PHIL HOGAN NEEDS TO RESIGN.

Suckit · 09-09-2020 1:51am

Deleted User wrote: »

Its not like we have a deep pool of talent in which to keep pulling these CEO's and prospective Government ministers from!

There SHOULD be exemptions for MEPS and European heads of state who have to travel a lot. In all honesty who here would quarantine for 14 days if they held the position of EU Commissioner for Trade? Who here did not break restrictions at some stage? "Let him without sin..............."

I'm delighted Mairead got the job, but we have lost out.

No.

There should NOT be any exemptions. I think Phil may have been a decent trade minister, but that does not give him or anyone else the right to disregard the rules his own party put in place. Do you honestly think that they should be allowed to make rules and then be the only ones allowed to break them?

The arrogance is less relevant but didn't help him.

Sir Oxman · 09-09-2020 2:57am

Deleted User wrote: »

Based on what .....is that really your best argument? We are all entitled to our opinion , that’s what Boards is about , but at least make an effort to debate your point.

The problem I have with your contributions (and not you alone btw) is that you completely ignore the main reason Hogan resigned/got the bullet - he lied and was caught out publicly (Irish and internationally) in those reputationally damaging *lies.

Try that with your boss tomorrow!

*Nevermind the whole circumstances around it - national/global pandemic which has devastated economies, curtailed natural freedoms, requires massive buy-in from the ordinary joe & josie etc etc

Rubberchikken · 09-09-2020 4:00am

A country can't have one rule for it's citizens and another for so called ministers/eu members/whatever.

If our president and taoiseach etc were willing to abide by then then Hogan and the others at this shindig should too.

His inablity to tell the whole truth in the first place didn't help his cause.
Every last word had to be dragged out if him and even that was painful.

Dishonesty, arrogance and shiftiness are very unattractive.

Muahahaha · 09-09-2020 9:24am

So Phil has done an interview with the Kilkenny People and he is blaming Varadkar and Martin for his resignation

Following his resignation the former EU Trade Commissioner wanted to thank the local community for their support and reiterated that ‘he broke no law’ and was subjected to ‘a full scale attack’ by the government.
“I wanted to take the opportunity to thank the people of Kilkenny for supporting me massively over the past few weeks during difficult times,” he said in an interview with the Kilkenny People, the only one he’s given following his resignation.
Mr Hogan acknowledged that ‘mistakes were made’ during his visit to Ireland in July and August when he attended the infamous Oireachtas Golf Society Dinner in Clifden and travelled to Kildare, a county in lockdown at the time on a number of occasions.
The former Commissioner said that his apology for the mistakes he made during his visit is sincere but added that the Covid regulations are not compatible with the work of MEPs.

“The regulations that presently exist are not compatible with the work that MEPs do,” he said.
Since Mr Hogan’s resignation a Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael and Green Party MEPs are asking that the 14-day quarantine requirement be lifted for MEPs who receive a negative coronavirus test before leaving Brussels.
The former Commissioner told the Kilkenny People that he has no intention to returning to political life either nationally or internationally.
“My life in public service after 38 years has come to an end. I am going to take some time out and reflect on what to do next,” he said.
“The government had a full scale attack on my compliance or otherwise,” he said adding that he ‘had no option but to resign because of the huge pressure from the Taoiseach, the Tanáiste and the media’. Mr Hogan also remarked that he did not receive ‘due process’ and said that he is ‘very disappointed’ with the way he has been treated.
“I didn’t get due process, unlike others. I am very disappointed that there was a huge effort concentrated on my resignation.
“I always feel like Irish people expect due process in the right forum. I didn’t get that. I wasn’t given that chance.”

https://www.kilkennypeople.ie/news/home/572229/phil-hogan-ive-made-mistakes-but-i-broke-no-law.html

I see he is still going with his 'I broke no law' spin, he obviously isnt able to take responsibility for breaking the law when he was caught by the Gardai on his phone

Psychiatric Patrick · 09-09-2020 10:05am

Muahahaha wrote: »

So Phil has done an interview with the Kilkenny People and he is blaming Varadkar and Martin for his resignation

https://www.kilkennypeople.ie/news/home/572229/phil-hogan-ive-made-mistakes-but-i-broke-no-law.html

I see he is still going with his 'I broke no law' spin, he obviously isnt able to take responsibility for breaking the law when he was caught by the Gardai on his phone

I was starting to wonder is using a phone while driving not actually against the law in the country at all the way this jackass and his fan club keep denying it.

I'll have a read of the full thing later. I'm invested to hear what he has to say and the lies he old Boss Lady.

Castlekeeper · 09-09-2020 10:13am

Despite the protestations of his supporters that we needed Phil Hogan in his position Brexit Trade negotiations, I think we might be better off without an Irish Trade Commissioner due to the NI border issues. There would be the risk of suspicion and pushback from the Unionist viewpoint and it would potentially cloud the bona fidas of the negotiation process and be used in spun and propaganda. As already mentioned, our Irish issues with Brexit are well set out at this stage and thrashed to death in the Withdrawal Agreement and Political Declaration, but there's obviously a way to go there yet and we might be better said by a neutral and more diplomatic representative, ie Michel Barnier has served us well to date in his role so maybe it'll all work out yet.
Financial services is where Brexit is really at so maybe were actually getting closer to real pressure points of influence and power now.

ChikiChiki · 09-09-2020 10:15am

Deleted User wrote: »

Based on what .....is that really your best argument? We are all entitled to our opinion , that’s what Boards is about , but at least make an effort to debate your point.

Based on your indifference to the non compliance of rules by people in strategic positions.

To maintain some semblance of stability in the economy and to avoid widespread restrictions full public compliance is needed with the rules that have been put in place. If people in positions of authority are breaking these rules then the public will follow. Perception and optics are everything.

FWIW, I never viewed Phil Hogan as particularly talented. He is a good networker with a bully persona but when you cut through the meat there is very little substance. Michael Cawley is a good operator.

Do you realize what you are advocating is a two tier system at a time when strong governance and accountability needs to be in place and everyone needs to be singing off the same hymn sheet? I do not agree with all the rules but they are in place for a reason. Being selfish goes is out the window.

2smiggy · 09-09-2020 10:17am

if he wasn't so arrogant about it , and in general , maybe he would still be in the job ?

stockshares · 09-09-2020 11:01am

stockshares wrote: »

Andrew McDowell and Mairead McGuinness to replace Phil Hogan

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/mairead-mcguinness-and-andrew-mcdowell-to-be-put-forward-as-nominees-to-replace-phil-hogan-as-irelands-european-commissioner-39503536.html

McGuinnesses replacements if she takes it.
https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1301865296202956803?s=19

Colm Markey received €90,000 in total in EU CAP payments for the years 2018-2019.

His farm showed a profit of €180,000 for 2019.

It would make you question why he needs a subsidy in the first place.

Quote from article:
"I think every farmer deserves a good income"

https://amp.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/new-meps-company-got-90000-in-eu-farm-payments-39516236.html?__twitter_impression=true

elperello · 09-09-2020 11:07am

stockshares wrote: »

Colm Markey received €90,000 in total in EU CAP payments for the years 2018-2019.

His farm showed a profit of €180,000 for 2019.

It would make you question why he needs a subsidy in the first place.

Quote from article:
"I think every farmer deserves a good income"

https://amp.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/new-meps-company-got-90000-in-eu-farm-payments-39516236.html?__twitter_impression=true

I expect he got the same payments as any other farmer on the same farm would have received.

jm08 · 09-09-2020 11:38am

stockshares wrote: »

Colm Markey received €90,000 in total in EU CAP payments for the years 2018-2019.

His farm showed a profit of €180,000 for 2019.

It would make you question why he needs a subsidy in the first place.

Quote from article:
"I think every farmer deserves a good income"

https://amp.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/new-meps-company-got-90000-in-eu-farm-payments-39516236.html?__twitter_impression=true

His CAP payments are €45K a year (not €90 for 2018-19). He has a big dairy farm which is doing well at the moment.

... and, just recently Teagasc published its annual farm survey which showed substantially different farm incomes across sectors, with the average dairy farm income at €87,000 while approximately half of all beef farms earned a farm income of €10,000 or less in 2017.

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/schemes/facts-and-figures-on-the-cap-in-ireland-where-the-money-comes-from-and-who-gets-it-37774326.html

stockshares · 09-09-2020 11:39am

elperello wrote: »

I expect he got the same payments as any other farmer on the same farm would have received.

Not saying otherwise but given his farm is so profitable you would wonder why he in particular needed this subsidy.

There are no such supports for other sectors .

Farmers are a protected species here. If their farm is unproductive they can always sell the land and find employment elsewhere just like others have to. They cannot fail here and have security that others don't have and can plan accordingly.

In his case he has a productive farm that was in profit to €180000 in 2019. Minus the subsidy that's €135000 profit.

No other industry or worker is protected like this. It's grossly unfair on everybody else. It allows them an enormous advantage over everybody else's d yet they constantly complain.

One example of this advantage is that 85% of College students come from a farming background. Those families have the security that enables them to send children to College.

I don't want to derail the thread but I think his example shows how things are weighted in their favour.

Donald Trump · 09-09-2020 11:46am

stockshares wrote: »

Not saying otherwise but given his farm is so profitable you would wonder why he in particular needed this subsidy.

There are no such supports for other sectors .

Farmers are a protected species here. If their farm is unproductive they can always sell the land and find employment elsewhere just like others have to. They cannot fail here and have security that others don't have and can plan accordingly.

In his case he has a productive farm that was in profit to €180000 in 2019. Minus the subsidy that's €135000 profit.

No other industry or worker is protected like this. It's grossly unfair on everybody else. It allows them an enormous advantage over everybody else's d yet they constantly complain.

One example of this advantage is that 85% of College students come from a farming background. Those families have the security that enables them to send children to College.

I don't want to derail the thread but I think his example shows how things are weighted in their favour.

It's funny to hear people whining about a subject that they have absolutely no knowledge of

Muahahaha · 09-09-2020 12:11pm

2smiggy wrote: »

if he wasn't so arrogant about it , and in general , maybe he would still be in the job ?

yeah I think so. Had he just told the full truth from day one he could have saved his own bacon. But instead we had lots of lies by omission and no less than nine public statements, each one explaining the previous one. His main trip wire was saying he went direct from Kilkenny to Clifden when Leo/Martin already knew he was in Kildare because Drew Harris reported it to them.

But similar to Barry Cowen had he told the uncensored truth from the off he could have saved his job. It was the lies to cover up the lies that got him. Ultimately it was Hogans own arrogance that led him to this behaviour.

Dual wheels · 09-09-2020 1:04pm

Would the post of commissioner not be a step down for mcguinness as first Vice President of parliament?? I would have thought she was in prime position to be the next president of parliament

jm08 · 09-09-2020 1:10pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

yeah I think so. Had he just told the full truth from day one he could have saved his own bacon. But instead we had lots of lies by omission and no less than nine public statements, each one explaining the previous one. His main trip wire was saying he went direct from Kilkenny to Clifden when Leo/Martin already knew he was in Kildare because Drew Harris reported it to them.

But similar to Barry Cowen had he told the uncensored truth from the off he could have saved his job. It was the lies to cover up the lies that got him. Ultimately it was Hogans own arrogance that led him to this behaviour.

There is a big difference between Barry Cowen and Hogan. Barry Cowen is still in a job as a TD in this State (and will likely be a minister in the future). Hogan actually lost his job in another State. If the Irish State wanted to punish him, it should be before the law courts, not in the court of public opinion.

jm08 · 09-09-2020 1:16pm

Dual wheels wrote: »

Would the post of commissioner not be a step down for mcguinness as first Vice President of parliament?? I would have thought she was in prime position to be the next president of parliament

I notice she got over 90% vote as First Vice President so she is very popular in across the European Parliament - probably why Ursula was anxious to make her a Commissioner! With this experience and her obvious popularity (not to mention she is very capable), she could be Ursula's replacement in a few years time. She probably could also go back to the EP in 3 years time and be elected its President.

stockshares · 09-09-2020 1:26pm

Donald Trump wrote: »

It's funny to hear people whining about a subject that they have absolutely no knowledge of

What makes you think so?

Edgware · 09-09-2020 1:39pm

stockshares wrote: »

Not saying otherwise but given his farm is so profitable you would wonder why he in particular needed this subsidy.

There are no such supports for other sectors .

Farmers are a protected species here. If their farm is unproductive they can always sell the land and find employment elsewhere just like others have to. They cannot fail here and have security that others don't have and can plan accordingly.

In his case he has a productive farm that was in profit to €180000 in 2019. Minus the subsidy that's €135000 profit.

No other industry or worker is protected like this. It's grossly unfair on everybody else. It allows them an enormous advantage over everybody else's d yet they constantly complain.

One example of this advantage is that 85% of College students come from a farming background. Those families have the security that enables them to send children to College.

I don't want to derail the thread but I think his example shows how things are weighted in their favour.

That 85% figure is pure bull**** which throws complete doubt over your other " facts"

jm08 · 09-09-2020 1:45pm

stockshares wrote: »

Not saying otherwise but given his farm is so profitable you would wonder why he in particular needed this subsidy.

The dairy sector is profitable probably because of Ireland dominant position as a producer of baby formula to places like China.

There are no such supports for other sectors .

Thats because they don't produce stuff that people need to stay alive (food to eat).

Farmers are a protected species here. If their farm is unproductive they can always sell the land and find employment elsewhere just like others have to. They cannot fail here and have security that others don't have and can plan accordingly.

Who is going to buy and farm the land? Who is going to grow the food for this person now that they have got a real job elsewhere?

In his case he has a productive farm that was in profit to €180000 in 2019. Minus the subsidy that's €135000 profit.

Thats a two year period. He has a very big farming enterprise. Not the normal.

No other industry or worker is protected like this. It's grossly unfair on everybody else. It allows them an enormous advantage over everybody else's d yet they constantly complain.

Its protected so that they remain producing food so that workers have something to eat (apart from Agri business employing about 180,000 people in Ireland).

One example of this advantage is that 85% of College students come from a farming background. Those families have the security that enables them to send children to College.

I'd say its more like they know there is no money in farming so their kids need to get a good job.

I don't want to derail the thread but I think his example shows how things are weighted in their favour.

Its all about maintaining a food supply for the population.

Donald Trump · 09-09-2020 1:54pm

jm08 wrote: »

stockshares wrote: »

One example of this advantage is that 85% of College students come from a farming background. Those families have the security that enables them to send children to College.

I'd say its more like they know there is no money in farming so their kids need to get a good job.

Kids have to get the points to go to college. Moaners can't really blame the farmer's kids for being smarter and more hardworking than they were.

You'll find very few farmer's kids who view getting pregnant to get a council house or just a straightforward life on the dole as an actual lifestyle choice.

99% of people in this country have the opportunity to go to college if they want to go and actually lift a finger.

09-09-2020 2:41pm

jm08 wrote: »

There is a big difference between Barry Cowen and Hogan. Barry Cowen is still in a job as a TD in this State (and will likely be a minister in the future). Hogan actually lost his job in another State. If the Irish State wanted to punish him, it should be before the law courts, not in the court of public opinion.

Turn that on its head, perhaps. Phil lost his job because he lied, omitted, obfuscated to his boss on numerous occasions. As has frequently been said on this thread, had he faced up from the first opportunity he had, he’d probably still be in that role. He didn’t, and he isn’t

Barry Cowen did (broadly) the same. He was removed from his Ministry. He can only be removed from being a TD by his constituents

Hawthorn Tree · 14-09-2020 11:36pm

Mr Hogan said: ‘If they knew I was a European Commissioner or a politician, they wouldn’t be stopping me.’

Why has nobody in FG or the Gardaí addressed this statement?

ShamNNspace · 15-09-2020 12:01am

Hawthorn Tree wrote: »

Mr Hogan said: ‘If they knew I was a European Commissioner or a politician, they wouldn’t be stopping me.’

Why has nobody in FG or the Gardaí addressed this statement?

Probably because its too close to the truth sadly

jm08 · 15-09-2020 12:12am

Hawthorn Tree wrote: »

Mr Hogan said: ‘If they knew I was a European Commissioner or a politician, they wouldn’t be stopping me.’

Why has nobody in FG or the Gardaí addressed this statement?

Because you are using it out of context.

"I was stopped by a member of the Irish police in relation to putting a phone...in answering a call...to my ear is certainly...ha, like if they knew I was a European Commissioner or a politician they wouldn't be stopping me: police were doing their job and doing it well."

https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1298965043632013312

elperello · 15-09-2020 12:14am

The first link is to Tony Connelly on what PH might have been trying to say.

https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1298965047000039424

Second link is to the clip itself.

https://www.thesun.ie/news/5828791/phil-hogan-gardai-wouldnt-stopped-him-phone-politician/

Not taking sides but there does appear to be a case for thinking he misspoke.

Have a look/listen and see what you think.

Suckit · 15-09-2020 1:14am

They should be stopping everyone EU Commissioner or not. The title doesn't give him any super powers that I am aware of that prevents him from driving any more carelessly than anyone else while holding a phone to their ear.
Even if he didn't have a hands free/BT kit, he could have pulled in, used speaker etc..

JohnnyFlash · 15-09-2020 1:38am

This was a shít idea wasn't it, looking back with the wisdom of time?

Jizique · 15-09-2020 7:39am

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

This was a shít idea wasn't it, looking back with the wisdom of time?

Of course it was, but the populist rabble got their pound of flesh, the bonus being that it was somebody linked to Irish Water.
Amazing how quiet it has gone now; not a dicky bird about Woulfe and any of the others who were there any more.

Hawthorn Tree · 15-09-2020 8:57am

jm08 wrote: »

Because you are using it out of context.

"I was stopped by a member of the Irish police in relation to putting a phone...in answering a call...to my ear is certainly...ha, like if they knew I was a European Commissioner or a politician they wouldn't be stopping me: police were doing their job and doing it well."

https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/status/1298965043632013312

He changed his tune when he knew he made a mistake.

like if they knew I was a European Commissioner or a politician they wouldn't be stopping me

PHIL HOGAN NEEDS TO RESIGN.

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