1967 VW Variant.

kadman · 31-07-2020 9:26am

John.G wrote: »

If the oil cooler shown is partially obscuring No3 cylinder then the timing on that cylinder was retarded by the cam profile as that cylinder ran hotter, the oil cooler was subsequently re located.

Correct, it was put in the doghouse;)

zilog_jones · 31-07-2020 9:32am

kadman wrote: »

And i see that manual shows the fastback interior with seatbelts.
This squareback has none. I'm not sure if they were ever fitted, but thats another days work:)

Going by the NCT, they weren't required in Ireland until June 1971? That manual is from the US, I don't think they were required by then (not until 1968) but lap belts in front seats were commonly fitted.

kadman · 31-07-2020 9:36am

Just got word, new starter is on the way, should have it at11.

So should have a better engine running vid sometime today.:)

kadman · 31-07-2020 9:37am

zilog_jones wrote: »

Going by the NCT, they weren't required in Ireland until June 1971? That manual is from the US, I don't think they were required by then (not until 1968) but lap belts in front seats were commonly fitted.

Thought as much.

31-07-2020 9:38am

Great project. It's great seeing an old engine come to life and 50+ years is a long time to be silent. There is a history of Type 3s in my family too.

What milage is on the car?
Was Alfa's father the first owner?

kadman · 31-07-2020 10:26am

Fratello wrote: »

Great project. It's great seeing an old engine come to life and 50+ years is a long time to be silent. There is a history of Type 3s in my family too.

What milage is on the car?
Was Alfa's father the first owner?

34k on the clock, which I would say is correct, judging by the condition of the body, and the new look of the mechanicals.

Even when we took off the starter motor, and could see the pinion bush in the gearbox housing, it looked new.

And if it was 134k, he would have to have driven 40+ miles per year, or 3k per month:D:D

Dont have the logbook yet, so dont know any details

alfa beta · 31-07-2020 12:49pm

Fratello wrote: »

Was Alfa's father the first owner?

'Volkswagen Leasing' is listed in the logbook prior to my Dad's name. They owned it for one year in 1967 I think. No other owners then apart from the ould fella (!!) and now Kadman himself :-)

Hotblack Desiato · 31-07-2020 12:50pm

zilog_jones wrote: »

Going by the NCT, they weren't required in Ireland until June 1971? That manual is from the US, I don't think they were required by then (not until 1968) but lap belts in front seats were commonly fitted.

We hired an old Bentley for our wedding day, the mrs couldn't get over that there were no rear :rolleyes: seat belts until the chauffeur pointed out there were none in the front either! In fairness even a brick wall isn't going to cause a 2 ton car to make a sudden stop :pac:

Didn't spoil our enjoyment of the nicely chilled champagne

alfa beta wrote: »

'Volkswagen Leasing' is listed in the logbook prior to my Dad's name. They owned it for one year in 1967 I think. No other owners then apart from the ould fella (!!) and now Kadman himself :-)

Explains the ZJ Dublin plate...

kadman · 31-07-2020 12:59pm

Success day 2.

Great day today. me and john done a few tweeks to the carb chokes, and reset the timing to
a more precise figure,

and amidst all the smoke, we managed to get it running at times very nicely.

And captured all the mayhem on vid for posting later today.

At the moment we are enjoying all the smoke and petrol fumes:D:D:D

Watch this space for more from the auld dudes:P:P:P

Hotblack Desiato · 31-07-2020 1:17pm

Does it need leaded juice?

kadman · 31-07-2020 1:24pm

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Does it need leaded juice?

No.

Vw fitted hardened steel valve seats in early 66.

kadman · 31-07-2020 3:48pm

Well John and myself had another great day.:)

Resulting in this engine now running 100% better than the last vid,
but not quite there yet. But its good enough to know that this is going to
be a sweet running motor.

Started off today with a brand new replacement starter motor. Far smaller and
lighter than the original bosch. But it packs a punch.

Fitted it on and it gave a great effort on the startup, which resulted in smoke and crap everywhere. We knew there was still an issue with the right hand carb, backfiring, spitting and banging.
We also noted that prior to this on acceleration it tended to flood into the manifold. Which was not good.

So using the process of elimination we knew we had to replace the inlet needle valve. So off with the cover. On inspection we saw that someone had fitted extra washers under the valve, a telltale sign that there was a flooding issue that was trying to be fixed. The concept being, drop the valve lower, it will close earlier as the float rises.
Problem is a faulty needle valve will not fully close at any position. Solution , replace the valve. Which is what we did.

Now that we positioned the timing spot on, it was firing almost immediately, which was great. We also knew that on previous attempts that the fuel pump was working as can be seen with the clear fuel line flowing petrol.

So we ran the car and the engine sounds great, but the carb still needs a brand new valve fitted , as the replacement is good but not perfect. So I have new valves, just need to find them and fit them later on.

Engine needs to be run for while to clean itself out, and then an oil change run again, and then another oil change. Ongoing process, but this enfine is definitely worth it.

So I will post a couple of youtubes showing where we were, and where we are at. ASAP

watch this space.:)

kadman · 31-07-2020 4:48pm

I know this is what you have all been waiting for

More to come

kadman · 31-07-2020 4:50pm

And another

More to come

kadman · 31-07-2020 4:51pm

And more

And more to come

kadman · 31-07-2020 4:53pm

And finally

kadman · 31-07-2020 5:05pm

Hey Alpha, I told you we would get it going:D:D:cool:

John.G · 31-07-2020 7:04pm

Are the auto choke(s) heating elements electrically powered up now?

zetecescort · 31-07-2020 8:04pm

Cant handle the speed of work, too used to following the likes of Project Blinky on youtube.

Keep up the great work

kadman · 31-07-2020 8:40pm

John.G wrote: »

Are the auto choke(s) heating elements electrically powered up now?

No,

They are manually set closed, and open by the heat of the engine, same result.

Neither is the electromagnetic wired to receive power, so that must be manually open, as its running. If it was not manually open, then it would not run.

Jeff2 · 31-07-2020 9:11pm

It sounds very good to me in the second last video you posted.

I mean for running with out the air filter.

It really is great to see it going again.

kadman · 31-07-2020 9:15pm

kadman wrote: »

And finally

Video Number 5 really shows how we have this engine finally starting up on the button, whenever we flick the innovative Aircraft/Ignition flip switch.

Its like Tom Cruise flipping on the afterburner in Topgun:D:D:D:D

kadman · 31-07-2020 9:21pm

Just to mention too, that while were doing all this the heater was putting ferocious heat into the car.

So its another indication of how good this car really is. It was the hottest VW I have ever sat in.

Plan for tomorrow is,
Fit a brand new needle valve into the R/H carb.
New manifold/carb gaskets.
Run the car for longer to dislodge any muck from the engine oilways.
Do an oil filter clean, and new oil change.

Now thats it on the button, have to look into driving it around the house for starters,
in order to check the clutch and gearbox. Then maybe renew all the brake components.

kadman · 31-07-2020 10:04pm

Jeff2 wrote: »

It sounds very good to me in the second last video you posted.

I mean for running with out the air filter.

It really is great to see it going again.[/QUOT

You are right, it sounds better than the engine in my own fastback, and it will get better too.:)

Once the bits and bobs are done the air filter is getting cleaned, and refilled with new oil, and going back on. Dont want any crap going down the carbs.

Very last smokey vid on post 118 IIRC, was for Alphas benefit:p to show him how we persevered to get this baby running.

But it was worth it on so many fronts:)

kadman · 31-07-2020 10:07pm

alfa beta wrote: »

'Volkswagen Leasing' is listed in the logbook prior to my Dad's name. They owned it for one year in 1967 I think. No other owners then apart from the ould fella (!!) and now Kadman himself :-)

So its gone from one ould fella, to another ould fella.:)

I will look after it as well as the first ould fella,;) trust me

alfa beta · 31-07-2020 11:29pm

kadman wrote: »

Hey Alpha, I told you we would get it going:D:D:cool:

I didn't doubt you .... but you got there much quicker than I expected ... I would have thought you'd have had to buy/order/install a raft of new bits and pieces so it's amazing to see it running so soon. This certainly bodes well for the other engines that have been sitting idle in that shed :-)

I'm away at the moment but I can't wait to get back and show these videos to my mum - she'll be amazed

kadman · 31-07-2020 11:50pm

alfa beta wrote: »

I didn't doubt you .... but you got there much quicker than I expected ... I would have thought you'd have had to buy/order/install a raft of new bits and pieces so it's amazing to see it running so soon. This certainly bodes well for the other engines that have been sitting idle in that shed :-)

I'm away at the moment but I can't wait to get back and show these videos to my mum - she'll be amazed

I would have no doubt that any of the engines in that shed could be got going with the same effort,
In the right hands of course:P:P:P

So if you need homes for anymore, let me know:D

I'm sure the sound of the variant alone will resonate happy memories with your mum:)

There were no raft of pieces to buy for this engine. I had new plugs, needle valve , gaskets anyway. And we knew the starting process would be tough on an old starter, thats why I opted for a new one, and it paid for itself in minutes.

The day I checked for compression, and got some, I knew that we were on a winner. If there is compression it tells a lot about condition of the parts. Either in an aircooled or water cooled engine. Once you get that, you only have to add fuel and a source of ignition, the rest is physics.

So when you want a donation for the next non runner, let me know:D

In the end it was an easy fix, if you know these engines, tougher if you dont.
But i did see some evidence on the car of previous attempts in the right direction. So I suspect your dad was engine savvy too. But the ignition aircraft switches are class, and I am leaving them in..
Tell your mum this journey is well worth it.

tc20 · 01-08-2020 12:19am

Just to add my admiration to kadman & his brothers work on the Variants revival.
I've owned a couple of old & young timers, and have an understanding of how an ICE works but I kneel before ye lads, your knowledge & passion. Keep her lit!
Alfa Beta's original thread has been a joy to follow - the sequel is every bit enthralling.

kadman · 01-08-2020 12:31am

tc20 wrote: »

Just to add my admiration to kadman & his brothers work on the Variants revival.
I've owned a couple of old & young timers, and have an understanding of how an ICE works but I kneel before ye lads, your knowledge & passion. Keep her lit!
Alfa Beta's original thread has been a joy to follow - the sequel is every bit enthralling.

Ah sure you couldn't let this ould girl in the shed for another 50 years:)

Sure we wouldn't be around to fix it:P

kadman · 02-08-2020 10:06am

AS the engine was running for a while it is good practice to change the oil
if the engine has been lying up for a while. And 50 years is a while:D

So the VwW oil filter is conveniently placed here for easy access.
As you will see, its a filter/strainer system thats easily cleanable
and re useable. No need to be buying new filters at all.

So remove the centre plug to drain the oil, then remove the 6 captive nuts,
remove the plate, then the strainer.

Plate off and you can see the strainer here in place.

Strainer off and you can see the oil pickup pipe in
the engine casing.

Here you caan see both the plate and the strainer. And
both these items are very clean for an old engine.

Once you have them all cleaned up, its just fit a new gasket if needed,
replace the strainer, and then the plate, and new washers.
New washers and correct torque make sure that the nuts are not over tightened, pulling the studs out of the case.

All done,

kadman · 02-08-2020 10:21am

And i decided to replace the needle inlet valve on the right hand carburetor.

On close inspection I noticed some corrosion at the seating on the inside of the carburetor cover,
where the needle valve is fitted. This corrosion prevents the valve crush washer from correctly seating,
so this can allow the fuel to squeeze by the valve under pressure. And this was clearly happening when the
engine was under increased acceleration.,,

So the solution was to clean the seat for the valve, and refit a new valve.

You can see the valves in the picture. New one on the left, and old one on the right.

I also inspected the electro magnetic jet more closely. It is a piston operated valve
with 3 equally spaced holes at the end. Petrol flows through the valve holes, and out the
end jet. Problem was the jet was over tightened, which is a regular occurrence on old
vw engines. Apart from damaging the valve, it can damage the seat in the carb. If this
happens the carb is then scrap. Luckily the damage is to the jet, as the holes have been forced oval
but not fully closed. So I fitted a non electric jet here

Here you can see the damaged jet.

kadman · 02-08-2020 10:42am

All these minor issues collectively effect the proper running of this engine. So only real option is to
take out the engine. Strip it down to a short block, and then inspect the heads to check for
proper valve seating which i suspect are leaking. Then re lap them, fit new seals everywhere, and rebuild
the engine. This wont take long at all.
And while I am at it, i can get all the tin work powder coated, fit a new clutch , starter bush,
and a new exhaust which I have 2 of NOS.

Looks like a nice winter project in a nice warm shed:)

But not just yet, I will wait to see if the compression comes up more. I checked cylinder number 2 and since the first test before it ran it has come up 25lb pressure.

John.G · 02-08-2020 10:46am

I wished they had that strainer centre drain plug in my last 77 beetle as it did/does make for a far easier drain, it probably encouraged just draining the oil without cleaning the strainer, it would also be interesting to compare the fine filtering properties of these strainers to the now universal full flow paper elements. I think the key to all those air cooled engines longevity or otherwise was to change the oil regularly as it ran very hot despite the oil cooler, friend of mine had a 67, 1300 beetle (Pict 1 carburettor, i think) for 16 years and I could almost swear that the engine was as new after ~ 170k miles but he changed the oil every 1200/1500 miles.

kadman · 02-08-2020 10:52am

I am fairly sure that the engine does not need splitting at the crank case
for inspection in the short term. As there has been no evidence at the moment
of any issue with oil pressure. Oil light goes out immediately, and stays out for about
5-10 seconds after the key is turned of after the engine running and hot.

All this points to adequate oil pressure at the moment. And these engines are easily
taken out and rebuilt in a short space of time. So engine rebuilds dont worry me.
This was the oil taken out of the engine, so it appears to have been well maintained.

kadman · 02-08-2020 10:59am

John.G wrote: »

I wished they had that strainer centre drain plug in my last 77 beetle as it did/does make for a far easier drain, it probably encouraged just draining the oil without cleaning the strainer, it would also be interesting to compare the fine filtering properties of these strainers to the now universal full flow paper elements. I think the key to all those air cooled engines longevity or otherwise was to change the oil regularly as it ran very hot despite the oil cooler, friend of mine had a 67, 1300 beetle (Pict 1 carburettor, i think) for 16 years and I could almost swear that the engine was as new after ~ 170k miles but he changed the oil every 1200/1500 miles.

I think you are right, frequent oil changes is the key, and the proper oil of course. The change in the centre oil plug was a killer right enough.

Any engine we had that did not have one, we stripped the plate of an old engine and switched it. Centre plug was easier and less messy.

kadman · 02-08-2020 12:43pm

Vw pancake engine that is fitted to this variant is quickly removed if u need
to do any work on it.
Its the same as this engine in the video, that seems great, but I decided to strip it down anyway,
as I wanted to fit a set of rings, now that I had it out, even tho it did not need it them.
Just see how clear the exhaust is.
But glad i did as I found a loose stud on the case, so I had to fit a case saver on one stud in order
to torque the head.

Its now in my own Vw fastback

This is what I had to do on the case,

And wind in the case saver

case saver in

Torque in the stud

kadman · 03-08-2020 2:23pm

I spent 30 minutes on the car today.

I removed the left hand carb and fitted a new inlet needle valve
on the fuel inlet. I fitted a new gasket to the inlet manifold that connects to the carb.

Checked all the jets to make sure they were the correct type, which they were.

Refitted the carb and started the engine. I then adjusted the distributor ignition timing
with the engine running, and to adjust by ear of the engine note.

I took a chance with this car that based on its condition when I saw it, that I could get this
engine running.

Its turned out that it appears to be a brilliant engine. Starting great, and running well, very responsive to the
accelerator pedal. Its a brilliant result.

And now this is what I have

I now intend to get the brake sorted on the rear wheel, and drive it out of the
shed:):)

Igotadose · 03-08-2020 2:58pm

kadman wrote: »

I now intend to get the brake sorted on the rear wheel, and drive it out of the
shed:):)

If you were to summarize, clean it up, rebuild the carburetors and the starter and you had it running? Impressive, being in a barn really didn't destroy that car!

Jeff2 · 03-08-2020 2:59pm

Maybe check the engine and gearbox mounts while you have the engine out.

kadman · 03-08-2020 3:54pm

Jeff2 wrote: »

Maybe check the engine and gearbox mounts while you have the engine out.

Checked them day 2 when it was on the lift.:)

Like all the rubber items on the car they are firm but supple and not dried or cracked. The only rubber that suffered harm are some of the window seals.

Gadgetman496 · 03-08-2020 4:19pm

I remember nearly 40 years ago my elderly mechanic who was almost deaf used to adjust\tune my engine by feel. He would leave his hand on the rocker cover as he adjusted & could tell when he had it right. He could even tell if the tappets needed adjusting by leaving his hand on the running engine.

I sure miss the passion & friendliness of that man. God Bless him.

Kadman, you have that passion too. I'd dearly love to have you as my mechanic for sure.

They might not make cars like they used to, but, they certainly don't make craftsmen like you anymore either.

My current wagon was recalled a couple of weeks ago, something to do with a relay module & fuses that were in a sealed box, on some cars moisture was getting into the unit & causing a fire. When the work was done I asked the mechanic (Technician I think they call them now) what role the part change played in the car, what did it actually do or control, he just looked at me and said, I have no idea, we are just trained to change the parts I have no idea what it actually does!!!

Different times…

alfa beta · 03-08-2020 11:19pm

kadman wrote: »

I now intend to get the brake sorted on the rear wheel, and drive it out of the
shed:):)

That sounds great - fair play to you Kadman and thanks for the videos :-)

SmartinMartin · 04-08-2020 12:30am

Just think......

If alfa beta's dad had a mechanic like kadman in the first place. AB might never have been born.

Jeff2 · 04-08-2020 1:02am

SmartinMartin wrote: »

Just think......

If alfa beta's dad had a mechanic like kadman in the first place. AB might never have been born.

I hope Alfa takes that as a laugh, like he was conceived in the back of the square back.

me

Alfa works our that the time the car was parked up .,......

kadman · 04-08-2020 12:32pm

Update.
I managed to get the car driving out of the shed. And I wanted it moving, to check all gears, which you can see me trying in the vid.

Its all good, gearstick selector plate needs a small bit of adjusting thats all..

So we are getting nearer to liftoff.:)

ohnonotgmail · 04-08-2020 12:58pm

is anybody else getting no sound on the video?

kadman · 04-08-2020 1:09pm

I had a problem with the video sound, so I will have to make a better, longer vid:)

Gadgetman496 · 04-08-2020 1:13pm

kadman wrote: »

I had a problem with the video sound, so I will have to make a better, longer vid:)

And there was me thinking, Holy moly, he's converted it to electric overnight!

kadman · 04-08-2020 1:32pm

Gadgetman496 wrote: »

I remember nearly 40 years ago my elderly mechanic who was almost deaf used to adjust\tune my engine by feel. He would leave his hand on the rocker cover as he adjusted & could tell when he had it right. He could even tell if the tappets needed adjusting by leaving his hand on the running engine.

I sure miss the passion & friendliness of that man. God Bless him.

Kadman, you have that passion too. I'd dearly love to have you as my mechanic for sure.

They might not make cars like they used to, but, they certainly don't make craftsmen like you anymore either.

My current wagon was recalled a couple of weeks ago, something to do with a relay module & fuses that were in a sealed box, on some cars moisture was getting into the unit & causing a fire. When the work was done I asked the mechanic (Technician I think they call them now) what role the part change played in the car, what did it actually do or control, he just looked at me and said, I have no idea, we are just trained to change the parts I have no idea what it actually does!!!

Different times…

Yep typical answer. But its not their fault.
They pinpoint the fault with the laptop....if they can.

Then fek out everything they think it could be. Throw in lots of new tech you dont need, but will have to pay for.

I call them laptop mechanics, not real ones..;)

davycha · 04-08-2020 2:57pm

Well done ,Kadman and your brother

,
Delighted to see this car back running and moving about on its own steam.
Great Thread , keep up the good work.

davycha

1967 VW Variant.

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