Dublin?

StupidLikeAFox · 22-12-2020 11:28PM

ooter wrote: »

As I've said before it doesn't matter what I think it's what the gaa think and if they deemed the funding necessary they obviously had good reason. But if the gaa told counties they would fund 50% of every GDO/coach they hire I'm not surprised dublin maximised the number of coaches they could employ.

It wasn't offered to other counties - it was a Dublin only scheme. Plus, in Dublin the gdo is aligned to a club, whereas other counties they are focussed on a geographical area. It's a special arrangement for Dublin only and has proved very successful

ooter · 22-12-2020 11:36PM

Can I ask this question because I'm genuinely interested and don't know the answer to it, if a county were to approach the gaa in January with a proposal, say that they would pledge €300k a year going forward for games development/coaches, would the gaa match that?

Enquiring · 22-12-2020 11:37PM

StupidLikeAFox wrote: »

It wasn't offered to other counties - it was a Dublin only scheme. Plus, in Dublin the gdo is aligned to a club, whereas other counties they are focussed on a geographical area. It's a special arrangement for Dublin only and has proved very successful

Some clubs have 2 full time coaches and other positions overseeing it all, like a coaching director. There are many clubs in Dublin with the finance and set up that dwarfs a lot of counties.

StupidLikeAFox · 22-12-2020 11:48PM

ooter wrote: »

Can I ask this question because I'm genuinely interested and don't know the answer to it, if a county were to approach the gaa in January with a proposal, say that they would pledge €300k a year going forward for games development/coaches, would the gaa match that?

No, doesn't seem so. My own club (in Kildare) tried to get a gdo between a few in the locality and we were told no. There is an East Leinster project coming on stream which might help but that's only open to Kildare, Meath and Louth

This article from Fermanagh is a bit of an eye opener as well in terms of the struggles of the poorer counties:
"We could give you numerous examples of when we went to Croke Park looking funding for X, Y and Z and it hasn’t been forthcoming. But you have to look after your own house, there is no point in relying on grants and handouts because they are not forthcoming.”

"When the finance for Games Development and coaching grants were tallied from 2007 to 2018, Fermanagh received the least of all 32 counties, just €634,173 compared to Dublin’s €17,916,477 for the same period."

"His findings suggested they should petition Croke Park for funding of two full-time coaches, but that request was turned down, leading Club Eirne to press ahead and fund the roles themselves."

Now five years in operation, they have reached a stage where they contributed €270,270 to the county board in 2019, and Treacy has targeted a figure of €300,000 in 2020."
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/fermanagh-fundraising-chairman-questions-equality-of-gaa-1.4176396

threeball · 22-12-2020 11:50PM

awaywithyou wrote: »

absolutely no way should coaches be made redundant.... i for one dont have a problem with the funding dublin gaa has access to from central council.. my issue is it is completely wrong for the parent company to be handing out money galore to one of its 32 counties... while giving the rest peanuts... that is not dublins fault... the other 31 counties would want to grow a backbone and let the GAA know that either they get the same funding per player or they are withdrawing their teams from competition.... it is completely completely wrong for central council to show favouritism to one of its memebers over the others.... The issue has nothing to do with dublin... the other 31 counties should be having a go at John Horan Tom Ryan etc... not John Costello

The least the GAA could do is look at funding GDOs based on counties performance. The weaker the county the higher the % of funding per GDO and have it decrease as you move up towards the top. Have a manager in position to run the GDOs on a regional basis.

Did you smash it · 22-12-2020 11:57PM

Ye don’t really understand the purpose of the funding of GDOs. Either side.

Dyr · 22-12-2020 11:59PM

Enquiring wrote: »

Some clubs have 2 full time coaches and other positions overseeing it all, like a coaching director. There are many clubs in Dublin with the finance and set up that dwarfs a lot of counties.

Name the clubs

Name the counties

Give the differences in finances

The Dominance of Dublin GAA *Mod warning post#1*

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The Dominance of Dublin GAA Mod warning post#1