Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

jaymla627 · 27-11-2020 2:26pm

alps wrote: »

Green washing would be an accurate description.

It's fair to point out that what the corporates behind this project clover want, are the emmissions offset that this gas can supply.

In their own words...farmers can export the slurry and we can claim the emmissions offset....

To be fair the slurry going into the AD plant would lower a farmers ammonia emissions massively depending on how much he supplies in, the costs involved though in carting slurry around the countryside into these plants would have to be covered by the co-op but I'd reckon they will want it foc, and that's where the entire thing falls apart

Timmaay · 27-11-2020 3:10pm

Birdnuts wrote: »

Probably - the worldwide price of NG has basically collapsed since hitting a peak in 2008 on the back a vast increase in supply via fracking, major new finds in Africa, the Med etc. Indeed major oil producing nations like Nigeria continue to burn of vast quantities of it as its not worth putting any more on world markets at current prices.

In terms of power generation also, natural gas power stations are only a fraction the capital cost of many other green sources, especially the likes of nuclear lol. It will be a huge policial debate moving forwards, as poorer countries continue rapidly developing moving forwards and have a much higher electricity requirement, it will be fairly rich of us the old west to tell them no you shouldn't put in them 5 natural gas power stations in for the same price of one alternative green source, and help more rapidly bring about economic growth.

Timmaay · 27-11-2020 3:14pm

Going back to dairying, anyone use Kerosene to heat water for the dairy? Electric water heater here under pressure whole time with this none chlorine sh1te and time to look into a replacement.

jaymla627 · 27-11-2020 3:20pm

Timmaay wrote: »

Going back to dairying, anyone use Kerosene to heat water for the dairy? Electric water heater here under pressure whole time with this none chlorine sh1te and time to look into a replacement.

You'll pick up a 300 litre Atlantic water heater on co-op superstores for 580 incl vat at the minute its serious value

Gawddawggonnit · 27-11-2020 4:33pm

jaymla627 wrote: »

To be fair the slurry going into the AD plant would lower a farmers ammonia emissions massively depending on how much he supplies in, the costs involved though in carting slurry around the countryside into these plants would have to be covered by the co-op but I'd reckon they will want it foc, and that's where the entire thing falls apart

FOC mightn’t be bad money for it. We charge 2cpl for importing slurry. We’d be choosy enough too because we only take duck, pig etc slurry...no dairy or veal slurry.

alps · 27-11-2020 4:42pm

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

FOC mightn’t be bad money for it. We charge 2cpl for importing slurry. We’d be choosy enough too because we only take duck, pig etc slurry...no dairy or veal slurry.

Over €200 a load.....gulp!!!!

Water John · 27-11-2020 8:05pm

The other point of why I brought up Project clover was the grass input of 22,000t
for each AD Plant. Of the 125 proposed, IWT County Cork would need about 20 AD plants. Serious amount of land, drawing on the same pool that dairying will require when nitrate derogation comes to an end.

jaymla627 · 27-11-2020 8:35pm

Water John wrote: »

The other point of why I brought up Project clover was the grass input of 22,000t
for each AD Plant. Of the 125 proposed, IWT County Cork would need about 20 AD plants. Serious amount of land, drawing on the same pool that dairying will require when nitrate derogation comes to an end.

I can't see it getting of the ground at all been honest, kite flying by the co-ops is all it is...

Base price · 27-11-2020 8:45pm

I read an article in the Farmers Journal earlier about DAFM wanting to increase the age for export calves to 28 days. The exporters have rejected the proposal on the grounds that it is more days than EU legislation requires for travelling calves, it will cause a welfare issue on farms and the Netherlands (our largest buyer) only buy calves up to 35 days.
Apparently they are discussing an 18 day old minimum age for export.
I cannot add the link as my Vodafone broadband is down and I’m using my phone. It is subscriber only.

3 the square · 27-11-2020 8:59pm

Timmaay wrote: »

Going back to dairying, anyone use Kerosene to heat water for the dairy? Electric water heater here under pressure whole time with this none chlorine sh1te and time to look into a replacement.

Did you enquire about gas heaters ??

straight · 27-11-2020 9:14pm

3 the square wrote: »

Did you enquire about gas heaters ??

The problem I have with the gas is I have nowhere to fit the tank. I believe it has to be 5 metres away from any building. I wonder could you use those tall gas bottles.

alps · 27-11-2020 9:29pm

Water John wrote: »

when nitrate derogation comes to an end.

Derogation is not temporary per se...

It will be allowed where growing conditions warrant its acceptance....we have no problem passing on this..

It will be allowed where water quality is maintained or improved in cases where that is required.........this is our Achilles heel....but it is within our own scope to manage this...

But as a group, we are not really taking it serious enough..

Tonynewholland · 27-11-2020 9:35pm

straight wrote: »

The problem I have with the gas is I have nowhere to fit the tank. I believe it has to be 5 metres away from any building. I wonder could you use those tall gas bottles.

Wouldn’t that be another job to do replacing them every few weeks and risk of running out on a long weekend. Electric is very convenient

Mooooo · 27-11-2020 9:39pm

Timmaay wrote: »

Going back to dairying, anyone use Kerosene to heat water for the dairy? Electric water heater here under pressure whole time with this none chlorine sh1te and time to look into a replacement.

Have you looked into a heat recovery until from the bulk tank compressors? Not sure of the roi but may be worth looking at.

Water John · 27-11-2020 10:19pm

alps wrote: »

Derogation is not temporary per se...

It will be allowed where growing conditions warrant its acceptance....we have no problem passing on this..

It will be allowed where water quality is maintained or improved in cases where that is required.........this is our Achilles heel....but it is within our own scope to manage this...

But as a group, we are not really taking it serious enough..

I doubt if derogation will survive in the longer term. Derogation by its very meaning is, temporary relaxation of a rule. Derogation from rules crops up a good bit in Organic as well.

Gary kk · 27-11-2020 10:20pm

straight wrote: »

The problem I have with the gas is I have nowhere to fit the tank. I believe it has to be 5 metres away from any building. I wonder could you use those tall gas bottles.

I think you missed it but for 5million you could have free gas.

Timmaay · 27-11-2020 10:51pm

Mooooo wrote: »

Have you looked into a heat recovery until from the bulk tank compressors? Not sure of the roi but may be worth looking at.

I remember looking into afew renewable water heating solutions, solar heat pump etc also, and 2bh even with grants the payback is horrendous, 10yrs+. A heat recovery from the tank here won't nearly supply enough of a heat lift because I use a platecooler, so still need something else to heat rest the way. I've no real interest in needlessly complicating the whole system also.

Gas I haven't looked into and yep, bit messy leaving a big white gas tank in the middle of the yard in front of everything. Jay my problem with them Atlanta heaters before was the hard water here use to corrode the arse off them in no time, use to only get 6months or so out of them. I got a duel element 300l tank here the min for 1000ish that has worked well last 6 or 7 years so maybe just the same again.

Morris Moss · 28-11-2020 12:43am

Timmaay wrote: »

I remember looking into afew renewable water heating solutions, solar heat pump etc also, and 2bh even with grants the payback is horrendous, 10yrs+. A heat recovery from the tank here won't nearly supply enough of a heat lift because I use a platecooler, so still need something else to heat rest the way. I've no real interest in needlessly complicating the whole system also.

Gas I haven't looked into and yep, bit messy leaving a big white gas tank in the middle of the yard in front of everything. Jay my problem with them Atlanta heaters before was the hard water here use to corrode the arse off them in no time, use to only get 6months or so out of them. I got a duel element 300l tank here the min for 1000ish that has worked well last 6 or 7 years so maybe just the same again.

Have kerosene here, it's cheap to run but by the time you have it plumbed, a boiler and storage tank in it starts adding up.

Gawddawggonnit · 28-11-2020 8:14am

Base price wrote: »

I read an article in the Farmers Journal earlier about DAFM wanting to increase the age for export calves to 28 days. The exporters have rejected the proposal on the grounds that it is more days than EU legislation requires for travelling calves, it will cause a welfare issue on farms and the Netherlands (our largest buyer) only buy calves up to 35 days.
Apparently they are discussing an 18 day old minimum age for export.
I cannot add the link as my Vodafone broadband is down and I’m using my phone. It is subscriber only.

Calves must be 21 days old before the agents will take them now. I’m not sure if it’s regulation or not. Doesn’t really matter now because there’s no market for them.

Gawddawggonnit · 28-11-2020 8:18am

alps wrote: »

It will be allowed where water quality is maintained or improved in cases where that is required.........this is our Achilles heel....but it is within our own scope to manage this...

But as a group, we are not really taking it serious enough..

Nailed it.
If farmers took it on themselves to act responsibly it would help try and keep the status quo. Unfortunately this probably won’t happen and only tightening regulations will force the issue.

whelan2 · 28-11-2020 10:11am

Isn't tail paint great? Did autumn calvers yesterday evening 3 with all paint gone off them this morning

gozunda · 28-11-2020 10:32am

whelan2 wrote: »

Isn't tail paint great? Did autumn calvers yesterday evening 3 with all paint gone off them this morning

Ara sure you need some decent permanent paint when painting cows tails not that aul rubbish

straight · 28-11-2020 10:41am

whelan2 wrote: »

Isn't tail paint great? Did autumn calvers yesterday evening 3 with all paint gone off them this morning

It is great. And cheap. Not so great after the first 3 weeks though but still good

Siamsa Sessions · 28-11-2020 11:21am

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Nailed it.
If farmers took it on themselves to act responsibly it would help try and keep the status quo. Unfortunately this probably won’t happen and only tightening regulations will force the issue.

Court cases like in the Journal this week don’t help - ticks all the negative boxes:

* repeat offender (slurry into the river on several occasions)
* big fish/biodiversity loss
* 1,000 cow herd

And I’m guessing the Inland Fisheries didn’t go straight to court without giving him a chance (or 2) to sort it out

Be interesting to know if he was in Bord Bia’s QA scheme?

mahoney_j · 28-11-2020 3:19pm

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Court cases like in the Journal this week don’t help - ticks all the negative boxes:

* repeat offender (slurry into the river on several occasions)
* big fish/biodiversity loss
* 1,000 cow herd

And I’m guessing the Inland Fisheries didn’t go straight to court without giving him a chance (or 2) to sort it out

Be interesting to know if he was in Bord Bia’s QA scheme?

Not for second condoning that farmer the fact he has. 1000 cows is irrelevant he polluted a river thru negligence he was caught and fined .....then there is co councils pumping and continuing to pump raw sewage into rivers and seas daily but there grand

DukeCaboom · 28-11-2020 3:29pm

Just one thing about that court case. He milks about 500 cows not 1000 as it came across in the Jornal.
He'd easily have 1000 cattle alright. As far as I know he rears a good share of the calves.

Gawddawggonnit · 28-11-2020 3:55pm

mahoney_j wrote: »

Not for second condoning that farmer the fact he has. 1000 cows is irrelevant he polluted a river thru negligence he was caught and fined .....then there is co councils pumping and continuing to pump raw sewage into rivers and seas daily but there grand

Be grand...as a convicted polluter (no fish kills, no environmental damage whatsoever) the man wouldn’t be allowed farm under his own name, be a director of a farm or a farming company (including any other directors of the farming company), for life. A hefty fine that is reflective of the damage done, local radio reports and interviews, full acceptance of further litigation from angling clubs etc etc etc.
If there was a zero tolerance policy like that would it change anything?

What’s his name and where’s he from?

Gawddawggonnit · 28-11-2020 3:58pm

Anyone know the details of the Young Farmer of the Year?
Total acres, stocking rates, amount of artificial fertilizer used, months of slurry storage etc etc?

jaymla627 · 28-11-2020 4:16pm

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Anyone know the details of the Young Farmer of the Year?
Total acres, stocking rates, amount of artificial fertilizer used, months of slurry storage etc etc?

By the look of the head on him if he caught a glimpse of himself in the mirror he'd try and have a go on himself

Green&Red · 28-11-2020 4:43pm

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Anyone know the details of the Young Farmer of the Year?
Total acres, stocking rates, amount of artificial fertilizer used, months of slurry storage etc etc?

Dara Killeen, was on his farm a couple of years ago. New entrant, very visible presence on social media.

He’s obviously doing something right, it all seems to be going very well for him.

Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

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