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Antisemitism rising sharply across Europe

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    #1022
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    1641 wrote: »
    Well, they are going to face an investgation by the Equality and Human Rights Commission anyway :


    "We are using our powers under the Equality Act to open an investigation, which will look at:
    • whether unlawful acts have been committed by the Party or its employees or agents
    • the steps taken by the Party to implement the recommendations made in the reports on antisemitism by Baroness Royall, the Home Affairs Select Committee and in the Chakrabarti Report
    • whether the Rule Book and the Party’s investigatory and disciplinary processes have enabled or could enable it to deal efficiently and effectively with complaints of race or religion or belief discrimination and racial harassment or victimisation, including whether appropriate sanctions have been or could be applied
    • whether the Party has responded to complaints of unlawful acts in a lawful, efficient and effective manner"
    https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/inquiries-and-investigations/investigation-labour-party

    Fair enough. One way or the other it would be nice to see an end to it. Has similar been done into Boris Johnson? He's a bumbling racist.


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    #1023
    markodaly
    Registered Users Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Hamas senior official Fathi Hamad, asks Palestinian diaspora to kill all Jews.
    “But our brothers [in the diaspora] are still preparing. They are trying to prepare. They are warming up. A long time has passed with them warming up. All of you 7 million Palestinians abroad, enough of the warming up. You have Jews everywhere and we must attack every Jew on the globe by way of slaughter and killing, if God permits. Enough of the warming up,” he added
    https://www.rappler.com/world/regions/middle-east/235490-hamas-fathi-hamad-condemned-call-palestinians-kill-jews

    Sounds like a lovely man, working for an organisation of real integrity.


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    #1024
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    markodaly wrote: »
    Hamas senior official Fathi Hamad, asks Palestinian diaspora to kill all Jews.


    https://www.rappler.com/world/regions/middle-east/235490-hamas-fathi-hamad-condemned-call-palestinians-kill-jews

    Sounds like a lovely man, working for an organisation of real integrity.

    You cut out the headline Marko...and a few follow ons
    Hamas official condemned after calling on Palestinians to kill Jews

    Saeb Erekat, secretary general of the West Bank-based Palestine Liberation Organization, which unlike Hamas has recognized Israel, condemned Hamad's comments.

    "The just values of the Palestinian cause include love for freedom, justice and equality. The repugnant statement of Hamas leader Mr. Fathi Hamad about Jews doesn't represent any of them," he tweeted.

    Hamas distances itself

    United Nations envoy Nickolay Mladenov also condemned the comments, labelling them a "dangerous, repugnant and inciteful statement! It must to be clearly condemned by ALL."

    In a statement later Monday, July 15, Hamas distanced itself from Hamad's words.

    "These comments do not represent the official positions of the movement and its consistent, adopted policies, which say our conflict is with the (Israeli) occupation which occupied our land and sullies our holy places and not a conflict with Jews across the world or Judaism as a religion," it said.

    Not defending any violence, just good to have the whole picture ;)


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    #1025
    markodaly
    Registered Users Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    Not defending any violence, just good to have the whole picture ;)

    That sounds awfully like, 'I am not racist, but...' because we all know we need to be nice and balance to a group like Hamas.

    Why people want to defend an outright dangerous and anti-Semitic group like Hamas is anyones guess but I suppose the strain of anti-Semitism runs deep in many places.


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    #1026
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    markodaly wrote: »
    That sounds awfully like, 'I am not racist, but...' because we all know we need to be nice and balance to a group like Hamas.

    Why people want to defend an outright dangerous and anti-Semitic group like Hamas is anyones guess but I suppose the strain of anti-Semitism runs deep in many places.

    No it doesn't Marko. You tried to sell a portion of a story and I clarified.
    I don't support Hamas, Israel or any other terrorist regime, never said I did.

    Ah, you took your spin and ran with it. Par for the course with you. Poor effort Marko. You continue to defend Israel out the corner of your mouth and criticise Hamas? :rolleyes:.


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    #1027
    gozunda
    Registered Users Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    No it doesn't Marko. You tried to sell a portion of a story and I clarified. I don't support Hamas, Israel or any other terrorist regime, never said I did.

    Ah, you took your spin and ran with it. Par for the course with you. Poor effort Marko. You continue to defend Israel out the corner of your mouth and criticise Hamas? :rolleyes:.

    Agreed. Reading that comment it would appear markodaly has picked it up wrong yet again. There is nothing in that comment which details the conclusion imo.


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    #1028
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,799 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    As pointed out before, this antisemitism row is very serious for Labour, now Corbyn is in trouble over this again. It's not going away

    https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-the-papers-50567551


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    #1029
    Calhoun
    Registered Users Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    As pointed out before, this antisemitism row is very serious for Labour, now Corbyn is in trouble over this again. It's not going away

    https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-the-papers-50567551

    Its crazy that anti-antisemitism is tied to the left rather than the right, if they don't put this to bed it could derail them when they should be knocking the Tories out.


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    #1030
    2ndcoming
    Registered Users Posts: 3,569 ✭✭✭2ndcoming


    Calhoun wrote: »
    Its crazy that anti-antisemitism is tied to the left rather than the right, if they don't put this to bed it could derail them when they should be knocking the Tories out.

    It isn't really though, it's far right Israelis who support Netanyahu's side who think they should be able to label anyone who criticises their policies as anti-Semitic.

    Chomsky made a statement today in defence of Corbyn. Plenty other moderate Jews have done so also.


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    #1031
    Calhoun
    Registered Users Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    2ndcoming wrote: »
    It isn't really though, it's far right Israelis who support Netanyahu's side who think they should be able to label anyone who criticises their policies as anti-Semitic.

    Chomsky made a statement today in defence of Corbyn. Plenty other moderate Jews have done so also.

    For the purposes of the election and the labor party right now the specter of it is hanging over them. Its not like this is the first time they have been accused of it.

    Antisemitism is nearly like a taboo, we shall see if it hinders or harms them soon enough.


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    #1032
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,395 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    As pointed out before, this antisemitism row is very serious for Labour, now Corbyn is in trouble over this again. It's not going away

    https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-the-papers-50567551

    They could have put this to bed years ago but choose to prevaricate and cover for people, people who mocked the holocaust, talked of Jewish plots again the workers, again and again.

    It would have meant friends and supporters being thrown out, for things they felt didn't warrant expulsion.


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    #1033
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 18,985 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    As pointed out before, this antisemitism row is very serious for Labour, now Corbyn is in trouble over this again. It's not going away

    https://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-the-papers-50567551

    Election coming up. Have to drag out the mud and start slinging. :pac:


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    #1034
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0B1lsIZIBFA


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    #1035
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,395 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    2ndcoming wrote: »
    It isn't really though, it's far right Israelis who support Netanyahu's side who think they should be able to label anyone who criticises their policies as anti-Semitic.

    Chomsky made a statement today in defence of Corbyn. Plenty other moderate Jews have done so also.

    Maybe so but it is British Jews that are getting it in the neck from Labour activists.

    So whatever they think in Israel or America isn't relevant.

    It wasn't far right Israelis that made the NEC or wider Labour leadership drag this out, delay expulsions give cover.


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    #1036
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,395 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Calhoun wrote: »
    Its crazy that anti-antisemitism is tied to the left rather than the right, if they don't put this to bed it could derail them when they should be knocking the Tories out.

    What the left was or should be is very different to what it is now.

    There are a lot of left wing people who have an absolute raw contempt for the working class, who operate in an exclusionary way.

    Why would a bit if antisemitism not be possible in it there is a long history in left wing politics of it.


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    #1037
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    no one thinks that Corbyn is a rabid dyed in the wool jew hater but perceptions are important and Labour have a PR problem here which needs to be tackled head on.


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    #1038
    FTA69
    Registered Users Posts: 9,252 ✭✭✭FTA69


    Danzy wrote: »
    Maybe so but it is British Jews that are getting it in the neck from Labour activists.

    Yeah they aren’t though that’s bollix. You’ve had a tiny group of people share some coded anti-Semitic sh*te on social media.

    The idea Corbyn is charging around Stamford Hill at the head of some new Einzatsgrüppe posing a threat to British Jews is just nonsense. The biggest threat to Jews in Europe are far right extremists and fundamentalist Muslim extremists - not Betty the 60 year old out leafleting for her local candidate.

    I’ve never seen such outlandish and consistent media smears in my life, which is how you know how close he is to actually changing things.


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    #1039
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 18,985 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    no one thinks that Corbyn is a rabid dyed in the wool jew hater but perceptions are important and Labour have a PR problem here which needs to be tackled head on.

    It's a PR problem that keeps getting thrown at it by its enemies, because the antisemitism slur usually requires only the vaguest of backing up.

    It's beyond lamentable at this stage that every time Corbyn seems to be doing well, that this nonsense gets dusted off and thrown about.

    The Conservatives have nothing to offer, except their redundant "get Brexit done" message, so they're going down the "Labour is antisemitic" route again and the Blairites lost their C'N'C, Tom Watson, recently too.

    It's a load of old bollocks.


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    #1040
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Tony EH wrote: »
    It's a PR problem that keeps getting thrown at it by its enemies, because the antisemitism slur usually requires only the vaguest of backing up.

    It's beyond lamentable at this stage that every time Corbyn seems to be doing well, that this nonsense gets dusted off and thrown about.

    The Conservatives have nothing to offer, except their redundant "get Brexit done" message, so they're going down the "Labour is antisemitic" route again and the Blairites lost their C'N'C, Tom Watson, recently too.

    It's a load of old bollocks.

    well now. a cynical person might say that what's good for the goose is good for the gander. left leaning folk have been throwing accusations of racism (and any amounts of "isms") at Conservatives for years. who is going to be the better man first and leave the name calling aside in favour of debating policy


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    #1041
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 18,985 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    well now. a cynical person might say that what's good for the goose is good for the gander. left leaning folk have been throwing accusations of racism (and any amounts of "isms") at Conservatives for years. who is going to be the better man first and leave the name calling aside in favour of debating policy

    No, only a person interested in whataboutery would say that.


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    #1042
    FTA69
    Registered Users Posts: 9,252 ✭✭✭FTA69


    Some Labour members share some coded, stupid stuff on Facebook = wall to wall coverage for a year.

    Boris Johnson, the Prime Minister, refers to Black people as “picanninies with watermelon smiles”, then refuses to apologise for it = no bother.


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    #1043
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Tony EH wrote: »
    No, only a person interested in whataboutery would say that.

    a bitter pill indeed


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    #1044
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 18,985 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    FTA69 wrote: »
    Some Labour members share some coded, stupid stuff on Facebook = wall to wall coverage for a year.

    Boris Johnson, the Prime Minister, refers to Black people as “picanninies with watermelon smiles”, then refuses to apologise for it = no bother.

    Mmmm, the problem is that simply calling Johnson out on his racist remark doesn't have the same cache as shouting "antisemite" into the air. That phrase is so loaded and triggering that all one has to do is say it and you can bet a large group will instantly form a picture in their heads and require nothing further.

    Into the bargain, a lot of it is completely baseless. Take a look at that video "Why I left the Labour Party" and watch the first minute or so to see just how empty a lot of these accusations actually are. Philip Collins - former speechwriter for Tony Blair, so we see where his loyalties lie - states that Corbyn is opposed to "Imperialism", which is a GOOD position to hold dear. But, Collins somehow tries to twist that into an "antisemitic" stance.

    There is, literally, nothing to see here, except twisted words and spoofery of the lowest kind from Blairites and Conservatives that shit themselves whenever Corybn does well.

    There's a lot of people in Britain that are interested in Labour's manifesto for the election that's coming up - at least they actually HAVE a manifesto - and the opposition are running scared.

    tenor.gif


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    #1045
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    whoever wins will have to deal with Brexit, the ultimate poisoned chalice.


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    #1046
    FTA69
    Registered Users Posts: 9,252 ✭✭✭FTA69


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    whoever wins will have to deal with Brexit, the ultimate poisoned chalice.

    Few cans, be grand.


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    #1047
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    no one thinks that Corbyn is a rabid dyed in the wool jew hater but perceptions are important and Labour have a PR problem here which needs to be tackled head on.

    The public are beginning to realise it's baseless. I'd say it's actually starting to work for him as he's seen to be constantly under attack for nonsense to distract from Tory policy.


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    #1048
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,799 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    The public are beginning to realise it's baseless.

    Somehow I doubt that. When papers on both sides of the divide are calling him out on it, it's something he has to deal with properly. Constantly brushing it under the carpet isn't working.


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    #1049
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    Somehow I doubt that. When papers on both sides of the divide are calling him out on it, it's something he has to deal with properly. Constantly brushing it under the carpet isn't working.

    On this the papers raise discussion more than convince people 'how it is'. Nothing concrete and people get bored. It is coming to the stage that folk are moving beyond it. There was a time when all anyone knew about him was he might be antisemetic but now they are curious what more there is to him.


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    #1050
    2ndcoming
    Registered Users Posts: 3,569 ✭✭✭2ndcoming


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    Somehow I doubt that. When papers on both sides of the divide are calling him out on it, it's something he has to deal with properly. Constantly brushing it under the carpet isn't working.

    There are no sides worth talking about in the UK mainstream media. The Mirror ignored it and went straight in on the Tories planning to sell the NHS, The Guardian said he struggled to answer the question properly and the rest to a man are centre-right to right Tory mouthpieces.


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    #1051
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,799 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    On this the papers raise discussion more than convince people 'how it is'. Nothing concrete and people get bored. It is coming to the stage that folk are moving beyond it. There was a time when all anyone knew about him was he might be antisemetic but now they are curious what more there is to him.

    Labour have admitted themselves they didn't acknowledge the problem and took too long dealing with it. Labour members have left the party over internal abuse, two MP and three peers have quit over it. Hundreds of complaints were made in just the first 6 months of the year. There is a formal investigation ongoing by the EHRC.


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