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Ireland's Hospitals owned by the Rich

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  • 27-03-2020 12:23pm
    #1
    LuasSimon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,208 ✭✭✭


    Like many i wouldn't have known that all these private hospitals ( blackrock,galway clinic etc ) seem to be owned by our own Oligarch rich like Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien.

    When will these people ever have enough wealth and to make it worse they wont pay tax in this country, preferring to pay a micky mouse percentage in Luxembourg or Malta. What good are these people to Ireland, fine they will rent out their hospitals at the minute but how much are they pocketing out of it ( more Millions?). These rich seem to be very cosy with the Fine Gael government .

    Is it any wonder so many are only existing in this country when a small number of people measure their wealth in Billions and essentially have the vast majority of the country's wealth, theres very little left for the rest of the population.


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    #2
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Go for it.


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    #3
    Salary Negotiator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,148 ✭✭✭Salary Negotiator


    You didn’t know that private hospitals were owned by private individuals?

    Who did you think owned them?


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    #4
    p to the e
    Registered Users Posts: 2,304 ✭✭✭p to the e


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    Like many i wouldn't have known that all these private hospitals ( blackrock,galway clinic etc ) seem to be owned by our own Oligarch rich like Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien.

    When will these people ever have enough wealth and to make it worse they wont pay tax in this country, preferring to pay a micky mouse percentage in Luxembourg or Malta. What good are these people to Ireland, fine they will rent out their hospitals at the minute but how much are they pocketing out of it ( more Millions?). These rich seem to be very cosy with the Fine Gael government .

    Is it any wonder so many are only existing in this country when a small number of people measure their wealth in Billions and essentially have the vast majority of the country's wealth, theres very little left for the rest of the population.

    It's "Mickey Mouse".


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    #5
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,421 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    Like many i wouldn't have known that all these private hospitals ( blackrock,galway clinic etc ) seem to be owned by our own Oligarch rich like Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien.
    So, you assumed they were all owned by poor people then? Interesting.


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    #6
    Tea Shock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 345 ✭✭Tea Shock


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    These rich seem to be very cosy with the Fine Gael government

    What has it got to do with the FG Government?


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    #7
    LuasSimon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,208 ✭✭✭LuasSimon


    Salary Negotiator wrote: »
    You didn’t know that private hospitals were owned by private individuals?

    Who did you think owned them?

    I thought the state owned them but only for Private Heathcare members. OK i was wrong , now i realize that Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien own them and unless you have enough money to purchase private healthcare your not allowed in.


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    #8
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,384 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    Salary Negotiator wrote: »
    You didn’t know that private hospitals were owned by private individuals?

    Who did you think owned them?

    They were trying to keep it private.


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    #9
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    #EatTheRich


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    #10
    1641
    Registered Users Posts: 1,256 ✭✭✭1641


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    I thought the state owned them but only for Private Heathcare members. OK i was wrong , now i realize that Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien own them and unless you have enough money to purchase private healthcare your not allowed in.


    A bit like hotels - or restaurants?


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    #11
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,159 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    I thought the state owned them but only for Private Heathcare members. OK i was wrong , now i realize that Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien own them and unless you have enough money to purchase private healthcare your not allowed in.

    that is the point of them.


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    #12
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,159 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    1641 wrote: »
    A bit like hotels - or restaurants?

    Or private enterprises in general really.


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    #13
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,808 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    The wealth eventually trickles down, it just has a strange look of debt and rising costs of living though, but plutocracy doesn't worry about that, it's all good!


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    #14
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,576 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    Like many i wouldn't have known that all these private hospitals ( blackrock,galway clinic etc ) seem to be owned by our own Oligarch rich like Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien.

    When will these people ever have enough wealth and to make it worse they wont pay tax in this country, preferring to pay a micky mouse percentage in Luxembourg or Malta. What good are these people to Ireland, fine they will rent out their hospitals at the minute but how much are they pocketing out of it ( more Millions?). These rich seem to be very cosy with the Fine Gael government .
    There is no right to cheap private healthcare. We should be glad that these business people provide these private hospitals which reduce the burden on the HSE and provide jobs for many professionals.
    LuasSimon wrote: »

    Is it any wonder so many are only existing in this country when a small number of people measure their wealth in Billions and essentially have the vast majority of the country's wealth, theres very little left for the rest of the population.
    The likes of Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien didnt steal the publics money. They created wealth. Its a huge distinction.


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    #15
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    I thought the state owned them but only for Private Heathcare members. OK i was wrong , now i realize that Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien own them and unless you have enough money to purchase private healthcare your not allowed in.

    The reason they want them private is because they dont want to be sharing a ward (much less a room) with Damo who is coming off the drugs or the travelling community who come in to disrupt the running of the establishment.


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    #16
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,576 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    The wealth eventually trickles down, it just has a strange look of debt and rising costs of living though, but plutocracy doesn't worry about that, it's all good!

    This is a constantly repeated myth. The idea of trickle down is a caricature of supply side economics. It is fine for you to use the term to mock this school of thought but I hope you are aware that advocates don't believe in this concept of wealth trickling down.


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    #17
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,808 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    Yellow_Fern wrote:
    This is a constantly repeated myth. The idea of trickle down is a caricature of supply side economics. It is fine for you to use the term to mock this school of thought but I hope you are aware that advocates don't believe in this concept of wealth trickling down.


    Oh I know it's bull****, but you d be surprised of the amount of people that still truly believe it


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    #18
    65535
    Registered Users Posts: 789 ✭✭✭65535


    Corruption, Greed, Cronyism, Bribery, Undue Influence, Nepotism etc. etc.

    It is sad to see top of the range hospitals under utilised whilst people can not get their ailments treated.

    However, along comes Corona and now (at least for a while) you will see 'a flattening of the curve'


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    #19
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    Ireland's Hospitals owned by the Rich
    Not only rich, but Rich!


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    #20
    handlemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    Like many i wouldn't have known that all these private hospitals ( blackrock,galway clinic etc ) seem to be owned by our own Oligarch rich like Larry Goodman and Denis O Brien.

    When will these people ever have enough wealth and to make it worse they wont pay tax in this country, preferring to pay a micky mouse percentage in Luxembourg or Malta. What good are these people to Ireland, fine they will rent out their hospitals at the minute but how much are they pocketing out of it ( more Millions?). These rich seem to be very cosy with the Fine Gael government .

    Is it any wonder so many are only existing in this country when a small number of people measure their wealth in Billions and essentially have the vast majority of the country's wealth, theres very little left for the rest of the population.

    Wealth of the world is unlimited. Nothing stopping you..


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    #21
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 75,378 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Tell you what

    Private healthcare in Ireland is not much better than you get in the public system in the UK. Let's nationalise all these private hospitals (at a fair market value) and let the taxpayer pay for that and their running costs. Of course that means the tax rates go up, but those of us currently paying through the nose for our private healthcare are better off. And then I can head up to BUPA in Belfast for my healthcare. Everyone, but particularly me, wins. Everyone pays for these extra public services and I get better private treatment in the UK. Sounds great to me


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    #22
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    i dont think anyone would object to paying additional income tax if it meant we could stop paying for vhi etc...the trouble is, do we trust official Ireland not to make a complete bollix of it?


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    #23
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,808 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    i dont think anyone would object to paying additional income tax if it meant we could stop paying for vhi etc...the trouble is, do we trust official Ireland not to make a complete bollix of it?

    can we trust private health insurance not to extract wealth from our health system, thus reducing the quality of service we get, in order to maximize their profits?


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    #24
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,283 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    i dont think anyone would object to paying additional income tax if it meant we could stop paying for vhi etc...the trouble is, do we trust official Ireland not to make a complete bollix of it?

    Our spend on administration for healthcare is insane, you couldnt trust them, it would cost them twice as much as all of us paying private health insurance and deliver half the service


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    #25
    FVP3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭FVP3


    1641 wrote: »
    A bit like hotels - or restaurants?

    But not like roads, or ports.


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    #26
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,576 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    i dont think anyone would object to paying additional income tax if it meant we could stop paying for vhi etc...the trouble is, do we trust official Ireland not to make a complete bollix of it?

    Health insurance in Ireland is very cheap. Youd pay vastly more in many countries. Private healthcare is generally better than public but its not hugely better. The main reason it is better despite being cheap because it is subject to some markets but its not a lot better as medicine is full of cartels and horrendous increasing demand.


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    #27
    FVP3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭FVP3


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    i dont think anyone would object to paying additional income tax if it meant we could stop paying for vhi etc...the trouble is, do we trust official Ireland not to make a complete bollix of it?

    If I could save my health insurance per month ( which I, not my employer pays for) then sure.


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    #28
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Wanderer78 wrote: »
    can we trust private health insurance not to extract wealth from our health system, thus reducing the quality of service we get, in order to maximize their profits?
    why would i expect a private business not to extract profits? its a contradiction in terms.

    i dont want to pay for health insurance. i really dont. but i have the means and i'm not prepared to gamble on my or my family's health.

    is there evidence that ending private health insurance would lead to an improvement in public healthcare? we spend more and more every year and yet we are told conditions in hospitals get continuously worse. So it's not purely a money issue.


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    #29
    Yellow_Fern
    Registered Users Posts: 2,576 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    FVP3 wrote: »
    But not like roads, or ports.

    There is a misconception that private means for the rich. That is not true. Plenty of ordinary people use private healthcare. Another example are roads. The M50 is a 'private' road. It was funded by business so there is a toll. Works fine.


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    #30
    Jolly Red Giant
    Registered Users Posts: 3,434 ✭✭✭Jolly Red Giant


    Tea Shock wrote: »
    What has it got to do with the FG Government?

    massive state subsidies to private hospitals :rolleyes:


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    #31
    Wanderer78
    Registered Users Posts: 28,808 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    why would i expect a private business not to extract profits? its a contradiction in terms.

    i dont want to pay for health insurance. i really dont. but i have the means and i'm not prepared to gamble on my or my family's health.

    is there evidence that ending private health insurance would lead to an improvement in public healthcare? we spend more and more every year and yet we are told conditions in hospitals get continuously worse. So it's not purely a money issue.

    there are profits, and then there are profits! id class excessive wealth extraction from the private sector as 'inefficiencies', just like the inefficiencies of the public sector

    completely understandable statement, so paying for health insurance makes sense

    yes and no id imagine, but i suspect we may never be able to untangle the complexity of having an intertwined system. completely agree, this isnt just a money issue, health care systems are highly complex systems


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