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2020 All Ireland Senior Football Championship MOD NOTE POST #1

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,149 ✭✭✭Mervyn Skidmore


    Teams guaranteed 4 games, into their tiers on merit for that year, and proper knockout for the latter part of the competition. It’s so obvious that it makes it all the more maddening that they won’t do it. Perfect solution.

    And the groups could be seeded based on the league, groups of 4 with one team from each tier of the league. It makes too much sense for the GAA though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 150 ✭✭moghrasa


    That was a lovely day out nice day and very enjoyable. Plus as you know it was the last time Bernard started for the Dubs. Also was the occasion Bugler and McDaid were blooded.

    It was also the GAA council who voted where the games were played if you do a bit of research so it was nothing to do with Dublin.

    I believe a lot of the problems with provincial football is similar to world rugby one sided games in groups. And nothing 'meaningful' until the last 8. What changes have world rugby made in comparison to the GAA?
    Zero innovation.

    However I assume you have no problem accepting the structure of the Rugby WC cup. You seem to be one of these oddballs who has an irrational hatred against another sport. If you don't like it don't watch it no one is forcing you to.
    Some leap to decide because he has Rugby in his username he has an "irrational hatred" of football.. Jesus Christ like.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭munster87


    And the groups could be seeded based on the league, groups of 4 with one team from each tier of the league. It makes too much sense for the GAA though.

    The league is so much more competitive and interesting at this stage. Should be the main competition.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,994 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    moghrasa wrote: »
    Some leap to decide because he has Rugby in his username he has an "irrational hatred" of football.. Jesus Christ like.

    One way or the other there is a clear anti Dublin GAA agenda there.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,289 ✭✭✭Padkir


    No celebrations whatsoever. It's so depressing.

    There's a lot to be said for supporting Mayo! ðŸ˜


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,994 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    munster87 wrote: »
    The league is so much more competitive and interesting at this stage. Should be the main competition.

    Agreed 100% and it should be tied in a championship last 8 knock out.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,564 ✭✭✭RugbyLover123


    That was a lovely day out nice day and very enjoyable. Plus as you know it was the last time Bernard started for the Dubs. Also was the occasion Bugler and McDaid were blooded.

    It was also the GAA council who voted where the games were played if you do a bit of research so it was nothing to do with Dublin.

    I believe a lot of the problems with provincial football is similar to world rugby one sided games in groups. And nothing 'meaningful' until the last 8. What changes have world rugby made in comparison to the GAA?
    Zero innovation.

    However I assume you have no problem accepting the structure of the Rugby WC cup. You seem to be one of these oddballs who has an irrational hatred against another sport. If you don't like it don't watch it no one is forcing you to.

    I don’t have a hatred for the GAA at all. I played for years and grew up going to Meath games in Pairc Tailteann and plenty of Dublin and Meath games in Croke Park. I loved the competitive nature of the games in the 00s!

    I just find it difficult to comprehend how Dubs fans can’t see that the game is dying because of their dominance and everything is set up for them to succeed. Maybe that makes me a bitter Meath man I don’t know, but from looking at this thread this evening it’s clear the majority outside of Dublin would agree with me that it is a non-competitive sport these days. Even the back and fourth way the game is played these days is a result of trying to stop the dubs. I suppose it’s not the Dubs fault but even the lack of an acceptance that everything is in their favour is quite surprising.

    And believe me Rugby has its faults too. Don’t take my username for me being anti every other sport. Sure I would be willing to bet most of my posts have been in the soccer thread!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭Cavan_King


    munster87 wrote: »
    The league is so much more competitive and interesting at this stage. Should be the main competition.

    Next year it appears the Leagues may be regionalised to cut travel and just be three games per team due to each Division splitting into two groups of four.

    Proposed:

    Applied to the 2021 AFL, the new divisions could look like this:

    Division One A: Monaghan, Tyrone, Donegal, Armagh
    Division One B: Dublin, Galway, Roscommon, Kerry
    Division Two A: Meath, Mayo, Westmeath, Down
    Division Two B: Cork, Laois, Clare, Kildare
    Division Three A: Cavan, Fermanagh, Derry, Longford
    Division Three B: Tipperary, Offaly, Limerick, Wicklow
    Division Four A: Antrim, Louth, Leitrim, Sligo
    Division Four B: Carlow, Wexford, Waterford, London


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    Cavan_King wrote: »
    Next year it appears the Leagues may be regionalised to cut travel and just be three games per team due to each Division splitting into two groups of four.

    Proposed:

    Applied to the 2021 AFL, the new divisions could look like this:

    Division One A: Monaghan, Tyrone, Donegal, Armagh
    Division One B: Dublin, Galway, Roscommon, Kerry
    Division Two A: Meath, Mayo, Westmeath, Down
    Division Two B: Cork, Laois, Clare, Kildare
    Division Three A: Cavan, Fermanagh, Derry, Longford
    Division Three B: Tipperary, Offaly, Limerick, Wicklow
    Division Four A: Antrim, Louth, Leitrim, Sligo
    Division Four B: Carlow, Wexford, Waterford, London

    Doesn't seem necessary anymore.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭Cavan_King


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    Doesn't seem necessary anymore.

    What doesn’t seem necessary?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,158 ✭✭✭RoyalCelt


    You may be correct.
    I’m just saying that playing on that perfect surface all the time which suits great athletes instead of a muddy field is a distinct advantage. They get to play at a fast pace and don’t have to adapt to sticky surfaces like other teams have to.

    It’s great to see them in full flow though.
    Sadly when they're outside croker it's nearly always in portlaoise which is the next best thing. Westmeath would have lost by 20 in croker no doubt but why wasn't it played in mullingar. Considering how long dublin have been playing at home now outside the leinster final dublin should play whoever in their home ground. Only one of many issues and sadly we're long past the time when it would really matter.

    Dublin wouldn't have won as many leinsters in the 00's if they didn't play in croker as much but these days it doesn't really matter for the end result.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    Cavan king - The league was structured like that for a while. Up to 70s. i remember Dublin playing Kilkenny and Antrim not long before they won the All Ireland.

    Even after that there used to be some really interesting games in league where the top teams in four leagues went into quarter finals. Remember seeing Dublin playing Cavan in Breffni and Cork playing Armagh, both of which were pretty novel pairings back then.

    Assuming all of this stuff is going to continue for another year, a complete open draw would be good in both. No provincials - 5 rounds in football and four in hurling. There'd be a few completely lop sided games but there are anyway.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    Cavan_King wrote: »
    What doesn’t seem necessary?

    Regionalised league. Players have already been travelling all over the country and people will start being vaccinated next year.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    The league was structured like that for a while. Up to 70s. i remember Dublin playing Kilkenny and Antrim not long before they won the All Ireland.

    Even after that there used to be some really interesting games in league where the top teams in four leagues went into quarter finals. Remember seeing Dublin playing Cavan in Breffni and Cork playing Armagh, both of which were pretty novel pairings back then.

    Assuming all of this stuff is going to continue for another year, a complete open draw would be good in both. No provincials - 5 rounds in football and four in hurling. There'd be a few completely lop sided games but there are anyway.

    Provincials won't be scrapped in Connacht and Ulster.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,994 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    I don’t have a hatred for the GAA at all. I played for years and grew up going to Meath games in Pairc Tailteann and plenty of Dublin and Meath games in Croke Park. I loved the competitive nature of the games in the 00s!

    I just find it difficult to comprehend how Dubs fans can’t see that the game is dying because of their dominance and everything is set up for them to succeed. Maybe that makes me a bitter Meath man I don’t know, but from looking at this thread this evening it’s clear the majority outside of Dublin would agree with my that it is a non-competitive sport these days. Even the back and fourth way the game is played these days is a result of trying to stop the dubs. I suppose it’s not the Dubs fault but even the lack of an acceptance that everything is in their favour is quite surprising.

    And believe me Rugby has its faults too. Don’t take my username for me being anti every other sport. Sure I would be willing to bet most of my posts have been in the soccer thread!

    Fair enough but I would disagree the game is dying Dublin have taken it on to new heights. Tyrone started it, Donegal baffled sides, and moved it on and Dublin refined it. Kerry are in the process of figuring it out. Plus with Harte gone I expect Tyrone to move on to more expansive era of their football.

    Football has never being a such a high level and innovative in my lifetime. It is up to the provincial council structures to catch up.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    Fair enough but I would disagree the game is dying Dublin have taken it on to new heights. Tyrone started it, Donegal baffled sides, and moved it on and Dublin refined it. Kerry are in the process of figuring it out. Plus with Harte gone I expect Tyrone to move on to more expansive era of their football.

    Football has never being a such a high level and innovative in my lifetime. It is up to the provincial council structures to catch up.

    It's up to the GAA to put up the funding so those counties can pay for the resources and coaching necessary for them to catch up.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    It is at intercounty level. A lot of counties have lost top players because they just don't have the interest to play anymore. Club football is still strong in most counties but some like Sligo are suffering even there.

    It isn't though.

    And you bring up Sligo, who have fallen down from the giddy heights they're used to.

    Would you get up the yard.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,158 ✭✭✭RoyalCelt


    It isn't though.

    And you bring up Sligo, who have fallen town from the giddy heights they're used to.

    Would you get up the yard.
    In Leinster counties are going the way of Derry. Club championship has completely taken over in terms of interest and importance. That trend will continue.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    It isn't though.

    And you bring up Sligo, who have fallen town from the giddy heights they're used to.

    Would you get up the yard.

    It is. They did it for Dublin so I think is you who needs to get up the yard. I bring up Sligo because they are a member of the association. Are you suggesting that we shouldn't care about the weaker counties?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 668 ✭✭✭Rockfish


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    And a Tier 2 won't revive football in those counties.

    'These counties' were never AI contenders anyway, look at what the league means to them when they are doing well? A Tier 2 with promotion for the top 1 or 2 is a real incentive for them


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Enquiring


    Rockfish wrote: »
    'These counties' were never AI contenders anyway, look at what the league means to them when they are doing well? A Tier 2 with promotion for the top 1 or 2 is a real incentive for them

    What county are you from?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    C__MC wrote: »
    Time to split the AL into 16 teams
    4 groups of 4, QFs, semis, final
    Remaining 16 in a lower competition similar format
    Dublin will still prob walk it the provincial championships are stone age

    Why?

    Do you want more dead rubbers or something?

    Leave the league alone.

    Have a two tiered open draw championship with a seeded first round reflecting league placings.

    Have the provincials as a pre-season/warm-up competition as befits their pointlessness.

    No backdoor. No insanely complicated nonsense. Space games out over the summer in a logical way so people can afford to go to them and just leave it at that.

    Too much tinkering goes on in the GAA. Just gave a coherent timetable.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 668 ✭✭✭Rockfish


    Enquiring wrote: »
    What county are you from?

    Masyo but dont see how thats relevant, im looking at it from a wider perspective


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    RoyalCelt wrote: »
    In Leinster counties are going the way of Derry. Club championship has completely taken over in terms of interest and importance. That trend will continue.

    So?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭munster87


    Enquiring wrote: »
    What county are you from?

    I don’t see the argument with not having a tiered structure. You can get promoted to the top and compete. If not good enough to get promoted then you weren’t going to win an All Ireland anyway


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    It is. They did it for Dublin so I think is you who needs to get up the yard. I bring up Sligo because they are a member of the association. Are you suggesting that we shouldn't care about the weaker counties?

    I'm suggesting that we shouldn't be giving airtime to the blow-ins who come in here every year bemoaning the fact that Dublin are winning and Dublin are to blame for all the ills in Gaelic football.

    We now have a poster above complaining that we play in Portlaoise too often that it is the same as us playing in Croke Park.

    Honestly, I haven't an iota of concern about what the likes of yourself think should be done. All it stretches to is "hobble Dublin". Not, "let's fix the glaring issues in other counties".


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    Rockfish wrote: »
    'These counties' were never AI contenders anyway, look at what the league means to them when they are doing well? A Tier 2 with promotion for the top 1 or 2 is a real incentive for them

    The League already exists. These countries don't want to be put into another tiered competition.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Enquiring


    Rockfish wrote: »
    Masyo but dont see how thats relevant, im looking at it from a wider perspective

    No, you're not. Supporters and players from counties that would be in tier 2 don't want this. It's people from 'tier 1' counties who are most vocal about it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Enquiring


    munster87 wrote: »
    I don’t see the argument with not having a tiered structure. You can get promoted to the top and compete. If not good enough to get promoted then you weren’t going to win an All Ireland anyway

    What county are you from?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    I'm suggesting that we shouldn't be giving airtime to the blow-ins who come in here every year bemoaning the fact that Dublin are winning and Dublin are to blame for all the ills in Gaelic football.

    We now have a poster above complaining that we play in Portlaoise too often that it is the same as us playing in Croke Park.

    Honestly, I haven't an iota of concern about what the likes of yourself think should be done. All it stretches to is "hobble Dublin". Not, "let's fix the glaring issues in other counties".

    This is just a ridiculous statement. Why bother replying if you don't care about what we think. Clearly you do. Reducing Dublin's funding is not going to hobble you. Surely you can replicate it from all the volunteers and club members I'm told exist in the city. Then there's all the sponsors. The glaring issues in other counties require a lot more funding to fix.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭munster87


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    The League already exists. These countries don't want to be put into another tiered competition.

    It would replace the league clearly. The only reason less importance is put on the league is that our (pointless to many counties) championship exists. There should be no championship imo and leagues or tiered championship.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    munster87 wrote: »
    It would replace the league clearly. The only reason less importance is put on the league is that our (pointless to many counties) championship exists. There should be no championship imo and leagues or tiered championship.

    The League shouldn't be replaced. Tiering the championship will just widen the divide and kill off intercounty football in a lot of counties. We know the GAA won't provide the support and exposure it needs. Look at how they treat the Joe McDonagh Cup.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭munster87


    A Dublin supporter fastidiously defending Dublin's dominance as "not their fault" is like a white person in Ireland claiming that racism isn't a problem in the US because it doesn't affect them.

    The All Ireland championship and racism really don’t need to be put together at all. Terrible comparison. And how is it Dublin’s fault?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭Cavan_King


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    Regionalised league. Players have already been travelling all over the country and people will start being vaccinated next year.

    Yes and there was a lot of complaints about the travelling.
    You are also looking at a shorter league timeframe next year. Possible end of February to April.
    And I wouldn’t expect a vaccine to be widely available in the first half of the year.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    A Dublin supporter fastidiously defending Dublin's dominance as "not their fault" is like a white person in Ireland claiming that racism isn't a problem in the US because it doesn't affect them.

    Wow. That's quite a stretch.

    Do you want to throw Nazis and the Holocaust in there for no apparent reason?

    Absolutely ridiculous statement.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭munster87


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    The League shouldn't be replaced. Tiering the championship will just widen the divide and kill off intercounty football in a lot of counties. We know the GAA won't provide the support and exposure it needs. Look at how they treat the Joe McDonagh Cup.

    How can you widen the divide between Dublin and say Waterford as things stand!? At least Waterford could focus on promotion from the 4th or 3rd tier or whatever they are in, rather than losing in Munster Championship year after year. Promotions could be like championships. Like in most sports that have leagues that use promotion/relegation


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    munster87 wrote: »
    How can you widen the divide between Dublin and say Waterford as things stand!? At least Waterford could focus on promotion from the 4th or 3rd tier or whatever they are in, rather than losing in Munster Championship year after year. Promotions could be like championships. Like in most sports that have leagues that use promotion/relegation

    Waterford are not the only team in Div 3 and 4.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,558 ✭✭✭✭castletownman


    Wow. That's quite a stretch.

    Do you want to throw Nazis and the Holocaust in there for no apparent reason?

    Absolutely ridiculous statement.

    I admit it was a convoluted way of saying that of course Dublin supporters are going to ignore the clear disparity the county enjoys when they are the beneficiaries.

    In much the same way that anyone else in a position of privilege are blind to issues that don't affect them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭munster87


    I took Waterford as an example, who are you specifically talking about?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Enquiring


    munster87 wrote: »
    How can you widen the divide between Dublin and say Waterford as things stand!?

    How about giving Dublin over one million euros a year and give Waterford fractions of that.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 207 ✭✭Rolo2010


    munster87 wrote: »
    I took Waterford as an example, who are you specifically talking about?

    All the Div 3 and 4 sides who oppose Tier 2.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 668 ✭✭✭Rockfish


    Enquiring wrote: »
    No, you're not. Supporters and players from counties that would be in tier 2 don't want this. It's people from 'tier 1' counties who are most vocal about it.

    ive given my opinion in good faith. I think that overall it would be better long term for the GAA in weaker counties, thats my opinion, you disagree?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,537 ✭✭✭crossman47


    Fair enough but I would disagree the game is dying Dublin have taken it on to new heights. Tyrone started it, Donegal baffled sides, and moved it on and Dublin refined it. Kerry are in the process of figuring it out. Plus with Harte gone I expect Tyrone to move on to more expansive era of their football.

    Football has never being a such a high level and innovative in my lifetime. It is up to the provincial council structures to catch up.

    It may be high level in your eyes but its boring as hell to the rest of us. I switched off tonight after Dublin's first goal. They have been given so many advantages they will win the AI every year for the forseeable future - something like twelve in a row and who wants that? Not even real Dub fans I suspect.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 668 ✭✭✭Rockfish


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    Waterford are not the only team in Div 3 and 4.

    Oh ffs its used as an example :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    I admit it was a convoluted way of saying that of course Dublin supporters are going to ignore the clear disparity the county enjoys when they are the beneficiaries.

    In much the same way that anyone else in a position of privilege are blind to issues that don't affect them.
    I'm not blind to issues.

    I'm just not blinded by the hatred that exists amongst the bleaters.

    To think Dublin are the cause of all ills in Gaelic football is just ridiculous.

    Look closer to home.

    Anyway, this crap has gone on long enough off topic.

    Roll on the other 2 games tomorrow. I look forward to the chat about this year's championship.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭munster87


    Rolo2010 wrote: »
    All the Div 3 and 4 sides who oppose Tier 2.

    Go on sure, which one are you from


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    crossman47 wrote: »
    It may be high level in your eyes but its boring as hell to the rest of us. I switched off tonight after Dublin's first goal. They have been given so many advantages they will win the AI every year for the forseeable future - something like twelve in a row and who wants that? Not even real Dub fans I suspect.

    Why not go over to the Dublin thread and ask some real Dublin fans? I'm sure you'll get an answer.

    I await your entrance.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Enquiring


    Rockfish wrote: »
    Excuse me but dont ****ing tell me what perspective im looking at things from, ive given my opinion in good faith. I think that overall it would be better long term for the GAA in weaker counties, thats my opinion, you disagree? Fine but less of the lecturing please

    It's easy to endorse something that won't affect you. Would it not be more beneficial for weaker counties to get a fairer portion of the cash available to counties like Dublin, Mayo and Kerry?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,029 ✭✭✭doc_17


    munster87 wrote: »
    The All Ireland championship and racism really don’t need to be put together at all. Terrible comparison. And how is it Dublin’s fault?

    Yes, it’s an awful comparison. But Dublin could insist on playing an odd match away in the championship. And by that I mean play, say this year, Donegal in an All Ireland semi final in MacCumhaill Park. Or Cavan in Breffni Park. Can’t use capacity as an excuse this year.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,537 ✭✭✭crossman47


    Why not go over to the Dublin thread and ask some real Dublin fans? I'm sure you'll get an answer.

    I await your entrance.

    No chance. I couldn't take the insufferable self justification. I'll stick to the real game and the only AI really worth winning - hurling.


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