Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

mahoney_j

Buford T. Justice XIX wrote: »

There was a good bit on that in the Dairy conference this morning, it should be online pretty soon.

Got bits and pieces during day some baffling stuff in it on one hand were told farm in environmentally freindly manner then were told no point growing extra grass in summer to create extra silage ....do they not know stock have to be fed over winter or on wet shifty days then told abandon common sense (and environmental) re using n in spring and backend .lower soil temps wetter soils lower growth but stick out the n .lads like Andre van barnaveld make so much sense on his approach to this but tegasc never gave him or his well thought out advice much air time

Gman1987

RightTurnClyde wrote: »

I'm no accountant but maximise the capex tax write off he'll be looking at close to 40k a year in loan repayments for the next 8 yrs. On 100 cows that's hard going.
He could drop the payments to 20k over say 17 years, but once his write off is gone he'll be paying 20k + another ~10k in tax on the loan as his heading for 60.
There is much room for tighter restrictions or higher costs there

I was thinking the same myself earlier today. Their is a large amount of lads around me getting into dairy and spending a huge amount of money to have a top of the range setup. Lets say they spend half a million on infrastructure via a loan (good few spending more than this), If they want to align to capital allowances they need to pay this back over seven year therefore circa. €71.5k per year plus interest. Taking the loan out over a longer period will result in you having to pay a tax bill from year eight and also a repayments out of taxed money. I'd say a lot of lads are spreading their repayments out over 15 years therefore their could find cash tightening significantly once their capital allowances finishes.

awaywithyou

Gman1987 wrote: »

I was thinking the same myself earlier today. Their is a large amount of lads around me getting into dairy and spending a huge amount of money to have a top of the range setup. Lets say they spend half a million on infrastructure via a loan (good few spending more than this), If they want to align to capital allowances they need to pay this back over seven year therefore circa. €71.5k per year plus interest. Taking the loan out over a longer period will result in you having to pay a tax bill from year eight and also a repayments out of taxed money. I'd say a lot of lads are spreading their repayments out over 15 years therefore their could find cash tightening significantly once their capital allowances finishes.

That’s where forming a company comes into the conversation...

jaymla627

mahoney_j wrote: »

Got bits and pieces during day some baffling stuff in it on one hand were told farm in environmentally freindly manner then were told no point growing extra grass in summer to create extra silage ....do they not know stock have to be fed over winter or on wet shifty days then told abandon common sense (and environmental) re using n in spring and backend .lower soil temps wetter soils lower growth but stick out the n .lads like Andre van barnaveld make so much sense on his approach to this but tegasc never gave him or his well thought out advice much air time

Next drought event/wet spring they'll be telling lads to spread as much n as possible to stock up on fodder reserves, their on the environment crusade path now as mandated by the higher ups in the department of ag, so for lads own sake don't be taking everything they say as gospel truth they haven't your entire interests at heart

Farm365

Grueller wrote: »

3.26 cows per ha.
16 ha so 52.16 cows.
52 friesians and a dexter.

Would there be many Dairy farmers stocked higher than this?

Gman1987

awaywithyou wrote: »

That’s where forming a company comes into the conversation...

But you cant live on fresh air, you still need to get the money out of the company.

cosatron

Grueller wrote: »

3.26 cows per ha.
16 ha so 52.16 cows.
52 friesians and a dexter.

whats the stocking rate for the rest of the farm, say non milking platform land

straight

Farm365 wrote: »

Would there be many Dairy farmers stocked higher than this?

Stocked at 2.5 here anyway and it's enough for me.

mahoney_j

Farm365 wrote: »

Would there be many Dairy farmers stocked higher than this?

4 cows/he milk block ,fragmented farm tho overall Sr across farm close to 2.6 this year I would increase cow block to 5 contract rear replacements keep no beef snd grow maize/beet on mix of own land and on contract ,less work more money dero and environment compliment

Siamsa Sessions

Farm365 wrote: »

Would there be many Dairy farmers stocked higher than this?

Every farmer in the IFJ on their Grass Management page is stocked higher. But that's hardly a reflection of the country as a whole.

Be interesting if the average stocking rate across the country was known?

K.G.

Gman1987 wrote: »

I was thinking the same myself earlier today. Their is a large amount of lads around me getting into dairy and spending a huge amount of money to have a top of the range setup. Lets say they spend half a million on infrastructure via a loan (good few spending more than this), If they want to align to capital allowances they need to pay this back over seven year therefore circa. €71.5k per year plus interest. Taking the loan out over a longer period will result in you having to pay a tax bill from year eight and also a repayments out of taxed money. I'd say a lot of lads are spreading their repayments out over 15 years therefore their could find cash tightening significantly once their capital allowances finishes.

If you have 280 borrowed on 50 or 60 cows your cash will tighten long before that

Mooooo

Overall sr for most would be 2.5 or a bit above below. I'd imagine. At the top of dero would be 2.9 so that would prob mean buying in forage as well. Milking platforms then can cary depending on land layout etc. Sr in journal grass week remove silage ground or surplus so if some say 4/ ha may just mean a share of ground is closed for silage etc

Panch18

don't forget that if they bring in a SR on the home block - once it's in there is only 1 way it will ever go - and it ain't up.

There is a history of this already - a cow will going forward excrete more apparently - suddenly she is excreting 89 kgs instead of the 85kgs she had been excreting in the past.

So if it comes in then we can all hang up our hats

Wildsurfer

Gman1987 wrote: »

But you cant live on fresh air, you still need to get the money out of the company.

That's where a partner with a good job comes into the conversation...

mahoney_j

Panch18 wrote: »

don't forget that if they bring in a SR on the home block - once it's in there is only 1 way it will ever go - and it ain't up.

There is a history of this already - a cow will going forward excrete more apparently - suddenly she is excreting 89 kgs instead of the 85kgs she had been excreting in the past.

So if it comes in then we can all hang up our hats

If this comes to pass aren’t tegasc etc very slow to react .again less cows producing more milk/milk solids makes si much sense why aren’t they promoting this ....are they afraid of looking bad or do they not pocess the skill set

Panch18

mahoney_j wrote: »

If this comes to pass aren’t tegasc etc very slow to react .again less cows producing more milk/milk solids makes si much sense why aren’t they promoting this ....are they afraid of looking bad or do they not pocess the skill set

i couldn't disagree with 1 word you've said J

jaymla627

Wildsurfer wrote: »

That's where a partner with a good job comes into the conversation...

Sounds like a great recipe for divorce down the line, especially in modern day society where no women of the current generation is going to sub the husbands farming enterprises so he can play with his cows and tractors, the business can either provide a living wage and meet all commitments our simply just lease the place out and have a easy life

Siamsa Sessions

mahoney_j wrote: »

If this comes to pass aren’t tegasc etc very slow to react .again less cows producing more milk/milk solids makes si much sense why aren’t they promoting this ....are they afraid of looking bad or do they not pocess the skill set

Isn't that what the EBI is supposed to do?

jaymla627

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Isn't that what the EBI is supposed to do?

Fertility and fat and pr % is all ebi was primarily focused on with smaller, low milk and really poor functional cows been breed that simply wont transition to a scenario where you need cows doing 650 plus kilos of ms a cow to compensate for having to carry lower numbers, the grass based low input no meal system is the hill Teagasc are prepared to die on and their is no changing that

yosemitesam1

mahoney_j wrote: »

If this comes to pass aren’t tegasc etc very slow to react .again less cows producing more milk/milk solids makes si much sense why aren’t they promoting this ....are they afraid of looking bad or do they not pocess the skill set

Sure when you've no skin in the game why would you keep awake at night and think about what to do if the **** hits the fan. Easier to enjoy your nights sleep and cross that bridge when you come to it, get paid the same either way...

K.G.

Its margin by volume.
No good in increasing the volume if you decrease the margin.the trick is increasing production at the same margin.up to mid 90 s the margin in milk was steadily declining despie milk price being the same level almost as now.typically most farms milking365,calving for maybe 6 months and feeding 6 , 7 or 8 kilos to cows and very labour intensive as qoutas restricted output so productivity per labour unit was poor.then people started adopting some of the grass based production methods which increased the margin and simplified systems which enabled people to being able to manage higher numbers.there was a few great years of good money for calves culls and lower costs and reasonable prices but those days disappeared with a bang in 09 .unfortunately while prices have recovered costs have steadily risen and now margins are on a steady downward slope.if rising volume is about a return to the early 90s pratices then you are going nowhere as the costs will erode the margin negating the higher volume.its all about margin and volume,one is no good without the other

blackdog1

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

Isn't that what the EBI is supposed to do?

I'm in the bottom 30% for ebi in dairygold but I have the highest average milk price in the coop. There isn't any correlation in my opinion.

ted_182

blackdog1 wrote: »

I'm in the bottom 30% for ebi in dairygold but I have the highest average milk price in the coop. There isn't any correlation in my opinion.

You might expand on that one. You have the highest average price in the coop?

blackdog1

ted_182 wrote: »

You might expand on that one. You have the highest average price in the coop?

On the coop performance report it lists what percentage you are on in relation to the rest of the suppliers. You get ranked out of 100. I'm in the 100% with an average milk price up until November of 37.5c litre.

ted_182

Fair play, whats youre avg constituants up to end of october?

Coolfresian

blackdog1 wrote: »

On the coop performance report it lists what percentage you are on in relation to the rest of the suppliers. You get ranked out of 100. I'm in the 100% with an average milk price up until November of 37.5c litre.

Exact same here with glanbia, bottom on ebi, top on average milk price, solids etc. All fresian/Holstein cows. Iv been saying it for years, no correlation for us and many others between ebi and achieving a top milk price.

blackdog1

ted_182 wrote: »

Fair play, whats youre avg constituants up to end of october?

Up untill the end of october it was 4.23fat 3.67 protein. Cow currently milking 23 litres @4.71 fat 3.85 protein. I'll hopefully finish the year at 3.7% protein supplied and 4.3% fat. I would also like to add that that milk price included a 5.6c winter bonus. So while I might have the highest milk price I might not be the most profitable.

ted_182

blackdog1 wrote: »

Up untill the end of october it was 4.23fat 3.67 protein. Cow currently milking 23 litres @4.71 fat 3.85 protein. I'll hopefully finish the year at 3.7% protein supplied and 4.3% fat. I would also like to add that that milk price included a 5.6c winter bonus. So while I might have the highest milk price I might not be the most profitable.

Thats would be based on winter suppliers id be thinking, it will say it at the top of the report nxt to supplier number. Mine would say manufacturing. A friend of mine, dg supplier, got 47 cent for octover milk, dunno what his avg to price to date is but it would be eyewatering lol. Excellent preformance all the same blackdog.

blackdog1

ted_182 wrote: »

Thats would be based on winter suppliers id be thinking, it will say it at the top of the report nxt to supplier number. Mine would say manufacturing. A friend of mine, dg supplier, got 47 cent for octover milk, dunno what his avg to price to date is but it would be eyewatering lol. Excellent preformance all the same blackdog.

No overall. Your rank out of 100 are overall. Your dairygold average and top 10% are compared to other winter suppliers though. I definitely won't be top come December due to volumes I'll be producing but hopefully I'll be in the top 10% for kilos produced.

Say my name

Ye''ll have to Google translate this one.

Norwegian couple receive a grant of €38,000 and then install a delaval milking robot. In doing so they increase the milking herd from 13 cows to 14 cows.

http://www.felleskjopet.no/alle-artikler/alle-artikler-fra-samvirke/lykkelig-som-liten/

More power to 'em.