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Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker **Spoilers from post 2076**

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    #2612
    ErnestBorgnine
    Registered Users Posts: 238 ✭✭ErnestBorgnine


    SMC92Ian wrote: »
    I did and love the new films, beautiful looking films with great craic to be had.

    You turned your brain on for a film you need to turn your brain off to enjoy and loved it did you?

    That's a retcon JJ would be proud of.


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    #2613
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    SMC92Ian wrote: »
    It's a film about stupid laser guns and laser swords. Turn your brain off. Enjoy it. Star Wars is for kids. Stop over anylising it. Bang, pow, zap. :D

    Except kids think it's bad also.

    It's pretty bad when the TV show and the cartoons are better than the movies.

    Besides there is nothing to analyse. It's vacant of any substance.


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    #2614
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Wedwood wrote: »
    BTW, there were plenty of people who didn’t like/had no interest in Star Wars during the original movies as well. They mainly just shrugged/ignored the movies and watched whatever they did like.

    If you don’t like the new movies, or prequels or whatever, that’s fine, just stop watching them over and over again and move on to something you actually do like.

    Kinda hard to not discuss the movie that the thread is about though..


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    #2615
    Theboinkmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 3,984 ✭✭✭Theboinkmaster


    Total flop and a financial loss for Disney
    Agent Coulson wrote: »
    Having watched in the cinema and thinking it was a big pile of ****e I now stand by that opinion after watching it again on Disney plus.

    In the cinema I wanted to like it so bad but I thought it was terrible, really disappointed.

    Watched again last week on Disney+ and had to watch it in about 4 pieces as kept switching off it's just so awful.

    I probably enjoyed Solo more...


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    #2616
    SMC92Ian
    Registered Users Posts: 2,015 ✭✭✭SMC92Ian


    ErnestBorgnine wrote: »
    You turned your brain on for a film you need to turn your brain off to enjoy and loved it did you?

    That's a retcon JJ would be proud of.

    Yes cause I love the CGI and practical effects so enjoy watching and wondering how it's done.

    Also kids don't like it? That's a first, we must be a rare breed here then because every person I've talked to about the film has enjoyed it. I guess it's just typical internet negativity.


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    #2617
    Runaways
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Runaways


    Still waiting on my rise of skywalker DVD To arrive. (I think I’m after ordering it of a scam site but it’s been weeks)
    So last night I watched the last Jedi For the first time in a very long time

    This film is ****ing epic it’s way better than I even remember. And I had huge problems with it initially

    So much going on in much deeper levels. For example everyone ranting about space Mary Poppins but that scene and the direction between Kylo and Leah sensing each other and the music. Just Brilliant
    I can’t wait to sit down and watch all three back to back But I would hazard a guess this will be looked back on as the best of the three


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    #2618
    SMC92Ian
    Registered Users Posts: 2,015 ✭✭✭SMC92Ian


    Runaways wrote: »
    Still waiting on my rise of skywalker DVD To arrive. (I think I’m after ordering it of a scam site but it’s been weeks)
    So last night I watched the last Jedi For the first time in a very long time

    This film is ****ing epic it’s way better than I even remember. And I had huge problems with it initially

    So much going on in much deeper levels. For example everyone ranting about space Mary Poppins but that scene and the direction between Kylo and Leah sensing each other and the music. Just Brilliant
    I can’t wait to sit down and watch all three back to back But I would hazard a guess this will be looked back on as the best of the three

    I was so hoping we'd get some twist where Rey would of joined Snoke and Kylo went back to the light. That's what I was thinking we were getting. Then he killed Snoke and I though okay maybe Rey was gonna join him. Such great moments in that film. Loved the casino and the chase. But sure can't have it though cause Star Wars fans cried and are racist scum. Wishing the girl who played Rose would die of cancer. Same for the lad who played Jar Jar.


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    #2619
    Runaways
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Runaways


    SMC92Ian wrote: »
    I did and love the new films, beautiful looking films with great craic to be had.


    Was it you said that you hadn’t seen solo? You really should it gets a load of crap but it’s the most fun Star Wars since Star Wars
    Rogue one is deadly too good especially as it ties into a new hope and the way it does it is just class


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    #2620
    Runaways
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Runaways


    SMC92Ian wrote: »
    I was so hoping we'd get some twist where Rey would of joined Snoke and Kylo went back to the light. That's what I was thinking we were getting. Then he killed Snoke and I though okay maybe Rey was gonna join him. Such great moments in that film. Loved the casino and the chase. But sure can't have it though cause Star Wars fans cried and are racist scum. Wishing the girl who played Rose would die of cancer. Same for the lad who played Jar Jar.

    They weren’t fans just troublemakers they’re doing it every franchise

    It falls into two groups as far as I can make out


    Casual Star Wars fans - Star Wars is shît Now


    Hard-core Star Wars fans - Nobody understands Star Wars and its themes and characters except for me and people who agree with me


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    #2621
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,168 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Christ, can we just assume in this thread, nobody is talking for All Star Wars fans? We're all just speaking for ourselves, don't need to bring in the scrotes who hobby in attacking what they love (or bullying people off Twitter and whatnot). That said, is such a thing as a consensus though, and that consensus is leaning towards "hey, Episode IX really flubbed the landing, what ARE they doing with this franchise?". That's not to say those who enjoyed EpIX aren't allowed, wrong or somehow lesser - I'd be damning my own brother were that true - but let's try to move past the Absolutes here and if any pronouncements are being made, it's from the sense of a speculative trend.


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    #2622
    SMC92Ian
    Registered Users Posts: 2,015 ✭✭✭SMC92Ian


    Runaways wrote: »
    Was it you said that you hadn’t seen solo? You really should it gets a load of crap but it’s the most fun Star Wars since Star Wars
    Rogue one is deadly too good especially as it ties into a new hope and the way it does it is just class

    I can't stand Ford or the character so avoided it.
    Runaways wrote: »
    They weren’t fans just troublemakers they’re doing it every franchise

    It falls into two groups as far as I can make out


    Casual Star Wars fans - Star Wars is shît Now


    Hard-core Star Wars fans - Nobody understands Star Wars and its themes and characters except for me and people who agree with me

    Also the hardcore Star Wars fans are the toxic parts of the community, they are the ones out burning Jar Jar and Rose figures, one of them tried to kill themselves, and a few others have stopped acting. Look at the poor Anakin actors, lives ruined due to the horrible fanbase. I've never see anything like it.


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    #2623
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    Shakey_jake wrote: »
    We've decoded the intel from the spy, and it confirms the worst.

    Somehow Palpatine returned. :o

    Like WHO thought this was a good IDEA!!??

    I'd imagine nobody did, but what was the alternative?

    I watched this again last week on Disney+ after watching TLJ a month or so ago and didn't find my opinion of either film changing. TLJ messed up the trilogy. And I can lay out quite clearly how and why.

    Star Wars as a series is all about hope and redemption. Luke and his friends face off against impossible odds and win. Darth Vader, one of the most evil men in the galaxy, gets redeemed. The preqeuls, bad as they were in the main, did a great job of developing the tragic Anakin arc. Kid plucked from the only family he has, with the weight of the galaxy placed on his shoulders, falls to the dark side because he cares deeply for his loved ones. His eventual redemption coming the same way, his love for his family. Who can't relate to that in some way? And its ultimately that love for his family that saves the galaxy then too. Redemption and hope are central themes for the films.

    Now lets look at where TLJ left things. The only character who could be redeemed (Kylo/Ben) chose the dark side. With no voice in his head (Snoke) playing him and twisting his thoughts, he deliberately and consciously chose the dark side. The Resistance was all but wiped out, with nobody coming to help them. The Republic was gone, the First Order was the only show in town and there was no sign of anything that could stand against them. We now have a single antagonist. Kylo Ren. How can ROS redeem him and retain the conflict throughout? It needs another antagonist, like Vader had Palpatine, or a realistic challenge to Ren that would create enough conflict within him to reverse his previous decision. Neither existed at the end of TLJ.

    So where does the hope or redemption come from? ROS simply had far too much work to do to close out the series. Look at how Empire left that trilogy. Yes, the Rebellion was on the run, but it still existed. Yes Vader had just beaten Luke, but Luke was still in the fight and planning to rescue Han. There was still a clear direction to the overall story. TLJ left the sequel trilogy with no clear path or direction. So where ROTJ simply had to close out the existing threads, ROS had to create entirely new ones to try and generate a coherent narrative throughout the 3 films. It was always going to struggle. It made a few mistakes all of its own as well, but overall it could never have been a satisfying film because of where it was beginning from. And sadly, the sequel trilogy may have done serious lasting damage to the franchise. The prequels weren't great and Star Wars needed a shot in the arm. It didn't get it.


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    #2624
    Runaways
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Runaways


    pixelburp wrote: »
    Christ, can we just assume in this thread, nobody is talking for All Star Wars fans? We're all just speaking for ourselves, don't need to bring in the scrotes who hobby in attacking what they love (or bullying people off Twitter and whatnot). That said, is such a thing as a consensus though, and that consensus is leaning towards "hey, Episode IX really flubbed the landing, what ARE they doing with this franchise?". That's not to say those who enjoyed EpIX aren't allowed, wrong or somehow lesser - I'd be damning my own brother were that true - but let's try to move past the Absolutes here and if any pronouncements are being made, it's from the sense of a speculative trend.


    Oh I agree but the last few pages here even show you the extremes
    As I said the folks who just like it and thought it was okay you never really hear them And they are the majority


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    #2625
    Homelander
    Registered Users Posts: 4,391 ✭✭✭Homelander


    It's not like it's black and white. You can like the movie and still think it was a weak effort. Disliking something doesn't mean you think it wasn't entertaining, just as finding entertainment in something isn't an automatic seal of approval.

    I "like" Phantom Menance and Revenge of the Sith, while being quite aware they're horrifically flawed movies. I'm perfectly capable of engaging in rational discussion on both sides of that fence.

    The general accepted consensus on the prequel trilogy is that it was enjoyable, entertaining, but ultimately was a wonderful creative vision completely tarnished by the bad film-making of George Lucas.

    Just as the generally accepted consensus is that the new trilogy was a disjointed mess capped off by a sloppy finale, regardless of the mileage of your entertainment.

    As for "the folks that thought it was okay but you never really hear them" - we could say the very same of the prequel trilogy but that doesn't get a pass, why should the sequel trilogy?

    The near universal approval of Rogue One and Mandalorian shows that the "toxic fanbase" boogeyman is just that - a ridiculous boogeyman often used to try and silence rational reasaonble debate around the sequel trilogy.

    Not helped by modern e-media utterly fixated on negative headlines. I mean, I could start a poll here, "What does everyone think of Runaways?"

    100 people could answer "He's great" and 2 people could say "he's a moron" and media outlets would run with "CRUEL TROLLS BRAND RUNAWAYS MORONIC".

    That's how online media is using the likes of twitter these days to stir the pot. Unfortunately it's also being used by some to dismiss all reasoned, genuine criticism with sexism/racism/toxic fandom/other miscellaneous labels.


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    #2626
    Runaways
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Runaways


    Have a read of this it’s a perfect example of the crap Lucasfilm employees get on a daily basis
    https://twitter.com/mjk_88/status/1260095334346260481?s=21


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    #2627
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,168 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Runaways wrote: »
    Oh I agree but the last few pages here even show you the extremes
    As I said the folks who just like it and thought it was okay you never really hear them And they are the majority

    True: and this is perhaps back to why Star Wars suffers from paying too much attention to the fans - that the best move for any Creative is to simply build what they want to make, and let the fans follow or not. Not to pander to either extreme.

    To expand on what you might be implying: there's a path to madness in these conversations, in overestimating the value of false-positives. Or negatives as may be the case. People who broadly enjoyed The Thing are less likely to (say) post on an aggregator like RT than the minority who were incensed because <reasons>. Not even films, take something like restaurants: I can name 4 or 5 good restaurants I've enjoyed yet if you go online, within the first page you'll invariably see the 0 star reviews 'cos the customer didn't get their water refilled in time.

    But then TBH, I've long thought now that Star Wars as a franchise is the most shallow pop-culture world there is. It's a place of icons & aesthetics - not character. For that to happen, it needs to go into TV & long-form storytelling, not blockbuster entertainment. Otherwise it'll keep flubbing the basics.


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    #2628
    Runaways
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Runaways


    Homelander wrote: »
    It's not like it's black and white. You can like the movie and still think it was a weak effort. Disliking something doesn't mean you think it wasn't entertaining, just as finding entertainment in something isn't an automatic seal of approval.

    I "like" Phantom Menance and Revenge of the Sith, while being quite aware they're horrifically flawed movies. I'm perfectly capable of engaging in rational discussion on both sides of that fence.

    The general accepted consensus on the prequel trilogy is that it was enjoyable, entertaining, but ultimately was a wonderful creative vision completely tarnished by the bad film-making of George Lucas.

    Just as the generally accepted consensus is that the new trilogy was a disjointed mess capped off by a sloppy finale, regardless of the mileage of your entertainment.

    As for "the folks that thought it was okay but you never really hear them" - we could say the very same of the prequel trilogy but that doesn't get a pass, why should the sequel trilogy?

    The near universal approval of Rogue One and Mandalorian shows that the "toxic fanbase" boogeyman is just that - a ridiculous boogeyman often used to try and silence rational reasaonble debate around the sequel trilogy.

    Not helped by modern e-media utterly fixated on negative headlines. I mean, I could start a poll here, "What does everyone think of Runaways?"

    100 people could answer "He's great" and 2 people could say "he's a moron" and media outlets would run with "CRUEL TROLLS BRAND RUNAWAYS MORONIC".

    That's how online media is using the likes of twitter these days to stir the pot. Unfortunately it's also being used by some to dismiss all reasoned, genuine criticism with sexism/racism/toxic fandom/other miscellaneous labels.

    Oh I know we live in a weird toxic time and social media platforms just amplify that and the loudest voices are usually the arseholes as evidenced above in that tweet I posted

    PS if you enjoyed the prequels you should really check out the clone wars it elevates the whole thing. so good

    The last four episodes of this final season are as good as any Star Wars you’ll see
    Sadly people write it off because it’s animation but they’re really missing out


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    #2629
    Brock Turnpike
    Registered Users Posts: 3,744 ✭✭✭Brock Turnpike


    Disappointing box office take less than a billion
    Runaways wrote: »
    Really good thread on what’s going on in TROS Which I know I missed a lot of. But not seen it again since the cinema
    It is worth a read if you can take the ‘It’s shît” Goggles off for just a minute.
    https://twitter.com/jgfidelis52/status/1259681781156061186?s=21

    Honestly, that is some of the worst straw-grasping I've ever seen on any subject.


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    #2630
    branie2
    Registered Users Posts: 10,299 ✭✭✭✭branie2


    Runaway hit highest gross beating The force Awakens
    I got the film on Blu-ray for my birthday today, and I'm looking forward to watching it later.


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    #2631
    Penn
    Registered Users Posts: 33,461 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Runaways wrote: »
    Really good thread on what’s going on in TROS Which I know I missed a lot of. But not seen it again since the cinema
    It is worth a read if you can take the ‘It’s shît” Goggles off for just a minute.
    https://twitter.com/jgfidelis52/status/1259681781156061186?s=21

    I much prefer this take on the movie from a British script editor. Very well balanced. Enjoyed his takes on other movies on that site too.

    https://medium.com/@ellardent/tweetnotes-star-wars-the-rise-of-skywalker-a9e14e30f4e2


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    #2632
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    SMC92Ian wrote: »
    Yes cause I love the CGI and practical effects so enjoy watching and wondering how it's done.

    Also kids don't like it? That's a first, we must be a rare breed here then because every person I've talked to about the film has enjoyed it. I guess it's just typical internet negativity.

    Everyone I talked to hated it. Those that love it, I guess just typical of modern short attention spans, and low standards. :D


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    #2633
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Penn wrote: »
    I much prefer this take on the movie from a British script editor. Very well balanced. Enjoyed his takes on other movies on that site too.

    https://medium.com/@ellardent/tweetnotes-star-wars-the-rise-of-skywalker-a9e14e30f4e2

    Is that just random tweets not an actual review.


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    #2634
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    pixelburp wrote: »
    True: and this is perhaps back to why Star Wars suffers from paying too much attention to the fans - that the best move for any Creative is to simply build what they want to make, and let the fans follow or not. Not to pander to either extreme......

    Not sure how this was pandering to the fans. Lets have a cavalry charge, and Bobby Ewing reincarnation, said no star wars fan ever.


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    #2635
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Runaways wrote: »
    Oh I know we live in a weird toxic time and social media platforms just amplify that and the loudest voices are usually the arseholes as evidenced above in that tweet I posted

    PS if you enjoyed the prequels you should really check out the clone wars it elevates the whole thing. so good

    The last four episodes of this final season are as good as any Star Wars you’ll see
    Sadly people write it off because it’s animation but they’re really missing out

    Who writes it off. I thought the cartoons generally have a great following. Very popular with the kids I know.


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    #2636
    Penn
    Registered Users Posts: 33,461 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    beauf wrote: »
    Is that just random tweets not an actual review.

    It's an analysis of the movie from a script editor, not a review. He basically tweets his opinion on certain films/shows then collects the tweets into a blog.


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    #2637
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Homelander wrote: »
    It's not like it's black and white. You can like the movie and still think it was a weak effort. Disliking something doesn't mean you think it wasn't entertaining, just as finding entertainment in something isn't an automatic seal of approval.

    I "like" Phantom Menance and Revenge of the Sith, while being quite aware they're horrifically flawed movies. I'm perfectly capable of engaging in rational discussion on both sides of that fence.

    The general accepted consensus on the prequel trilogy is that it was enjoyable, entertaining, but ultimately was a wonderful creative vision completely tarnished by the bad film-making of George Lucas.

    Just as the generally accepted consensus is that the new trilogy was a disjointed mess capped off by a sloppy finale, regardless of the mileage of your entertainment.

    As for "the folks that thought it was okay but you never really hear them" - we could say the very same of the prequel trilogy but that doesn't get a pass, why should the sequel trilogy?

    The near universal approval of Rogue One and Mandalorian shows that the "toxic fanbase" boogeyman is just that - a ridiculous boogeyman often used to try and silence rational reasaonble debate around the sequel trilogy.....

    I think most people are aware that most of the star wars are very flawed. Only the original won any Oscars. But there is a difference being meh or even bad but enjoyable.

    But its got to a point where its so bad, most people can't ignore it and it stops being fun.


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    #2638
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,651 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Penn wrote: »
    It's an analysis of the movie from a script editor, not a review. He basically tweets his opinion on certain films/shows then collects the tweets into a blog.

    Its kinda hard work to read it like that. Just saying. He has a lot of valid points.


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    #2639
    Penn
    Registered Users Posts: 33,461 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    beauf wrote: »
    Its kinda hard work to read it like that. Just saying. He has a lot of valid points.

    Yeah, the site can be quite slow too. I just think he's quite good as he's clearly a fan of what he writes about, but he will give criticism where it's needed, while also explaining why some poor choices might have been made for a greater purpose.


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    #2640
    Runaways
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Runaways


    Back to my point about the perpetually aggrieved being the most consistently vocal complainers it’s really weird

    People who like it just get on with it I don’t feel the need to have to be right about it right


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    #2641
    Runaways
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Runaways


    - the Majority of people liked it. just get over it


    - No I keep need to going on about it because I will convince someone eventually


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