How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

Murple · 10-09-2020 07:33AM

Scoondal wrote: »

My son finished school in the middle of March. There was no further connection between the school and the pupil after that. Lists of work were sent to me so that I could teach my child at home. An attempt was made to provide videos of the teacher with the text book ... it was laughable.

Laughable?

SusanC10 · 10-09-2020 08:09AM

Can any of the Primary Teachers here tell me is there any guidance from Dept on singing in the Classroom ? 5th Class.

Boggles · 10-09-2020 08:22AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

Can any of the Primary Teachers here tell me is there any guidance from Dept on singing in the Classroom ? 5th Class.

No Stairway to Heaven.

wirelessdude01 · 10-09-2020 08:36AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

Can any of the Primary Teachers here tell me is there any guidance from Dept on singing in the Classroom ? 5th Class.

Singing is allowed. Only mention of singing in the document refers to choirs where there would be pupils from different classes/year groups mixing and thus breaking the whole bubble illusion.

SusanC10 · 10-09-2020 09:21AM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Singing is allowed. Only mention of singing in the document refers to choirs where there would be pupils from different classes/year groups mixing and thus breaking the whole bubble illusion.

Would you mind sending me a link to that document please ?
Daughter is saying that they are having "Choir Practice" today with other 5th Class. Not overly happy about it tbh.

irishblessing · 10-09-2020 10:05AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

Can any of the Primary Teachers here tell me is there any guidance from Dept on singing in the Classroom ? 5th Class.

In the new guidelines released for re-opening of the pubs, wasn't bands/karaoke banned for this reason? The risk of the virus spreading out by singing, people singing along, and talking louder over the music greatly increases the risk. Once again, schools are supposed to be some magical place where the virus isn't able to act as it normally does in other settings? :mad: I would literally pull my child from the school today if that was going on.

average_runner · 10-09-2020 10:07AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

Would you mind sending me a link to that document please ?
Daughter is saying that they are having "Choir Practice" today with other 5th Class. Not overly happy about it tbh.

Did you ring the school to talk about it ?

SusanC10 · 10-09-2020 10:11AM

average_runner wrote: »

Did you ring the school to talk about it ?

Not yet. She literally said it in the car outside the school gates - "We will be singing today !" I asked her about it and she said that there will be singing with the other 5th for the Choir. Then hoped out of the car.
I was going to wait and see what actually happens. She wears a mask in school.

Supercell · 10-09-2020 10:11AM

My three kids are all learning new songs in their primary school, (Junior, First and Third class), singing goes with the territory in primary school I would have thought? Not bothered about it as there is effectively zero social distancing and all are in prefabs anyhow, c'est la vie

irishblessing · 10-09-2020 10:18AM

Supercell wrote: »

My three kids are all learning new songs in their primary school, (Junior, First and Third class), singing goes with the territory in primary school I would have thought? Not bothered about it as there is effectively zero social distancing and all are in prefabs anyhow, c'est la vie

wow... global pandemic in which virus cases in schools are taking up and your attitude is "c'est la vie?" So just go ahead and spread it as much as possible since they're at risk anyway? Well I'm all about mitigating risk as much as can be done. Will you still say ah well, "c'est la vie" if your children bring the virus home and you're flattened/seriously ill/coping with it for months on end? Singing maybe went with the territory in pre covid times, but we are not in those times now.

irishblessing · 10-09-2020 10:21AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

Not yet. She literally said it in the car outside the school gates - "We will be singing today !" I asked her about it and she said that there will be singing with the other 5th for the Choir. Then hoped out of the car.
I was going to wait and see what actually happens. She wears a mask in school.

But then it will have actually happened. Why not ring the school before it happens and tell them you're not okay with it?

10-09-2020 10:44AM

Clear that parents need access to the guidance given to schools for Covid and what is and isn't safe to do re art, pe, singing etc.,and what might be in hand to avoid the dangers i.e., humming,talking along to songs, having choir practice outdoors etc. Of course parents would have to be careful that kids won't face a Spanish Inquisition at the end of every schoolday!

BonsaiKitten · 10-09-2020 10:45AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

Would you mind sending me a link to that document please ?
Daughter is saying that they are having "Choir Practice" today with other 5th Class. Not overly happy about it tbh.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CEHuVvDhq73/?igshid=15ocmxaetojtr

Now, I know that's an instagram page but have read the guidance myself and can confirm singing is covered in it. The mention of choir might interest you but again, not prohibited.

You can access the full guidance by Googling "Roadmap for reopening school". Links should appear right away.

SusanC10 · 10-09-2020 10:47AM

BonsaiKitten wrote: »

https://www.instagram.com/p/CEHuVvDhq73/?igshid=15ocmxaetojtr

Now, I know that's an instagram page but have read the guidance myself and can confirm singing is covered in it. The mention of choir might interest you but again, not prohibited.

You can access the full guidance by Googling "Roadmap for reopening school". Links should appear right away.

Thanks for this. Going to have a read of it all.

History Queen · 10-09-2020 10:50AM

Balagan1 wrote: »

Clear that parents need access to the guidance given to schools for Covid and what is and isn't safe to do re art, pe, singing etc.,and what might be in hand to avoid the dangers i.e., humming,talking along to songs, having choir practice outdoors etc. Of course parents would have to be careful that kids won't face a Spanish Inquisition at the end of every schoolday!

The guidance is available on the Department of Education website if parents wish to read it

Supercell · 10-09-2020 10:53AM

irishblessing wrote: »

wow... global pandemic in which virus cases in schools are taking up and your attitude is "c'est la vie?" So just go ahead and spread it as much as possible since they're at risk anyway? Well I'm all about mitigating risk as much as can be done. Will you still say ah well, "c'est la vie" if your children bring the virus home and you're flattened/seriously ill/coping with it for months on end? Singing maybe went with the territory in pre covid times, but we are not in those times now.

Ah here, I think you are being a bit melodramatic, these are little children with runny noses, holding hands, bumping off each other, playing with the same toys, shouting constantly, you really think singing adds much to that?

irishblessing · 10-09-2020 11:06AM

Supercell wrote: »

Ah here, I think you are being a bit melodramatic, these are little children with runny noses, holding hands, bumping off each other, playing with the same toys, shouting constantly, you really think singing adds much to that?

Melodramatic, in a global pandemic, in which the same activity is banned in other settings? :-p So yeah, since it's banned from the pubs and and elsewhere the world over I'd say the experts really think singing adds much to it.

The child in question here is in 5th class. I don't think they all have runny noses, or are holding hands, or playing with toys, or shouting in a classroom. Not sure what point you're trying to make with those examples that don't even apply. In my kid's school, they're actually not allowed to come in contact with each other. Tag isn't allowed to be played or games where they touch each other and they're also not going to be sharing things between each other. Seems to be pretty standard with all schools I'm aware of in our friend/family circles.

10-09-2020 11:14AM

Supercell wrote: »

Ah here, I think you are being a bit melodramatic, these are little children with runny noses, holding hands, bumping off each other, playing with the same toys, shouting constantly, you really think singing adds much to that?

Sometimes I would be comforted to believe comments like this are a wind-up, however unpleasant or mindless. Especially if they actually have kids in their care.

kilburn · 10-09-2020 11:20AM

Anyone know how long after a positive case is confirmed before HSE contact the school

TonyMaloney · 10-09-2020 11:27AM

Balagan1 wrote: »

Sometimes I would be comforted to believe comments like this are a wind-up, however unpleasant or mindless. Especially if they actually have kids in their care.

In fairness to Supercell, this sort of thing should not be left to the parents.

There should be clear guidance on things like singing. It's just another failing by the DoE.

deliege · 10-09-2020 11:28AM

Belgian mainstream newspapers today, from Flanders public health agency looking at recent contact tracking numbers:

" We mainly get infected at work and school: Staying at home is not enough. You have to isolate yourself

We notice that a sick person often brings the virus into the family and infects several other family members." That says Ria Vandereyt, spokeswoman for the Agency for Care and Health. On the basis of contact research, they see how, together with the restart of the schools and the business community, the corona virus is spreading eagerly in our living rooms. (...)"

https://www.hln.be/nieuws/binnenland/we-raken-vooral-besmet-op-werk-en-school-thuisblijven-volstaat-niet-je-moet-je-afzonderen~a9b85a09/

JDD · 10-09-2020 11:34AM

deliege wrote: »

Belgian mainstream newspapers today, from Flanders public health agency looking at recent contact tracking numbers:

" We mainly get infected at work and school: Staying at home is not enough. You have to isolate yourself (...) We notice that a sick person often brings the virus into the family and infects several other family members." That says Ria Vandereyt, spokeswoman for the Agency for Care and Health. On the basis of contact research, they see how, together with the restart of the schools and the business community, the corona virus is spreading eagerly in our living rooms. "

https://www.hln.be/nieuws/binnenland/we-raken-vooral-besmet-op-werk-en-school-thuisblijven-volstaat-niet-je-moet-je-afzonderen~a9b85a09/

I just don't know how you can avoid getting infected in a house, if another family member is infected. If my husband caught it, by the time symptoms show I probably would also be infected. If one of my children got infected in school and brought it home, well, not only would I likely be infected when they were presymptomatic, but you can't isolate a child in a room for 14 days while they're ill. Even if I moved into the room to mind them, it's likely that I would get sick and not be able to mind them, so the other parent would have to take over.

It's completely unreasonable to think the infection won't spread amongst family members. The best we can hope for is that the family stay home once the first person shows symptoms, and stay isolated until the last person recovers.

I'd love to know how many of this "clusters from private homes" are just people within the same house infecting each other, and how many are proper clusters, meaning there was a gathering in the house and the infection spread to another household.

Thewife · 10-09-2020 11:36AM

What are the official guidelines around suspected cases in a class ? 2 kids were sent home from my daughters class on Monday after becoming ill in the class with coughing and those kids are awaiting testing according to my daughter as told in a group snapchat between them . Our kids have given us all this information , there has been no contact from the school in relation to this and I’m just wondering at what point would the school notify parents of the possibility of a confirmed case in our kids class ?
Thank you in advance

Supercell · 10-09-2020 11:37AM

Balagan1 wrote: »

Sometimes I would be comforted to believe comments like this are a wind-up, however unpleasant or mindless. Especially if they actually have kids in their care.

See this is the problem, just because I'm not panicking by default means I'm mindless, that's called cognitive dissonance (putting it politely).

Read what I wrote before, my kids are in tiny prefabs, Junior, 1st Class and 3rd class. I don't know what other schools are like where no kid touches each other, at all apparently or plays with the same toys, my kids school certainly doesn't have that luxury, and I'd wager if you looked at that parents kids school that's not really the reality either unless the classes are truly tiny and the kids are older(5th, 6th class perhaps). Its unlikely in any Dublin school I'd guess unless its a very expensive private school.

Stop and think for a moment, does singing really add to it, for my young lot in prefabs, not a jot is my considered, not mindless opinion.
I do appreciate you have your opinion and won't be swayed one bit by this, but for the record I did want to reply to your insulting comment. I don't like reading bickering online so that my final comment on this.

drunkmonkey · 10-09-2020 11:37AM

deliege wrote: »

Belgian mainstream newspapers today, from Flanders public health agency looking at recent contact tracking numbers:

" We mainly get infected at work and school: Staying at home is not enough. You have to isolate yourself (...) We notice that a sick person often brings the virus into the family and infects several other family members." That says Ria Vandereyt, spokeswoman for the Agency for Care and Health. On the basis of contact research, they see how, together with the restart of the schools and the business community, the corona virus is spreading eagerly in our living rooms. "

https://www.hln.be/nieuws/binnenland/we-raken-vooral-besmet-op-werk-en-school-thuisblijven-volstaat-niet-je-moet-je-afzonderen~a9b85a09/

Not a lot can be done about indoor transmission in households without severe constraints on daily life, Masks don't work in that environment. There's no real solution besides get on with it.
The testing were doing is showing up covid up to 78 days after infection, we've no idea if current reported cases testing positive even have active covid.

Mrsmum · 10-09-2020 11:43AM

JDD wrote: »

I just don't know how you can avoid getting infected in a house, if another family member is infected. If my husband caught it, by the time symptoms show I probably would also be infected. If one of my children got infected in school and brought it home, well, not only would I likely be infected when they were presymptomatic, but you can't isolate a child in a room for 14 days while they're ill. Even if I moved into the room to mind them, it's likely that I would get sick and not be able to mind them, so the other parent would have to take over.

It's completely unreasonable to think the infection won't spread amongst family members. The best we can hope for is that the family stay home once the first person shows symptoms, and stay isolated until the last person recovers.

I'd love to know how many of this "clusters from private homes" are just people within the same house infecting each other, and how many are proper clusters, meaning there was a gathering in the house and the infection spread to another household.

It would be interesting to know when someone is infected, how many of their family are infected by them or escape. Take someone like Claire Byrne just as an example since she has been public about it, she has young children and would obviously have been affectionate with them before she knew she was Covid positive , so when she got it, did her kids get it too and her husband also. If not how come ?

TonyMaloney · 10-09-2020 11:46AM

Supercell wrote: »

See this is the problem, just because I'm not panicking by default means I'm mindless, that's called cognitive dissonance (putting it politely).

Read what I wrote before, my kids are in tiny prefabs, Junior, 1st Class and 3rd class. I don't know what other schools are like where no kid touches each other, at all apparently or plays with the same toys, my kids school certainly doesn't have that luxury, and I'd wager if you looked at that parents kids school that's not really the reality either unless the classes are truly tiny and the kids are older(5th, 6th class perhaps). Its unlikely in any Dublin school I'd guess unless its a very expensive private school.

Stop and think for a moment, does singing really add to it, for my young lot in prefabs, not a jot is my considered, not mindless opinion.
I do appreciate you have your opinion and won't be swayed one bit by this, but for the record I did want to reply to your insulting comment. I don't like reading bickering online so that my final comment on this.

There's been numerous studies on large outbreaks caused by group singing (choirs, concerts etc.) in indoor settings.

here's a recent enough article on it
https://www.npr.org/2020/08/10/888945949/is-singing-together-safe-in-the-era-of-coronavirus-not-really-experts-say?t=1599734428396

You make a fair point about transmission occurring through the kids being kids and mixing together as kids do, but I'd guess that activities like singing could accelerate the transmission and be particularly dangerous for the teacher who might otherwise be able to do a degree of social distancing

10-09-2020 11:47AM

History Queen wrote: »

The guidance is available on the Department of Education website if parents wish to read it

Thank you! An enormous amount of info in there and hard to search it. Still, info re singing, art, PE etc., under Covid restrictions must be in there.

deliege · 10-09-2020 11:50AM

JDD wrote: »

I'd love to know how many of this "clusters from private homes" are just people within the same house infecting each other, and how many are proper clusters, meaning there was a gathering in the house and the infection spread to another household.

I understand. Amongst my acquaintances I know of one family in France and one in Belgium where one parent got it (from work for one, unknown for the other), was detected soonish (as quite sick), self-isolated as best as possible (ensuite guest room) and... it worked for one, not for the other (e.g. one spouse contaminated, the other not). In both cases the kids (primary school aged) were not tested, nor had any significant symptoms.

More recently I heard of another, in Jura, where a family got together for a diner celebrating the return of a young adult (from a sabbatical. Returned from Mexico and should have been isolating for 15 days...). Parents, grand-parents, some cousins, 10 people I'm told. So far 6 tested positive...

kilburn · 10-09-2020 11:53AM

Thewife wrote:

What are the official guidelines around suspected cases in a class ? 2 kids were sent home from my daughters class on Monday after becoming ill in the class with coughing and those kids are awaiting testing according to my daughter as told in a group snapchat between them . Our kids have given us all this information , there has been no contact from the school in relation to this and Iâ€™m just wondering at what point would the school notify parents of the possibility of a confirmed case in our kids class ? Thank you in advance

Have been asking this very same question for days but no answer.

Once school receives confirmation from HSE the HSE decides the further action.

I have no idea how long after positive result is confirmed that the HSE contact school.

Same situation here 2 kids in our kids class out of school nearly 2 weeks community knows from family they are positive but school still hasn't been informed

How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

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