Used Model S vs new Model 3

copeyhagen · 28-06-2019 1:49pm #1

decided to start a new thread, if i ask in the model 3 thread, answers will be biased, same with the model s thread!

100% buying a tesla now, minds made up. either a 2016 85d or a brand new 3. ye know more about the differences than I do! is there anything else im missing from the below.

2016 model s 85d
+maybe very slightly more mileage per charge
+better looking (imo)
+bigger car, more storage (family of 4, two kids under 6)
+free supercharging for life (good for work commutes around country)
+10k cheaper approx
- only AP1 (nor much of an issue atm)
-older technology
-1 year of normal warranty left
-5 years battery and motor warranty left

brand new model 3 sr+
+newer technology in general
+ap3 ready
+4 year warranty on everything, or 100k km
+8 year warranty on battery&motor
-RWD only (not much of a negative I suppose)

besides the warranty, which is a big one obv, is there anything i have missed above?!

cheers!

Rob

Gumbo · 28-06-2019 3:09pm

I'd buy the new M3 Performance.
The Tech, sensors and build quality is better than what was available in the 2016, 2017 cars.

krissovo · 28-06-2019 3:24pm

Model 3 for me.

Why the SR+? Surely a performance spec M3 is similar price to a decent 2016 Model s.

Plus kids would love this at charge stops :-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6DP4DX5t5g

80sDiesel · 28-06-2019 3:37pm

I played that game all the time on my phone. Fantastic game

Sabre Man · 28-06-2019 4:20pm

A Model S 85 will have a higher consumption in kWh/km than a Model 3.

If you need the storage space or want to save 10k + supercharging fees, a Model S or X is the way to go. I also like that Model S has a binnacle display and more stalks.

A 20016 Model S isn't likely to get all the newest updates, so what you buy is more or less what you get, while a Model 3 will get many updates and improvements.

Mike9832 · 28-06-2019 4:25pm

Model 3 performance

Forget SR+

September1 · 28-06-2019 9:35pm

I did not drive those two cars, but according to Elon Musk second hand Model S is better https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/976771803044446208

copeyhagen · 28-06-2019 11:27pm

gonna head to sandyford tomorrow and have a look at both of them, ill come back with an opinion after!!

thanks for answers so far

unkel · 28-06-2019 11:50pm

copeyhagen wrote: »

+10k cheaper approx

Not really. Bring in a decent 2016 S with AP and it will set you back as much as a new 3 SR+ after VRT

copeyhagen · 30-06-2019 12:45am

went to Tesla today to look at both ,the model s is imo a million miles away from the model 3, though i do like the 3.

the sr+ rwd just isnt for me, gonna go or the used model s, just suits me better for now, if the model 3 lr is released eventually i would be interested, bit not gonna drop 60k now for the model 3 performance.

but eyah, theres n oway i will be saving 10k fro mthe cost of a new model 3 for a 2016, one can hope.

30-06-2019 4:25pm

The model 3 is quite expensive and really aimed at company car buyers to steal the 3 series and A4 sales.

Model S is a good car.

What do you not like about RWD ? I got RWD in the i3 and it's leaps and bounds better than any FWD EV because it's got a lot more grip. Test drive a Kona EV or Leaf 40 and you will know what I'm talking about , even though they got decent power and 0-100 tmes that suffers badly especially on damp roads.

Model S is a good car, and it's big , plenty of room.

Personally, I'd save the 10 K and get a Model 3 when it comes down in price. You'll probably save even more when you take into account interest + depreciation.

I see no used Model S on the Irish site, surprise surprise off to the U.K.

copeyhagen · 30-06-2019 6:23pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The model 3 is quite expensive and really aimed at company car buyers to steal the 3 series and A4 sales.

Model S is a good car.

What do you not like about RWD ? I got RWD in the i3 and it's leaps and bounds better than any FWD EV because it's got a lot more grip. Test drive a Kona EV or Leaf 40 and you will know what I'm talking about , even though they got decent power and 0-100 tmes that suffers badly especially on damp roads.

Model S is a good car, and it's big , plenty of room.

Personally, I'd save the 10 K and get a Model 3 when it comes down in price. You'll probably save even more when you take into account interest + depreciation.

I see no used Model S on the Irish site, surprise surprise off to the U.K.

nothing agaisnt the rwd, just the awd 85d sounds better. been looking at tonnes of sr+ videos and reading on the teslamotors forum and dont think thats for me, people reporting 170 miles range between charges.

if i own the mdoel s for 2 years and its still worth a few bob ill upgrade when the time comes to a LR m3 or soemthing.

n97 mini · 30-06-2019 7:16pm

copeyhagen wrote: »

nothing agaisnt the rwd, just the awd 85d sounds better. been looking at tonnes of sr+ videos and reading on the teslamotors forum and dont think thats for me, people reporting 170 miles range between charges.

if i own the mdoel s for 2 years and its still worth a few bob ill upgrade when the time comes to a LR m3 or soemthing.

Yeah, the fastest Teslas are all 4wd.

30-06-2019 8:28pm

copeyhagen wrote: »

nothing agaisnt the rwd, just the awd 85d sounds better. been looking at tonnes of sr+ videos and reading on the teslamotors forum and dont think thats for me, people reporting 170 miles range between charges.

if i own the mdoel s for 2 years and its still worth a few bob ill upgrade when the time comes to a LR m3 or soemthing.

Yeah AWD is better of course but if a RWD comes around at the right price I think you'd be mad not to snatch it up. My greatest fear would be keeping one out of warranty.

unkel · 01-07-2019 12:46am

High spec late 2015 S85D under GBP35k

Linky

Once a few shiploads of Model 3 will have been delivered to the UK, the prices of used Model S should come down quite a bit. Obviously post-brexit, bringing one of them in to Ireland might no longer be a viable option...

copeyhagen · 01-07-2019 11:00am

seen that one alright Unkel.

theres a nice 2015 on the tesla CPO website with a 90d battery, its 50k euro but comes with a 4 year warranty.

Every used Tesla vehicle has passed a 70‑point inspection and comes with either a 4‑year or 50,000 mile limited warranty or a 2‑year, up to 100,000 mile warranty

does anyone know if that would transfer with the car to Ireland?! the lad in Sandyford reckons the warranty travels with the car?

unkel · 01-07-2019 11:47am

Yes it does transfer with the car. 90D is very nice, I drove a 90D from Sandyford 2 years ago. Pretty rapid 0-100km/h in a touch over 4s, same as the Model 3 LR AWD I drove last week

Any link to the car?

copeyhagen · 01-07-2019 12:15pm

it was on the tesla uk used car section. 50k for a 2015 is expensive, but the 4 year warranty would give peace of mind for things like MCU etc.

at the same time, you could buy a used car from a dealer for 10k cheaper and hope nothing goes wrong ,though its unlikely to cost 10k in repairs.. hopefully!

unkel · 01-07-2019 12:51pm

copeyhagen wrote: »

it was on the tesla uk used car section. 50k for a 2015 is expensive

Ah ok, I thought you saw it in Tesla Ireland as you posted:

copeyhagen wrote: »

theres a nice 2015 on the tesla CPO website with a 90d battery, its 50k euro

So you meant GBP50k? Before bringing it in? That's madness imho. Better off buying a brand new one. There is one on the website, 75D, brand new for €72k + registration tax, I presume that's the VRT and will be about €3k-€4k?

copeyhagen · 01-07-2019 1:27pm

no, sorry, I should have said, its on the English site. its 50k euro converted or thereabouts.

would that English one you posted with the chip in windscreen, would that fail nct?

Petetheroadie · 03-09-2019 12:22pm

What did you do in the end?

copeyhagen wrote: »

no, sorry, I should have said, its on the English site. its 50k euro converted or thereabouts.

would that English one you posted with the chip in windscreen, would that fail nct?

Nedved85 · 07-06-2020 9:41pm

Resureccting a bit of an old thread here I know, but I still think it's relevant, especially with Model S prices coming down in the UK and lockdown being relaxed a bit.

Heart is set on a tesla and specifically the Model 3 for a good while.

Aiming for the SR+, probably white with 19" rims, or red with aeros.

However, looking at some of the latest CPO Model S' in the UK, my mind is going into overdrive.

eg:

https://www.tesla.com/en_GB/used/5YJSB7E17GF133380?token=$2y$10$rkQivfVAanlw81wz0FI/k.Bkt1YkTy3R3xxgguOXLUCE4JMVg4o4m&redirect=no

2 Year Warranty up to 37k miles

£35600 => say €40500

VRT of about 2k ?

Call it €43k all in including ferry/flight (not sure the flight is possible/advisable just now)

or

https://www.tesla.com/en_GB/used/5YJSB7E13GF163606?token=$2y$10$KZ6ZalaoCZxySvB9.RZ1T.m/MOVC.n.9tcMwkuVo8YEqqUhGJXSIi&redirect=no

Exact same warranty as a new Mode 3 - No surroof though

£37600 ==> say €42700

VRT 2k?

Call it €45k all in. (Edging a little too high for me for a 2nd hand car..)

Serious alternatives no?

A lot of depreciation already lost at this stage on those too

Looks like a lot of car for the price.

Just to mix it up - I'm also considering a second hand model 3 from some of the reputable dealers over there

Gumbo · 07-06-2020 9:47pm

If I could afford a M3P, I’d buy one over an older generation S as the tech is all there.

I’m currently looking at Model S too in the UK, a M3P is out of budget.

Nedved85 · 07-06-2020 9:49pm

M3P is too much for me.

Obviously I'd love one, but the SR+ fits me range wise to be honest.

Model S 75 should get similar range?

One big benefit down the line is the storage space should that need arise

Gumbo · 07-06-2020 9:52pm

Nedved85 wrote: »

M3P is too much for me.

Obviously I'd love one, but the SR+ fits me range wise to be honest.

Model S 75 should get similar range?

One big benefit down the line is the storage space should that need arise

Then it comes down to car size and space required. Kids etc, 7 seats?
Price the conversion on Revolut. You can transfer from revolut to Tesla as that’s what unkel (user on here) done.

Also, budget €500 for flight over, fuel, food and ferry back. It should be less
But at least if you budget 500 then you won’t be left short.

Nedved85 · 07-06-2020 9:56pm

Yup, Revolut for sure. Would probably sign up to Revolut premium to save on fees too.

I imported a Leaf before and did it that way.

No need for a 7 seater, but the hatchback would be useful should any kids come along.

Saying that, the Model 3 would do the job for us too to be honest. The S woould be more comfortable though, spacewise.

slave1 · 07-06-2020 10:13pm

Used MS all the way, way more practical car, the boot on the M3 would never work for me.
You should find plenty within that budget, free supercharging for life, free premium connectivity for life, faster AC charging, bigger inside, bigger boot, bigger frunk

Gumbo · 07-06-2020 10:20pm

slave1 wrote: »

Used MS all the way, way more practical car, the boot on the M3 would never work for me.
You should find plenty within that budget, free supercharging for life, free premium connectivity for life, faster AC charging, bigger inside, bigger boot, bigger frunk

If he buys from Tesla, a CPO he will loose the super charging, premium connectivity etc as Tesla appear to be removing them from all CPO cars.

07-06-2020 10:23pm

My PCP is up in November, can't decide what to do, m3 too expensive for my mileage and so is any car for 50K.

Being toying with the idea of a Model S only it would have around 160 K Kms for my budget and I'm driving 30,000 Kms a year + so in 5 years I'd have another 150 K odd kms.

Reliability of the Model S drivetrain is pretty good it's the rest of the car, Air Suspension, door handles, MCU etc etc can all add thousands.

Then there is the sensible side of me saying Kia E-Niro or E-Soul, Kona is woefully noisy. Kia has 7 year warranty. Disadvantage of the Kia/Hyundai is wheel spin in the wet.

Or keep i3 but not sure I really want to keep it much beyond warranty, already out since February.

Model S P85 600 dual motors sounds great but if something breaks it could cost thousands. It would be a car I'd keep a while.

Nedved85 · 07-06-2020 10:27pm

The MCU on the facelift models is ok no? It's the older ones that have issues?

slave1 · 07-06-2020 10:32pm

Gumbo wrote: »

If he buys from Tesla, a CPO he will loose the super charging, premium connectivity etc as Tesla appear to be removing them from all CPO cars.

If buying from Tesla.
Look around and there are CPOs with the free for life stuff sold by Tesla 2 years ago with 4 year CPO warranty back on sale by current owner and the warranty transfers so these are the sweet spot

markpb · 07-06-2020 10:38pm

Gumbo wrote: »

If he buys from Tesla, a CPO he will loose the super charging, premium connectivity etc as Tesla appear to be removing them from all CPO cars.

I wouldn’t place too much value on free super charging. Tesla have an extremely limited network here and no sign of expansion so it’s only going to be useful to a small number of people. Even then, you’d need to be using them very frequently for it to make much difference. And then, if you over use them, you’ll nerf your battery.

Black_Knight · 07-06-2020 10:40pm

Feel like im in the same boat, but with less money. Model S kinda ticks all the boxes, but has 2 drawbacks. 1. it's big, and would fairly dominate my driveway, and 2. it's big, and might scare my wife away from driving it. She's gotten very comfortable driving the Ioniq these days (while her car sits in the driveway gathering cobwebs... like it does most the year), and taking her car out involves removing both cars from the driveway which would be tiresome if she's afraid to move a giant model S.

The Model 3 on the other hand isn't lacking on boot storage from what i've seen in videos, and there's the frunk too. Wife would be able to drive it (at least likely to be more comfortable in it than a Model S). But there's the cost.

Ioniq is perfectly fine at the moment, but when baby #2 arrives, and we have to go anywhere with a boot absolutely brimming (or not bring certain things), and stop en route... I can hear the sighing already. That will likely be the tipping point. eNiro was originally the plan, but I don't see many of those going around. Model S is the alternative, but see above. Model 3 is probably ideal, but €€€. This time next year the "I told you so's" will begin, but with VAT on imports from the end of 2020, and the model 3 too young to depreciate enough to be affordable (to me), i'm struggling to see what my options are.

TLDR:
Ioniq small and only have it a year, baby 2 coming.
Model S big, wifey scared, and "we just got a car".
Model 3 pricey, and "we just got a car".

Gumbo · 07-06-2020 10:49pm

Nedved85 wrote: »

The MCU on the facelift models is ok no? It's the older ones that have issues?

Even the older ones now seem to be ok since a recent update. It reduced the data logging and hence the stress that the MCU is under.

Also worth noting there are aftermarket fixes in the UK for about £500.

Gumbo · 07-06-2020 10:51pm

markpb wrote: »

I wouldn’t place too much value on free super charging. Tesla have an extremely limited network here and no sign of expansion so it’s only going to be useful to a small number of people. Even then, you’d need to be using them very frequently for it to make much difference. And then, if you over use them, you’ll nerf your battery.

Either do I. Hence my posts in the MS thread

But I just wanted to print it out to the OP. Along with the connectivity removal it’s just a little annoying.

unkel · 07-06-2020 10:56pm

Nedved85 wrote: »

Resureccting a bit of an old thread here

And a bittersweet resurrection it is. The OP went for the used Model S. But his car got stolen recently. So I think he might be back to this same choice again.

Nedved85 wrote: »

No need for a 7 seater, but the hatchback would be useful should any kids come along.

Saying that, the Model 3 would do the job for us too to be honest.

You have no kids yet, you don't need the practicality or space yet. Only you can gauge when it is likely you will need those. Are you planning to start a family very soon? Or maybe not so soon?

In my view it's a bit pointless to buy something now for a situation you might be in or a need you might have in the future. That's why I'm voting Model 3. The base model is not super value for money in Ireland, it's a bit overpriced. But that said, there is nothing else like it out there, supply of EVs will likely be smaller than demand for the next year or two anyway so it should have relatively low depreciation

Nedved85 wrote: »

The MCU on the facelift models is ok no? It's the older ones that have issues?

No, they are the same. Only very recent cars get the newer MCU2. The issue with the MCU1 is much less likely to rear its ugly head now that a software update has stopped all the mad logging of data to the limited lifespan flash storage chip. But always a good idea to buy a used Tesla with a Tesla warranty if you can...

07-06-2020 10:58pm

Black_Knight wrote: »

eNiro was originally the plan, but I don't see many of those going around. .

Eniro is probably the most sensible option, good warranty and pretty reliable cars.

If anything goes wrong on a model S it can be expensive, Air suspension can cost thousands for instance. Door handles couple of grand too I heard. Common issue.

If you do low enough miles a model S with some mileage might not be so bad but for me it could be a completely different matter doing 30K Kms a year and the rest.

unkel · 07-06-2020 11:05pm

A lot of talk about expensive issues on the Model S, and that's an entirely fair point. It should be noted though that all Model S in the UK and Ireland are still covered under the 8 year motor, battery and drive train warranty. For another 2 years even for the oldest cars.

And as I said, a good idea to get a car with a Tesla warranty. No other manufacturer in the world offers a 2 year or sometimes even 4 year warranty on a used car that's already 6 years old. My warranty for my car bought directly from Tesla is going to last me the full 2 years, and the car slave1 got (in a private sale!) came with a near 2.5 year cover-to-cover warranty! And Tesla customer service is excellent when it comes to warranty repairs.

Black_Knight · 07-06-2020 11:09pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Eniro is probably the most sensible option, good warranty and pretty reliable cars.

If anything goes wrong on a model S it can be expensive, Air suspension can cost thousands for instance. Door handles couple of grand too I heard. Common issue.

If you do low enough miles a model S with some mileage might not be so bad but for me it could be a completely different matter doing 30K Kms a year and the rest.

Model S at ~€35k or less vs eNiro at €40k. Up to 2 years warranty (if CPO, which would be more likely if I did) vs 7 years warranty. I don't do much mileage at all. 15k kms a year.
If a 1-2 year old M3 was around eNiro money it'd certainly be worth thinking about, but if 2nd hand 1-2 year old eNiros appear at the same time for ~30k then the M3 is a harder sell.

Black_Knight · 07-06-2020 11:11pm

unkel wrote: »

A lot of talk about expensive issues on the Model S, and that's an entirely fair point. It should be noted though that all Model S in the UK and Ireland are still covered under the 8 year motor, battery and drive train warranty. For another 2 years even for the oldest cars.

And as I said, a good idea to get a car with a Tesla warranty. No other manufacturer in the world offers a 2 year or sometimes even 4 year warranty on a used car that's already 6 years old. My warranty for my car bought directly from Tesla is going to last me the full 2 years, and the car slave1 got (in a private sale!) came with a near 2.5 year cover-to-cover warranty! And Tesla customer service is excellent when it comes to warranty repairs.

Odd when you read up about a used Tesla and you're delighted to see "new battery, 3 door handles changed, MCU upgraded". You think to yourself, thank God all that stuff has gone wrong already!

unkel · 07-06-2020 11:12pm

Sure thing. But none of those need to worry you when you got a 2 year warranty from Tesla

And all of those (except the battery) still need to worry you when you buy privately with no warranty

07-06-2020 11:22pm

2 year warranty mileage limited ?

The model s would be a car I’d keep a long time 2 years warranty isn’t a lot really considering my mileage.

8 year drivetrain isn’t a lot either when the car is already 5 or 6 years old.

It’sa risk no doubt about it. One of my greatest worries would be the air suspension.

What’s the warranty on the Niro ? 7 years what does that include? Everything for 7 years but mileage limited?

Mike3287 · 07-06-2020 11:25pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Eniro is probably the most sensible option, good warranty and pretty reliable cars.

If anything goes wrong on a model S it can be expensive, Air suspension can cost thousands for instance. Door handles couple of grand too I heard. Common issue.

If you do low enough miles a model S with some mileage might not be so bad but for me it could be a completely different matter doing 30K Kms a year and the rest.

When you look back on your life in 20 years, don't you want to be able to say you had the balls to get the right car?

That ain't a bloody e-Niro btw ;-)

Also how anyone can pick a model 3 over model S too

Saw a 3 in town recently, my god was it ugly, the back ahhhh, awful

Model S much better looking car, especially 17 up, stunning car

Model 3 with aero wheels one of the ugliest yokes I've ever seen

Nedved85 · 07-06-2020 11:27pm

No kids unkel, but you'd never know in the nearish future that might be a factor. I think a Model 3 would do spacewise so I don't think I'd rule it out for that.

Also, as mentioned above (by Gumbo I think) , I don't think my other half would drive a Model S, she would drive a Model 3.

Side note, I actually had money down on a loaner Model 3 here from Tesla that was low 40s pretty recently. I had to back out as I could not sell my leaf in time and the trade in was brutal. The exact same car went back up on the inventory and sold recently for almost 6k more! The upside to all of this is that if I do indeed import a used model 3, I have have documentation that shows a keenly priced used Model 3 Tesla advertised here...

ie low VRT

Mike3287 · 07-06-2020 11:29pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

2 year warranty mileage limited ?

The model s would be a car I’d keep a long time 2 years warranty isn’t a lot really considering my mileage.

8 year drivetrain isn’t a lot either when the car is already 5 or 6 years old.

It’sa risk no doubt about it. One of my greatest worries would be the air suspension.

What’s the warranty on the Niro ? 7 years what does that include? Everything for 7 years but mileage limited?

100k cars are not for plebs, no offence

If your worried about running costs out of warranty a 100k Tesla MS aint for you

07-06-2020 11:35pm

Mike3287 wrote: »

100k cars are not for plebs, no offence

If your worried about running costs out of warranty a 100k Tesla MS aint for you

Why should I not be worried about a car that could cost thousands to fix if it breaks ? I don’t want to throw money away on a car unnecessarily. I got to work for it.

I do fair bit of driving which is only going to increase actually now that I think about it because I changed jobs and back to Monday to Friday and no longer on shift so mileage will increase a lot due to not having such time off.

unkel · 07-06-2020 11:36pm

Nedved85 wrote: »

Also, as mentioned above (by Gumbo I think) , I don't think my other half would drive a Model S

Black_Night. And it's a valid point. Model S is much longer than any car most previous owners have ever driven at about 5m long, but the width is the killer. Even if you're a very confident driver, it takes guts and skill to drive it into some of the multistory carparks. Or even some tight drive thrus. While of course ignoring the car beeping NOOOOOO!!!! at you all the time.

Nedved85 wrote: »

I actually had money down on a loaner Model 3 here from Tesla that was low 40s pretty recently. I had to back out as I could not sell my leaf in time

Bloody hell, you should have found or forced a solution there, that was a bargain, presuming it was a 2020 Model 3?

Gumbo · 07-06-2020 11:37pm

Mike3287 wrote: »

When you look back on your life in 20 years, don't you want to be able to say you had the balls to get the right car?

I and others very rarely agree with you, but I do here. And you know what, I’m even gonna like that post for this sentence alone.

unkel · 07-06-2020 11:41pm

Mike3287 wrote: »

100k cars are not for plebs, no offence

If your worried about running costs out of warranty a 100k Tesla MS aint for you

I for one am happy that you are back posting here man. But then you come out straight away with a stinker like that. Which will make many in here think what are you, a child?

Of course it bloody matters what out of warranty repairs can be expected and how much they cost. Pretty much none of the regulars in here could afford to or even if they could, would be willing to spend the guts of 100k on a car. We're not made of money. Personally I have not much more than a beer income. But I really like many aspects of a champagne lifestyle. This can be done. But you need to be very careful in your approach and handling. Buy well, sell well and hedge your risks. Potential expensive problems are crucial in all of this.

Mike3287 · 07-06-2020 11:43pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Why should I not be worried about a car that could cost thousands to fix if it breaks ? I don’t want to throw money away on a car unnecessarily. I got to work for it.

I do fair bit of driving which is only going to increase actually now that I think about it because I changed jobs and back to Monday to Friday and no longer on shift so mileage will increase a lot due to not having such time off.

That's the whole point

You shouldnt have to be worried

Its a car for rich people, with no money worries

Nedved85 · 07-06-2020 11:46pm

unkel wrote: »

Bloody hell, you should have found or forced a solution there, that was a bargain, presuming it was a 2020 Model 3?

Bargain, absolutely. 192 reg. Very low mileage, not the color I wanted to be honest, but I was OK with that given the price.

It was the start of the pandemic, no way I could sell my car.

Financially it was way too much of a gamble at that time so I could not proceed. I would have needed a significant bridging loan and my gut felt wrong risking it at that time.

Leaf gone now and I feel confident enough to either go for the s or a used M3 in the UK.

Delighted I have the docs if I do import a Model 3 though

Used Model S vs new Model 3

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