Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - Read OP for Mod Warnings

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 12:47AM

jibber5000 wrote: »

Where in any literature has it said that multiple children are dying due to Covid induced Kawasaki disease?

There's been about 400 cases in the ages 0-14 in Ireland without a single fatality. Surely it's enough of a sample to decide that it's less harmful to children, thank God.

13-05-2020 12:48AM

JoeA3 wrote: »

I don’t believe I am. In fact I think I am doing exactly the opposite to what you suggest. I AM taking some personal responsibility, I am not waiting for Leo to hold my hand.

I can’t understand why some people are incapable of assessing relative risk on their own turf without relying on the Nanny state. How is it going to be any less risky in 1, 2, 6 weeks time (the completely arbitrary dates that Leo / Tony / NPHET have dictated) than it is now? There’s a 250k+ total population in my county. And from that total, approx 350 confirmed cases since this started, the vast majority of whom have probably long recovered. To my mind I’m in greater danger of getting bitten by a Rattle snake than contracting this virus in my locality.

So for the sake of my sanity and more importantly my child’s wellbeing, we are getting our lives back to some normality while of course exercising a degree of common sense.

The fact that you think that you think you are more likely to get bitten by a rattlesnake in Ireland than catch covid-19 says it all.
...

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 12:50AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The fact that you think that you think you are more likely to get bitten by a rattlesnake in Ireland than catch covid-19 says it all.
...

Somehow I don't think it was meant literally but don't let that get in the way of your fit of fanaticism.

Speakerboxx · 13-05-2020 12:51AM

road_high wrote: »

I honestly don’t care. If they want to “extend it” let them off. But they won’t because money is talking as it is always does and they can’t afford to extend the welfare payments meaning they can’t keep it going much longer if ditherers like Holohan would like to. It’s coming to an organic end

I feel exactly the same. Enough is enough now. I be personally giving tony and co the two fingers to any other extensions he may introduce in the meantime. I am going to do my own thing in a safe manner and I'm not going be stopped either. I wont do anything that will harm anyone but i will use a bit of cop on as well with these restrictions. Some don't make any sense. If I cycle 10km solo outside the zone, who am I harming if i'm not near anyone while on a bike?

13-05-2020 12:52AM

jibber5000 wrote: »

Where in any literature has it said that multiple children are dying due to Covid induced Kawasaki disease?

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=Kawasaki+covid-19&btnG=#d=gs_qabs&u=%23p%3DuO1RBmSE8sMJ

JoeA3 · 13-05-2020 12:52AM

Deleted User wrote: »

The fact that you think that you think you are more likely to get bitten by a rattlesnake in Ireland than catch covid-19 says it all.
...

Not. Enough. Facepalms.

JoeA3 · 13-05-2020 12:54AM

Speakerboxx wrote: »

I feel exactly the same. Enough is enough now. I be personally giving tony and co the two fingers to any other extensions he may introduce in the meantime. I am goin to do my own thing in a safe manner and I'm not going be stopped either. I wont do anything that will harm anyone but i will use a bit of cop on as well with these restrictions. Some don't make any sense. If i cycle 10km solo outside the zone, who am i harming if im not near anyone while on a bike?

No one. As far as I can see loads of people have been doing likewise for weeks.

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 12:58AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=Kawasaki+covid-19&btnG=#d=gs_qabs&u=%23p%3DuO1RBmSE8sMJ

Not a single one of the documents on Google scholar mentioned a fatality other than one in 1967 caused by Kawasaki but I did find this:

A very rough estimation of incidence based on data from Bergamo, Italy, and New York State and a lot assumption is between 0.011%(95% CI: 0.009-0.014%)-0.31%(95% CI: 0.2-0.47%) of infected children.

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 01:00AM

Speakerboxx wrote: »

I feel exactly the same. Enough is enough now. I be personally giving tony and co the two fingers to any other extensions he may introduce in the meantime. I am going to do my own thing in a safe manner and I'm not going be stopped either. I wont do anything that will harm anyone but i will use a bit of cop on as well with these restrictions. Some don't make any sense. If I cycle 10km solo outside the zone, who am I harming if i'm not near anyone while on a bike?

I think some people are convinced there's like a 5km bubble that if they cross, a kitten somewhere dies of covid.

13-05-2020 01:02AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

Not a single one of the documents on Google scholar mentioned a fatality other than one in 1967 caused by Kawasaki but I did find this:

A very rough estimation of incidence based on data from Bergamo, Italy, and New York State and a lot assumption is between 0.011%(95% CI: 0.009-0.014%)-0.31%(95% CI: 0.2-0.47%) of infected children.

Kawasaki's disease has a mortality rate of roughly 0.5%. I'm pretty sure there has been more than 200 cases in history.

https://www.uptodate.com/contents/kawasaki-disease-clinical-features-and-diagnosis

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 01:04AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Kawasaki's disease has a mortality rate of roughly 0.5%. I'm pretty sure there has been more than 200 cases in history.

It's about cases of Kawasaki in children who've contracted covid. If you're going to attach a link at least bloody read the contents first.

13-05-2020 01:04AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

It's about cases of Kawasaki in children who've contracted covid. If you're going to attach a link at least bloody read the contents first.

Pretty sure covid-19 wasn't around in 1967.

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 01:06AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Pretty sure covid-19 wasn't around in 1967.

No the death in 1967 was from Kawasaki, not covid. That was the only fatality mentioned on the Google scholar link. The quote I attached was in relation to instances of Kawasaki as a result of covid. This really isn't that hard. Go back and read what you yourself attached.

13-05-2020 01:08AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

It's about cases of Kawasaki in children who've contracted covid. If you're going to attach a link at least bloody read the contents first.

What is the likelihood of multiple children contracting Kawasaki's disease whilst also suffering from covid-19?

jibber5000 · 13-05-2020 01:09AM

Deleted User wrote: »

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=Kawasaki+covid-19&btnG=#d=gs_qabs&u=%23p%3DuO1RBmSE8sMJ

From the European report it states only one death in Europe from Kawasaki linked Covid up to end of April out of 100 cases notified.

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 01:09AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What is the likelihood of multiple children contracting Kawasaki's disease whilst also suffering from covid-19?

It was there in the quote I attached in the first place, here it is again, now take your time and read it slowly.

A very rough estimation of incidence based on data from Bergamo, Italy, and New York State and a lot assumption is between 0.011%(95% CI: 0.009-0.014%)-0.31%(95% CI: 0.2-0.47%) of infected children.

13-05-2020 01:10AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

No the death in 1967 was from Kawasaki, not covid. That was the only fatality mentioned on the Google scholar link. The quote I attached was in relation to instances of Kawasaki as a result of covid. This really isn't that hard. Go back and read what you yourself attached.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31094-1/fulltext

13-05-2020 01:12AM

jibber5000 wrote: »

From the European report it states only one death in Europe from Kawasaki linked Covid up to end of April out of 100 cases notified.

Kids die from more than Kawasaki's. Spare a thought for the kids with CF.

moonage · 13-05-2020 01:16AM

The UK’s Kawasaki Disease Foundation issued a statement on April 28 which included the following:

"Fewer cases of Kawasaki Disease than would be normally expected at this time of year are currently being seen – not more."

https://www.societi.org.uk/kawasaki-disease-and-covid-19/

jibber5000 · 13-05-2020 01:16AM

Deleted User wrote: »

What is the likelihood of multiple children contracting Kawasaki's disease whilst also suffering from covid-19?

"For the 9 detailed patients most had incomplete presentation for Kawasaki disease (with a mean 1.7 (+/-1.2) criteria per patient for the 5 non fever criterion) and only one had a classical form"

Out of the 9 studied only one had classical Kawasaki. Out of the 9 if the mean is 1.7 out of the 5 non fever criterion, surely the actual diagnosis could be questioned in many of these cases?

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 01:17AM

moonage wrote: »

The UK’s Kawasaki Disease Foundation issued a statement on April 28 which included the following:

"Fewer cases of Kawasaki Disease than would be normally expected at this time of year are currently being seen – not more."

https://www.societi.org.uk/kawasaki-disease-and-covid-19/

That'll soften the cough of the panic merchant above.

jibber5000 · 13-05-2020 01:22AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Kids die from more than Kawasaki's. Spare a thought for the kids with CF.

Any child with CF should be kept indoors away from other children, nobody is arguing that.

Kawasaki was brought up by you earlier, hence the discussion.

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 01:25AM

jibber5000 wrote: »

Any child with CF should be kept indoors away from other children, nobody is arguing that.

Kawasaki was brought up by you earlier, hence the discussion.

Hence he made it blindingly obvious he hadn't a clue what to do after linking Google scholar.

jibber5000 · 13-05-2020 01:28AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

It was there in the quote I attached in the first place, here it is again, now take your time and read it slowly.

A very rough estimation of incidence based on data from Bergamo, Italy, and New York State and a lot assumption is between 0.011%(95% CI: 0.009-0.014%)-0.31%(95% CI: 0.2-0.47%) of infected children.

IF we extrapolate from those figures that say 1 in every 1000 infected child gets kawasaki and the mortality of Kawasaki is less than .5%, the mortality from covid induced kawasaki would be roughly 1/200,000.

LiquidZeb · 13-05-2020 01:32AM

jibber5000 wrote: »

IF we extrapolate from those figures that say 1 in every 1000 infected child gets kawasaki and the mortality of Kawasaki is less than .5%, the mortality from covid induced kawasaki would be roughly 1/200,000.

And yet it was being framed as the bubonic plague 2.0 in a previous page. I understand the situation is scary but people need to develop a bit of perspective.

MrDavid1976 · 13-05-2020 01:38AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

And yet it was being framed as the bubonic plague 2.0 in a previous page. I understand the situation is scary but people need to develop a bit of perspective.

More than perspective. Some compassion also - attacking that man for allowing his child play with other children is off the wall. I think there are people here hoping that the figures go up so that the lock down can continue and they will be proven right.

Let the people get on with things in a careful manner and protect the vulnerable/high risk. If that means dedicated hours in supermarkets and parks etc then great.

Meanwhile the HSE should concentrate on what it is supposed to be doing.

tobefrank321 · 13-05-2020 01:39AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C5&q=Kawasaki+covid-19&btnG=#d=gs_qabs&u=%23p%3DuO1RBmSE8sMJ

Maybe I need an eyesight test, but I saw no case there of a child dying.

It concluded as follows:

With regards to her COVID-19 infection, our patient’s clinical course and presentation were mild.
Throughout her hospitalization, she did not have any notable respiratory symptoms and repeat chest x-ray
was not obtained.

jibber5000 · 13-05-2020 01:39AM

LiquidZeb wrote: »

And yet it was being framed as the bubonic plague 2.0 in a previous page. I understand the situation is scary but people need to develop a bit of perspective.

Majority affected with it between ages of 1-4. So even if every child in Ireland was infected with Covid, which is virtually impossible, we might not see one fatality due to this.

jibber5000 · 13-05-2020 01:42AM

tobefrank321 wrote: »

Maybe I need an eyesight test, but I saw no case there of a child dying.

There was one in the European study to be fair.

Should be noted it has a much higher incidence in children of Asian ethnicity.

tobefrank321 · 13-05-2020 01:47AM

jibber5000 wrote: »

There was one in the European study to be fair.

Should be noted it has a much higher incidence in children of Asian ethnicity.

There's been something like 1 million covid cases in Europe and likely over 100,000 children infected. So this puts it into perspective.

The scaremongering has gone off the scale at this stage.

The common flu is likely just as dangerous to children, ie barely at all.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part III - Read OP for Mod Warnings