How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

Bananaleaf · 12-08-2020 11:29PM

Bobtheman wrote: »

Jesus these tablets are great....

Bob! That was not what your principal meant when they said "The department have given us all money to get tablets for the classroom"

i_surge · 12-08-2020 11:29PM

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Now, this is interesting. I could be very wrong on this, but as far as I am aware, schools have the power to make those local arrangements. I say this because I know of one school who is doing some form of blended learning. Can detail the specifics if anyone interested, but to keep this as concise as possible I won't for now.

The only reason I can think of re: why this is not a nationwide plan is that I'm guessing the boards of management would have to be in agreement (parents are on BOMs so they would have a say) that this model would work.

Thing about it is though, I'd imagine that if it is possible for a school to do half and half, but some just don't, the whole country isn't going to go out on strike because some teachers somewhere are not happy with the policy that their school designed.

Full disclosure: I'm just a teacher, have no management or post holding experience (don't ever want it either!) so I'm just going on the roadmap and my experience of seeing other circulars/policies being implemented over the years.

Sounds like a lot of the blind following the blind and all too afraid to cause a fuss.

Bananaleaf · 12-08-2020 11:32PM

i_surge wrote: »

Sounds like a lot of the blind following the blind and all too afraid to cause a fuss.

Do you have a child going back to school?
Has their principal been in contact with you?

i_surge · 12-08-2020 11:33PM

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Do you have a child going back to school?
Has their principal been in contact with you?

No skin in the game except I don't want us to do obviously stupid things when we are trying to contain a virus.

Bananaleaf · 12-08-2020 11:44PM

i_surge wrote: »

No skin in the game except I don't want us to do obviously stupid things when we are trying to contain a virus.

Yeah, fair enough. I understand that. As some on this thread will be sick of me mentioning, I have a father who falls into the "very high risk" category. I am his closest contact so will have to visit him at times to bring him to hospital apps etc.

I do not want to return to my place of work. It is only in the past week that I have become extremely anxious about it. I would prefer to work from home and while up to about a week ago I did want to return, I am now secretly (not-so-secret anymore!) hoping that there is a last-minute U-turn.

I don't think there will be though, because even though the money the govt have spent on schools isn't enough to have them Covid-safe, it is WAY too much to have pumped into them and then not open them come Sep.

What can we do? Not a rhetorical question, I'm genuinely asking. I've outlined in a previous post all the efforts that were made by my circle of colleagues and friends to contact the various powers that be, but we just hit brick walls the whole time.

i_surge · 12-08-2020 11:47PM

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Yeah, fair enough. I understand that. As some on this thread will be sick of me mentioning, I have a father who falls into the "very high risk" category. I am his closest contact so will have to visit him at times to bring him to hospital apps etc.

I do not want to return to my place of work. It is only in the past week that I have become extremely anxious about it. I would prefer to work from home and while up to about a week ago I did want to return, I am now secretly (not-so-secret anymore!) hoping that there is a last-minute U-turn.

I don't think there will be though, because even though the money the govt have spent on schools isn't enough to have them Covid-safe isn't enough, it is WAY too much to have pumped into them and then not open them come Sep.

What can we do? Not a rhetorical question, I'm genuinely asking. I've outlined in a previous post all the efforts that were made by my circle of colleagues and friends to contact the various powers that be, but we just hit brick walls the whole time.

Tough situation, hope you find an answer.

Smacruairi · 12-08-2020 11:52PM

i_surge wrote: »

No skin in the game except I don't want us to do obviously stupid things when we are trying to contain a virus.

I agree with you, the rotating weeks or time was suggested by every teaching org I know. Govt wouldn't go for it. You can technically go off and do your own blended thing but there's not a hope in hell you'd get it through the BOM from my experience. No school wants to be the one who says "we can't do it", you'd lose your whole student population. So now it's a bit of a Mexican standoff with the DES.

One thing I was say however, was that I was in making a safety video for our students today with a safety expert, and seeing as we are going to have to live with the virus for the foreseeable future, if they all follow the steps we say, it's as close to ok as you'll get it. Social distancing in schools is impossible in its current format, but most schools are doing a hell of a lot better at securing their buildings that I thought they would be able to.

If a school isn't communicating, it's because the principal is up to their eyes in about 9000 small acts. The senior management teams have organised their own meetings sans DES to share best practice, often going 3hrs or so (virtually) and then the same the next day. If this plan is in any way successful, it will be to the detriment of the wellbeing of several principals who could find themselves burned out by the end of the year. (and that's with me still moaning at my boss about the micro issues!)

Drumpot · 13-08-2020 09:23AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UJ2PL5ERVo

Very good video from Dr John basically outlining what a lot of us suspect. Evidence suggesting very young children are actually more likely to spread virus and there’s no difference between adults and older children.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/12/health/covid-kids-school-gupta-essay/index.html

CNN report on what USA schools are doing and some things to expect.

Honestly, I’m not sure what to make of it all as a parent. Seems like schools are going to be very high risk environments if a pupil has the virus and goes to class.

Then on the flip side, schools are important to children. We don’t know how long this is going to play out. If you keep them out of school do you have to not let them play with kids on the road? Maybe being outdoors makes it a lower risk and of course they will only be playing with 2-3 kids, instead of being in a classroom of 30 so the risk is substantially less.

GPoint · 13-08-2020 10:06AM

https://www.newstalk.com/news/schools-return-masks-breaks-1059920

Feel for the secondary school kids.
Breathing breaks ffs. At least they do realise its going to be a challenge to make kids sit in a mask all day.

average_runner · 13-08-2020 10:18AM

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Yeah, fair enough. I understand that. As some on this thread will be sick of me mentioning, I have a father who falls into the "very high risk" category. I am his closest contact so will have to visit him at times to bring him to hospital apps etc.

I do not want to return to my place of work. It is only in the past week that I have become extremely anxious about it. I would prefer to work from home and while up to about a week ago I did want to return, I am now secretly (not-so-secret anymore!) hoping that there is a last-minute U-turn.

I don't think there will be though, because even though the money the govt have spent on schools isn't enough to have them Covid-safe, it is WAY too much to have pumped into them and then not open them come Sep.

What can we do? Not a rhetorical question, I'm genuinely asking. I've outlined in a previous post all the efforts that were made by my circle of colleagues and friends to contact the various powers that be, but we just hit brick walls the whole time.

For a teacher in a no win situation. I understand the working from home part but its not practical unless kids are of a certain age and all have the equipment.

If you are a primary teacher, do you have a teaching helper in the class?
Could you do remote to the class on big screen and the helper helps the class in the room?

jrosen · 13-08-2020 10:20AM

There is no such thing as covid safe, for anyone in any sector.

I can see there being changes as the days/weeks go on. This is new for the students and schools and they will learn with each day what working and what isn't.
It wont be possible for any student to stay in one room and sit at one seat for an entire school day. There will need to be breaks/walking breaks outside even.

I wear a mask all day and at first it was uncomfortable but now its ok. The students will get used to it.

average_runner · 13-08-2020 10:21AM

Drumpot wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UJ2PL5ERVo

Very good video from Dr John basically outlining what a lot of us suspect. Evidence suggesting very young children are actually more likely to spread virus and there’s no difference between adults and older children.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/12/health/covid-kids-school-gupta-essay/index.html

CNN report on what USA schools are doing and some things to expect.

Honestly, I’m not sure what to make of it all as a parent. Seems like schools are going to be very high risk environments if a pupil has the virus and goes to class.

Then on the flip side, schools are important to children. We don’t know how long this is going to play out. If you keep them out of school do you have to not let them play with kids on the road? Maybe being outdoors makes it a lower risk and of course they will only be playing with 2-3 kids, instead of being in a classroom of 30 so the risk is substantially less.

Playing outdoors is minimal risk. Kids are doing this already and they have to get on with their socialising skills.
Sure they are all in sport out door for the last month together

Bananaleaf · 13-08-2020 10:33AM

average_runner wrote: »

For a teacher in a no win situation. I understand the working from home part but its not practical unless kids are of a certain age and all have the equipment.

If you are a primary teacher, do you have a teaching helper in the class?
Could you do remote to the class on big screen and the helper helps the class in the room?

Thanks for the reply. No, I'm second level. I just have to get on with it, same as the rest of the country. I am scared though. But sure so are a lot of people.

All I can do is try my best. I'll have a mask and a visor and I'll have plenty of sanitiser.

Heard from my principal today and teachers will be moving with students in base rooms in our place.

Again, makes sense in theory but I'm worried about having to be in contact with areas/rooms that other staff members have been in and possibly not cleaned properly. I'm also a bit worried about the air quality in rooms where students have been sitting still for hours. Even with the windows open, if you've humid weather like you have today, there is nearly no point.

Very worried. I always, without fail, catch a cold in September. No matter how much I seem to prepare for it (vitamins, sleep, hydration, eat well, have always been a regular sanitiser of my workspace) it always happens.

Does anyone have answers to the following:

Is there any benefit to me bringing a desk fan around with me or is it pointless?

Is there any benefit to me getting the flu vaccine? I know it won't protect me against Covid, but does it help boost the immune system against colds? Am I talking through my hole?

Bananaleaf · 13-08-2020 10:35AM

jrosen wrote: »

I can see there being changes as the days/weeks go on. This is new for the students and schools and they will learn with each day what working and what isn't.
It wont be possible for any student to stay in one room and sit at one seat for an entire school day. There will need to be breaks/walking breaks outside even.

What I don't understand at second level is that if we all actually believe that young people are not at risk of transmitting the virus, why the need to have them shut away in the one room all day in the first place?

average_runner · 13-08-2020 10:41AM

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Thanks for the reply. No, I'm second level. I just have to get on with it, same as the rest of the country. I am scared though. But sure so are a lot of people.

All I can do is try my best. I'll have a mask and a visor and I'll have plenty of sanitiser.

Heard from my principal today and teachers will be moving with students in base rooms in our place.

Again, makes sense but I'm worried about having to be in contact with areas/rooms that other staff members have been in and possibly not cleaned properly. I'm also a bit worried about the air quality in rooms where students have been sitting still for hours. Even with the windows open, if you've humid weather like you have today, there is nearly no point.

Very worried. I always, without fail, catch a cold in September. No matter how much I seem to prepare for it (vitamins, sleep, hydration, eat well, have always been a regular sanitiser of my workspace) it always happens.

Does anyone have answers to the following:

Is there any benefit to me bringing a desk fan around with me or is it pointless?

Is there any benefit to me getting the flu vaccine? I know it won't protect me against Covid, but does it help boost the immune system against colds? Am I talking through my hole?

Flu vaccine could give you the flu also, my wife got it two years ago and got a terrible dose from it.

In a way i believe the government should issue a statement, anyone with kids or interacting with them should keep away from the elderly. But that brings its own problems as some grand parents look after kids

wirelessdude01 · 13-08-2020 10:43AM

average_runner wrote: »

In a way i believe the government should issue a statement, anyone with kids or interacting with them should keep away from the elderly. But that brings its own problems as some grand parents look after kids

Would also negate the narrative that schools can open more or less safely.

gabeeg · 13-08-2020 10:48AM

average_runner wrote: »

Flu vaccine could give you the flu also, my wife got it two years ago and got a terrible dose from it.

In a way i believe the government should issue a statement, anyone with kids or interacting with them should keep away from the elderly. But that brings its own problems as some grand parents look after kids

I don't mean to negate your own experience, but the flu vaccine can't give you the flu because it doesn't contain any active virus.
Possibly she caught another virus?

The flu vaccine won't give you any protection from covid to the best of my knowledge, but if course it will protect vulnerable people from catching the flu from you.
Which is no bad thing.

Also there's nothing that says you can't have the flu and covid at the same time, which would most likely be pretty bloody awful

morebabies · 13-08-2020 10:50AM

What do you guys think will most likely happen, as in, unless I've misunderstood the virus, once 1 million children start mixing, what may begin as sporadic reports of cases here and there in schools will surely become a nationwide explosion of cases... ?

Will the Department make a blanket decision to close all schools do you think, or will they continue to try and put out fires locally because they don't want to go back on their mantra of a full reopening?

average_runner · 13-08-2020 10:56AM

gabeeg wrote: »

I don't mean to negate your own experience, but the flu vaccine can't give you the flu because it doesn't contain any active virus.
Possibly she caught another virus?

The flu vaccine won't give you any protection from covid to the best of my knowledge, but if course it will protect vulnerable people from catching the flu from you.
Which is no bad thing.

Also there's nothing that says you can't have the flu and covid at the same time, which would most likely be pretty bloody awful

I rephrase it a bit better, it gave her flu like symptons which had her in the bed for a week and out of work for 1.5 weeks.

Vaccine can give you flu like symptons that needs treatment

average_runner · 13-08-2020 10:57AM

morebabies wrote: »

What do you guys think will most likely happen, as in, unless I've misunderstood the virus, once 1 million children start mixing, what may begin as sporadic reports of cases here and there in schools will surely become a nationwide explosion of cases... ?

Will the Department make a blanket decision to close all schools do you think, or will they continue to try and put out fires locally because they don't want to go back on their mantra of a full reopening?

No one knows, but i do hope schools reports to all parents if even one case in the school

Bananaleaf · 13-08-2020 11:02AM

I've bought two of those clear plastic pencil cases to keep my keys and phone in.

Added bonus that I wasnt expecting is that I can still use my phone while it is still in the pencilcase. So thinking I will keep it in there during the day and never take it or my keys out until I get to my car, where I will have a sanitiser in the boot to run over everything before getting into car. Am also considering having a change of top (bottoms taking it a bit far in the carpark :pac: ) and shoes in car to replace the ones I was wearing around the school. Straight into a bag with them and home to be either washed or hung out the back garden for a couple of hours.

SusanC10 · 13-08-2020 11:03AM

average_runner wrote: »

No one knows, but i do hope schools reports to all parents if even one case in the school

In the email from our Primary School, they have said that they will tell Parents if there is a suspected or confirmed case in the Class.
But it also says that 2 Classes are 1 Bubble.
So I don't know.

average_runner · 13-08-2020 11:15AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

In the email from our Primary School, they have said that they will tell Parents if there is a suspected or confirmed case in the Class.
But it also says that 2 Classes are 1 Bubble.
So I don't know.

Reason we need to know is because the grand parents wants the kids after school, they miss them. We aren't sure but want to be sure the schools are releasing all information asap so we can take the kids away to protect them

Oranage2 · 13-08-2020 11:16AM

Looks like the plan is to open the schools. If there are cases in a school then close that school. Rinse and repeat and pray there aren't any cases.

Seems there's little about minimizing risk to the teachers and students. The bubble and pods talk is just a token suggestion to seem like there's something being done but in reality it's basically just the first point.

gabeeg · 13-08-2020 11:27AM

So we know that colds, coughs, sniffles and high temperature will keep individual kids out of school.
And we know that a case or two of covid will likely shut an entire school for a time.

But I think it's also worth noting that bad weather could shut schools frequently too.
It probably wouldn't even require a yellow weather warning to make teaching in a class with all windows and doors open impossible, and the kids inside utterly miserable.

JDD · 13-08-2020 11:27AM

Well, having waited it out for as long as possible, I have just forked out €200 for schoolbooks for a senior infant and third classer, along with another €100 on uniform. So they better bloody start back now.

EDIT: And I still have the school shoes to buy and "voluntary" contribution to pay. If it turns out that the schools are closed by October, I'll be on Kildare St with a pitchfork.

Drumpot · 13-08-2020 11:28AM

morebabies wrote: »

What do you guys think will most likely happen, as in, unless I've misunderstood the virus, once 1 million children start mixing, what may begin as sporadic reports of cases here and there in schools will surely become a nationwide explosion of cases... ?

Will the Department make a blanket decision to close all schools do you think, or will they continue to try and put out fires locally because they don't want to go back on their mantra of a full reopening?

I think alot of this is will end up being about faith and trust. We are going to have to put our trust in the individual school that they are putting in enough measures to mitigate the risks to children and trust that they will be honest and transparent if a situation emerges.

Bottom line is that there is going to be 25+ a class. You cannot have a risk free environment unless the room is massive and/or has a savage ventilation system. If one student in the room has the virus, how exactly do other children not get it if they are in the same room for 5-8 hours ? When you break it down to its simplest form, its quite depressing and concerning. Washing your hands, a couple of feet distance, what difference does that make if you are stuck in a class for hours with somebody infected (teacher aswell).

On a side note, are classes going to be like 1900s shut up and listen environments ? Speaking/Talking increases chances of virus spreading, so will teachers/schools be far more strict (because they have to be), which in turn will take away somewhat from the general social benefits of going to school.

SusanC10 · 13-08-2020 11:29AM

Oranage2 wrote: »

Looks like the plan is to open the schools. If there are cases in a school then close that school. Rinse and repeat and pray there aren't any cases.
.

If there were a case in either of our schools, I would be happier if they closed the whole school rather than just the Bubble/Pod/Class being sent home.

Oranage2 · 13-08-2020 11:33AM

SusanC10 wrote: »

If there were a case in either of our schools, I would be happier if they closed the whole school rather than just the Bubble/Pod/Class being sent home.

I think they'd have to close the school as every kid would need testing before they could go back. Probably just closed for a few days - week. Though if teachers got it then there could be a shortage very quick

Bananaleaf · 13-08-2020 11:38AM

JDD wrote: »

Well, having waited it out for as long as possible, I have just forked out €200 for schoolbooks for a senior infant and third classer, along with another €100 on uniform. So they better bloody start back now.

EDIT: And I still have the school shoes to buy and "voluntary" contribution to pay. If it turns out that the schools are closed by October, I'll be on Kildare St with a pitchfork.

And this is why they will open, even if it is unsafe to do so. Because there will be loads of people like JDD who will be raging if they don't after all the money they've paid. And rightly so.

How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

Comments