Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

The Late Late Show · 04-11-2019 08:59PM

Reputable Rog wrote: »

What happens if a new school opens within 200 metres of an established alcohol hoarding? I remember in Limerick there was a massive Murphys illuminated sign on the Ballysimon Road, would that sign have to come down if a new school opened within 200 metres?

It is stupid, pointless legislation that no one wants, that no one asked for and that solves no problems but could create problems. If someone has it in mind to drink, they will and if they enter a school, the teachers will deal with the problem and the Gardai will deal with any ASB. There is a need to give Gardai and teachers more power to deal with brats and to target ASB. Simon Harris' extremist anti-business killjoy approach is not needed and solves nothing.

The Late Late Show · 04-11-2019 09:04PM

brick tamland wrote: »

One decent outcome from all this Brexit uncertainty ****e is that this minimum charging wont be coming in anytime soon.

Wont be coming in until same stipid deal us in place up north and that is further away than ever with no end in site.

Simon Harris needs to be REMINDED small alcohol firms need to advertise and they create jobs. Having no localised advertising will not make a difference to the likes of Diageo but could be crucial to local craft beer brewers. Ireland is not Saudi Arabia/Taliban or Gilead so Harris needs to stop trying to turn back the clock with oppressive legislation.

askU · 13-11-2019 11:51AM

Anti alcohol laws gaining speed.

Leroy42 · 13-11-2019 12:00PM

The Late Late Show wrote: »

Simon Harris needs to be REMINDED small alcohol firms need to advertise and they create jobs. Having no localised advertising will not make a difference to the likes of Diageo but could be crucial to local craft beer brewers. Ireland is not Saudi Arabia/Taliban or Gilead so Harris needs to stop trying to turn back the clock with oppressive legislation.

And how will this legislation stop them from advertising?

Leroy42 · 13-11-2019 12:01PM

askU wrote: »

Anti alcohol laws gaining speed.

What anti alcohol legislation?

There is no anti-alcohol legislation, alcohol will still be available to buy and sell in the country.

goose2005 · 13-11-2019 01:07PM

mikemac2 wrote: »

You can blame Catholicism for many things but teetolism isn't one of them.

Look to the evangelical Protestants for that

Sure most here were probably a Pioneer at one stage even if it was 12 years old to a older teen. It never stopped anyone from breaking a pledge

Catholics were involved too, like Fr Mathew. However, American prohibitionism was a Protestant imposition, partially aimed at taming the savage Italian/Irish/Polish Catholics. https://ehistory.osu.edu/sites/ehistory.osu.edu/files/mmh/clash/Prohibition/Sub-Narratives/nativismandprohibition.htm

machaseh · 13-11-2019 01:58PM

We don't need a nanny state to control our drinking, nor do we need continuously higher alcohol prices. Higher alcohol pricing is mostly going to affect people who are dependent on alcohol, like alcoholics, by bringing them into even greater financial ruin, in addition it might even encourage illegal smuggling of alcohol (even just popping over to the North could save you hundreds of quid on a trunk full of booze) or even worse illegal production of alcohol in homes (methanol laced poitin anyone?)

What we need is education regarding alcohol use and abuse and strict enforcement of things like driving under influence laws and public misconduct related to alcohol. Let people go to pubs whenever they want, get rid of strict laws regarding alcohol sales (off licenses etc.). It doesn't work anyway.

When my friend visited here, he was like 'why is it so hard to find alcohol in a country that is known for drinking?' We were looking for an off license in an area where it was like 10-15 minutes walk to the nearest one.

Suckit · 13-11-2019 02:03PM

machaseh wrote: »

When my friend visited here, he was like 'why is it so hard to find alcohol in a country that is known for drinking?' We were looking for an off license in an area where it was like 10-15 minutes walk to the nearest one.

I think that is part of it. Trying to get rid of that image, but I am also pretty sure that they are going the wrong way about it.

Thelonious Monk · 13-11-2019 02:13PM

It's ridiculous, but we'll just lie back and take it. So we deserve it really. A simple boycott of pubs for a few days would have this MUP silliness gone immediately, it is being done for the publicans after all, as well as for nanny state reasons.

machaseh · 13-11-2019 02:41PM

Suckit wrote: »

I think that is part of it. Trying to get rid of that image, but I am also pretty sure that they are going the wrong way about it.

Ireland shouldnt focus on getting rid of the image of a drinking country. It should instead focus on promoting its image regarding other things. And when you think about it what does ireland have going for it other than drinking?

The cuisine is terrible
Hardly anybody speaks the Irish language
The weather is terrible
You'd definitely not visit for the historical city centers because they are nothing compared to what you'd find in continental europe
It has great traditional sports but most people outside of Ireland don't even know what GAA or hurling is.

The main thing it'd have going for it would be the traditional music and the nice nature, and more could be done to promote ireland based on those things rather than drinking.

Subsidize REAL trad music playing in all pubs, for example, and then I dont mean the kind of fake one you find in Temple Bar, but I mean the kind you'd find in the villages such as Clifden and also in Galway and the like.

And improve access to the beautiful nature sites that Ireland has. Not just by car, but especially by greatly improving bike infrastructure.

machaseh · 13-11-2019 02:42PM

For example I took me mate to Inisheer island, we only saw one old man speaking irish with another old woman. All the younger folks (behind the bar in the pub etc.) were having their banter in normal English.

Suckit · 13-11-2019 02:50PM

I agree.
If some politicians are to be believed, they are also coming under pressure from groups similar to and including AA.
So they have dismissed the thousands of others that don't have issues with alcohol and because we haven't (yet) put pressure on them, they will fire ahead with this nonsense.
I honestly do not see what putting a minimum price on alcohol is expected to achieve.

Richard Hillman · 13-11-2019 02:58PM

It is a cultural genocide. Drinking is a large part of our culture. They continue to curtail our drinking activities and it will only get worse.

Essentially what they want is for us to be is non drinkers, be vegetarian, cycle everywhere, partake in weekly 5k fun runs, wear flannel, wear glasses, grow beards, and talk about our feeling a lot.

Jog on, lads. Its Ireland, not an American West Coast college campus.

Thelonious Monk · 13-11-2019 03:09PM

We don't say "jog on" in Ireland

Reputable Rog · 13-11-2019 06:58PM

Reputable Rog wrote: »

What happens if a new school opens within 200 metres of an established alcohol hoarding? I remember in Limerick there was a massive Murphys illuminated sign on the Ballysimon Road, would that sign have to come down if a new school opened within 200 metres?

https://amp.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/end-of-an-era-as-macrooms-iconic-mural-falls-foul-of-alcohol-law-963622.html

And so it begins, cultural vandalism.

randomname2005 · 13-11-2019 10:21PM

Reputable Rog wrote: »

https://amp.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/end-of-an-era-as-macrooms-iconic-mural-falls-foul-of-alcohol-law-963622.html

And so it begins, cultural vandalism.

Perhaps this is going ot apologies mods if it is deemed so, but the quotes at the end of the article make me so angry. They talk about first drinks being given by parents and relatives as a bad thing, surely it is better this than chugging bottles of vodka down the field.
Also, this talk of alcohol advertising and cost is crap. Go to many European countries where alcohol is cheap and they have few of the problems we have. I lived in a southern European country for a few years, and even during big festivals there would be little if any problems. People would drink but not get stupid drunk. It was frowned upon to get sick or be a d1ck when drunk, not encouraged. We could probably do more to curb alcohol abuse by dealing with drunks, throwing them in the drunk tank for a night, and fining them and discouraging this behavior.
We changed societies attitude to drink driving, we can do the same with excessive drinking

elperello · 13-11-2019 10:30PM

This advertising thing has sort of taken me unawares.
I've been posting on this thread for some years but concentrated on the nonsense that is MUP.
I must admit I took my eye off the ball with regard to the advertising issues.

Can anyone point to any empirical evidence to stand up the 200m from schools ban?
Why 200m? Will kids not a affected by hoardings they pass by 300m from the school?

Suckit · 13-11-2019 10:32PM

It makes it look like they're doing something useful.

elperello · 13-11-2019 11:04PM

machaseh wrote: »

Ireland shouldnt focus on getting rid of the image of a drinking country. It should instead focus on promoting its image regarding other things. And when you think about it what does ireland have going for it other than drinking?

The cuisine is terrible
Hardly anybody speaks the Irish language
The weather is terrible
You'd definitely not visit for the historical city centers because they are nothing compared to what you'd find in continental europe
It has great traditional sports but most people outside of Ireland don't even know what GAA or hurling is.

The main thing it'd have going for it would be the traditional music and the nice nature, and more could be done to promote ireland based on those things rather than drinking.

Subsidize REAL trad music playing in all pubs, for example, and then I dont mean the kind of fake one you find in Temple Bar, but I mean the kind you'd find in the villages such as Clifden and also in Galway and the like.

And improve access to the beautiful nature sites that Ireland has. Not just by car, but especially by greatly improving bike infrastructure.

You make some interesting points but there's nothing wrong with a few drinks.

This guy Austin Allsup https://www.bandsintown.com/a/370086-austin-allsup
was on with Miriam O'Callaghan yesterday publicising his bands gig in the Texas Red Dirt Pub Crawl Tour. He was talking about being a bit hungover and drinking and you could almost sense the dismay in the studio. I'm not giving out about Miriam but the whole scene has changed now. Anything that promotes drink is dangerous territory in the media.

I've seen bands like this playing in the US and the carry on makes sessions here look like a garden party.

I'm not uncritically promoting heavy drinking which is obviously bad for you but there are worse things that can befall young people. We have become too po faced and given too much ground to the neo prohibitionists. We are in danger of forgetting how to have the crack.

Footnote:Austin Allsup's dad Tommy Allsup played guitar with Buddy Holly. He flipped a coin with Ritchie Valens to determine who would travel on the plane. He lost and ended up on the bus and you know the rest.

Suckit · 13-11-2019 11:47PM

It's the media that needs to change.

14-11-2019 11:53AM

elperello wrote: »

You make some interesting points but there's nothing wrong with a few drinks.

This guy Austin Allsup https://www.bandsintown.com/a/370086-austin-allsup
was on with Miriam O'Callaghan yesterday publicising his bands gig in the Texas Red Dirt Pub Crawl Tour. He was talking about being a bit hungover and drinking and you could almost sense the dismay in the studio. I'm not giving out about Miriam but the whole scene has changed now. Anything that promotes drink is dangerous territory in the media.

I've seen bands like this playing in the US and the carry on makes sessions here look like a garden party.

I'm not uncritically promoting heavy drinking which is obviously bad for you but there are worse things that can befall young people. We have become too po faced and given too much ground to the neo prohibitionists. We are in danger of forgetting how to have the crack.

Footnote:Austin Allsup's dad Tommy Allsup played guitar with Buddy Holly. He flipped a coin with Ritchie Valens to determine who would travel on the plane. He lost and ended up on the bus and you know the rest.

I lived in East-Central Europe for a few years(where they can really drink), and was working for a software company. The normal practice was to go out to a restaurant for lunch( the three course lunch menu was about 2 euros) and most people had a pint with lunch. Over arrives HR woman from the US who observed this practice and cue meetings and discussions and then a company wide memo reminding that the company was an alcohol free place and the practice of having a beer with lunch went against company policy etc etc.

One guy went to the doctor complaining of regular indigestion after lunch. Ever since the company effectively banned him from having a beer with lunch he was getting heartburn and discomfort, so the Czech doctor wrote him a letter insisting he should be allowed have a beer with lunch for medical reasons.

Over there, they don't so much have a drink culture but they have a beer culture. You can buy beer in the gym, in the cinema, on the bus to Prague, in McDonalds and pubs and licensed premises can(and many do) open 24 hours a day 365 days of the year.

I have to say the creeping in of this oppressive attitude towards alcohol very uncomfortable. Also to an extent, the sudden change of attitude towards vaping(whole different topic I know, but its a similar trial by media bias)

He was talking about being a bit hungover and drinking and you could almost sense the dismay in the studio.

I didn't hear it but I well believe it.

mjv2ydratu679c · 14-11-2019 11:55AM

Deleted User wrote: »

I lived in East-Central Europe for a few years(where they can really drink), and was working for a software company. The normal practice was to go out to a restaurant for lunch( the three course lunch menu was about 2 euros) and most people had a pint with lunch. Over arrives HR woman from the US who observed this practice and cue meetings and discussions and then a company wide memo reminding that the company was an alcohol free place and the practice of having a beer with lunch went against company policy etc etc.

One guy went to the doctor complaining of regular indigestion after lunch. Ever since the company effectively banned him from having a beer with lunch he was getting heartburn and discomfort, so the Czech doctor wrote him a letter insisting he should be allowed have a beer with lunch for medical reasons.

Over there, they don't so much have a drink culture but they have a beer culture. You can buy beer in the gym, in the cinema, on the bus to Prague, in McDonalds and pubs and licensed premises can(and many do) open 24 hours a day 365 days of the year.

I have to say the creeping in of this oppressive attitude towards alcohol very uncomfortable. Also to an extent, the sudden change of attitude towards vaping(whole different topic I know, but its a similar trial by media bias)

I didn't hear it but I well believe it.

that place sounds like heaven, where was that?

Thelonious Monk · 14-11-2019 12:00PM

Valentin Itchy Spaceship wrote: »

that place sounds like heaven, where was that?

I bet it's Brno and he worked for IBM

14-11-2019 12:03PM

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I bet it's Brno and he worked for IBM

Right and wrong. Brno but not IBM.

Thelonious Monk · 14-11-2019 12:08PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Right and wrong. Brno but not IBM.

I nearly took a job there with them once

14-11-2019 12:13PM

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I nearly took a job there with them once

My ex worked there for 4 years and loved it. I heard a few horror stories though from others.

LineOfBeauty · 14-11-2019 12:19PM

Upping drinking prices never works. All it means is that the regular Irish citizen is every bit as hungover on a Sunday morning but even more poor than they already are.

14-11-2019 01:01PM

elperello wrote: »

This advertising thing has sort of taken me unawares.
I've been posting on this thread for some years but concentrated on the nonsense that is MUP.
I must admit I took my eye off the ball with regard to the advertising issues.

Can anyone point to any empirical evidence to stand up the 200m from schools ban?
Why 200m? Will kids not a affected by hoardings they pass by 300m from the school?

It's all about the long term

Take the everydsy prevalence of alcohol away, ie. advertising, and people become less aware of it and thus less likely to consume it.

Take smoking for example.
Would a teenager today from a non-smoking household be able to name as many cigarette brands as a teenager from a non smoking household could in 1983.

I doubt it.
Because a teenager today if far less exposed to cigarette branding than they were in 1983.

Some will claim advertising does not work, if that's the case why do drinks companies spend billions on it.

14-11-2019 01:12PM

Reputable Rog wrote: »

https://amp.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/end-of-an-era-as-macrooms-iconic-mural-falls-foul-of-alcohol-law-963622.html

And so it begins, cultural vandalism.

It's commercialism not culture.

Don't get the two confused like people did for Arthur's Day.

14-11-2019 03:01PM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

That's proof that advertising influences people to choose certain brands over others, not that it makes them start drinking/smoking in the first place.

That's somewhat true but the presence and prevalence of alcohol advertising, regardless of brand, is going to attract new people to alcohol.

Anyone who laments the loss of alcohol advertising, especially around places kids gather, is a fcking moron in my eyes.

Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

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