The Chinese Big Lie

Yurt2 · 07-04-2020 09:54AM

s982102 wrote: »

Try this: https://directorsblog.nih.gov/2020/03/26/genomic-research-points-to-natural-origin-of-covid-19/

and

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9

and many more if you google it..

It can't be assumed that all information released by US media is true as US is the opponent of China. This is just like you need to put a question mark on any news that Chinese media has posted. The information from both sides could be true or false.. Evidence is needed with some analysis..

I love this false equivalence about how information gets disseminated in China v the US.

The very large glowing and important distinction being, if bad information gets disseminated by either the US government or press, in can be vetted and debunked in short order and no one will come to your door and disappear you.

China? What do you think happens when one tries to release information of public importance that the CCP thinks undermines it's authority?

Honestly, an extremely bad equivalence to draw.

This very message would be cause for a knock on the door if posted on 微信

Yurt2 · 07-04-2020 09:55AM

cryptocurrency wrote: »

Nailed it

Not really. It's an apologist's post and point of view.

s982102 · 07-04-2020 10:14AM

Yurt! wrote: »

I love this false equivalence about how information gets disseminated in China v the US.

The very large glowing and important distinction being, if bad information gets disseminated by either the US government or press, in can be vetted and debunked in short order and no one will come to your door and disappear you.

China? What do you think happens when one tries to release information of public importance that the CCP thinks undermines it's authority?

Honestly, an extremely bad equivalence to draw.

This very message would be cause for a knock on the door if posted on 微信

Well, US did lots of dirty jobs, too. Don't you think?

Considering what CCP is like twenty years ago and now, there has been an great improvement! Also, most importantly, China is becoming better in economy and other areas. Chinese people are getting wealthy and don't need worry about if they can have proper food to eat for diner any more. I think this is more important than other things. Don't you think?

There is 1.4 billion people in China. It is a massive country and is hard to mange. The only county that is similar to China is India. Is India any better than China for living? I know you will say there is freedom, democracy etc in India. Do these really bring benefits to people?

One more point, China started red revolution 80-90 year ago to bring down the government of Republic of China which was very corrupted. If the current government is that bad, there could be a revolution again. But the truth is, it is not that bad yet and is getting better..

I think it is very difficult to change you political opinions. But if I could get you thinking about this, I am satisfied.

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 10:17AM

Yurt! wrote: »

Not really. It's an apologist's post and point of view.

Apologists? Because it pointed out the facts. You seem hell bent on blaming one group and will skim over all other stuff to be clear on that.

The incompentance this end is clearly the biggest issue here yet you are so focused on Jan that everything else just gets a past.

That is clearly the text book example of an apologists view. Yours.

LessOutragePlz · 07-04-2020 10:19AM

s982102 wrote: »

Regardless what both sides are saying, it is true that western governments didn't prepare for this situation. They all thought the outbreak happened in China which is far away. They were sitting there with popcorn and watching instead of preparing for what was coming. The politicians then started to blame others instead of themselves which is what they are very good at.

No one has denied that some western governments reactions were terrible, and could have been a lot better but, I thought this thread was supposed to be about discussing how China has lied about the outbreak of the virus and covered up the initial outbreak. Yet you and a few other posters seem to be very keen on drawing the discussion back to how under prepared western governments were for the eventual arrival of the virus. Then you accuse us of falling for a "smokescreen" talk about a pot calling a kettle black. If you want to discuss how terrible the reactions of western governments have been might I suggest you create a separate thread to discuss that topic as this thread is for discussing the lies peddled by the CCP.

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 10:20AM

s982102 wrote: »

Well, US did lots of dirty jobs, too. Don't you think?

Considering what CCP is like twenty years ago and now, there has been an great improvement! Also, most importantly, China is becoming better in economy and other areas. Chinese people are getting wealthy and don't need worry about if they can have proper food to eat for diner any more. I think this is more important than other things. Don't you think?

There is 1.4 billion people in China. It is a massive country and is hard to mange. The only county that is similar to China is India. Is India any better than China for living? I know you will say there is freedom, democracy etc in India. Do these really bring benefits to people?

One more point, China started red revolution 80-90 year ago to bring down the government of Republic of China which was very corrupted. If the current government is that bad, there could be a revolution again. But the truth is, it is not that bad yet and is getting better..

I think it is very difficult to change you political opinions. But if I could get you thinking about this, I am satisfied.

I alos think the ship has well sailed for a boycott of China to do anything. They have developed their internal economy now so much that in the new world of a deglobalised world, they have 1.4 billion internal market to work with and a middle class population bigger then the population of America.

I am sure such moves to break everything up will see much bigger losers then them.

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 10:22AM

LessOutragePlz wrote: »

No one has denied that some western governments reactions were terrible, and could have been a lot better but, I thought this thread was supposed to be about discussing how China has lied about the outbreak of the virus and covered up the initial outbreak. Yet you and a few other posters seem to be very keen on drawing the discussion back to how under prepared western governments were for the eventual arrival of the virus. Then you accuse us of falling for a "smokescreen" talk about a pot calling a kettle black. If you want to discuss how terrible the reactions of western governments have been might I suggest you create a separate thread to discuss that topic as this thread is for discussing the lies peddled by the CCP.

You don't think the issues are connected?

If a virus appeared in Asia, killed 130k and hardly touched Europe due to action, you'd have stop talking or caring about the struggle in Asia months back.

Yurt2 · 07-04-2020 10:27AM

s982102 wrote: »

Well, US did lots of dirty jobs, too. Don't you think?

Considering what CCP is like twenty years ago and now, there has been an great improvement! Also, most importantly, China is becoming better in economy and other areas. Chinese people are getting wealthy and don't need worry about if they can have proper food to eat for diner any more. I think this is more important than other things. Don't you think?

There is 1.4 billion people in China. It is a massive country and is hard to mange. The only county that is similar to China is India. Is India any better than China for living? I know you will say there is freedom, democracy etc in India. Do these really bring benefits to people?

One more point, China started red revolution 80-90 year ago to bring down the government of Republic of China which was very corrupted. If the current government is that bad, there could be a revolution again. But the truth is, it is not that bad yet and is getting better..

I think it is very difficult to change you political opinions. But if I could get you thinking about this, I am satisfied.

China is a much less open society than it was 10 years ago. A cursory look at the country will tell you that. All manner of dissent is being snuffed out. I hate pulling rank like this, but anyone who has spent time in-country in the Hu Jintao era and the Xi era will tell you no different.

There is no equivalency to be drawn between the US and China in this regard. In fact it's a ridiculous one.

The ROC was what it was, and Chiang Kai Shek was no choirboy (though it's founder Sun Yat Sen was perhaps the greatest Chinese moderniser in history). It's a false choice, but I'd take Generalissimo Chiang's ROC over the years of terror in the Great Leap Forward and Cultural Revolution all day long.

The above post is an astonishing airbrushing of China in the 20th Century, and going into the 21st century in fact.

Yurt2 · 07-04-2020 10:33AM

cryptocurrency wrote: »

I alos think the ship has well sailed for a boycott of China to do anything. They have developed their internal economy now so much that in the new world of a deglobalised world, they have 1.4 billion internal market to work with and a middle class population bigger then the population of America.

I am sure such moves to break everything up will see much bigger losers then them.

China as much as it may crow to the contrary, is heavily reliant on globalisation. It's internal market is overstated and heavily concentrated in a handful of cities. It's no secret that their economic reporting (much like their virus figures) are heavily massaged.

Witness the sh*tshow that went on with Luckin coffee, a national champion consumer brand that had complete bullsh*t sales figures designed to trick investors. They're not the only fake giant company wandering around waiting to fall on their faces.

Just last year I was wandering around mega-malls in second and third tier cities that were more or less empty.

Paper tiger, held together with the CCP's authoritarian sticky-tape.

LessOutragePlz · 07-04-2020 10:39AM

cryptocurrency wrote: »

You don't think the issues are connected?

If a virus appeared in Asia, killed 130k and hardly touched Europe due to action, you'd have stop talking or caring about the struggle in Asia months back.

No I don't see a connection between China lying about the initial outbreak and covering it up and the woeful reactions of some western governments to the outbreak.

Care to enlighten me?

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 10:41AM

Yurt! wrote: »

China is a much less open society than it was 10 years ago. A cursory look at the country will tell you that. All manner of dissent is being snuffed out. I hate pulling rank like this, but anyone who has spent time in-country in the Hu Jintao era and the Xi era will tell you no different.

There is no equivalency to be drawn between the US and China in this regard. In fact it's a ridiculous one.

The ROC was what it was, and Chiang Kai Shek was no choirboy (though it's founder Sun Yat Sen was perhaps the greatest Chinese moderniser in history). It's a false choice, but I'd take Generalissimo Chiang's ROC over the years of terror in the Great Leap Forward and Cultural Revolution all day long.

The above post is an astonishing airbrushing of China in the 20th Century, and going into the 21st century in fact.

You are expecting everyone to pick sides like its two teams in a football match and is even now bringing in the horrors of the great leap forward. This isn't what is being discussed.

Some of us are saying here that the know time frames is that form a new virus, the panic, the reaction, then the control measures in China are easy to bash from here and people seem to be going at length to say if they knew about this and that ealier that things would have been different but thats not the case.

China implmented a lockdown fairly early in a new virus, a harsh measure and certianly not one that I could see any western government making if it had not been done or been shown to be successful in Asia first.

G7 governments sat on theior hands for months and bought nothing and preped nothing before in landed on our doorstep. This is not the fault of China or any other asian country. Figures from poor developed nations next to China indicate that the G7 nations have been shown to be useless in their response to this crisis.

Claims that the two week window in Janaury would have seen the western saviours could have absailed in and saved the day with their silver bullet are also rubbish as they didn't have the silver bullet when it started to appear on their own shores. The response seen in most places comes across like total chaos, lack of preperation, all been coordianted by Mr Bean.

skellig_rocks · 07-04-2020 10:42AM

LessOutragePlz wrote: »

Granted it is a ridiculous and untenable idea to sue China but he is merely stating what some uninformed people are suggesting. If you'd listened on for another a minute then you'd have heard that according to research done almost 60 witnesses have said that bats were not sold in the Wuhan wet market:

"According to municipal reports and the testimonies of 31 residents and 28 visitors, the bat was never a food source in the city, and no bat was traded in the market. There was possible natural recombination or an intermediate host of the coronavirus, yet little proof has been reported.”

Therefore, there is a possibility that the virus escaped from a research lab that is only 300 yards away from the entrance of the wet market.

This is only one shop from the Wuhan seafood wet market, but its price list didn't have bats as sellable items (I can read Chinese):

23723414-7915765-A_list_of_prices_for_one_of_the_businesses_operating_at_the_mark-m-27_1579697664979.jpg

23723414-7915765-A_list_of_prices_for_one_of_the_businesses_operating_at_the_mark-m-27_1579697664979.jpg

EDIT:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7915765/Chinese-food-market-epicentre-deadly-SARS-like-virus-outbreak-selling-live-KOALA.html

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 10:45AM

skellig_rocks wrote: »

This is only one shop from the Wuhan seafood wet market, but its price list didn't have bats as sellable items (I can read Chinese):

EDIT:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7915765/Chinese-food-market-epicentre-deadly-SARS-like-virus-outbreak-selling-live-KOALA.html

Where is the pangolin

Yurt2 · 07-04-2020 10:47AM

cryptocurrency wrote: »

You are expecting everyone to pick sides like its two teams in a football match and is even now bringing in the horrors of the great leap forward. This isn't what is being discussed.

Some of us are saying here that the know time frames is that form a new virus, the panic, the reaction, then the control measures in China are easy to bash from here and people seem to be going at length to say if they knew about this and that ealier that things would have been different but thats not the case.
China implmented a lockdown fairly early in a new virus, a harsh measure and certianly not one that I could see any western government making if it had not been done or been shown to be successful in Asia first.

G7 governments sat on theior hands for months and bought nothing and preped nothing before in landed on our doorstep. This is not the fault of China or any other asian country. Figures from poor developed nations next to China indicate that the G7 nations have been shown to be useless in their response to this crisis.

Claims that the two week window in Janaury would have seen the western saviours could have absailed in and saved the day with their silver bullet are also rubbish as they didn't have the silver bullet when it started to appear on their own shores. The response seen in most places comes across like total chaos, lack of preperation, all been coordianted by Mr Bean.

Not asking anyone to pick sides. The US has its problems, and we're all accustomed to pointing them out.

But there's a level of naivety and delusion about the bizzare defense being mounted on behalf of disgraceful behaviour by the Chinese government.

I'm not sure why you'd bother. The very obvious problems are staring you in the face, but you keep bringing up the US. We all know the US's response has been less than stellar.

You just be sure to tell me when the Federal government starts calling around to silence, threaten and disappear people for pointing that out. Ta

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 10:51AM

Yurt! wrote: »

Not asking anyone to pick sides. The US has its problems, and we're all accustomed to pointing them out.

But there's a level of naivety and delusion about the bizzare defense being mounted on behalf of disgraceful behaviour by the Chinese government.

I'm not sure why you'd bother. The very obvious problems are staring you in the face, but you keep bringing up the US. We all know the US's response has been less than stellar.

You just be sure to tell me when the Federal government starts calling around to silence, threaten and disappear people for pointing that out. Ta

Isn't there loads of cases of medical staff and prison staff being scilenced over PPE? Thye are not even allowed to bring their own. UK and US.

jmayo · 07-04-2020 11:03AM

s982102 wrote: »

Well, US did lots of dirty jobs, too. Don't you think?

Considering what CCP is like twenty years ago and now, there has been an great improvement! Also, most importantly, China is becoming better in economy and other areas. Chinese people are getting wealthy and don't need worry about if they can have proper food to eat for diner any more. I think this is more important than other things. Don't you think?

There is 1.4 billion people in China. It is a massive country and is hard to mange. The only county that is similar to China is India. Is India any better than China for living? I know you will say there is freedom, democracy etc in India. Do these really bring benefits to people?

One more point, China started red revolution 80-90 year ago to bring down the government of Republic of China which was very corrupted. If the current government is that bad, there could be a revolution again. But the truth is, it is not that bad yet and is getting better..

I think it is very difficult to change you political opinions. But if I could get you thinking about this, I am satisfied.

Why the fook do some people immediately jump to whataboutery when anyone makes a claim calling out the cr** that the likes of China have done and continue to do.
It is the same when discussing Putin's Russia or hell even the old USSR.
Yes we know the US has lot of faults and is an interfering troublesome nation, but FFS if anyone thinks they and China are similar in the way they are ruled and disseminate information they need a lobotomy.

And to totally gloss off the history of communist run China above and make it sound as some benign regime that just got rid of a corrupt leader in Chiang Kai-shek is frankly quite ludicrous and either designedly totally disingenuous or the ramblings of an eejit.

The CCP learned from the mistakes of it's former fellow communist state and adversary, the USSR.
If they hadn't opened up somewhat, invited in a form of capitalism, offering riches to some then they may have gone the way of the former USSR.

Granted the West, and most especially it's multinationals and it's avaricious consumers, have aided and abetted this transition which has helped the communist party get even richer and stay in power.

All I keep hearing here is that it is not the Chinese people, but the CCP that is at fault.

But who exactly are the CCP?
They aren't just a bunch of old guys in the politburo or central committee, they have lots of members, lots of ordinary people who keep the whole system in power.

And some of those people who are very well connected are over here and in other places in the West.
What you may think is just some ordinary Chinese girl or guy may happen to have family that are reasonably high up in the party.
And there is no way in hell they want the system to change.
Trust me on that.

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 11:08AM

jmayo wrote: »

Why the fook do some people immediately jump to whataboutery when anyone makes a claim calling out the cr** that the likes of China have done and continue to do.
It is the same when discussing Putin's Russia or hell even the old USSR.
Yes we know the US has lot of faults and is an interfering troublesome nation, but FFS if anyone thinks they and China are similar in the way they are ruled and disseminate information they need a lobotomy.

And to totally gloss off the history of communist run China above and make it sound as some benign regime that just got rid of a corrupt leader in Chiang Kai-shek is frankly quite ludicrous and either designedly totally disingenuous or the ramblings of an eejit.

The CCP learned from the mistakes of it's former fellow communist state and adversary, the USSR.
If they hadn't opened up somewhat, invited in a form of capitalism, offering riches to some then they may have gone the way of the former USSR.

Granted the West, and most especially it's multinationals and it's avaricious consumers, have aided and abetted this transition which has helped the communist party get even richer and stay in power.

All I keep hearing here is that it is not the Chinese people, but the CCP that is at fault.

But who exactly are the CCP?
They aren't just a bunch of old guys in the politburo or central committee, they have lots of members, lots of ordinary people who keep the whole system in power.

And some of those people who are very well connected are over here and in other places in the West.
What you may think is just some ordinary Chinese girl or guy may happen to have family that are reasonably high up in the party.
And there is no way in hell they want the system to change.
Trust me on that.

So are you part of the "it's all of them, the chinese (collective)" camp, seems so.

skellig_rocks · 07-04-2020 11:19AM

cryptocurrency wrote: »

China implmented a lockdown fairly early in a new virus, a harsh measure and certianly not one that I could see any western government making if it had not been done or been shown to be successful in Asia first.

Why didn't China do something back in December, when the doctors tried to alert the virus to the public?

Chinese government allowed the "thousand family banquet" to go ahead on 19 January in Wuhan, even after they knew the virus?

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3049173/coronavirus-10-new-cases-confirmed-30-more-suspected-wuhan-after

http://www.chinanews.com/sh/2020/01-19/9064003.shtml

They only lockdown Wuhan just before Chinese new year, after 5M migrate workers already left Wuhan to other parts of China and rest of the world.

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3047720/chinese-premier-li-keqiang-head-coronavirus-crisis-team-outbreak

SCMP wrote:

5 million left Wuhan before lockdown, 1,000 new coronavirus cases expected in city

cryptocurrency wrote: »

China implmented a lockdown fairly early in a new virus, a harsh measure and certianly not one that I could see any western government making if it had not been done or been shown to be successful in Asia first.

Both China and WHO were against travel bans in January/February:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-51338899

BBC wrote:

"Travel restrictions can cause more harm than good by hindering info-sharing, medical supply chains and harming economies," the head of the World Health Organization (WHO) said on Friday.

The WHO recommends introducing screening at official border crossings. It has warned that closing borders could accelerate the spread of the virus, with travellers entering countries unofficially.

China has criticised the wave of travel restrictions, accusing foreign governments of ignoring official advice.

"Just as the WHO recommended against travel restrictions, the US rushed in the opposite direction," foreign ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying said. "[It is] certainly not a gesture of goodwill."

Sometimes China are hard to please, isn't it?

cryptocurrency wrote: »

Claims that the two week window in Janaury would have seen the western saviours could have absailed in and saved the day with their silver bullet are also rubbish as they didn't have the silver bullet when it started to appear on their own shores. The response seen in most places comes across like total chaos, lack of preperation, all been coordianted by Mr Bean.

Maybe western governments were strongly believe China can contain the virus within its border. Obviously China failed to do so. Western governments followed WHO guideline religiously which I think is the main reasons we are where we are. (Travel bans, masks wearing, etc.). Taiwan, HK, Vietnam succeed because they didn't follow WHO guidelines.

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 11:42AM

skellig_rocks wrote: »

Why didn't China do something back in December, when the doctors tried to alert the virus to the public?

Chinese government allowed the "thousand family banquet" to go ahead on 19 January in Wuhan, even after they knew the virus?

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3049173/coronavirus-10-new-cases-confirmed-30-more-suspected-wuhan-after

http://www.chinanews.com/sh/2020/01-19/9064003.shtml

They only lockdown Wuhan just before Chinese new year, after 5M migrate workers already left Wuhan to other parts of China and rest of the world.

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3047720/chinese-premier-li-keqiang-head-coronavirus-crisis-team-outbreak

Both China and WHO were against travel bans in January/February:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-51338899

Sometimes China are hard to please, isn't it?

Maybe western governments were strongly believe China can contain the virus within its border. Obviously China failed to do so. Western governments followed WHO guideline religiously which I think is the main reasons we are where we are. (Travel bans, masks wearing, etc.). Taiwan, HK, Vietnam succeed because they didn't follow WHO guidelines.

It quite clearly shows with they didn't have a clue if they are allowing banquets one week and blowing up their own economy the next. It does show when they did that Mongolia reacted and the UK didn't

skellig_rocks · 07-04-2020 11:46AM

cryptocurrency wrote: »

It quite clearly shows with they didn't have a clue if they are allowing banquets one week and blowing up their own economy the next. It does show when they did that Mongolia reacted and the UK didn't

The banquet was on 19 January. I thought China told WHO about the virus in late December and the US about the virus on 3 January? So what did China told the World about the virus?
Not human-human transmissible? Just a flu? Did China lie?

s982102 · 07-04-2020 11:49AM

skellig_rocks wrote: »

Why didn't China do something back in December, when the doctors tried to alert the virus to the public?

Chinese government allowed the "thousand family banquet" to go ahead on 19 January in Wuhan, even after they knew the virus?

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3049173/coronavirus-10-new-cases-confirmed-30-more-suspected-wuhan-after

http://www.chinanews.com/sh/2020/01-19/9064003.shtml

They only lockdown Wuhan just before Chinese new year, after 5M migrate workers already left Wuhan to other parts of China and rest of the world.

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3047720/chinese-premier-li-keqiang-head-coronavirus-crisis-team-outbreak

Both China and WHO were against travel bans in January/February:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-51338899

Sometimes China are hard to please, isn't it?

Maybe western governments were strongly believe China can contain the virus within its border. Obviously China failed to do so. Western governments followed WHO guideline religiously which I think is the main reasons we are where we are. (Travel bans, masks wearing, etc.). Taiwan, HK, Vietnam succeed because they didn't follow WHO guidelines.

Did Ireland lock down the country when there was a first confirmed case? It is a brand new virus that we have never seen before. The government will take caution to do anything major. Possible H2H was identified in early Jan. The close down occurred on Jan. 23rd. What else do you want to do?

I was so pissed about what the local government in China did when this first happened. There were so many things that they could have done much better! They did improve over time after the Province lead has been changed. Everything was getting more organized. China has done all the hard work when battling with the virus and gained some valuable experiences such like full lock-down. This is why China is back to normal.

On the other side, European governments didn't take all this seriously in Feb and March. There weren't even forced quarantine in place. Self isolation is not effective as people will try to get out to do things.. That causes more spreading... So much..

Anyway, this will be last post for this topic as what I said before, for an adult, it is hard to change one's political opinions. If I can get you guys thinking if you were criticizing from a fair angle, that would be enough for me. Think what would you do when the situation like this comes to you? What did US do when H1N1 broke out a few years back? What would Ireland do if a highly contentious virus started here? Would you have done better than China?

Thanks to the guys who gave fair opinions.

The banquet was on 19 January. I thought China told WHO about the virus in late December and the US about the virus on 3 January? So what did China told the World about the virus?
Not human-human transmissible? Just a flu? Did China lie?

China never said it was a flu. Trump did!

2u2me · 07-04-2020 11:52AM

skellig_rocks wrote: »

This is only one shop from the Wuhan seafood wet market, but its price list didn't have bats as sellable items (I can read Chinese):

Would those prices be considered cheap or expensive?

2u2me · 07-04-2020 11:54AM

Yurt! wrote: »

But there's a level of naivety and delusion about the bizzare defense being mounted on behalf of disgraceful behaviour by the Chinese government.

Could you please detail specifics of what they are defending. I'm usually the first one happy to criticize the CCP.

cryptocurrency · 07-04-2020 11:56AM

skellig_rocks wrote: »

The banquet was on 19 January. I thought China told WHO about the virus in late December and the US about the virus on 3 January? So what did China told the World about the virus?
Not human-human transmissible? Just a flu? Did China lie?

Did they not have a clue, bit like over here except we had at least 2 months more knowledge.

The banquet actually backs up their case of not having a clue, and isn't a charge against them.

2u2me · 07-04-2020 12:02PM

cryptocurrency wrote: »

Did they not have a clue, bit like over here except we had at least 2 months more knowledge.

The banquet actually backs up their case of not having a clue, and isn't a charge against them.

They released the information that it was human-human transmissable on the 20th of January to the world. All of our inaction since that date has been our own fault.

One could certainly speculate they had to reason to cover up until then but I'd tend to agree with you that they just didn't know.

Timeline of events from AlJazeera

skellig_rocks · 07-04-2020 12:11PM

2u2me wrote: »

They released the information that it was human-human transmissable on the 20th of January to the world. All of our inaction since that date has been our own fault.

One could certainly speculate they had to reason to cover up until then but I'd tend to agree with you that they just didn't know.

Timeline of events from AlJazeera

I thought this guy knew about the disease in December 2019:

fiveleavesleft · 07-04-2020 12:23PM

skellig_rocks wrote: »

I thought this guy knew about the disease in December 2019:

He heard about a virus in the hospital & that patients were being quarantined. He thought it was SARS, don't think he knew anymore than that.

2u2me · 07-04-2020 12:25PM

skellig_rocks wrote: »

I thought this guy knew about the disease in December 2019:

That is how an authoritarian regime works. They try to promote 'stabilization' whenever possible. Its why I would never want to live under such a vile regime.

They have since conducted an investigation and recommended the reprimand be withdrawn. At least they did that. Everything after the first few weeks of the virus seems to be completely open and honest from them.

This week it delivered its report, finding that Li had not disrupted public order, and that he was a professional who fought bravely and made sacrifices. However it reportedly maintained that Li had not verified the information before sending it, and it was “not consistent with the actual situation at the time”.

Source

skellig_rocks · 07-04-2020 12:26PM

fiveleavesleft wrote: »

He heard about a virus in the hospital & that patients were being quarantined. He thought it was SARS, don't think he knew anymore than that.

But SARS was human to human transmissible. But China only officially said the Covid-19 is h2h transmission on 20 January. Why did China silence him?

skellig_rocks · 07-04-2020 12:29PM

2u2me wrote: »

That is how an authoritarian regime works. They try to promote 'stabilization' whenever possible. Its why I would never want to live under such a vile regime.

They have since conducted an investigation and recommended the reprimand be withdrawn. At least they did that. Everything after the first few weeks of the virus seems to be completely open and honest from them.

Source

20 March 2020, when the rest of the world are already in crisis. Sorry I think it is too late. Too many lives are already lost and can be prevented if China took Li's message seriously.

The Chinese Big Lie

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